7 Common Errors of Interpretation for Chapters 4-6 of Revelation

[6 Stories]

COMMON ERROR 1 Rapture takes place in the twinkling of an eye. Everyone disappears instantly. (The "Left Behind" Theory)
NEW THEORY 1 The Change from mortal to immortal takes place in the twinkling of an eye. Nobody becomes invisible.

COMMON ERROR 2 "Hereafter" is after the church is gone.
NEW THEORY 2 Daniel's "Hereafter" began with the kingdom in which he lived (Babylon). Revelation: "Hereafter" is 1st century Rome.

COMMON ERROR 3 John is raptured into heaven after the church age.
NEW THEORY 3 John sees the arrival of Jesus into heaven after he rose from the dead around 32 A.D.

COMMON ERROR 4 24 Elders symbolically are the Church which has been raptured into heaven. (Song 2) proves Church as 24 elders.
NEW THEORY 4 24 Elders are angelic creatures who have worshipped God since creation. (Song 2) Cherubim sing this song.

COMMON ERROR 5 Antichrist is rider on the white horse.
NEW THEORY 5 Rider on the white horse is any leader who wants to rule the world (Nero, Hitler). Seal 4 limits death to 1/4 of the earth.

COMMON ERROR 6 "Tribulation Saints" (martyrs) die during 7 years of Tribulation. (After Church is raptured)
NEW THEORY 6 "Tribulation Saints" is a term made to fit a Common Theory. The martyrs pictured during the fifth seal died during the 1st century.

COMMON ERROR 7 The events of the sixth seal will occur near the beginning of the 7 years of great tribulation.
NEW THEORY 7 The six stories of chapters 6-19 all end when the throne of God shakes the earth and/or when Jesus returns.

These 7 common errors have prevented the church from finding a consensus interpretation for the Revelation.
WTEW Bible Studies will air a 30-minute presentation on YouTube, Friday at 5pm.
I am happy to discuss common errors/new theory individually or collectively.

 

[The Light]

COMMON ERROR 1 Rapture takes place in the twinkling of an eye. Everyone disappears instantly. (The "Left Behind" Theory)
NEW THEORY 1 The Change from mortal to immortal takes place in the twinkling of an eye. Nobody becomes invisible.

Satan has spent much energy preparing the world for the disappearance of the Church. The immortal body will be caught up and disappear from this earth.

COMMON ERROR 2 "Hereafter" is after the church is gone.
NEW THEORY 2 Daniel's "Hereafter" began with the kingdom in which he lived (Babylon). Revelation: "Hereafter" is 1st century Rome.

"Hereafter" will be after the rapture of the Church

COMMON ERROR 3 John is raptured into heaven after the church age.
NEW THEORY 3 John sees the arrival of Jesus into heaven after he rose from the dead around 32 A.D.

Doesn't make sense.

COMMON ERROR 4 24 Elders symbolically are the Church which has been raptured into heaven. (Song 2) proves Church as 24 elders.
NEW THEORY 4 24 Elders are angelic creatures who have worshipped God since creation. (Song 2) Cherubim sing this song.

The kings and priests of Revelation 5 is the Church in heaven. The 24 elders have crowns which shows that Jesus has come. The crowns are for Gods people as Revelation 3 shows.

COMMON ERROR 5 Antichrist is rider on the white horse.
NEW THEORY 5 Rider on the white horse is any leader who wants to rule the world (Nero, Hitler). Seal 4 limits death to 1/4 of the earth.

Antichrist is the rider on the white horse.

COMMON ERROR 6 "Tribulation Saints" (martyrs) die during 7 years of Tribulation. (After Church is raptured)
NEW THEORY 6 "Tribulation Saints" is a term made to fit a Common Theory. The martyrs pictured during the fifth seal died during the 1st century.

The 5th seal is the Great Tribulation. Most of the tribulation saints will be the Jews across the earth as the 144,000 first fruits from the twelve tribes' attests.

COMMON ERROR 7 The events of the sixth seal will occur near the beginning of the 7 years of great tribulation.
NEW THEORY 7 The six stories of chapters 6-19 all end when the throne of God shakes the earth and/or when Jesus returns.

