Is it possible to lose salvation?

[Ronald Nolette]

Like Mary interceded at the wedding of cans and Jesus did as she said.

Paul says remember the traditions you were taught either by word of mouth or letters from us. Now you show us what traditions he was talking about. Be specific and use Scripture.

Well I would venture a guess that it was what was handed down from the Apostles and what was taught by Paul. Not everything that was sais became scripture but would not have contradicted what God decided would become Scripture. The word tradition here means teaching- not some practice or custom.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Rev. 5:8
And when he had taken it, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb. Each one had a harp and they were holding golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of God’s people.

This is the very picture of intercession. If it’s NOT – why are they carrying our prayers and taking them to the Lamb??

ntercession refers to the act of intervening on behalf of another, often in a context of prayer or influence.

• In a general sense, it can mean using one's influence to help someone else, such as seeking forgiveness from an authority.
  
  1
• In a religious context, it often refers to intercessory prayer, where one prays on behalf of others or asks a saint to pray for them.
  
  2
• 
  
  
  
  
  
  
• The term is also used in the Bible, emphasizing the importance of praying for others and includes various scriptural references.
  https://www.bing.com/ck/a?!&&p=ebb6...sZS12ZXJzZXMtYWJvdXQtaW50ZXJjZXNzaW9uLw&ntb=1
  Not it is not the very pictrue of intercession. You are making an assumption without evidence that the censors are the saints praying to God on behalf of earthly saints.
  

  No - it was passed down from Bishop to Bishop . . .
  
  They had a CHURCH to guide them – the SAME Church that eventually compiled and declared the Canon of Scripture in the 4th century. This was the Catholic Church. And because people rebelled against His Church - we no have thousands of sects that ALL teach different doctrines based on the individual interpretations of their founders who ALL claim to have been “led” to the "truth" . .

  Bishop/Pastor same thing. it was the catholic church small C. And they sought to reform the church by bringing it back from the corruption that caused the dark ages. And they had the Apostles and their writings to guide them. there was no centralized church like we understand it. If there was one it would have been all the churches Paul planted and nurtured.
  https://www.bing.com/ck/a?!&&p=ebb6...sZS12ZXJzZXMtYWJvdXQtaW50ZXJjZXNzaW9uLw&ntb=1
  
  

  • The problem arose when some rich men would have their own unauthorized translations copies that were filled with errors. Because of this, heretical teachings began to spread.
    At the Council of Toulouse (1229AD) – the Church forbade the owning of these flawed and error-filled Bibles

  
  The Roman Catholic Church historically forbade the reading of the Bible in one's native language during certain periods.
  • The Council of Toulouse (1229) and Council of Trent (1546) issued prohibitions against the laity possessing vernacular translations of the Bible, citing concerns over heresy and the potential for corrupt
  
  They were not heretical nor flawed any more than the vulgate was. they were translations form the most part by church doctors.
  

  I ALREADY have.
  It’s called Sacred Tradition, and its supported by Scripture (2 Thes 2:15, 1 Cor 11:2, 2 Tim 2:2, 1 Thes 2:13).

  And if the "sacred tradition" as romanism calls it, contradicts the written word of God, it is to be rejected and resisted at all costs.
  
  
  
  
  
  

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Absolutely. He just never gave it SOLE Authority over the Church as YOU believe

In matters oif how, when and where to worship and what form and how to build its buildings etc.etc. you are correct. Even in morals like what would constitute dress to that is tempting.

BUT in doctrine- the bible is the sole and full authority for the church. Any doctrine that contradicts god's Word is heretical and to be resisted and rejected at all costs.

 

[Grailhunter]

Sorry, but your Catholic nonsense is unscriptural, and false.

See, It was not Jesus's Literal Blood at the Last Supper, as if it was, he would have bled into the cup.
It was not Jesus's Litearl Body given at the Last Supper, as if it was, He would have cut a part of his flesh off and given it to them .

