Satan and his demons are real beings/entities (with personalities) not abstract evil within unregenerate man

[Spiritual Israelite]

Prove cherubim are angels or an angel of God from the Word of God! You would do well if you begin with how 'cherub' is defined from the Hebrew language. There is not a single verse in Scripture that applies this definition to an angel or messenger of God. I did however find where Cherub is reference to a place in Babylon, i.e. a city!

Strong's Hebrew Dictionary
3742. כְּרוּב keruwb (kᵉrûwb)
Search for H3742 in KJVSL; in KJV; load in ESI.

כְּרוּב kᵉrûwb, ker-oob'

of uncertain derivation; a cherub or imaginary figure:—cherub, (plural) cherubims.

masculine noun


Strong's Hebrew Dictionary
3743. כְּרוּב Keruwb (Kᵉrûwb)
Search for H3743 in KJVSL; in KJV; load in ESI.

כְּרוּב Kᵉrûwb, ker-oob'

the same as H3742; Kerub, a place in Babylon:—Cherub.

proper locative noun

Based on your interpretation of Ezekiel 28:12-19, you apparently think a cherub is a man. Is that what you're going to go with? Or are you going to go with the idea that the cherub of Ezekiel 28:12-19 is an imaginary figure? Make up your mind. What exactly do you think a cherub is, if not an angel or other type of non-human being created by God?

 

[marks]

Also...Guys...the only thing untenable is that the Cherubim are figures of angels.
...imaginary Chubby little winged kids, notwithstanding.

Malachi 4:2

• "But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall."

Same word "wings" as we see in the image of the Cherubim. Because they're NOT a physical description of Christ, they represent an aspect of His Glory. Christ didn't come to earth flying with wings to heal, and thus this passage in Malachi has to be understood in the light of the whole Bible. It is no picture of Christ, no violation of the second commandment. Because Christ doesn't have wings. It is a parabolic image or likeness depicting some aspect of the "Glory of God" in His magnificent redemption plan. So no, it's not untenable that the Bible can speak of the Glory of God with cryptic imagery of Wings, Ox or Lion. It is untenable that Golden Angels were the furniture covering the Mercy seat, had wings outstretched over it, or were where Glory of God came to sit between them to dwell with men. What is untenable to the circumspect exegete, is that the furniture of the Tabernacle pointed to Angels and not Christ.

There is another usage of "wings" in the OT refering to the corners of the priestly robes, or the prayer shawl. Like when the woman who was bleeding 12 years, "If I can only touch the hem of His robe", perhaps remembering the Scripture there is healing in His wings.

Much love!

 

[WPM]

You clearly don't know the history of Tyre! God used this city assuring its prosperity, wealth and beauty that the Holy Temple through the abundant materials King Hiram possessed and gave to support King David, that Solomon would be well equipped to build the Holy Temple. Including the place where God met and spoke to chosen people, where the cherubim were placed over the mercy seat, symbolizing the presence of God being with and among His people.

READ Eze 27 of all the artisans and craftsmen, along with its perfect beauty, the cedars, along with the multitude of all kind of riches; with silver, iron, tin, and lead. Read also of the many merchants and inhabitants of the isles around them becoming rich through their abundance. If the King of Tyre had remained faithful and given glory to God they might have remained forever. But in arrogance greed filled with pride the city was brought down because the king made himself a god and assumed credit for all these great riches were through them and not through the providence of God.

In the same way God had lifted up Pharoh in Egypt that His name would be known and gloried in all the earth. That through Tyre the Temple in Jerusalem would be built. Read the account of King Hiram with King David, and Solomon if you doubt the city of Tyre was not faithful to give of its abundance to honor God that the nation would build the Holy Temple unto God. The king of Tyre knew King David, and Solomon were acquiring these materials that the Holy Temple of God in glory and honor to Him that would be known throughout the earth.

But you don't see the lamentation pertaining to the apostate king of Tyre, you think the lamentation is referring to Satan who you mistakenly believe was created an angel of God who became the epitome of evil!

Please quote me Scripture that teaches what you claim. You haven't done that yet. All I have is your opinions.

 

[WPM]

Prove cherubim are angels or an angel of God from the Word of God! You would do well if you begin with how 'cherub' is defined from the Hebrew language. There is not a single verse in Scripture that applies this definition to an angel or messenger of God. I did however find where Cherub is reference to a place in Babylon, i.e. a city!

Strong's Hebrew Dictionary
3742. כְּרוּב keruwb (kᵉrûwb)
Search for H3742 in KJVSL; in KJV; load in ESI.

כְּרוּב kᵉrûwb, ker-oob'

of uncertain derivation; a cherub or imaginary figure:—cherub, (plural) cherubims.

masculine noun


Strong's Hebrew Dictionary
3743. כְּרוּב Keruwb (Kᵉrûwb)
Search for H3743 in KJVSL; in KJV; load in ESI.

