Maybe I Am Not Understanding the Post Tribulation Rapture. - Can You Help?

[Spiritual Israelite]

What you are telling me is that you do not know the difference between a parable and a prophecy. The story of the 10 virgins is a parable. The 144,000 first fruits, 12,000 from each tribe is a prophecy.

You don't think Matthew 25:1-13 is prophecy? It most certainly is. It's a prophecy related to the future second coming of Christ when He comes for His bride (the church). A parable can also be a prophecy. It's a prophecy that is given using figurative text (the five wise virgins figuratively represent the church and the bridegroom figuratively represents Jesus) rather than literal text.

 

[Davy]

I reject your notion that the woman in Revelation 12 is the Church for many reasons.

I don't care to hear your long speeches for rejecting that Christ's Church is involved in the events of Rev.12; particularly once the dragon and serpent is booted out of the heavenly dimension down into our earthly dimension at the end of this present world.

Lord Jesus was clear in His Olivet discourse that His coming to gather His saints will be after... the tribulation. That is written, and no one can change it. You can listen to those charlatans who think they can change that, but you will suffer in the coming storm at the end when God washes their false wall of untempered mortar and brings it down when they see Christ coming in the clouds, and He finds out they had fallen away to worship the "another Jesus" (2 Cor.11).

 

[The Light]

I don't care to hear your long speeches for rejecting that Christ's Church is involved in the events of Rev.12; particularly once the dragon and serpent is booted out of the heavenly dimension down into our earthly dimension at the end of this present world.

Exactly. When the scriptural proof is presented your course of action is to stick your head in the sand.

Lord Jesus was clear in His Olivet discourse that His coming to gather His saints will be after... the tribulation.

There will be a coming AFTER the tribulation. Problem is, you think that the tribulation is 7th seal wrath of God, when scripture says that the tribulation is OVER at the 6th seal.

That is written, and no one can change it.

There is no need to change it. There is a need for you to understand what is written.

You can listen to those charlatans who think they can change that, but you will suffer in the coming storm at the end when God washes their false wall of untempered mortar and brings it down when they see Christ coming in the clouds, and He finds out they had fallen away to worship the "another Jesus" (2 Cor.11).

I listen to the Word of God. You take part of the Bible to draw a false conclusion.

 

[Davy]

Exactly. When the scriptural proof is presented your course of action is to stick your head in the sand.


There will be a coming AFTER the tribulation. Problem is, you think that the tribulation is 7th seal wrath of God, when scripture says that the tribulation is OVER at the 6th seal.


There is no need to change it. There is a need for you to understand what is written.


I listen to the Word of God. You take part of the Bible to draw a false conclusion.

Not interested in your doctrines of men rhetoric.

 

[Ronald D Milam]

What you are telling me is that you do not know the difference between a parable and a prophecy. The story of the 10 virgins is a parable. The 144,000 first fruits, 12,000 from each tribe is a prophecy.

God was never, EVER, EVER going to tell Satan His plans 2000 years ahead of time He is God, but even we humans have enough brain power to understand you do not give your enemies your plans ahead of time.

And if you really think God only uses numbers in a parable, well, I do think think that you do not understand how God uses numbers throughout scriptures, everyone knows this. We all know God's Number Lingo, you can look it up anywhere.

7 = Divine Completion there are 7 Churches (BUT...many more) there are 7 Heads or powers set up to bring Israel unto compliance with God. The 7 Feasts, the 7 Eyes et al.

8 = New Beginnings and after the 7 Feasts we get a New Beginning.

10 = Completion, there were thousands of Laws but God gave us the 10 Commandments, the 10 Plagues, the 10 Horns in Revelation = the E.U. Completely Healed from the Mortal Wound.

12 = Fulness so the 12 tribes equals God's Fullness for the Kingdom Age.