Jesus knows that the OT that He authored by the HOLY Spirit says that its an abomination before God to drink blood and eat human flesh.
You dont know this, because you are a not a real student of the bible. .. @Grailhunter

Now....When did Jesus offer His blood and body LITERALLY?? = He offered it LITERALLY when they whipped Him and Crucified Him, and His BLOOD was thereby shed, and His Body literally given on THE CROSS.

Have not mentioned anything Catholic. You need to keep your time periods straight.

See, It was not Jesus's Literal Blood at the Last Supper, as if it was, he would have bled into the cup.

Again Christ said.....this is my blood.....not this is symbolizes My blood. This is My blood that I shed for the New Covenant. Even if Christ says it, you do not believe it. Maybe it would be easier for you to throw your Bible away and start your own religion.

See, It was not Jesus's Literal Blood at the Last Supper, as if it was, he would have bled into the cup.

And Baptism is just for keeping Christians clean. Too much non-sense with you.

 

[LoveYeshua]

Wrong again.
When describing it He said “truly truly. And when He performed the Bread and Wine Ritual He said “This is my blood…” Not… this symbolizes My blood.

Paul understood the direct divine connection….

23 For I received from the Lord what I also passed on to you: The Lord Jesus, on the night he was betrayed, took bread, 24 and when he had given thanks, he broke it and said, “This is my body, which is for you; do this in remembrance of me.” 25 In the same way, after supper he took the cup, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood; do this, whenever you drink it, in remembrance of me.” 26 For whenever you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death until he comes. 27 So then, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord. 28 Everyone ought to examine themselves before they eat of the bread and drink from the cup. 29 For those who eat and drink without discerning the body of Christ eat and drink judgment on themselves. 1st Corinthians 11:23-29

And early Christian writers understood the miracle of the Lord’s body and blood in the Bread and Wine Ritual…..

Irenaeus teaches that the bread and wine are really the Lord’s body and blood. His witness is, indeed, all the more impressive because he produces it quite incidentally while refuting the Gnostic and Docetic rejection of the Lord’s real humanity.

If the Lord were from other than the Father, how could he rightly take bread, which is of the same creation as our own, and confess it to be his body and affirm that the mixture in the cup is his blood?

Hippolytus speaks of ‘the body and the blood’ through which the Church is saved, and Tertullian regularly describes the bread as ‘the Lord’s body.

Ignatius of Antioch Take note of those who hold heterodox opinions on the grace of Jesus Christ which has come to us, and see how contrary their opinions are to the mind of God. . . . They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer because they do not confess that the Eucharist is the flesh of our Savior Jesus Christ, flesh which suffered for our sins and which that Father, in his goodness, raised up again. They who deny the gift of God are perishing in their disputes.

Justin Martyr For not as common bread nor common drink do we receive these; but since Jesus Christ our Savior was made incarnate by the word of God and had both flesh and blood for our salvation, so too, as we have been taught, the food which has been made into the Eucharist by the Eucharistic prayer set down by him, and by the change of which our blood and flesh is nurtured, is both the flesh and the blood of that incarnated Jesus.

I have said what I know is the truth of the matter as scripture explains it. You can have a different opinion it is your choice you can also follow the teachings or writings of others is it pleases you. We all have free will but there is only one truth, it is for you to use discernment to find it.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Have not mentioned anything Catholic. You need to keep your time periods straight.


Again Christ said.....this is my blood.....not this is symbolizes My blood. This is My blood that I shed for the New Covenant. Even if Christ says it, you do not believe it. Maybe it would be easier for you to throw your Bible away and start your own religion.



And Baptism is just for keeping Christians clean. Too much non-sense with you.

The flesh at the last supper.

and the flesh in John 6.

are these the same, and does everyone who eat each type all recieve the same thing?

 

[LoveYeshua]

LoveYeshua
That fact that something is in remembrance...
does not state HOW it is to be remembered.


