No Law : Under Grace

[Johann]

So just who... would want us to think that ALL future sin is automatically forgiven by Lord Jesus? The devil and his children, of course. Satan does not want us to repent and ask Christ to forgive us of future sin.

Really?

To examine whether the New Testament supports the idea that Jesus died for future sins, it's essential to delve into the scriptural texts, analyzing their morphology (the form of words) and syntax (sentence structure) to ascertain their implications. While the concept of atonement for future sins is more theological and doctrinal, certain passages can be scrutinized to infer this belief.

Hebrews 10:12-14
Textus Receptus (TR):
"But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God; from henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool. For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified."

Greek (TR):
οὗτος δὲ μίαν ὑπὲρ ἁμαρτιῶν προσενέγκας θυσίαν εἰς τὸ διηνεκές ἐκάθισεν ἐν δεξιᾷ τοῦ Θεοῦ, τοῦ λοιποῦ ἐκδεχόμενος ἕως τεθῶσιν οἱ ἐχθροὶ αὐτοῦ ὑποπόδιον τῶν ποδῶν αὐτοῦ· μιᾷ γὰρ προσφορᾷ τετελείωκεν εἰς τὸ διηνεκές τοὺς ἁγιαζομένους.

Lexham English Bible (LEB):
"But this one, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for all time, sat down at the right hand of God, from now on waiting until his enemies are made a footstool for his feet. For by one offering he has perfected for all time those who are being made holy."

Analysis:

Perfect Tense in Greek (τετελείωκεν, teteleiōken): The verb τετελείωκεν is in the perfect tense, indicating a completed action with continuing results. This means that Christ's act of perfecting believers has been accomplished and continues to have effect into the future. The phrase εἰς τὸ διηνεκές (for all time) reinforces the perpetual nature of this perfection.

Present Participle (τοὺς ἁγιαζομένους, tous hagiazomenous): The participle ἁγιαζομένους is present, denoting an ongoing process of being made holy, which implies continuous action affecting future states.

1 John 1:7
Textus Receptus (TR):
"But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin."

Greek (TR):
ἐὰν δὲ ἐν τῷ φωτὶ περιπατῶμεν, ὡς αὐτὸς ἐστὶν ἐν τῷ φωτί, κοινωνίαν ἔχομεν μετ᾿ ἀλλήλων, καὶ τὸ αἷμα Ἰησοῦ Χριστοῦ τοῦ Υἱοῦ αὐτοῦ καθαρίζει ἡμᾶς ἀπὸ πάσης ἁμαρτίας.

Lexham English Bible (LEB):
"But if we walk in the light as he himself is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus his Son cleanses us from all sin."

Analysis:

Present Tense in Greek (καθαρίζει, katharizei): The verb καθαρίζει (cleanses) is in the present tense, indicating continuous or habitual action. This continuous cleansing suggests that Jesus' blood is perpetually effective in purifying believers from sin, which can include future sins.
Romans 5:8-10
Textus Receptus (TR):
"But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life."

Greek (TR):
συνιστᾷ δὲ τὴν ἑαυτοῦ ἀγάπην εἰς ἡμᾶς ὁ Θεός, ὅτι ἔτι ἁμαρτωλῶν ὄντων ἡμῶν, Χριστὸς ὑπὲρ ἡμῶν ἀπέθανεν. πολλῷ οὖν μᾶλλον δικαιωθέντες νῦν ἐν τῷ αἵματι αὐτοῦ σωθησόμεθα δι’ αὐτοῦ ἀπὸ τῆς ὀργῆς. εἰ γὰρ ἐχθροὶ ὄντες κατηλλάγημεν τῷ Θεῷ διὰ τοῦ θανάτου τοῦ Υἱοῦ αὐτοῦ, πολλῷ μᾶλλον καταλλαγέντες σωθησόμεθα ἐν τῇ ζωῇ αὐτοῦ.

Lexham English Bible (LEB):
"But God demonstrates his own love for us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Therefore, by much more, because we have been declared righteous now by his blood, we will be saved through him from the wrath. For if, while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of his Son, by much more, having been reconciled, we will be saved by his life."

Analysis:

Aorist Tense in Greek (ἀπέθανεν, apethanen): The verb ἀπέθανεν (died) is in the aorist tense, indicating a past action. This emphasizes the completeness of Christ's sacrificial death.