Oh yea, 6 = Mankind (if you paid mind to this you would see that when God gives us 666 He is just emphasizing that the LAST BEAST is "ONE MAN" and not a Kingdom per se. All the other Beasts passed their kingdoms on, not the AC who will be killed and Jesus will take over, thus HE ALONE is the Beast. As Dan. 7:17 tells us, each Beast Kingdom started out as Beast MEN.

Dan. 7:17 These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth.

There are other numbers etc. etc. but these are the main ones via prophesy. So, when God gives us PERFECT NUNMBERS that doesn't clue you in that that he's giving us a code?

Do you not see a pattern here? I have saved unto myself 7000 men who have not bowed to other gods as in 7 x 10 x 10 x 10 = 7000 or Divine Completion x Completion.

12 x 12 x 10 x 10 x 10 = 144,000 or Fulness x Completion.

God uses numbers on purpose, the Hebrew Language had only 4000 words in its infancy, we now use over 500,000 words in the English Language. This is one reason people cannot grasp that God created our universe during what He defined as 6 Yowm's and He rested on the 7th yowm, it was a time period, I can show how Yowm is used fir a day, month, year, two years, a Season, a general time period, the X Whole etc. etc. It was never created in 6 days, there were no days because Earth wasn't even formed yet. And guess what, we lose a lot of people because we still peddle that falsehood.

What part of 144,000, twelve thousand from each tribe do you not grasp?

You thinking God gave away His plans to Satan is amusing. Here is the gist, you built a thesis around this supposed factoid and that thesis i too important to discount, even if it is in error.

Go back and forth on the timing of the Rapture? No, the timing is the same. There are two raptures. The is raptured before the great tribulation and the 12 tribes across the earth that have their blindness remove will be raptured pre wrath, at the 6th seal. If you understood what first fruits are you would understand they are first fruits of the second harvest.

There is a pre 70th week rapture, NO ONE ELSE gets into to the wedding, The Jews will remain on earth to reign with their brother Jesus for 1000 years, they are the Fathers Bride. One Rapture, when Jesus returns why would anyone need to be raptured? That fails the logic 101 test brother.

It puzzles me why you want to solve a problem when the answer is already given.

Sure, God just told Satan ahead of time.........NOT. That is why He uses the 1/3 will repent in Zech. 13:8-9, He gives Satan a ratio he can not know until the very end of time. God did not tell us a number that repents, if its 1/3 that is 5 million, only known at the very end. It will be Males & Females and not all Virgins. Just like the Bride of Christ are not all virgins, nor all female. Israel is God's bride, they came first, thus they are MALES we were called later thus we are FEMALES as per unto what each symbol represents.

Israel is the fruit harvest.

Israel are the Wheat that Grows together with the tares until the end. We go to marry the Lamb in heaven.

 

[The Light]

God was never, EVER, EVER going to tell Satan His plans 2000 years ahead of time He is God, but even we humans have enough brain power to understand you do not give your enemies your plans ahead of time.

Are you serious? Do you not understand that the false religion from Babylon has a false Christ? Do you not understand that the false religion of Babylon has the sun as the father God. A ray of the sun impregnates a human woman and has a son who is savior of the world. There are many, many false religions in the world and most of them have a false savior.

Do you not know that Tammuz is the false Christ from Babylon?

Ezekiel 8
13 He said also unto me, Turn thee yet again, and thou shalt see greater abominations that they do.

14 Then he brought me to the door of the gate of the Lord's house which was toward the north; and, behold, there sat women weeping for Tammuz.

Satan knows exactly what Gods plans are. That is why most of the false religions of the world have a false Messiah. Tammuz the false Christ from Babylon is Horus the false Christ from Egypt. Who is Apollo the false Christ who carries a bow. Look through all the eastern religions. Same stuff.

Here is one example of the false religion that was all over the world in many forms.