Also, I'd like to say that Jesus did say IN REMEMBRANCE of Me.
There is a difference between memory and remembrance:

Memory involves the brain's capability to store, retain, and recall information and experiences, making it a fundamental component of cognitive function and learning. Whereas remembrance is more specific and often associated with the act of honoring or commemorating past events or individuals, usually in a formal or ceremonial context.


For anyone that might be interested...this is a good link:

Memory vs. Remembrance — What’s the Difference?

Memory encapsulates cognitive recall of past experiences, while remembrance is the deliberate act of recalling or honoring those memories.

www.askdifference.com

i know this and i quoted it and what it meant

LoveYeshua
You can explain John 6 any way that you deem appropritate.

I like to read the NT plainly and simply.
Jesus said TRULY TRULY IOW,,,,pay attention I'm going to say something important.
Then He went on to make some statements that were so extreme that it caused some to leave.

He didn't ask them to come back because they misunderstood...
He, instead, asked the Apostles if they TOO were going to leave because of this difficult saying that is hard to accept.

Receiving Him means all that you have stated.
But we RECEIVE Jesus even sans communion.

@Grailhunter
the Key of this matter is here and it proves definitely what Jesus said about eating his flesh and drinking his blood is not literal and it explains also why some cannot grasp the meaning of it.

Jhn 6:63 The Spirit gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life.

Jhn 6:64 However, there are some of you who do not believe.” (For Jesus had known from the beginning which of them did not believe and who would betray Him.)

Jhn 6:65 Then Jesus said, “This is why I told you that no one can come to Me unless the Father has granted it to him.”

Jesus Was clear on this whole matter. this is also why Jesus spoke in parables.

 

[ProDeo]

So the “unanswered question” — What happens to the bread and wine during this ritual? — Scripture does not spell out a change in their substance. Jesus said, “Do this in remembrance of Me” (Luke 22:19),

That and nothing more.

 

[ProDeo]

Just a side note, nothing happens to the bread and wine during consecration. As Augustine explain the "accidents of bread and wine remain" but the substance has changed.

If Jesus is really in the substance as you believe then you would fall flat on your face because of His holiness.

 

[Grailhunter]

I have said what I know is the truth of the matter as scripture explains it. You can have a different opinion it is your choice you can also follow the teachings or writings of others is it pleases you. We all have free will but there is only one truth, it is for you to use discernment to find it.

Christ says the truth.... my opinion and your opinion does not matter. There is not even room here for interpretation as to what Christ said, what the Apostles believed and said, and what early Christian writers attested to.

You are free to write your own Bible….that is what the Jehovah’s Witnesses did.

 

[ProDeo]

The were among the first denomination. ...
The 1st "church" are the first born again Christians........so, you want to read John 20:22 and Acts 2, and find out who that is, and none were Catholics.

On the part I colored blue, the word catholic in Greek means "universal" or "all-inclusive", the body of Christ. Not to be confused with the Roman Catholic, just one of the many branches. The early Church started well, things went wrong when the church became a state religion.

 

[Behold]

On the part I colored blue, the word catholic in Greek means "universal" or "all-inclusive", the body of Christ. Not to be confused with the Roman Catholic, just one of the many branches. The early Church started well, things went wrong when the church became a state religion.

During Most of the history of the MaryCult...........they concluded that only their religion/denomination was the "One true Church" and all other Christitans, were not a part of it, unless you joined THEM.

So, the word Catholic does means "universal" but the True CC has never been universally accepting of other denominations.
In fact they murder other Christians who would not join THEM.....or accept THEIR Teaching.

Its "twisted clever"" to call your church "universal" and then it becomes a lie when the "one true church"......is their ONLY idea of Christianity, and all other Christians are "false".

 

[Behold]

Have not mentioned anything Catholic.

When you teach that the Communion or the Last Supper is the : "literal body of Jesus and literal blood" then you are teaching 100% Catholic (MaryCult) Theology.
And if that Priest ever puts that Catholic Wafer in your mouth, they will tell you that that is the LITERAL Body of Jesus, and that wine or grape juice is the LITERAL blood of Jesus.