Perfect Passive Participle (δικαιωθέντες, dikaiōthentes): The participle δικαιωθέντες (having been justified) is perfect passive, indicating a completed action with continuing results. This implies that the justification achieved through Christ's blood continues to apply, covering both present and future states of sin.

Future Tense (σωθησόμεθα, sōthēsometha): The verb σωθησόμεθα (we will be saved) is in the future tense, indicating that the salvation effected through Christ's sacrifice continues to protect believers from future wrath.

Conclusion
In summary, the perfect and aorist tenses in these passages from the Textus Receptus, as seen in the Lexham English Bible, support the theological interpretation that Christ's sacrificial death encompasses not only past and present sins but also future sins. The perfect tense in Hebrews 10:14 and the continuous present in 1 John 1:7 highlight the ongoing efficacy of Christ's sacrifice, while the aorist tense in Romans 5:8-10 underscores the completeness of the act and its lasting effects.

You think Jesus was not aware of our future sins? Of course we need to repent, daily, of our shortcomings and missing the mark.

Thanks
J.

 

[Johann]

So are we free to kill our brother?

No, we are under the law of Christ Jesus.

 

[Johann]

Matthew 5:19 (ESV)
Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Context and who were the recipients?

 

[Davy]

Really?

To examine whether the New Testament supports the idea that Jesus died for future sins, it's essential to delve into the scriptural texts, analyzing their morphology (the form of words) and syntax (sentence structure) to ascertain their implications. While the concept of atonement for future sins is more theological and doctrinal, certain passages can be scrutinized to infer this belief.

All your wanderings with your attempt to use those Scriptures to support the false OSAS theory of men are CANCELLED simply by what Apostle Paul taught here...

Rom 3:24-25
24 Being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in His blood, to declare His righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
KJV

It is noted that you failed to address the above Scripture by Apostle Paul.

 

[Johann]

All your wanderings with your attempt to use those Scriptures to support the false OSAS theory of men are CANCELLED simply by what Apostle Paul taught here...

Rom 3:24-25
24 Being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in His blood, to declare His righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
KJV

It is noted that you failed to address the above Scripture by Apostle Paul.

Already answered-not my problem if you have a problem. And you neglect context, as always.
Romans 3:24-25 (KJV)
24 Being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in His blood, to declare His righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

Textus Receptus (TR) Greek Text:
Romans 3:24
24 δικαιούμενοι δωρεὰν τῇ αὐτοῦ χάριτι διὰ τῆς ἀπολυτρώσεως τῆς ἐν Χριστῷ Ἰησοῦ,

Romans 3:25
25 ὃν προέθετο ὁ Θεὸς ἱλαστήριον διὰ πίστεως ἐν τῷ αὐτοῦ αἵματι εἰς ἔνδειξιν τῆς δικαιοσύνης αὐτοῦ διὰ τὴν πάρεσιν τῶν προγεγονότων ἁμαρτημάτων ἐν τῇ ἀνοχῇ τοῦ Θεοῦ,

Lexham English Bible (LEB) Translation:
24 being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,
25 whom God made publicly available as a propitiation through faith in his blood, for a demonstration of his righteousness, because of the passing over of previously committed sins, in the forbearance of God.

Morphological and Syntactical Analysis:
Romans 3:24
δικαιούμενοι (dikaioumenoi):

Morphology: Present Passive Participle, Nominative Plural Masculine
Meaning: "being justified"
Syntax: This participle functions as a descriptive clause, indicating a continuous action of being made righteous.
δωρεὰν (dorean):

Morphology: Adverb
Meaning: "freely"
Syntax: Modifies the participle "being justified," emphasizing the unearned nature of justification.
τῇ αὐτοῦ χάριτι (tē autou chariti):

Morphology: Dative Singular Feminine
Meaning: "by His grace"
Syntax: This phrase indicates the means by which justification is given.
διὰ τῆς ἀπολυτρώσεως (dia tēs apolytrōseōs):

Morphology: Genitive Singular Feminine
Meaning: "through the redemption"
Syntax: This prepositional phrase specifies the method or agency of justification.
τῆς ἐν Χριστῷ Ἰησοῦ (tēs en Christō Iēsou):

Morphology: Genitive Singular Masculine
Meaning: "that is in Christ Jesus"
Syntax: Modifies "redemption," specifying the source of redemption.
Romans 3:25
ὃν (hon):

Morphology: Relative Pronoun, Accusative Singular Masculine
Meaning: "whom"
Syntax: Refers to Christ Jesus, the object of the verb "set forth."
προέθετο (proetheto):