Acts 14
8 And there sat a certain man at Lystra, impotent in his feet, being a cripple from his mother's womb, who never had walked:

9 The same heard Paul speak: who stedfastly beholding him, and perceiving that he had faith to be healed,

10 Said with a loud voice, Stand upright on thy feet. And he leaped and walked.

11 And when the people saw what Paul had done, they lifted up their voices, saying in the speech of Lycaonia, The gods are come down to us in the likeness of men.

12 And they called Barnabas, Jupiter; and Paul, Mercurius, because he was the chief speaker.

13 Then the priest of Jupiter, which was before their city, brought oxen and garlands unto the gates, and would have done sacrifice with the people.

14 Which when the apostles, Barnabas and Paul, heard of, they rent their clothes, and ran in among the people, crying out,

15 And saying, Sirs, why do ye these things? We also are men of like passions with you, and preach unto you that ye should turn from these vanities unto the living God, which made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and all things that are therein:

So if you don't think that Satan knew of Gods plan to send a savior to the world, you are very unfamiliar with the religions that were in the world with a false savior thousands of years be Christ was on the earth.

 

[The Light]

God was never, EVER, EVER going to tell Satan His plans 2000 years ahead of time He is God, but even we humans have enough brain power to understand you do not give your enemies your plans ahead of time.

And if you really think God only uses numbers in a parable, well, I do think think that you do not understand how God uses numbers throughout scriptures, everyone knows this. We all know God's Number Lingo, you can look it up anywhere.

7 = Divine Completion there are 7 Churches (BUT...many more) there are 7 Heads or powers set up to bring Israel unto compliance with God. The 7 Feasts, the 7 Eyes et al.

8 = New Beginnings and after the 7 Feasts we get a New Beginning.

10 = Completion, there were thousands of Laws but God gave us the 10 Commandments, the 10 Plagues, the 10 Horns in Revelation = the E.U. Completely Healed from the Mortal Wound.

12 = Fulness so the 12 tribes equals God's Fullness for the Kingdom Age.

Oh yea, 6 = Mankind (if you paid mind to this you would see that when God gives us 666 He is just emphasizing that the LAST BEAST is "ONE MAN" and not a Kingdom per se. All the other Beasts passed their kingdoms on, not the AC who will be killed and Jesus will take over, thus HE ALONE is the Beast. As Dan. 7:17 tells us, each Beast Kingdom started out as Beast MEN.

Dan. 7:17 These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth.

There are other numbers etc. etc. but these are the main ones via prophesy. So, when God gives us PERFECT NUNMBERS that doesn't clue you in that that he's giving us a code?

Do you not see a pattern here? I have saved unto myself 7000 men who have not bowed to other gods as in 7 x 10 x 10 x 10 = 7000 or Divine Completion x Completion.

12 x 12 x 10 x 10 x 10 = 144,000 or Fulness x Completion.

Brother. Why do you not just accept what is written. Why do you need to change the scripture when the answer is already given. You lose the whole purpose that the 144,000 are from 12 tribes.

Revelation 7
3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.

4 And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel.

5 Of the tribe of Juda were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Reuben were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Gad were sealed twelve thousand.

6 Of the tribe of Aser were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Nephthalim were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Manasses were sealed twelve thousand.

7 Of the tribe of Simeon were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Levi were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Issachar were sealed twelve thousand.

8 Of the tribe of Zabulon were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Joseph were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Benjamin were sealed twelve thousand.

You lose the whole purpose that the 144,000 are first fruits that are redeemed from the earth and are before the throne.

Revelation 14
3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.

4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

5 And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God.

You get completely off the trail. If the 144,000 are 5,000,000 Jews, then those 5.000.000 Jews would be in heaven before the great tribulation. The fact is, those 5,000,000 flee to a place of protection and remain on earth during the wrath of God which is the 7th seal.

You completely throw yourself of the path of understanding.

You thinking God gave away His plans to Satan is amusing. Here is the gist, you built a thesis around this supposed factoid and that thesis i too important to discount, even if it is in error.