The events of the 6th seal occur at the end of the great tribulation. The wrath of God begins when the 7th seal is opened starting with the 1st trumpet. Jesus returns at the 6th seal as marked by the signs of the sun, moon and stars.

These 7 common errors have prevented the church from finding a consensus interpretation for the Revelation.
WTEW Bible Studies will air a 30-minute presentation on YouTube, Friday at 5pm.
I am happy to discuss common errors/new theory individually or collectively.

It matters not whether there is a consensus it only matters what is correct.

 

[Randy Kluth]

I agree with a lot of this. Dispensational Eschatology is purely an insertion into the book of Revelation, even after we were warned not to add anything to the book! Pretribulation Theology is non-existent in the NT Scriptures, and it was non-existent in the Church for 1800 years. If there were any exceptions to this, they did not rise to the level of an accepted theology within the Church.

I don't know who the 4 Horsemen are, but I'm pretty confident Antichrist isn't any of them. They appear to be angels bringing judgment to the earth in the endtimes.

The Tribulation Period I actually call "the Reign of Antichrist," which lasts only for "a time, times and half a time," aka 3.5 years.

I agree that Dispensationalism has caused some confusion in the interpretation of Revelation. In my view, Amillennialism has also been a problem.

The cause of a lot of the confusion over Christian Eschatology is impatience waiting for Israel to come to Christ. That is what caused Amillennialism, and that therefore resulted in Symbolic Interpretation.

Dispensationalism attempted to restore ancient Premillennialism, following the ideas of Catholic Lacunza, who followed after Ribera. The idea of Premill I agree with. However, somewhere along the way, Dispensationalists began to worry about Christians suffering God's Wrath when Antichrist arrives. The Bible says that Christians will not suffer God's Wrath.

In the restoration of ideas about a future Antichrist, it became apparent that the Church would have to suffer for her testimony. That testimony would not be popular in an antichristian world!

And so, it was thought that if the tribulation of the time of Antichrist is to be associated with God's Wrath at the end of the age, surely the Church must be caught up before that time at a "secret coming" of Christ? Of course, I don't think so, but it had long been taught that Christians would escape the outpouring of God's Wrath at Christ's Coming.

 

[ewq1938]

The 5th seal is the Great Tribulation.

No it isn't. The 5th seal makes mention of deaths that will occur during the GT, but that is future to the events of the 5th seal being namely the dead wanting vengeance and being told to wait. That conversation takes place an unknown amount of time BEFORE the GT happens.

 

[ewq1938]

The 24 elders have crowns which shows that Jesus has come.

That is not evidence of the second coming having happened. The elders have crowns because they have authority as elders. They receive these crowns well before the second coming. Rev 3:9 speaks of people of a first century church already having crowns which disproves your claim.

 

[The Light]

That is not evidence of the second coming having happened. The elders have crowns because they have authority as elders. They receive these crowns well before the second coming. Rev 3:9 speaks of people of a first century church already having crowns which disproves your claim.

Rev 3:9
9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

 

[The Light]

No it isn't. The 5th seal makes mention of deaths that will occur during the GT, but that is future to the events of the 5th seal being namely the dead wanting vengeance and being told to wait. That conversation takes place an unknown amount of time BEFORE the GT happens.

Jesus returns at the 6th seal as marked by the signs of the sun, moon and stars. The great tribulation is over before Jesus returns at the 6th seal, therefore the great tribulation is the 5th seal.

 

[ewq1938]

Jesus returns at the 6th seal as marked by the signs of the sun, moon and stars.

You ignored what I said. The language of the 5th seal does not support it speaking of the trib happening then. That is a fact you cannot deny. It shocks you because you have for so long believed as you do, as wrongly as it is.

If you wish to progress in understanding, toss away all your preconceived beliefs and start anew.

First thing to learn about the seals is they are not in Chronological order. Second, they are not events that happen at the opening of the seals. They are all prophecies of trumpet events.

 

[ewq1938]

Rev 3:9
9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

3:11

Rev 3:9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
Rev 3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.
Rev 3:11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

 

[Traveler]

One thing I found out is that I can take 20 well schooled theologians and when asked about the book of Revelation no two will be in full agreement. Most of the problems come with timing and overlap. However as we get closer to the time for its fulfillment this book starts to make a lot more sense and begins to read like the daily news.

