Why I don't believe in a pretrib rapture

[soberxp]

From the time of Paul, all the generations have looked forward to the rapture as happening before they die.(the Great Hope)..and Yes, it could come before my death since I am of the last generation which began around 1947 or so. Since a generation is 20 years, 1967 would fulfill that twenty years. That would make those at that time 58...Where I am 74 it is likely I will not see the Rapture simply because my number is very short. At that time it, the rapture will not matter for I will be with Jesus after I die..Yet, the Rapture is an event that will happen and I believe during this time period. Keep in mind after the Rapture, the anti-christ must come to enough power to rule the world in order to enforce the covenant the Jews made with Death and Hell (Isa 28:14-22). There could be a pattern of 38-40 years before Daniel's 70th week would start. (the 38-40 years in the wilderness is a pattern that has not yet been repeated.

If you are still on earth when the Rapture Event happens, there will be no true believers on earth immediately after this event. There will be "elect" of God who will have to loose their heads for Jesus Christ. Known as the tribulation saints, they are a martyred group of Saints who are held under the altar in Rev 6:9-11. They have to make a choice in the mark of the beast or loosing their heads.

You still don't see the lies in it. If a person is taken away (raptrue) alive, how can he declare that he can accept/receive the resurrection.

Is he greater than Moses, Elijah, Enoch,and so on. And Equal to Jesus Christ, even Jesus Christ experienced death.

 

[Bladerunner]

You still don't see the lies in it. If a person is taken away (raptrue) alive, how can he declare that he can accept/receive the resurrection.

Because this person is already part of His Church. God will justify them according to his clock. They in the Church have already been judged and simply await the rapture to reunite their Souls (in Heaven) with their Bodies from the Grave. One has to repent (turn away from the everyday life of sin). It does not for you to accept Jesus but rather Having faith in Him without fail.

 

[soberxp]

Because this person is already part of His Church. God will justify them according to his clock. They in the Church have already been judged and simply await the rapture to reunite their Souls (in Heaven) with their Bodies from the Grave. One has to repent (turn away from the everyday life of sin). It does not for you to accept Jesus but rather Having faith in Him without fail.

Incomprehensible, has no ability to distinguish, people alive can receive the resurrection, do you think this sentence is reasonable?

What is resurrection? Pls definition

 

[Bladerunner]

Incomprehensible, has no ability to distinguish, people alive can receive the resurrection, do you think this sentence is reasonable?

the resurrection is not something one receives. The resurrection is of the Body so that it can be reunited with the Soul from either Hades (Hell) or Paradise(Heaven). The resurrection of those in the grave, who died in the name of the Lord Jesus will be resurrected and reunited with their Souls from Heaven...Then the body's of both the living and those just resurrected will be transfigured so that they (Body and Soul) live in Heaven. Following this, we are told we will have a have a Bema Judgement for all the Church. After the millennium, Jesus and His Church saints will have a wedding dinner (rev 19:7-10) before He comes back to earth in the Clouds to bring Judgement to the World.

 

[soberxp]

the resurrection is not something one receives. The resurrection is of the Body so that it can be reunited with the Soul from either Hades (Hell) or Paradise(Heaven). The resurrection of those in the grave, who died in the name of the Lord Jesus will be resurrected and reunited with their Souls from Heaven...Then the body's of both the living and those just resurrected will be transfigured so that they (Body and Soul) live in Heaven. Following this, we are told we will have a have a Bema Judgement for all the Church. After the millennium, Jesus and His Church saints will have a wedding dinner (rev 19:7-10) before He comes back to earth in the Clouds to bring Judgement to the World.

So read your own explanation again....
The resurrection of those in the grave, who died in the name of the Lord Jesus

 

[Bladerunner]

So read your own explanation again....
The resurrection of those in the grave, who died in the name of the Lord Jesus

Resurrection is not something (one receives) while they are alive......oops, for got to put that in...getting late.

 

[Bladerunner]

Resurrection is not something (one receives) while they are alive......oops, for got to put that in...getting late.

going to have to fire my secretary, typing is bad.

 

[Taken]

Eh... "soul" is an overloaded word. Not every book of the Bible means the same thing when it uses this word.

E.g. the Psalms use 'soul' as a synonym for 'person.' Other books use it as a synonym for 'spirit.' Paul uses it as an antonym for 'spirit.'

Danggit Paul, why you gotta be so complicated?

Actually Paul is giving bits of knowledge that pertains to “a soul”.

A mankind of body With a soul is a person.
A mankind of body Without a soul, is not a person…
It is a dead body, cadaver, corpse, remains.

A souls “life” is Gods breath.
God is Spirit, thus His Life IN a soul, is spirit.

 

[Taken]

You still don't see the lies in it.

Disagree.
Bladerunner is speaking with the concept of Spiritual Understanding….which doesn’t necessarily resonate with Carnal Understanding.

If a person is taken away (raptrue) alive, how can he declare that he can accept/receive the resurrection.

Not IF, but when a person is Raptured, he has already fulfilled his One Death Requirement…
“Crucified” with Jesus.
No one “agrees” per'se’ with “resurrection”.

Resurrections have been happening for centuries, to this day.
It means a body has died, it’s living soul has departed its body, God returns the living soul to the body and the body resumes living.

At the end of days of all Human Earthly Mortal Life…they With the Lord God… will have been Raised up in a new body that which can Never Again Die.