You got over 4000 false religions, and the majority are based on the sun, moon and stars which have false Christs born of a father from the sky such as Zeus, Jupiter, and the sun. Seems like Satan knows the plan or maybe God forgot to use His secret code.

There is a pre 70th week rapture,

I see no scripture anywhere that says the rapture of the Church is pre 70th week. It is pre great tribulation which occurs in the midst of the week.

NO ONE ELSE gets into to the wedding,

First off Jacob has two brides. Secondly, the fig tree has two harvests. Thirdly, one harvest in the summer for the Church at the trump of God or voice of God and one harvest in the fall at the last trump blown on the feast of Trumpets. Fourthly, there are two folds. The Church is the first fold and the 12 tribes across the earth, the seed of the woman, is the second fold.

John 10
14 I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.

15 As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.

16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

Fifthly, one coming when it's like the days of Noah and one coming when it is like the days of Lot.

The Jews will remain on earth to reign with their brother Jesus for 1000 years, they are the Fathers Bride. One Rapture, when Jesus returns why would anyone need to be raptured? That fails the logic 101 test brother.

144,000 first fruits are taken to heaven before the great tribulation. If you have pumpkins as first fruits, the harvest is pumpkins. Since the 1st fruits is 144,000 from 12 tribes, the seed of the woman, the harvest will be from the 12 tribes.

The nation of Israel, the woman, those that flee to the place of protection will remain on the earth during the wrath of God.

Sure, God just told Satan ahead of time.........NOT.

If you were correct, there would not be so many religions with false Christs that began 2000 years before the birth of Christ.

That is why He uses the 1/3 will repent in Zech. 13:8-9, He gives Satan a ratio he can not know until the very end of time.

Satan can just look in a Bible..........or do you think that he is not that smart?

God did not tell us a number that repents, if its 1/3 that is 5 million, only known at the very end. It will be Males & Females and not all Virgins. Just like the Bride of Christ are not all virgins, nor all female. Israel is God's bride, they came first, thus they are MALES we were called later thus we are FEMALES as per unto what each symbol represents.

The 144,000 are all virgin males. The harvest will be males and females from the 12 tribes. The woman Israel remains on the earth during the 7th seal, one year, wrath of God.

Israel are the Wheat that Grows together with the tares until the end. We go to marry the Lamb in heaven.

Wheat is harvested in the summer. The Church is raptured in the summer. Here is what the Jews will say.

Jeremiah 8
20 The harvest is past, the summer is ended, and we are not saved.

The Jews of the seed of the woman, the twelve tribes across the earth will be raptured in the fall fruit harvest on the Feast of Trumpets

 

[The Light]

Not interested in your doctrines of men rhetoric.

In other words, you can provide no scriptural backup to support your claims.

 

[The Light]

I don't care to hear your long speeches for rejecting that Christ's Church is involved in the events of Rev.12; particularly once the dragon and serpent is booted out of the heavenly dimension down into our earthly dimension at the end of this present world.

In other words, you reject Gods Word showing that He will turn to His Chosen when the fullness of the Gentiles comes in.

Lord Jesus was clear in His Olivet discourse that His coming to gather His saints will be after... the tribulation.

Right. There is one coming after the tribulation that occurs at the sixth seal before the 7th seal which contains the wrath of God.

That is written, and no one can change it.

Don't need to change it. All you need to know is that there are two folds and the 1st fold is the Church and second fold is of the 12 tribes across the earth, the seed of the woman.

When the fullness of the Gentiles comes in, part of Israel will have their eyes opened.

Romans 11
25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

You can listen to those charlatans who think they can change that, but you will suffer in the coming storm at the end when God washes their false wall of untempered mortar and brings it down when they see Christ coming in the clouds, and He finds out they had fallen away to worship the "another Jesus" (2 Cor.11).

I don't really need to listen to anybody because few understand there are 2 raptures and one is pretrib.

