Rapture ... soon?

[Ronald David Bruno]

Are you aware of any ancient, or even greater then 100 years old, source material describing this? I've looked for years but not found anything. Can you point me in a direction?

Much love!

You asked me that same question almost three years ago. I came up with this:
"The Social Life of a Jew in the Time of Christ". London: Church Missions To The Jews, 1929 by Keith Elijah Khodada

"The Passover at the Time of Christ", Miami, Fl. Hard Press Pub. Reprented from London Jews Society, 1909
K. E. Khodada

"Manners and Customs of Bible Lands" Chicago, Il. Moody Press, 1953 by Fred H. Wight

"The Ancient Near East; An Anthology of Texts and Pictures, Israel" Princeton Univ. Press, 1958. James A. Pritchard

Ancient sources? Don't know of any. I did first hear about it from Dr..Craig Johnson, my first pastor/ professor long ago.
All the disciples were Galileans except Judas, so they would be aware of symbolism Jesus used to allude to the wedding. It was a theme that ran through the Bible: The Church being the bride, the betrothal made, a covenant, a commitment, preparations, "I go and prepare a place for you and I will return", " No one knows the day or the hour ... only the Father", His Father's tells Him when it is time to go get His bride and the trumpet is blown, the bride is ready, the wedding party has oil in there lamps, he lifts her up and carries her away to the Father's house and the door is shut.
Sounds true. If you could find those old books in a Library, check the references and sources in those books.

 

[Jay Ross]

No one knows the day or the hour ... only the Father", His Father's tells Him when it is time to go get His bride and the trumpet is blown, the bride is ready, the wedding party has oil in there lamps, he lifts her up and carries her away to the Father's house and the door is shut.
Sounds true.

I find that it is interesting that the three parables in Matthew 25 represent three periods of time in the seventh age. The first parable, the Ten virgins, I believe occurs very early, just after the start of the seventh age. The second parable, the Parable of the Talents tells us about Satan's plan while he is imprisoned in the Bottomless pit for 1,000 years and how he intends to obstruct the establishment of God's Everlasting Kingdom during the seventh age. The third parable is about the judgement of the nations, the separation of the Rams from the Male Goats, that will occur during the Final Judgement of those who call Jesus Lord, Lord into those who receive their inheritance from God of the whole earth and those who will be dispatched into the Lake of Fire at the end of the Seventh Age.

During the first 1,000 years of the seventh age, God has entered into a covenant of peace with the Israelites to remove the beasts of the field, i.e. Satan, the Beast(s) and the Little Horn from the face of the earth while they are imprisoned in the Bottomless pit and during the short period of the Little While Period they will be released, and they will then bring much distress upon the Saints as they go after them to kill them and to force them to worship the beast and then Satan.

There is much that we cannot comprehend because of the timespan of the seventh age but the Saints will be tested with fire to refine us to remove the dross from us so that we will be more acceptable to God at the time of our judgement.

Shalom

 

[Earburner]

I lean towards His Coming/RAPTURE as the same event, NOT two ( a secret rapture then 7 years later for judgment.

Which is described in KJV 2 Thes. 1:7-10 as being a simult-aneous event. Redemption for all of God's born again saints and destruction upon all the wicked unsaved by His flaming fire.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

I find that it is interesting that the three parables in Matthew 25 represent three periods of time in the seventh age. The first parable, the Ten virgins, I believe occurs very early, just after the start of the seventh age. The second parable, the Parable of the Talents tells us about Satan's plan while he is imprisoned in the Bottomless pit for 1,000 years and how he intends to obstruct the establishment of God's Everlasting Kingdom during the seventh age. The third parable is about the judgement of the nations, the separation of the Rams from the Male Goats, that will occur during the Final Judgement of those who call Jesus Lord, Lord into those who receive their inheritance from God of the whole earth and those who will be dispatched into the Lake of Fire at the end of the Seventh Age.

During the first 1,000 years of the seventh age, God has entered into a covenant of peace with the Israelites to remove the beasts of the field, i.e. Satan, the Beast(s) and the Little Horn from the face of the earth while they are imprisoned in the Bottomless pit and during the short period of the Little While Period they will be released, and they will then bring much distress upon the Saints as they go after them to kill them and to force them to worship the beast and then Satan.

There is much that we cannot comprehend because of the timespan of the seventh age but the Saints will be tested with fire to refine us to remove the dross from us so that we will be more acceptable to God at the time of our judgement.

Shalom

Jesus' parables about he Second Coming, our readiness for it and His coming judgment in the Great Tribulation are about to be fulfilled _ in this age. It doesn't appear that you recognize any of the signs; nor are you ready. It will be like in the days of Noah for you. Either get on board the Ark or be swept away by the flood.
Our resurrection happens at the Second Coming. Then there will be a Millennial Kingdom, a time of peace, love, joy and harmony like the world has bever seen, Paradise reborn.
Then towards the end ( as described in Rev. 20) a final war, the second resurrection, the Great White Throne Judgment which will amount to the destruction of Hades and all those who were in it, Death itself, the 1st Heavens and 1st Earth - all destroyed in the Lake Of Fire. (2 Peter 3:10).
We went over this many times and you disagree. You don't interpret this chapter literally and likely most of Revelation and your eschatology in general is like a Picasso painting to me.