Rapture…is The Lord Jesus saving, rising up whom HE has Saved, for the past 2,000 + years.
“First” Resurrection, at the end of mortals, is God raising up, whom He has saved…from the Beginning, Adam, 4,000 years, Hebrews, ISRAEL, Jews, and all Gentiles that believed IN Him. ( but did not know Jesus or believe Jesus was the Christ )

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[soberxp]

Disagree.
Bladerunner is speaking with the concept of Spiritual Understanding….which doesn’t necessarily resonate with Carnal Understanding.



Not IF, but when a person is Raptured, he has already fulfilled his One Death Requirement…
“Crucified” with Jesus.
No one “agrees” per'se’ with “resurrection”.

Resurrections have been happening for centuries, to this day.
It means a body has died, it’s living soul has departed its body, God returns the living soul to the body and the body resumes living.

At the end of days of all Human Earthly Mortal Life…they With the Lord God… will have been Raised up in a new body that which can Never Again Die.

Rapture…is The Lord Jesus saving, rising up whom HE has Saved, for the past 2,000 + years.
“First” Resurrection, at the end of mortals, is God raising up, whom He has saved…from the Beginning, Adam, 4,000 years, Hebrews, ISRAEL, Jews, and all Gentiles that believed IN Him. ( but did not know Jesus or believe Jesus was the Christ )

Glory to God,
Taken

This is obviously another gospel, and I don't want to say why, so why take some people and not others, It's like some people have to face something, others don't,

You don't need to add more explanation or introduction to it, because it doesn't make sense from the start.


The author writes that those who are still alive will........"raptrue"(it is not a Biblical word)
The living include the author himself, so is he experienced what you said "raptrue"(it is not a Biblical word)

 

[Taken]

This is obviously another gospel, and I don't want to say why, so why take some people and not others, It's like some people have to face something, others don't,

You don't need to add more explanation or introduction to it, because it doesn't make sense from the start.


The author writes that those who are still alive will........"raptrue"(it is not a Biblical word)
The living include the author himself, so is he experienced what you said "raptrue"(it is not a Biblical word)

Rapture is an English Word “Meaning” caught up.

Rapture is transliterated from other languages, to English, “meaning” caught up.

Caught up is Biblical.

If you think another is preaching a “different” gospel…best to be understanding of your own gospel in order to recognize what IS different.

 

[soberxp]

Rapture is an English Word “Meaning” caught up.

Rapture is transliterated from other languages, to English, “meaning” caught up.

Caught up is Biblical.

If you think another is preaching a “different” gospel…best to be understanding of your own gospel in order to recognize what IS different.

Since the author didn't use that word, who is forcing the word is.

In my,eyes the word rapture = rape true.

 

[Taken]

Since the author didn't use that word, who is forcing the word is.

The Transcribers used their own languages WORDS that mean “caught up, snatch, seize, rise up, take”

In my,eyes the word rapture = rape true.View attachment 71005

Rape is a type of Force, without consent.

Catching Up… is A Force of Taking by Gods Power, of those WHO HAVE Consented.

The common denominator is FORCE.
The Difference is ONLY those who “consented” will be Forced, taken up, Raptured, by Gods Power.

 

[JLB]

As @JLB has stated, and with which I agree, the rapture and the resurrection are one event and happen simultaneously.

‘Amen.

 

[JLB]

Since the author didn't use that word, who is forcing the word is.

In my,eyes the word rapture = rape true.View attachment 71005

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15

• that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord

Those who are alive and remain on earth will be caught up with the dead in Christ, to be gathered together with the Lord, at His coming.


For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17

• Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them

 

[soberxp]

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15

• that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord

Those who are alive and remain on earth will be caught up with the dead in Christ, to be gathered together with the Lord, at His coming.


For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17

• Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them

remain can be means dead bodies.

Then we who are alive and dead bodies with the dead in Christ.

What shall be caught up together with dead in Christ.

The still alive now and will be dead bodies.

 

[JLB]

remain can be means dead bodies.

The dead in Christ will rise first.

Remember we are discussing what occurs at His coming.

• And the dead in Christ will rise first.

For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17

• Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.

 

[soberxp]

The dead in Christ will rise first.

Remember we are discussing what occurs at His coming.

• And the dead in Christ will rise first.

For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17

• Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.

In the Bible there is only the first resurrection, no second, only the second death.
No matter what you call it rise first, seems there is only one resurrection, the first resurrection.

And the dead in Christ will rise first.

Here the rise first,He stressed that these dead with Christ.

But there are those who do not want to die with Christ.

 

[GodsGrace]

It's like drawing a snake and then adding legs to it.
Pain the lily is not chinese expression.the one above is.

You mean that it's like adding something that is not true...
to something that is true?

Yes. Many Christians do this.

 

[Wick Stick]

Actually Paul is giving bits of knowledge that pertains to “a soul”.

A mankind of body With a soul is a person.
A mankind of body Without a soul, is not a person…
It is a dead body, cadaver, corpse, remains.

A souls “life” is Gods breath.
God is Spirit, thus His Life IN a soul, is spirit.

Paul defines "soul" in his letters similarly to the Greek philosophers before him - Plato, Aristotle, etc.

David and Moses and Ezekiel don't use that definition. When they say "soul" they usually just mean "person" or "self."

We shouldn't take Paul's use of the word and read it backwards into things written a thousand years earlier. It leads to weird theology.