כְּרוּב Kᵉrûwb, ker-oob'

the same as H3742; Kerub, a place in Babylon:—Cherub.

proper locative noun

What are you talking about? Can you do your research before coming out with your false teaching?

kerûb

BDB Definition:

1) cherub, cherubim (plural)

1a) an angelic being

1a1) as guardians of Eden

1a2) as flanking God’s throne

1a3) as an image form hovering over the Ark of the Covenant

1a4) as the chariot of Jehovah (figuratively)

Part of Speech: noun masculine

A Related Word by BDB/Strong’s Number: of uncertain derivation

---

H3742 (KJC)​

כּרוּב

kerûb

Total KJV Occurrences: 91

cherubims, 63

Gen 3:24, Exo 25:18-20 (4), Exo 25:22, Exo 26:1, Exo 26:31, Exo 36:8, Exo 36:35, Exo 37:7-9 (4), Num 7:89, 1Sa 4:4, 2Sa 6:2, 1Ki 6:23, 1Ki 6:25, 1Ki 6:27-29 (4), 1Ki 6:32 (2), 1Ki 6:35, 1Ki 7:29, 1Ki 7:36, 1Ki 8:6-7 (3), 2Ki 19:15, 1Ch 13:6, 1Ch 28:18, 2Ch 3:7, 2Ch 3:10-11 (2), 2Ch 3:13-14 (2), 2Ch 5:7-8 (3), Psa 99:1 (2), Isa 37:16, Eze 10:1-3 (3), Eze 10:6-9 (5), Eze 10:15-16(3), Eze 10:18-20 (3), Eze 11:22, Eze 41:18, Eze 41:20, Eze 41:25

cherub, 27

Exo 25:19 (2), Exo 37:8 (2), 2Sa 22:11, 1Ki 6:24-27 (6), 2Ch 3:11-12 (3), Psa 18:10, Eze 9:3, Eze 10:2, Eze 10:4, Eze 10:7, Eze 10:9 (2), Eze 28:14 (2), Eze 28:16, Eze 41:18 (3)

cherubims’, 1

Eze 10:5

---

H3742 (Strong)​

כְּרוּב

kerûb

ker-oob'

Of uncertain derivation; a cherub or imaginary figure: - cherub, [plural] cherubims.

Total KJV occurrences: 91

 

[rwb]

Please quote me Scripture that teaches what you claim. You haven't done that yet. All I have is your opinions.

Do your own study, because it is clear the only voice you listen to is your own!

 

[rwb]

BDB Definition:

What is BDB Definition?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

What are you talking about? Can you do your research before coming out with your false teaching?

kerûb

BDB Definition:

1) cherub, cherubim (plural)

1a) an angelic being

1a1) as guardians of Eden

1a2) as flanking God’s throne

1a3) as an image form hovering over the Ark of the Covenant

1a4) as the chariot of Jehovah (figuratively)

Part of Speech: noun masculine

A Related Word by BDB/Strong’s Number: of uncertain derivation

---

H3742 (KJC)​

כּרוּב

kerûb

Total KJV Occurrences: 91

cherubims, 63

Gen 3:24, Exo 25:18-20 (4), Exo 25:22, Exo 26:1, Exo 26:31, Exo 36:8, Exo 36:35, Exo 37:7-9 (4), Num 7:89, 1Sa 4:4, 2Sa 6:2, 1Ki 6:23, 1Ki 6:25, 1Ki 6:27-29 (4), 1Ki 6:32 (2), 1Ki 6:35, 1Ki 7:29, 1Ki 7:36, 1Ki 8:6-7 (3), 2Ki 19:15, 1Ch 13:6, 1Ch 28:18, 2Ch 3:7, 2Ch 3:10-11 (2), 2Ch 3:13-14 (2), 2Ch 5:7-8 (3), Psa 99:1 (2), Isa 37:16, Eze 10:1-3 (3), Eze 10:6-9 (5), Eze 10:15-16(3), Eze 10:18-20 (3), Eze 11:22, Eze 41:18, Eze 41:20, Eze 41:25

cherub, 27

Exo 25:19 (2), Exo 37:8 (2), 2Sa 22:11, 1Ki 6:24-27 (6), 2Ch 3:11-12 (3), Psa 18:10, Eze 9:3, Eze 10:2, Eze 10:4, Eze 10:7, Eze 10:9 (2), Eze 28:14 (2), Eze 28:16, Eze 41:18 (3)

cherubims’, 1

Eze 10:5

---

H3742 (Strong)​

כְּרוּב

kerûb

ker-oob'

Of uncertain derivation; a cherub or imaginary figure: - cherub, [plural] cherubims.

Total KJV occurrences: 91

He can't seem to decide what he thinks cherubim are. He has said he thinks they are imaginary figures, but has also indicated that the human king of Tyre is the anointed cherub described in Ezekiel 28:12-19. So, does he think cherubim are imaginary figures or human beings? He has to make up his mind. Of course, we know they are neither. In scripture they are real beings, most likely angels, and not human beings or imaginary figures.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Do your own study, because it is clear the only voice you listen to is your own!