Morphology: Aorist Middle Indicative, 3rd Person Singular
Meaning: "hath set forth"
Syntax: Main verb indicating God's action.
ὁ Θεὸς (ho Theos):

Morphology: Nominative Singular Masculine
Meaning: "God"
Syntax: Subject of the verb "set forth."
ἱλαστήριον (hilastērion):

Morphology: Accusative Singular Neuter
Meaning: "a propitiation"
Syntax: Object of the verb "set forth," describing Christ as the means of atonement.
διὰ πίστεως (dia pisteōs):

Morphology: Genitive Singular Feminine
Meaning: "through faith"
Syntax: Prepositional phrase indicating the means by which propitiation is received.
ἐν τῷ αὐτοῦ αἵματι (en tō autou haimati):

Morphology: Dative Singular Neuter
Meaning: "in His blood"
Syntax: Specifies the basis of faith, indicating the means by which propitiation is accomplished.
εἰς ἔνδειξιν τῆς δικαιοσύνης αὐτοῦ (eis endeixin tēs dikaiosynēs autou):

Morphology: Prepositional Phrase, Genitive Singular Feminine
Meaning: "for a demonstration of His righteousness"
Syntax: Indicates the purpose of setting forth Christ as a propitiation.
διὰ τὴν πάρεσιν (dia tēn paresin):

Morphology: Accusative Singular Feminine
Meaning: "because of the passing over"
Syntax: Explains the reason for the demonstration of righteousness.
τῶν προγεγονότων ἁμαρτημάτων (tōn progegonotōn hamartēmatōn):

Morphology: Genitive Plural Neuter
Meaning: "of previously committed sins"
Syntax: Genitive phrase modifying "passing over."
ἐν τῇ ἀνοχῇ τοῦ Θεοῦ (en tē anochē tou Theou):

Morphology: Dative Singular Feminine
Meaning: "in the forbearance of God"
Syntax: Indicates the manner in which God’s righteousness is demonstrated.
Theological Implications:
Justification: The present passive participle "δικαιούμενοι" (being justified) indicates an ongoing state of being made righteous, which is given freely by God's grace. This underscores the unmerited nature of justification.

Grace and Redemption: The terms "δωρεὰν" (freely) and "χάριτι" (by His grace) emphasize that justification and redemption are acts of divine grace, not human merit. The phrase "διὰ τῆς ἀπολυτρώσεως" (through the redemption) points to the redemptive work of Christ as the means by which grace is imparted.

Propitiation: The term "ἱλαστήριον" (propitiation) indicates Christ as the atoning sacrifice that appeases God's wrath. The phrase "διὰ πίστεως ἐν τῷ αὐτοῦ αἵματι" (through faith in His blood) highlights the necessity of faith in Christ's sacrificial death for atonement.

Righteousness and Forbearance: The phrase "εἰς ἔνδειξιν τῆς δικαιοσύνης αὐτοῦ" (for a demonstration of His righteousness) underscores that God's righteousness is demonstrated in the forgiveness of sins. "διὰ τὴν πάρεσιν τῶν προγεγονότων ἁμαρτημάτων" (because of the passing over of previously committed sins) reflects God’s forbearance, showing that He temporarily overlooked past sins until the atonement was accomplished through Christ.

Divine Forbearance: The phrase "ἐν τῇ ἀνοχῇ τοῦ Θεοῦ" (in the forbearance of God) indicates that God's patience and restraint allowed for the passing over of sins, revealing His mercy and longsuffering.

This detailed analysis of Romans 3:24-25 from the Textus Receptus and Lexham Bible provides a comprehensive understanding of the theological depth and grammatical structure of the passage, emphasizing the doctrines of justification, redemption, and propitiation through faith in Christ's atoning work.

Context of Romans 3:24-25
To fully understand Romans 3:24-25, we need to consider the broader context of Paul's argument in Romans 3 and the surrounding chapters. Paul is addressing both Jewish and Gentile believers in Rome, emphasizing that all are under sin and in need of God's righteousness.

Immediate Context (Romans 3:21-26)
Romans 3:21-23: Paul asserts that the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from the law, although the Law and the Prophets bear witness to it. This righteousness comes through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe, for there is no distinction; all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.
Romans 3:24-26: This passage explains how this righteousness is given freely by God's grace through the redemption in Christ Jesus. God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement (propitiation) through the shedding of his blood, to be received by faith. This was to demonstrate God's righteousness because, in his forbearance, he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished—demonstrating his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus.