You will not change my mind nor will I change yours, so let's keep separate and ignor eachother from now on.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Which is described in KJV 2 Thes. 1:7-10 as being a simult-aneous event. Redemption for all of God's born again saints and destruction upon all the wicked unsaved by His flaming fire.

Rev. 11 -19 gives more depth explanation. His coming is described, from the seventh trumpet, many things happen: He becomes king of all nations,
, the Rapture ( IMHO), heaven opens, rewards given, dead are judged, but the destruction is not one event. The Seven Bowls of Wrath are released which takes weeks, likely over 40 days (the armies war against ... not an immediate destruction as soon as He arrives).

 

[marks]

You asked me that same question almost three years ago. I came up with this:

That's just like me to repeat myself.

I'm going to try to find those, thank you very much!

Much love!

 

[rebuilder 454]

Your story reminds me of the Pre-tribbers etc. who are looking for a way out so as not to face the Great Tribulation without reading the signs correctly that tells us how far it will be in time before it will happen and that the "Christians" alive at that time must go through that period of Great Tribulation.

As someone in the scientific used to say many years ago, "Why is this so?" The same question is applicable to many "Christian theological theories" which have no bases in the actual scriptures.

What is the most painful thing that many people fear is "CHANGE" and they will do everything that they can to avoid that change.

All that is false conjecture based on how you assume others are controlled by fear or some other imaginary dynamic.

If you factor in the bride and groom, the entire picture changes.
Things line up in harmony.

Without the bride , groom, wife, and "husband" ,as heaven uses to illustrate end times, most any position is "provable"...depends on the level of torture they put the bible through.

 

[rebuilder 454]

Simple and wrong.

One more time. John has a vision of 7 seven seals opening, When the seals are actually opened, the events described DO NOT occur. THIS IS PROPHECY of future events that happen much later. Jesus opened all the seals when he ascended, and the text shows him opening all of them in a short time .

That means John was looking back 60 years?
While in heaven

 

[Earburner]

Rev. 11 -19 gives more depth explanation. His coming is described, from the seventh trumpet, many things happen: He becomes king of all nations,
, the Rapture ( IMHO), heaven opens, rewards given, dead are judged, but the destruction is not one event. The Seven Bowls of Wrath are released which takes weeks, likely over 40 days (the armies war against ... not an immediate destruction as soon as He arrives).

Evidently you are not reading from the KJV Bible. If you were you would understand the word "WHEN" written in two places of 2 Thes. 1:7-10 being applied to TWO events happening at the same time.

[7] And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
[8] In flaming fire taking vengeance......

Also, don't forget that WHEN Jesus is revealed from heaven, it will be IN Flaming Fire.
No one who is unsaved shall escape the Lord's VENGEANCE in flaming fire!!!

 

[David in NJ]

Hi Ronald,

The New Jerusalem will be in the universal realm, the rulership there with the OT saints as promised. (Heb. 11: 16) We, the Body of Christ have our rulership with Christ on His own throne in the highest, the third heaven. (Rev. 3: 21)

New Jerusalem is the Body of Christ

 

[David in NJ]

Only the Lord, the High Priest has the right to officiate at the Golden altar. He is the Messenger of the covenant. Rev. 8 reveals the Lord`s work through the trib. as the Mediator of the New Covenant. And I agree that the `Day` (GK. period of time or one day) will be fulfilled after the vials have been poured out.

The Sections are -

1. At end of trumpets. (Rev. 9: 12 ff. Rev. 16: 18)
2. At the end of the A/C & false prophet ruling. (Rev. 13: 5 Rev. 16: 16 - 18 Rev. 19: 19 & 20)
3. At the end of the vials. (Rev. 16: 17 - 21)
4. When the Lord comes. (Rev. 6: 12 - 17. 16: 16 - 21. Rev. 19: 11 - 21)


View attachment 74107

144,000 is SYMBOLIC and they are not Jews of the flesh

 

[David in NJ]

I find that it is interesting that the three parables in Matthew 25 represent three periods of time in the seventh age. The first parable, the Ten virgins, I believe occurs very early, just after the start of the seventh age. The second parable, the Parable of the Talents tells us about Satan's plan while he is imprisoned in the Bottomless pit for 1,000 years and how he intends to obstruct the establishment of God's Everlasting Kingdom during the seventh age. The third parable is about the judgement of the nations, the separation of the Rams from the Male Goats, that will occur during the Final Judgement of those who call Jesus Lord, Lord into those who receive their inheritance from God of the whole earth and those who will be dispatched into the Lake of Fire at the end of the Seventh Age.

During the first 1,000 years of the seventh age, God has entered into a covenant of peace with the Israelites to remove the beasts of the field, i.e. Satan, the Beast(s) and the Little Horn from the face of the earth while they are imprisoned in the Bottomless pit and during the short period of the Little While Period they will be released, and they will then bring much distress upon the Saints as they go after them to kill them and to force them to worship the beast and then Satan.