The seals emanate from this earth. It is actions that satan initiates so as to enable their son of perdition to rise to power on a global scale. The Trumpets and bowls of wrath come from God and is his answer. The Gentile church is gathered during the sixth seal. The Jews remain during the Trumpets and are gathered before the bowls of wrath.

 

[Davy]

Sorry, but there are many errors with what you suggest. And you really should show the Scripture you are referring to.

COMMON ERROR 4 24 Elders symbolically are the Church which has been raptured into heaven. (Song 2) proves Church as 24 elders.
NEW THEORY 4 24 Elders are angelic creatures who have worshipped God since creation. (Song 2) Cherubim sing this song.

The 24 elders in Rev.4 is a 'future' forward vision in Heaven. It is NOT about the 'present'. So there's no reason to think those 24 elders represent angels or cherubim, especially since they are shown to have crowns. The crown represents a promised reward by Christ to His elect at His coming, so that's more reason to consider that vision being for after Christ's future return.

COMMON ERROR 5 Antichrist is rider on the white horse.
NEW THEORY 5 Rider on the white horse is any leader who wants to rule the world (Nero, Hitler). Seal 4 limits death to 1/4 of the earth.

The rider on the white horse of Rev.6 representing the 1st Seal is about the 'final' Antichrist that is prophesied to come at the very end of this world, playing God, in Jerusalem. The prophecy is about a specific entity that will work great signs and wonders, and miracles, that will deceive the whole world, except Christ's elect (Daniel 9:17 and Daniel 11 with the "vile person", Daniel 7 & 8 about the "little horn", Matt.24 about the pseudo-Christ, 2 Thess.2 about the "man of sin", and Rev.13 about the "another beast"). That false-Messiah has not come yet.

So trying to label those like Nero, Hitler, or even a pope, etc., as that final Antichrist is actually a very funny idea.

COMMON ERROR 6 "Tribulation Saints" (martyrs) die during 7 years of Tribulation. (After Church is raptured)
NEW THEORY 6 "Tribulation Saints" is a term made to fit a Common Theory. The martyrs pictured during the fifth seal died during the 1st century.

Both statements are error.
The time for the 5th Seal event is not here yet today. It is set for closer to the coming time of "great tribulation" at the end just prior to Christ's future return. All... of the SEALS of Rev.6 are the 7 SIGNS Jesus gave in His Olivet discourse which reveal the things that are to happen leading up to His future return. That is why those given eyes to see, and ears to hear are able to study the Matt.24 and Mark 13 SIGNS in parallel with the Seals of Rev.6.

COMMON ERROR 7 The events of the sixth seal will occur near the beginning of the 7 years of great tribulation.
NEW THEORY 7 The six stories of chapters 6-19 all end when the throne of God shakes the earth and/or when Jesus returns.

Both statements are in error. The Book of Revelation gives the same SIGNS Jesus gave in His Olivet discourse. The very last SIGN He gave is that of His future return. The 21 events of Revelation involve ONLY those 7 SIGNS Jesus gave. Thus the Seals, Trumpets, and Vials occur in 'parallel' to each other. This is why Jesus' future coming is shown at the end of the 6th Seal, and on the 7th Trumpet, and on the 7th Vial. And the first section of Rev.19 is actually for after... His coming when the Babylon harlot is shown already destroyed, with the latter part of Rev.19 showing Jesus coming on a white horse with His army, and that also is the timing of the 6th Seal of Rev.6, and 7th Trumpet of Rev.11.

These 7 common errors have prevented the church from finding a consensus interpretation for the Revelation.
WTEW Bible Studies will air a 30-minute presentation on YouTube, Friday at 5pm.
I am happy to discuss common errors/new theory individually or collectively.

And based on your attempted correction, it reveals the Church will remain in confusion about the events and order written all the way up to the day of Christ's future return.

 

[The Light]

The seals emanate from this earth. It is actions that satan initiates so as to enable their son of perdition to rise to power on a global scale. The Trumpets and bowls of wrath come from God and is his answer.