Broader Context (Romans 1-3)
Romans 1:18-32: Paul discusses the wrath of God against ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, focusing on Gentile sinfulness.
Romans 2: Paul turns to the Jews, emphasizing that possessing the Law does not exempt them from judgment; rather, both Jews and Gentiles are accountable to God.
Romans 3:1-20: Paul concludes that no one is righteous, quoting several Old Testament scriptures to show that both Jews and Gentiles are under sin. The purpose of the Law is to make people conscious of sin.
Future Sins in Context
The question of whether Romans 3:24-25 includes future sins can be addressed by examining the scope of Christ's atonement and the nature of justification by faith.

Justification as a One-Time Act:

Justification, according to Paul, is a legal declaration by God where a believer is declared righteous through faith in Christ. This is a one-time act that covers all sin—past, present, and future. When Paul states that believers are "justified freely by his grace" (Romans 3:24), he is indicating that this justification is comprehensive.
Redemption in Christ:

The redemption that is in Christ Jesus (Romans 3:24) implies a complete deliverance from the bondage of sin. This redemption is not limited to sins committed up to the point of belief but encompasses all sin due to the once-for-all nature of Christ's sacrifice.
Propitiation Through Faith in His Blood:

The propitiation (ἱλαστήριον, hilastērion) through faith in Christ's blood (Romans 3:25) is a reference to the atoning work of Christ, which satisfies God's righteous wrath against sin. This atonement is effective for all time, making provision for all sin.
Remission of Sins that are Past:

The phrase "for the remission of sins that are past" (Romans 3:25, KJV) is often understood in the context of God's forbearance. Before Christ's sacrifice, God, in his forbearance, passed over sins committed, not immediately punishing them. This passing over did not mean forgiveness without a future atonement. Christ's death is retrospective, covering the sins of those who had faith in God's promises before Christ's coming.
God's Righteousness Demonstrated:
Shalom

J.

 

[Davy]

No, we are under the law of Christ Jesus.

Apostle Paul taught about God's laws in 1 Timothy 1 and even said the law was good, if used lawfully, and that's Christian doctrine. He said the law wasn't made for the righteous, but for the sinner.

Thus anyone teaching that God's law is now dead per The New Covenant haven't truly understood Apostle Paul and The New Covenant relationship with God's laws. Lot of country preachers just read that Galatians 3:24-25 Scripture and then run with it, not understanding the rest of what Apostle Paul taught (like in 1 Corinthians 6 and Galatians 5).

 

[Davy]

Belief on The New Covenant Jesus Christ involves the gift of The Holy Spirit promised by Jesus. For one who stays in Christ, The Holy Spirit will warn us when we get in a situation to break God's laws. But it is still up to each believer to LISTEN AND HEED The Holy Spirit. When we do listen, then we won't be doing anything that is against God's laws. For like Paul said, the law is good and was not made for the righteous, but for the ungodly and sinner.

Therefore, as long as we Walk by The Spirit in Christ Jesus, then we won't be under the law, simply because we won't be doing anything that is against God's laws. But... IF we instead walk by our flesh and sin, then we definitely will be under God's laws. And that is how Paul explained it in Galatians 5.

Thus Christian Doctrine by Apostle Paul is that God's law still exists for the ungodly and sinner. And I don't care who you are, all born in the flesh except Lord Jesus Christ are concluded under sin so that His Salvation might be for those who believe on Him.

As long as we live in these flesh bodies, we cannot be literally perfect like Lord Jesus was when He was in the flesh, but only counted as perfect through Faith. We all fall short of the glory of God. So what do we do then, when we find ourselves in some future sin? How do we express our Faith?

Apostle John in 1 John 1 showed us what we must do to address future sin in our lives. We need to repent and ask Christ forgiveness, and John says that Christ is faithful to cleanse us of the sin and will forgive us. Thus REPENTANCE is part of our continual Walk with Jesus Christ.

 

[Davy]

Already answered-not my problem if you have a problem. And you neglect context, as always.
Romans 3:24-25 (KJV)
24 Being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:
25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in His blood, to declare His righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
....

Context of Romans 3:24-25
To fully understand Romans 3:24-25, we need to consider the broader context of Paul's argument in Romans 3 and the surrounding chapters. Paul is addressing both Jewish and Gentile believers in Rome, emphasizing that all are under sin and in need of God's righteousness.

