WHAT IS MEANT IN HEBREWS SAYING THERE IS NO MORE SACRIFICE FOR SINS?

[JLB]

If you don't continue in your confidence to the end, you were not made a partaker of Christ.

‘Those are your words, that come from a Calvinist mindset.

They are certainly not what the scripture itself states.


Beware, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief in departing from the living God; but exhort one another daily, while it is called “Today,” lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. For we have become partakers of Christ if we hold the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end. Hebrews 3:12-14

• departing from the living God;

Please answer my question:

How can a car depart from a garage it was never in?

How can a person depart from the army they were never in?

Like in the parable of the sower, some seed sprouted up but then withered away, because it had no root. An emotional experience, but not regeneration.

‘That is certainly not what the scripture says.

These on rocky soil were persecuted BECAUSE they were Christians and while under persecution they chose to renounce Christ in order to save their life.


Wow brother, you really need to shed that Calvinism stronghold actually study the word under the guidance of the Spirit.

 

[JLB]

There are nominal Christians.

‘Could you give me a scripture that the term “nominal Christian” so I can see what you mean?

 

[ProverbsInPink]

If you don't continue in your confidence to the end, you were not made a partaker of Christ. This is the plain saying of the passage. And this agrees with other Scripture.

Like in the parable of the sower, some seed sprouted up but then withered away, because it had no root. An emotional experience, but not regeneration.

You can know the truth, but not be born again. And then you give up on what you know, and depart, but you've still never been born again.

Much love!

@marks, are you a Calvinist?

 

[ProverbsInPink]

‘Could you give me a scripture that the term “nominal Christian” so I can see what you mean?

What defines nominal Christianity?

 

[JLB]

I think that is not a good analogy.

How can a person depart from the army they were never in?


Strongs G868 - Fall away

1. to make stand off, cause to withdraw, to remove
   1. to excite to revolt
2. to stand off, to stand aloof
   1. to go away, to depart from anyone
   2. to desert, withdraw from one
   3. to fall away, become faithless
   4. to shun, flee from
   5. to cease to vex one
   6. to withdraw one's self from, to fall away
   7. to keep one's self from, absent one's self from

 

[David in NJ]

Not at all
Hebrews is written to believing Israel NOT us. Israel is under covenant not us. In the new covenant there is still no offering for willful sin
This is I thought helpful in understanding Hebrew 10:26. Its not about our salvation.

Doug,
You are under the spell of 'dispensationalism'

Escape with your life now = run to the LORD Jesus Christ and pray for your heart, soul and mind to love Him and His Truth

 

[David in NJ]

Yes, the bride to be can know God before she is married, and sin. But she is not yet as one flesh (saved in Christ).

Salvation is the marriage.

When is the Marriage?

 

[marks]

@marks, are you a Calvinist?

No I am not. Thank you for asking!

Much love!

 

[ProverbsInPink]

How can a person depart from the army they were never in?


Strongs G868 - Fall away

1. to make stand off, cause to withdraw, to remove
   1. to excite to revolt
2. to stand off, to stand aloof
   1. to go away, to depart from anyone
   2. to desert, withdraw from one
   3. to fall away, become faithless
   4. to shun, flee from
   5. to cease to vex one
   6. to withdraw one's self from, to fall away
   7. to keep one's self from, absent one's self from

You didn't read the link.

God knows who are his own. We cannot presume to judge.

Especially not from a platform that presumes to judge based first and foremost when they are predisposed to contempt for a particular denomination. Which then blinds them to understanding God's teachings.

 

[Always]

It is the Time factor that causes this all to seem iffy. Within time we see things unfolding that in God are not, but are in Him "finished" even before the foundation of the world. This perspective is light through the prism of Christ, who He himself is not divided or in process as we would appear to be. This is the illusion of Time in which we are cast for our time of decision--a decision, which in God is a foregone conclusion--"finished."