 

[Ronald D Milam]

Are you serious? Do you not understand that the false religion from Babylon has a false Christ? Do you not understand that the false religion of Babylon has the sun as the father God. A ray of the sun impregnates a human woman and has a son who is savior of the world. There are many, many false religions in the world and most of them have a false savior.

Do you not know that Tammuz is the false Christ from Babylon?

These are imitating God's plans, BUT Satan can not bother God right? LOL he wishes. But Satan can hinder and plan for harming God's peoples, he is trying to kill every Jew, God was never giving Satan and his followers that information. He gave him 1/3 and a code for all Israel that repents (144,000) just like God gave us a code/stand in for the church and for Israel (the Woman). If you would just back up and look at the facts you might see it. The Seals are not judgments, the seal up the judgments, therefore if people can get that lightbulb moment in their mental frame of mind, they could then see Rev. 7 is one thing, it is Israel fleeing Judea at the AoD which comes 30 days before the Beast conquers Israel JUST BEFORE the DOTL (God's Wrath) falls in Rev. 8, that is why the 7th Seal is on the OTHER SIDE of Rev. 7, God says HURT NOT the Earth, Sea and Trees until Israel (144,000 PERFECT NUMBER) repents or are Sealed by the holy spirit. An what hurts the Earth, Sea and Trees? The Rev. 8 Trumps (first four Trumps = Four Phases of an Asteroid Impact. You can't see how it NATURALLY FLOWS because you refuse to see the Codes and Metaphors, well, you see the ones you want to see.

Babylon is not False Religion, its the False Governance, the Harlot is the False Religion, the Beast (False Governance) is ridden by the Harlot or False Religion. Babylon = Satan's Dark Rule of Confusion.

Satan knows exactly what Gods plans are. That is why most of the false religions of the world have a false Messiah. Tammuz the false Christ from Babylon is Horus the false Christ from Egypt. Who is Apollo the false Christ who carries a bow. Look through all the eastern religions. Same stuff.

Again, Satan putting out LIES IS HIS NATURE.........Satan knowing how many people to plan for is totally different. You come up with very bad analogies brother.

Here is one example of the false religion that was all over the world in many forms.

There is no such thing, False Religion (Harlot) is Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, Sun Worship et al, its ALL FALSE RELIGIONS of All Time.

So if you don't think that Satan knew of Gods plan to send a savior to the world, you are very unfamiliar with the religions that were in the world with a false savior thousands of years be Christ was on the earth.

Again, he knows that an Asteroid is going to take out the New World for him and tat Gid is going to destroy Russia, Iran an Turkeys Armies b y 5/6 also, and thus he can plan for those because God WANTS HIM to be a Beast over Israel, Isaiah 10:5 says the AC is an instrument God is using. BUT...God DOES NOT WANT him kill the Jews who REPENT !! Two totally different things. You conflate everything wrongly.

 

[Davy]

In other words, you can provide no scriptural backup to support your claims.

Provided Bible Scripture is exactly what I HAVE BEEN DOING, but people like you have been brainwashed to reject those Bible Scriptures. So don't make silly excuses for your REBELLION, God sees your untruthfulness.

 

[Davy]

In other words, you reject Gods Word showing that He will turn to His Chosen when the fullness of the Gentiles comes in.

CAN'T YOU EVEN STAY ON TOPIC? Is your mind so LOOSE and influenced by the wrong spirit that you can't even comprehend what you read??

You REJECT what Lord Jesus revealed about the TIME of His future return to gather His saints per Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27, which is AFTER THE TRIBULATION that happens at the end of this world.

That means you are NOT a disciple of Jesus Christ, but a disciple of MEN and their false doctrines. In your case, those doctrines of men involve their FALSE Pre-trib Rapture Theory.

 

[JLB]

Right. He will come a second time for those look for Him. It is the Church that is looking for Him. After He comes for the Church, there will be 144,000 first fruits from the twelve tribes. Acceptable first fruits are a guarantee of a harvest. Part of Israel will have its eyes opened when the fullness of the Gentiles comes in. We are warned not to be ignorant of this mystery.