NO NEED for a "broader context" PUSHED into the Romans 3:25 verse. Paul meant exactly what he said, "for the remission of sins that are PAST".

That means all sins prior to our first belief and baptism on Jesus Christ.

Future sins still need to be repented of to Jesus Christ, asking Him forgiveness, in order to STAY in the WALK with Him. This is actually one of the reasons for Communion time with Jesus, working our problems out with Him and remembering what He did on His cross for us.

 

[Johann]

NO NEED for a "broader context" PUSHED into the Romans 3:25 verse. Paul meant exactly what he said, "for the remission of sins that are PAST".

That means all sins prior to our first belief and baptism on Jesus Christ.

Future sins still need to be repented of to Jesus Christ, asking Him forgiveness, in order to STAY in the WALK with Him. This is actually one of the reasons for Communion time with Jesus, working our problems out with Him and remembering what He did on His cross for us.

Just working with the Scriptures-you don't and are none the wiser.

 

[bro.tan]

-
The law/commandments define transgression..

In other words, If there was no law or commandment that said....>"tho shalt not murder"< then if you murdered, there is nothing to define it as murder.

"where there is NO LAW.....there is NO SIN.. no Transgression"... = There is no LAW that defines that deed as a sin.

So, when we are unbelievers, the law and commandments continually define our carnality as sin.

This is the "curse of the Law".....as the law is what defines us all as .."all have sinned".

When we are born again, our "old man of sin" that was defined by the law, is crucified with Christ, and we are "made free from the law", having become ":dead to the Law".

This is explained as.. "Christ is the end of the Law, for righteousness, to everyone who believes"

"the born again are not under the law, but under Grace".

"Christ has redeemed the born again from the CURSE OF THE LAW".

A man asked Jesus this very question, "...What good thing shall I do that I may have eternal life?", and Jesus replied, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. (Matthew 19:16-19).

This was a direct answer to a direct question, which all of us will do well to take heed to. Anybody can claim to have faith, but actions speak louder than words. Faith and works go together and you can't have one without the other. "Here is the patience of the saints; here are they that keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus" (Revelation 14:12).

Why does the bible seem to teach that the law has been done away with, if we must still keep the commandments? When the bible speaks of laws we no longer have to keep, it is speaking of the sacrificial laws and Priesthood laws. These laws were a school master pointing us to the fact that Jesus would be sacrificed for our sins. Since Jesus died we are no longer under a school master, (required to offer up bulls and goats for our sins).

Now we must believe (have faith) Jesus died for us (Hebrews 10:4,9-10) 4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins. 9 then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second. 10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

This doesn't mean we don't have to obey God's moral laws of conduct. That would be like a man getting paroled from prison and then ignoring the same laws that sent him to prison in the first place. Jesus only died once, so if we willingly break God's law, after accepting Jesus, our reward will be eternal damnation (Hebrews 10:26-27) 26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. Let us avoid this at all costs, seeking a better reward. Jesus will return real soon And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. (Revelation 22:12).

 

[Johann]

NO NEED for a "broader context" PUSHED into the Romans 3:25 verse. Paul meant exactly what he said, "for the remission of sins that are PAST".

Already explained, biblically-you need to put on your reading glasses.
J.

 

[Johann]

NO NEED for a "broader context" PUSHED into the Romans 3:25 verse. Paul meant exactly what he said, "for the remission of sins that are PAST".

That means all sins prior to our first belief and baptism on Jesus Christ.

Future sins still need to be repented of to Jesus Christ, asking Him forgiveness, in order to STAY in the WALK with Him. This is actually one of the reasons for Communion time with Jesus, working our problems out with Him and remembering what He did on His cross for us.