Welcome to CATHOLIC Theology.......its as false as false can be.

Again Christ said.....this is my blood.....not this is symbolizes My blood.

But its not His blood, literally, during the last Supper.
As His blood was running inside His veins and was going to be poured out of them, not too many hours later, as the LITERAL Sacrifice of Jesus's body and Blood.

See : "The Cross" for the update on Jesus's literal body and blood being given for the sin of the world, and that is not symbolic.

And Baptism is just for keeping Christians clean.

Sin is in your heart.
Remember?
So, can water baptism cleanse your heart?
The MaryCult will tell you that it "washes away you sin"..
Now.....Can water touch the sin on the inside of you, @Grailhunter ?
If so, the next time you commit that favorite carnal deed, then take a shower and you're good to go.......right?

 

[GodsGrace]

You posted that the early "non jewish" Christians were defined as "THe Way, and "Christians".

And that is correct.
We all know the Apostles were Jewish Behold.

What I was stating referred to what name Christianity came to be known.
Again...it was
THE WAY
CHRISTIAN
CATHOLIC

The POINT being that the Catholic church is the first and original church.

Since you cannot defend this...
you'd like to go down a rabbit hole about who was included in THE WAY?

The Way referred to the first Jews that believed in Jesus
AND
the Gentiles to whom Paul was preaching.

You could look this up in church history.

Im helping you to understand, (after your 50 yrs of study), that the Jewish Apostles were defined as being of "the Way" and "Christians".
Hopefully it wont take you 50 more yrs "of study" to realize it.

But you're forgetting that the Apostles were told to teach and baptize all nations, which they did.
And some real study on your part would help you to understand what Jesus taught much better.....

You don't even know which denomination goes back to the beginning.....
sad. Start your studying NOW.

 

[GodsGrace]

During Most of the history of the MaryCult...........they concluded that only their religion/denomination was the "One true Church" and all other Christitans, were not a part of it, unless you joined THEM.

So, the word Catholic does means "universal" but the True CC has never been universally accepting of other denominations.
In fact they murder other Christians who would not join THEM.....or accept THEIR Teaching.

Its "twisted clever"" to call your church "universal" and then it becomes a lie when the "one true church"......is their ONLY idea of Christianity, and all other Christians are "false".

@ProDeo is absolutely correct Behold.
You could learn from him.

You say that the CC has never been universally accepted by other denominations.

LEARN SOME HISTORY Behold.

There WERE NO OTHER DENOMINATIONS in the early church.
There were a lot of heretical ideas circulation...
if you want to call that a denomination....

The present day was there to dispute and abolish these heresies.
NO OTHER denomination was present.

Please state which denomination that is present today was also present right after Jesus.

 

[GodsGrace]

The were among the first denomination. ...
The 1st "church" are the first born again Christians........so, you want to read John 20:22 and Acts 2, and find out who that is, and none were Catholics.

Well Behold....
looks like you don't know the difference between
church
and
Church.

Something else for you to learn.
It's kind of important.

 

[GodsGrace]

Christs Church…is with IN a man.

A Gathering of men…hearing the Gospel of Jesus Christ…heard the Gospel, in open fields, in town squares, in the Temple, in Synagogue's, in homes, Long before A group of men decided to appoint themselves as the Teachers and Preachers of “the Universe”.

The “Universe”… Bold…funny. Since mans habitat / estate is Earth, and the Universe includes the cosmos… The estate of holy angels.
Quite Confident, holy angels Have “the Highest Ranking Cleric”! (And it is not the Catholic Church)

Nice try.

How about reply to my post no. 2218?

And you think John 15:2 is explained by what you wrote above?

No wonder Christianity is in trouble.

You could try again...


What does this mean?

John 15:2
2“Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit, He takes away;


Does that sound to you like a born again believer is saved forever??
Jesus wouldn't agree with you.

 

[GodsGrace]

We all begin our Natural Life IN Sin…
Which means: Against God.