The answer here, is that when we too can say "I am", we are. Even so, Time by nature hauntingly hold to doubt. Thus, we are told to endure.

In my own case, in my own experience, God took me from not knowing and not believing--passing over any time of believing--to knowing. He did that. I was unknowingly dead, but then and now alive. Having done nothing and given no opportunity or time to doubt--literally removed from time, then returned to it knowing. It is with and in that timeless knowledge that I now have no choice but to speak. Still, though it was given to me, none of it is mine except in Him.

As for the Bride, first comes the marriage--which is salvation--then comes the wedding feast. Therefore He said in the order in which it comes, "Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me."

hmmm, I understand what you are saying.....

 

[ProverbsInPink]

No I am not. Thank you for asking!

Much love!

I didn't think so.
I just wanted something on the record from the latest member whose soteriology is dismissed by those who make false accusations against them in their concerted effort to distort the truth of the Gospel.

 

[marks]

Those are your words, that come from a Calvinist mindset.

I'm not Calvinist.

How can a person depart from the army they were never in?

There are a number of passages that many people take as saying that the born again can become dead again but the Bible does not say that.

Many shall depart from the faith, but that doesn't mean they were regenerated and now become flesh again. We use the plain to interpret the less than plain.

I've already shown you one passage that doesn't mean what you've though it meant. We can look at them all one by one if you like. Here are two passages that are exceedingly plain, and leave no room for what you suggest.

1 John 3:1-3 KJV
1) Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
2) Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
3) And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.

If you are born again now, you shall be like Jesus when He appears. No caveats. No other conditions. Only, Now we are the sons of God, and when He appears, will shall shall shall be like Him.

Colossians 3:1-4 KJV
1) If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
2) Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
3) For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
4) When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

If you are raised with Christ now . . . you shall also appear with Him in glory. No caveats, not other conditions, only, if you are raised with Him now you shall appear with Him in glory.

Plainly stated. Simple message. No caveats. And if you think any verse says otherwise, then you have a serious problem, because that would mean a contradition in the Bible.

Bonus round:

Philippians 3:20-21 KJV
20) For our conversation (citizenship) is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:
21) Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

If you are a citizen of heaven, Jesus will transform your body to be like His.

When you are born again, your old man is crucified. Do you suppose God will resurrect your flesh old man so you can return to that life? Nothing in Scripture even hints at this.

Much love!

 

[ProverbsInPink]

Doug,
You are under the spell of 'dispensationalism'

Escape with your life now = run to the LORD Jesus Christ and pray for your heart, soul and mind to love Him and His Truth

Are you saying Doug is not a Christian?

 

[marks]

These on rocky soil were persecuted BECAUSE they were Christians and while under persecution they chose to renounce Christ in order to save their life.

Matthew 13:20-21 KJV
20) But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
21) Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.

No, they were not Christians.

Much love!

 

[ProverbsInPink]

I'm not Calvinist.


There are a number of passages that many people take as saying that the born again can become dead again but the Bible does not say that.

Many shall depart from the faith, but that doesn't mean they were regenerated and now become flesh again. We use the plain to interpret the less than plain.

I've already shown you one passage that doesn't mean what you've though it meant. We can look at them all one by one if you like. Here are two passages that are exceedingly plain, and leave no room for what you suggest.

1 John 3:1-3 KJV
1) Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not.
2) Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
3) And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.

If you are born again now, you shall be like Jesus when He appears. No caveats. No other conditions. Only, Now we are the sons of God, and when He appears, will shall shall shall be like Him.

Colossians 3:1-4 KJV
1) If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
2) Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
3) For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
4) When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

If you are raised with Christ now . . . you shall also appear with Him in glory. No caveats, not other conditions, only, if you are raised with Him now you shall appear with Him in glory.

Plainly stated. Simple message. No caveats. And if you think any verse says otherwise, then you have a serious problem, because that would mean a contradition in the Bible.