Early Christian writings, particularly those of the Church Fathers, provide substantial support for the belief that Jesus' death was a sacrificial act intended for the forgiveness of sins, including future sins. Here are some notable examples from the 1st and early 2nd centuries:

New Testament Writings
Pauline Epistles:

Romans 5:8-9: "But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Since we have now been justified by his blood, how much more shall we be saved from God’s wrath through him!"
1 Corinthians 15:3: "For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures."
2 Corinthians 5:21: "God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God."
Hebrews (authorship traditionally ascribed to Paul or another early Christian leader):

Hebrews 9:28: "So Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him."
Hebrews 10:10: "And by that will, we have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all."
Writings of Early Church Fathers
Clement of Rome (c. 35-99 AD):

1 Clement 49:6: "In love hath the Lord taken us to himself; for the love which he had towards us, Jesus Christ our Lord hath given his blood for us by the will of God, and his flesh for our flesh, and his soul for our souls." This indicates an understanding of Jesus' death as a sacrificial act for humanity’s sins.
Ignatius of Antioch (c. 35-108 AD):

Letter to the Ephesians 1:7: "There is one Physician who is possessed both of flesh and spirit; both made and not made; God existing in flesh; true life in death; both of Mary and of God; first passible and then impassible, even Jesus Christ our Lord."
Letter to the Trallians 2:1: "Be ye subject to the bishop as to the Lord, for 'he watches for your souls, as one that shall give account to God.' Therefore, be diligent, and cling to Him, that you may not become weak in your minds, as in the body. Be firm in faith, steadfast, immovable, being always abounding in the work of the Lord, knowing that your labor is not in vain in the Lord." Here, Ignatius emphasizes the importance of steadfast faith in Jesus’ sacrificial role.
Polycarp (c. 69-155 AD):

Letter to the Philippians 8:1: "He [Jesus] endured all things for our sakes, that we might live in him." This statement reflects the belief that Jesus' sufferings and death were on behalf of humanity, ensuring life for believers.
Patristic Interpretations and Theological Reflections
Justin Martyr (c. 100-165 AD):

Dialogue with Trypho 88: Justin discusses how Christ’s death served as a ransom for all sinners, indicating an early Christian understanding of the universal and future applicability of Jesus' sacrificial act.
Irenaeus (c. 130-202 AD):

Against Heresies 5.14.3: "He [Jesus] came to save all through means of Himself—all, I say, who through Him are born again to God—infants, and children, and boys, and youths, and old men." Irenaeus emphasizes the inclusive and redemptive nature of Christ's mission, implying a comprehensive salvation that spans all ages and times.

So-to sum this up--
The belief that Jesus died for the sins of humanity, including future sins, is deeply rooted in early Christian writings. The New Testament, particularly the Pauline epistles and the book of Hebrews, provides the foundational scriptural basis for this doctrine. Additionally, the writings of early Church Fathers like Clement of Rome, Ignatius of Antioch, and Polycarp further affirm this understanding, reflecting a consistent and widespread belief in the early Christian community. These early texts collectively highlight the sacrificial and redemptive nature of Jesus' death as a central tenet of Christian faith.

No need to respond
J.

 

[Davy]

Just working with the Scriptures-you don't and are none the wiser.

I don't "work" the Scriptures, which it sounds like you are trying to suggest. I KEEP the Scriptures, instead of going off on philosophical tangents to try and force outside ideas into them. This is why I proclaimed that what Apostle Paul said in Romans 3:25 he meant it exactly as written. But what did you... try to do? You tried to ADD into what Paul said, in an attempt to 'change' what he meant.

 

[Davy]

Early Christian writings, particularly those of the Church Fathers, provide substantial support for the belief that Jesus' death was a sacrificial act intended for the forgiveness of sins, including future sins. Here are some notable examples from the 1st and early 2nd centuries:
....

Your post is just cannon fodder.

The subject is NOT whether Christ's death on the cross was for the forgiveness of sins of those who believe, for it is.


The subject under discussion is about Romans 3:25 with what Apostle Paul said, which you don't believe. You instead try to change what Paul said...

Rom 3:25
25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in His blood, to declare His righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
KJV

 

[Davy]

Already explained, biblically-you need to put on your reading glasses.
J.

Only thing you've shown is that you... don't believe what Apostle Paul said about Faith on Christ's death and resurrection is for the remission of sins THAT ARE PAST (Romans 3:25).

What Paul said there doesn't fit men's false 'Once Saved, Always Saved' theory, now does it? No it does not. And no amount of trying to push other Scripture into the argument with attempting to change... what Paul said, just will not work!

Many brethren that believe on Jesus Christ today are being lied to with false OSAS ideas that all future sin is automatically forgiven by Jesus, when Paul showed it is not. Lot of money is made by false prosperity preachers pushing that OSAS lie. Someone ought to get those fakes to read their Bible more, as Jesus showed He will close the door on the five foolish virgins which represent believers on Him that will be deceived during the coming tribulation.

 

[Ritajanice]

How can The Spirit lie to our spirit, if we have been Born Again?