Romans 11
25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

After the fullness of the Gentiles comes in at the trump of God or voice of God, Jesus will also return at the 6th seal for the 12 tribes across the earth, the seed of the woman. The seed of the woman will look up at the coming of Jesus at the 6th seal at the last trump, blown on the Feast of Trumpets. The woman, those of the nation of Israel will remain on the earth in her place of protection during the 7th seal wrath of God.

‘At the coming of the Lord all the church will be caught up to Him and return with Him to Jerusalem to remove the wicked and reign with Him as King over the earth.

This is called the Day of the Lord.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

In other words, you reject Gods Word showing that He will turn to His Chosen when the fullness of the Gentiles comes in.

Do you not think you are one of God's Chosen?

Romans 8:31 31 What, then, shall we say in response to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? 32 He who did not spare his own Son, but gave him up for us all—how will he not also, along with him, graciously give us all things? 33 Who will bring any charge against those whom God has chosen? It is God who justifies. 34 Who then is the one who condemns? No one. Christ Jesus who died—more than that, who was raised to life—is at the right hand of God and is also interceding for us.

Do you think "those whom God has chosen" refers to those who live in modern day Israel?

 

[The Light]

Provided Bible Scripture is exactly what I HAVE BEEN DOING, but people like you have been brainwashed to reject those Bible Scriptures.

There are no scriptures I reject. I reject your understanding of them.

 

[The Light]

Do you not think you are one of God's Chosen?

Romans 8:31 31 What, then, shall we say in response to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? 32 He who did not spare his own Son, but gave him up for us all—how will he not also, along with him, graciously give us all things? 33 Who will bring any charge against those whom God has chosen? It is God who justifies. 34 Who then is the one who condemns? No one. Christ Jesus who died—more than that, who was raised to life—is at the right hand of God and is also interceding for us.

Do you think "those whom God has chosen" refers to those who live in modern day Israel?

Do you think the Chosen People are the Jews?

 

[The Light]

CAN'T YOU EVEN STAY ON TOPIC? Is your mind so LOOSE and influenced by the wrong spirit that you can't even comprehend what you read??

Always the blind man telling me what he sees.

You REJECT what Lord Jesus revealed about the TIME of His future return to gather His saints per Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27, which is AFTER THE TRIBULATION that happens at the end of this world.

I don't reject that at all. I know He comes with His angels and gathers the elect from heaven and earth. I also know that those gathered return to heaven for the marriage supper of the lamb.

There are two folds that are joined to one fold. Can you identify who the two fold are?

That means you are NOT a disciple of Jesus Christ, but a disciple of MEN and their false doctrines. In your case, those doctrines of men involve their FALSE Pre-trib Rapture Theory.

Ah. The accuser of the brethren has arrived. You are not a wise man. This is why you walk in blindness.

 

[Davy]

There are no scriptures I reject. I reject your understanding of them.

 

[Davy]

Always the blind man telling me what he sees.


I don't reject that at all. I know He comes with His angels and gathers the elect from heaven and earth. I also know that those gathered return to heaven for the marriage supper of the lamb.

There are two folds that are joined to one fold. Can you identify who the two fold are?




Ah. The accuser of the brethren has arrived. You are not a wise man. This is why you walk in blindness.

 

[Davy]

As any... honest person can easily see The Light's 'intentional' rejection... of the Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27 Scripture by Lord Jesus Christ, that is because of one of the following possibilities...

1. The Light is determined to put Faith in man's false doctrine of a Pre-trib Rapture which goes directly opposite of what Jesus said there that His coming to gather His saints will be AFTER... the tribulation.

2. Or The Light has 'another spirit' that he/she is listening to, and that spirit is not from God.

3. Or The Light is a disguised Unbeliever come here to spread confusion and lies among the body of Christ.