There is much that we cannot comprehend because of the timespan of the seventh age but the Saints will be tested with fire to refine us to remove the dross from us so that we will be more acceptable to God at the time of our judgement.

Shalom

The Ten virgins Parable is the Second Coming of CHRIST

 

[David in NJ]

Evidently you are not reading from the KJV Bible. If you were you would understand the word "WHEN" written in two places of 2 Thes. 1:7-10 being applied to TWO events happening at the same time.

Also, don't forget that WHEN Jesus is revealed from heaven, it will be IN Flaming Fire.

They are very confused on here = all due to the error/lie of pre-trib rapture.

 

[Jay Ross]

All that is false conjecture based on how you assume others are controlled by fear or some other imaginary dynamic.

If you factor in the bride and groom, the entire picture changes.
Things line up in harmony.

Without the bride, groom, wife, and "husband", as heaven uses to illustrate end times, most any position is "provable"...depends on the level of torture they put the bible through.

Why is that so? What false conjecture have I assumed? Had I not factored in the bride and the groom into what I have written above as being the first parable in Matt 25? Had I not lined things up in harmony as presented in scripture?

The problem that I see is that people are fearful of what the future will bring and their pre-trib rapture is their story that gives them peace in their spirit, but that spirit is the wrong spirit to hold onto.

At present what we are seeing is the fulfilment of Deu 28 as God waits for Israel to repent of their idolatrous worship, occurring even today, before the end of the fourth age of Israel's existence. When the living people of the earth in around twenty years' time see the kings of the earth gathering in the land of Canaan to destroy the Israelites living in the land of Canaan because of their feeble attempt to rebuild a third temple which Jesus said that He would build in around 1,050 years from now, then we can know that the rebuilding of the Third is not something that God wants the nation of Israel to do. Jesus openly said that if Israel causes the temple to be destroyed then within three days of the Lord, He will rebuild that temple from the body of His Saints to worship God once more in this rebuilt temple which is found in John 2.

If what I am writing is a false recounting of the scriptures, then God will judge me, but to those who are judging me, their future will not be what they are hoping for.

Shalom

 

[Jay Ross]

The Ten virgins Parable is the Second Coming of CHRIST

That is the manner in which you want the story to go. If this is the second coming of Christ, who is the Bride that Christ comes for at this time?

 

[David in NJ]

That is the manner in which you want the story to go. If this is the second coming of Christ, who is the Bride that Christ comes for at this time?

Hello Jay = great question = thank you

i would like to point out a few attributes of the Gospel and in this case, the parable of ten virgins

a.) i did not write the gospel of Matthew AND since God brought me into this world around 1962, impossible for me to influence
the Parable of the 'Ten virgins' in Matt 25:1-13

b.) Since it is a 'parable' , it does not need to follow a set criteria other then that which the LORD purposed in the parable

c.) continuing with point (b) = there are three MAIN criteria which the LORD specified for us to be AWARE of
1.) all ten virgins fall asleep as they are waiting for the LORD's Second Coming = His Return
2.) OIL
3.) only those with the 'OIL' enter into Eternal Life as they are gathered by the LORD

d.) continuing with point (c) = Yes there is more, however the parable is dependent on the MOST Important three aspects/criteria
and NOT vice versa

Would you agree that the LORD purposed those three MAIN points???

 

[Jay Ross]

Would you agree that the LORD purposed those three MAIN points???

What you have posted is what is the traditional understanding of the parable is and what I heard a pastor quote in his sermon on this parable recently.

But the question that I had asked above was, "Who was the Bride that Christ came for?"

That question you have not answered, and it is important that we do understand who Christ was referencing in this parable. Perhaps Christ was giving reassurance to those who were listening to the telling of this parable who were descendants of Abraham.

 

[Jay Ross]

AND since God brought me into this world around 1962

If this is the case, then you are a pup trying to teach someone who is older and possibly wiser.

That usually is a red herring that does not go down well.

 

[David in NJ]

What you have posted is what is the traditional understanding of the parable is and what I heard a pastor quote in his sermon on this parable recently.

But the question that I had asked above was, "Who was the Bride that Christ came for?"

That question you have not answered, and it is important that we do understand who Christ was referencing in this parable. Perhaps Christ was giving reassurance to those who were listening to the telling of this parable who were descendants of Abraham.

The LORD did not require the Bride to be in the parable.

In His foreknowledge and in accordance with His Gospel, His criteria in the parable for us = is the 'OIL'

 

[David in NJ]

If this is the case, then you are a pup trying to teach someone who is older and possibly wiser.

That usually is a red herring that does not go down well.

In a similar approach, i am as much a 'pup' as Christ was to the Jewish elders.

The Holy Spirit is my Guide/Teacher and most christians today have NOT grown beyond having men and women teaching them.

If you fall into the trap of 'age based legalism' you will fail to learn from the Holy Spirit in younger vessels = Matthew 18:1-5

It is GOD who decides what, how much and to whom HE gives understanding = Luke 11:13