I believe the Living witness of God His Holy Spirit, which backs up His written word?

We are Born Of The Spirit?....what in us has been Born Of The Spirit?

Do you actually know what you have been Born Again of?

You need to be Born Again of imperishable/ incorruptible seed, which liveth and abideth forever....where does that seed liveth and abideth forever?

Who has said we were never without sin?

The seed is not the cross neither is it the gospel, it’s exactly what the word of God says it is....don’t add your own man made religion to Gods word as it makes no sense whatsoever....just manmade gobbly gook...

There is no confusion in Gods word ...as we have Gods Living witness leading us through His word to understand His word in the spirit.

To much intellect on what God’s word mean I see for many...lacking spiritual knowledge/ understanding....which can only come from the Spirit of God within us ....as and when he’s ready to bring us to that spiritual knowledge and understanding..

​

◄ 1 John 3:9 ►

​

Audio Crossref Comment Greek Verse (Click for Chapter) New International Version No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God. New Living Translation Those who have been born into God’s family do not make a practice of sinning, because God’s life is in them. So they can’t keep on sinning, because they are children of God. English Standard Version No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God’s seed abides in him; and he cannot keep on sinning, because he has been born of God. Berean Standard Bible Anyone born of God refuses to practice sin, because God’s seed abides in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God. Berean Literal Bible Anyone having been born of God does not practice sin, because His seed abides in him, and he is not able to continue sinning, because he has been born of God.

 

[ShineTheLight]

How can The Spirit lie to our spirit, if we have been Born Again?

I believe the Living witness of God His Holy Spirit, which backs up His written word?

We are Born Of The Spirit?....what in us has been Born Of The Spirit?

Do you actually know what you have been Born Again of?

You need to be Born Again of imperishable/ incorruptible seed, which liveth and abideth forever....where does that seed liveth and abideth forever?

Who has said we were never without sin?

​

◄ 1 John 3:9 ►

​

Audio Crossref Comment Greek Verse (Click for Chapter) New International Version No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God’s seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God. New Living Translation Those who have been born into God’s family do not make a practice of sinning, because God’s life is in them. So they can’t keep on sinning, because they are children of God. English Standard Version No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God’s seed abides in him; and he cannot keep on sinning, because he has been born of God. Berean Standard Bible Anyone born of God refuses to practice sin, because God’s seed abides in him; he cannot go on sinning, because he has been born of God. Berean Literal Bible Anyone having been born of God does not practice sin, because His seed abides in him, and he is not able to continue sinning, because he has been born of God.

This person in the video gives good explanation to that verse.

 

[Ritajanice]

This person in the video gives good explanation to that verse.

For some reason it won’t load on YouTube.

There is nowhere in scripture that says a “ Born Again “ I repeat “ Born Again “ can sin...

The Holy Spirit cannot indwell the heart / spirit of a sinner...their sins must be forgiven before we can become Born Of The Spirit.

One’s testimony on how they became Born Of Gods seed, which is the Living Spiritual birth...

Posting reams and reams of scripture and other people’s commentaries does NOT make one’s “ spirit Born Again “...only God via His Spirit....can do that supernatural act.

God is a Living Spirit....he is not a book...

You can read all about how one becomes Born Again in scripture....unfortunately to understand any of that...you must be Born Of The Spirit, Spirit gives birth to spirit, regenerated “....that can only be understood in our spirit, once God makes us Born Again via His Holy Spirit, who is Gods “ LIVING “ seed , that indwells our heart/ spirit...never ever to leave, we are one with God in spirit.....that can only come by “ heart” /Spirit revelation.

 

[Johann]

I don't "work" the Scriptures, which it sounds like you are trying to suggest. I KEEP the Scriptures, instead of going off on philosophical tangents to try and force outside ideas into them. This is why I proclaimed that what Apostle Paul said in Romans 3:25 he meant it exactly as written. But what did you... try to do? You tried to ADD into what Paul said, in an attempt to 'change' what he meant.

Cheers.
J.

 

[Johann]

Your post is just cannon fodder.

The subject is NOT whether Christ's death on the cross was for the forgiveness of sins of those who believe, for it is.


The subject under discussion is about Romans 3:25 with what Apostle Paul said, which you don't believe. You instead try to change what Paul said...

Rom 3:25
25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in His blood, to declare His righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
KJV

First time I hear Scriptures is referred to as "canon fodder" and you are still none the wiser.
Cheers
J.