Exactly

The Gentile church is gathered during the sixth seal.

I don't believe this is correct. The Gentiles are gathered before the seals are opened. It is only when the fullness of the Gentiles comes in that God turns His attention to His Chosen.

Romans 11
25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

 

[The Light]

The Gentile church is gathered during the sixth seal. The Jews remain during the Trumpets and are gathered before the bowls of wrath.

It is actually the 12 tribes across the earth that are gathered at the 6th seal. There is a reason that there are 144,000 first fruits from the 12 tribes across the earth. Since there are first fruits of the 12 tribes, there will be a harvest of the 12 tribes. This occurs at the 6th seal and then the 1 Year wrath of God begins.

It is only those from the nation of Israel, that fled to a place of protection and unbelievers that will be on earth during the 1 year wrath of God.

 

[Traveler]

It is actually the 12 tribes across the earth that are gathered at the 6th seal. There is a reason that there are 144,000 first fruits from the 12 tribes across the earth. Since there are first fruits of the 12 tribes, there will be a harvest of the 12 tribes. This occurs at the 6th seal and then the 1 Year wrath of God begins.

It is only those from the nation of Israel, that fled to a place of protection and unbelievers that will be on earth during the 1 year wrath of God.

No. You see the church in heaven claiming the blood of christ and the word of their testimony. The 144000 Jews are set in place to take the place of the saints that are no longer there. They will be reaching out to the Jews during the Trumpets.

Rev 7:13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?
Rev 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
Rev 7:15 Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them.

 

[The Light]

No. You see the church in heaven claiming the blood of christ and the word of their testimony. The 144000 Jews are set in place to take the place of the saints that are no longer there. They will be reaching out to the Jews during the Trumpets.

The Church never goes through the tribulation. The Church is in heaven before the seals are opened.

Revelation 5
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.


The 70th week of Daniel is about the people of Daniel.
Daniel 9
24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

The 144,000 will not be on earth during the wrath of God. Revelation 13 and 14 occurs during the seals. The 144,000 are already in heaven before those verses in Revelation 7 which we can prove because the 5th seal is the great tribulation. Here is the great tribulation in Revelation 14
Rev 14
13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them.

Then Jesus returns for the second harvest at the 6th seal. Here is that harvest in Rev 14.

Rev 14
14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.

16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.

18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.

19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.

Jesus comes at the 6th seal for the second harvest BEFORE THE WRATH OF GOD.

 

[The Light]

You ignored what I said. The language of the 5th seal does not support it speaking of the trib happening then

I did not ignore what you said. I corrected it with the coming of Jesus at the 6th seal which happens before the great tribulation. We have proof of that here.

Revelation 7
14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

. That is a fact you cannot deny. It shocks you because you have for so long believed as you do, as wrongly as it is.

The facts say the 5th seal is the great tribulation.

Revelation 6
10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

The great tribulation is getting ready to happen and then Jesus returns for the second harvest at the 6th seal. As I said the proof is those that came out of great tribulation in Revelation 7

If you wish to progress in understanding, toss away all your preconceived beliefs and start anew.

I already did this long ago. That's why I understand that Revelation 13 and 14 occurs in the seals. That's why I understand that the wrath of God is over at the 7th trumpet when the kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord. That's why I understand that the vials of wrath occur in the same timeframe as the trumpets of wrath.

First thing to learn about the seals is they are not in Chronological order.

They certainly are. You are starting off going down the wrong trail. The seals are in the exact same order as the events that Jesus talks about in Matthew 24.

Second, they are not events that happen at the opening of the seals. They are all prophecies of trumpet events.

The tribulation occurs during the seals. The trumpets are wrath of God. They occur after Jesus returns at the 6th seal.

 

[ScottA]

COMMON ERROR 1 Rapture takes place in the twinkling of an eye. Everyone disappears instantly. (The "Left Behind" Theory)
NEW THEORY 1 The Change from mortal to immortal takes place in the twinkling of an eye. Nobody becomes invisible.

COMMON ERROR 2 "Hereafter" is after the church is gone.
NEW THEORY 2 Daniel's "Hereafter" began with the kingdom in which he lived (Babylon). Revelation: "Hereafter" is 1st century Rome.