Bonus round:

Philippians 3:20-21 KJV
20) For our conversation (citizenship) is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:
21) Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

If you are a citizen of heaven, Jesus will transform your body to be like His.

When you are born again, your old man is crucified. Do you suppose God will resurrect your flesh old man so you can return to that life? Nothing in Scripture even hints at this.

Much love!

The Bible is clear we can never lose God's gift of His grace through Salvation. We did not work to attain it. We cannot work to lose it.
God leads His Elect to Jesus. Unless this occurs we cannot come into the embrace of Jesus and be reborn.

Just as with the parable in John 3 and Nicodemus. Rebirth in Christ is eternal.

According to some, we can lose Salvation. Which then implies we lose our regeneration,rebirth.

I'm new to all these frictions here. I have come to the conclusion those who do this aren't really in the word.
Their focus seems to be attack against the Gospel and believers.

It isn't that they expend the effort to know what is in the new testament books. No. Instead they accuse Calvinism. And think that's suppose to invalidate anything anyone says about the Gospel afterward.

Foolishness comes at great price.

 

[Muna]

When is the Marriage?

I was just looking at this last night myself, looking at the espousal thing between Mary and Joseph and before they came together and Paul's espousal of them to Christ in a similar comparitive manner.

Mary was espoused to Joseph

Matt 1:18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together,
she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.

Paul said, here, "I have espoused you to one husband" (almost like the friend of the bridgroom, as was John)

2 Cr 11:2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.

In Matt 1:18 it says,

It says, "before they came together, she was found with child (which is Jesus in Mary according to the flesh) of the Holy Ghost"

Whereas here in Paul says (before the same come together) he travailed with them this way

Gal 4:19 My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you (according to the Spirit)

Because a Paul points out here,

Ephes 5:30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

Ephes 5:31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

Ephes 5:32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

He espouses them as a virgin to Christ (2 Cr 11:2)

2 Cr 11:2 For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.

But wouldnt the birth of Christ somewhat mirror the same shown in Mary (but not according to the flesh) but the Spirit?

The birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise (insert Mat 12:49 in the place of Mary ) and so before they came together, she/they were found with child of the Holy Ghost (or Christ being formed in them) of whom Paul travailed.

In the one would have Christ in them according to the flesh (in Mary) whereas in the other would have Christ formed in them (insert Matt 12:49) according to the Spirit.

Then ofcourse we also have two sets of virgins presented to us (they which are called the wise and also the foolish). And while the foolish went out to buy, its then that they that were ready went into the marriage

Matt 25:10 And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut.

And as the wise were ready and went into the marriage, it similarly says in Rev 19:7 that "his wife hath made herself ready"

Rev 19:7 Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.

All that to show the one espoused in both pictures are still referred to as the wife before they even come together.

What might your thoughts be on this?

Edit: typo

 

[Muna]

That wasnt really too clear was it?
Sorry, I gotta rethink how to word that better.

 

[marks]

The Bible is clear we can never lose God's gift of His grace through Salvation. We did not work to attain it. We cannot work to lose it.
God leads His Elect to Jesus. Unless this occurs we cannot come into the embrace of Jesus and be reborn.

Just as with the parable in John 3 and Nicodemus. Rebirth in Christ is eternal.

According to some, we can lose Salvation. Which then implies we lose our regeneration,rebirth.

I'm new to all these frictions here. I have come to the conclusion those who do this aren't really in the word.
Their focus seems to be attack against the Gospel and believers.

It isn't that they expend the effort to know what is in the new testament books. No. Instead they accuse Calvinism. And think that's suppose to invalidate anything anyone says about the Gospel afterward.

Foolishness comes at great price.

The seeking for truth, and trying "win" a debate are very different things, aren't they? It's always good to know what our own motivation are, I should say!

Much love!

 

[Muna]

@ProverbsInPink should change her name to Proverbsinpurple, because it would match really good with her purple badge.

 

[ScottA]

When is the Marriage?

Oh, I answered that in post #57