We all have opportunity to hear and Learn ABOUT God, and Freely Choose To Believe (Accept God) or Not Believe (Continue standing AGAINST God.)

Do you really Believe men…who Give their Heartful true word of Belief and their bodily Life unto Death, confirming their Belief…
And ARE blessed with Gods Gift of Salvation…
Continue TO SIN…(ie. Stand Against God)?

Glory to God,
Taken

Uhhh.
That post wasn't to YOU.

Of course we're on an open board and you can reply to it....

But how about replying to MY posts to YOU instead?

A reply to 2218 would be appreciated.

Tough, isn't it?

 

[GodsGrace]

i know this and i quoted it and what it meant


@Grailhunter
the Key of this matter is here and it proves definitely what Jesus said about eating his flesh and drinking his blood is not literal and it explains also why some cannot grasp the meaning of it.

Jhn 6:63 The Spirit gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life.

Jhn 6:64 However, there are some of you who do not believe.” (For Jesus had known from the beginning which of them did not believe and who would betray Him.)

Jhn 6:65 Then Jesus said, “This is why I told you that no one can come to Me unless the Father has granted it to him.”

Jesus Was clear on this whole matter. this is also why Jesus spoke in parables.

I used to think this.
The problem began when I found out what
John 6:53 means.

What do YOU think it means LoveYeshua?

 

[Behold]

And that is correct.
We all know the Apostles were Jewish Behold.

But you left them out. (Apostles), and (Jewish Christians) ........when you posted that it was Gentiles only who were "of the way".

Goodness. , how many more times do i need to show you this?

The POINT being that the Catholic church is the first and original church.

The only "church" is the body of Christ.......The Christians.

Now, all This stuff..

Catholic.
Baptist
Methodist
AOG
Church of Christ
Ect...

See all those?

Those are "denominations"........that contain Christians.

Now the word "Catholic" means "universal"......but this is a lie regarding the MaryCult as they do not exactly accept those other denominations as being "the one true Church"..
And certainly, you would not try to be dishonest about that....as you know that the MaryCult falsely proclaimes itself as the ONLY= "ONE TRUE Church".. wich means that all others, like those in my list are ...not "TRUE", According to false MaryCult teaching.

You could look this up in church history.

I teach the early History regarding the Local Assemblies that were found in people's Houses. (churches).
Do you rememver when...Ananias and Sapphira tried to cheat the local church, and God killed them, in the Church?
Well, noone there was a Catholic, and that "church" was in someone house........as those are your "early church"... = churches.

Have you seen me post this ... <B><, that i sometimes sign as my "sig"..........see that fish. ???
Ive posted it for about 20 yrs on "christian forums".. including Christianforums.net
That FISH....symbolizes the "fishers of men" that is the "early Church"... or "The Way"......Its what they used as their symbol = the "Icthus"

But you're forgetting that the Apostles were told to teach and baptize all nations, which they did.

Water baptism does not make anyone a Christian......if it did then all those Jews that John the Baptist baptized for "remission of sin", would be Christian.
They weren't.

Also, your Mark 16... says to "make Disciples."""
It does not say to make Christians., as there is no GOSPEL in Mark 16.....as the "repent and be water baptized".. is not The Gospel.
Listen , I can dunk an unbeliever 345 times, and i can say....>>"In Jesus, name"... or "Father, Son, Holy Spirit" and they come out of the water 345 times.. And after i said that,. this sinner....water baptized 345 times....,is stil not born again., is not forgiven, and is still going to Hell.

You don't even know which denomination goes back to the beginning.....

None of the Apostles were Catholics.
Mary was not a Catholic.
Just read a bible, and it'll show you that there were none.
A.) Noone in the NT is a Catholic.
The MaryCult decided that Peter was a Catholic......their first Pope, after he is dead.
Had they tried that trick when He was alive, he would have "cast them out".
See, the MaryCult has this fascination with giving people MaryCult TITLES after they die, that have nothing to do with the Bible.

So, all this MaryCult nonsense, started with MaryCult Church Fathers........and those are not Apostles.