COMMON ERROR 3 John is raptured into heaven after the church age.
NEW THEORY 3 John sees the arrival of Jesus into heaven after he rose from the dead around 32 A.D.

COMMON ERROR 4 24 Elders symbolically are the Church which has been raptured into heaven. (Song 2) proves Church as 24 elders.
NEW THEORY 4 24 Elders are angelic creatures who have worshipped God since creation. (Song 2) Cherubim sing this song.

COMMON ERROR 5 Antichrist is rider on the white horse.
NEW THEORY 5 Rider on the white horse is any leader who wants to rule the world (Nero, Hitler). Seal 4 limits death to 1/4 of the earth.

COMMON ERROR 6 "Tribulation Saints" (martyrs) die during 7 years of Tribulation. (After Church is raptured)
NEW THEORY 6 "Tribulation Saints" is a term made to fit a Common Theory. The martyrs pictured during the fifth seal died during the 1st century.

COMMON ERROR 7 The events of the sixth seal will occur near the beginning of the 7 years of great tribulation.
NEW THEORY 7 The six stories of chapters 6-19 all end when the throne of God shakes the earth and/or when Jesus returns.

These 7 common errors have prevented the church from finding a consensus interpretation for the Revelation.
WTEW Bible Studies will air a 30-minute presentation on YouTube, Friday at 5pm.
I am happy to discuss common errors/new theory individually or collectively.

Why do you theorize--do you not know that was the very reason the Bride was told to be silent in church?

 

[Traveler]

There is the tribulation that comes from this earth and is directed towards the saints during the opening of the seals. Then there is the tribulation that comes from the throne of God in reply during the trumpets and later through the bowls of wrath. The 7th week of Daniel takes place during the trumpets. They are the ones that have to over come the mark of the beast.

Rev 15:1 And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God.
Rev 15:2 And I saw as it were a sea of glass mingled with fire: and them that had gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name, stand on the sea of glass, having the harps of God.
Rev 15:3 And they sing the song of Moses the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb, saying, Great and marvellous are thy works, Lord God Almighty; just and true are thy ways, thou King of saints.

Keep in mind that the saints do not sing the song of Moses, so obviously these are Jews.

 

[The Light]

There is the tribulation that comes from this earth and is directed towards the saints during the opening of the seals.

Correct. The tribulation is over with the coming of Jesus at the 6th seal. The Church is already in heaven BEFORE the seals are opened.

Then there is the tribulation that comes from the throne of God in reply during the trumpets and later through the bowls of wrath.

The trumpets and bowls occur in the same timeframe. It is the one-year wrath of God.

The 7th week of Daniel takes place during the trumpets. They are the ones that have to over come the mark of the beast.

Keep in mind that the saints do not sing the song of Moses, so obviously these are Jews.

You are correct that they are Jews singing the song of Moses. What you are not understanding is that Revelation 13 and 14 occurs during the seals. At the 6th seal there is a rapture BEFORE the wrath of God.

Revelation 6
12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;
Revelation 6
16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

Here is another view of the coming of Jesus that occurs at the 6th seal.

Revelation 14
14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.

16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.

18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.

19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.

Those raptured are singing the song of Moses. They are Jews.........as you say. It is the Jews that are raptured when Jesus comes at the 6th seal BEFORE wrath.

Only those of the nation of Israel that flee to a place of protection and unbelievers will be on earth during the 1-year wrath of God.

 

[Traveler]

The Trumpets are only started in the seventh seal. The saints are already in heaven and the Jews still remain.

Rev 8:1 And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.
Rev 8:2 And I saw the seven angels which stood before God; and to them were given seven trumpets.
Rev 8:3 And another angel came and stood at the altar, having a golden censer; and there was given unto him much incense, that he should offer it with the prayers of all saints upon the golden altar which was before the throne.

You may get a better understanding of the seals from here;

My look at Revelation

How Far into the End Times are we? It does not take much to grasp that we are now in the end times. The signs of summer are all around and we know that our redemption is drawing close. All expectations are that we will be the generation that gets to see it. No, none of us know the date and we...

www.christianityboard.com