What do you think cherubim are? You have said they are imaginary figures but also that you think the human king of Tyre was an anointed cherub. So, please make up your mind and tell us what you think cherubim are. I know you don't think they are angels, but what exactly do you think they are?

 

[rwb]

What do you think cherubim are? You have said they are imaginary figures but also that you think the human king of Tyre was an anointed cherub. So, please make up your mind and tell us what you think cherubim are. I know you don't think they are angels, but what exactly do you think they are?

Strong's Hebrew Dictionary
3742. כְּרוּב keruwb (kᵉrûwb)
Search for H3742 in KJVSL; in KJV; load in ESI.


כְּרוּב kᵉrûwb, ker-oob'


of uncertain derivation; a cherub or imaginary figure:—cherub, (plural) cherubims.


masculine noun

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Strong's Hebrew Dictionary
3742. כְּרוּב keruwb (kᵉrûwb)
Search for H3742 in KJVSL; in KJV; load in ESI.


כְּרוּב kᵉrûwb, ker-oob'


of uncertain derivation; a cherub or imaginary figure:—cherub, (plural) cherubims.


masculine noun

Why can't you just answer my question? What you showed here says "a cherub OR imaginary figure". That means the word can refer to something real and not imaginary OR to an imaginary figure. So, which of those are you going with? In Ezekiel 28:12-19, since you don't believe it's describing Satan or any other angel, do you believe it's saying that a human being is a cherub or that it's describing an imaginary figure?

 

[WPM]

Do your own study, because it is clear the only voice you listen to is your own!

LOL. Typical Pretrib response. Why not admit: you are making it up as you go?

 

[WPM]

He can't seem to decide what he thinks cherubim are. He has said he thinks they are imaginary figures, but has also indicated that the human king of Tyre is the anointed cherub described in Ezekiel 28:12-19. So, does he think cherubim are imaginary figures or human beings? He has to make up his mind. Of course, we know they are neither. In scripture they are real beings, most likely angels, and not human beings or imaginary figures.

I know! He is all over the place. This is what error produces. He just swallows what TS tells him but is unable to support it by hard Scripture. Talk about winging it.

 

[TribulationSigns]

I can see that some people here still think King of Tyrus is Satan or an angel. NOPE!

What are Cherubim? That has been of great controversy. It is the passage where theologians and people like SI and WPM originally got the whole idea of Cherubim being angels in the first place. The source of confusion is the mention of the Cherub in Ezekiel 28:14. The passage in question quite clearly declares that the person it is speaking about as the covering Cherub is the king of Tyrus, not an angel. Nevertheless, certainly we can understand their logic, if not their entrenchment. They "assume" that because the reference here says the king was in the Garden of Eden, it has to refer to Satan as a fallen angel. And from this they surmise that God is using the king as a type of Satan. However, without Biblical warrant, we cannot make such a leap of faith in interpretation. The rule of thumb applies that "assumption is the mother of error." He was called the anointed cherub because he was representative man, created in the likeness of God in Adam, and has fallen to sin and lost all semblance of the image of God. Clearly, the King of Tyrus was not in the Garden of Eden, nor perfect in beauty as Adam was, but he is representative of mankind and his degradation.

Ezekiel 28:12-16

• "Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.
• Thou hast been in Eden the Garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
• Thou art the anointed Cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
• Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
• By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering Cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire."

At first glance it is easy to see how one could make such a mistake about the king representing a fallen angel. However, rather than "reading into this text" an angel, the king of Tyrus is quite clearly a man being castigated by God for being created in the image of God to be righteous, but who has turned from God in his sin and thus come under judgment. So rather than represent a fallen angel, this represents FALLEN MAN. It illustrates original man in Adam, created good (Genesis 1:26-27) in the image/likeness of God before the fall. Man, as he was created without sin, but who has fallen in Adam, losing the glory of the likeness of God he was created with. Thus because of his fall and our inheritance of his spirit of bondage to disobedience, we are all subject to death. But thanks to our God, that full glory of God's image can be restored in Christ Jesus. Thus He is often referred to as the second Adam.

1st Corinthians 15:20-22

• "But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
• For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
• For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive."

Now we can see the spiritual darkness begin to clear as we can see more of the picture. We were 'ALL' created in the image of God in Adam. The sin of Adam separated man from that image of God. And in the process, it separated ALL of us in generations to follow from that likeness. It was man who was perfect in the mountain (Kingdom) of God. But sin was found in us, and we all died in Adam (1st Corinthians 15:20-22) and are come under judgment as surely as King Tyrus had. And except we are restored to the image of God that 'man' had in the garden, we remain fallen and subject to the wrath of God. The king of Tyrus is man directly from the loins of Adam, who can only be restored to the image of God, in the second Adam, which is Christ.

Romans 8:29

• "For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren."

It should be self-evident that (according to scripture) it was man (Adam) and NOT angels who were in the Garden of Eden where every precious stone was his covering. It was Adam who was the anointed Cherub that covereth upon the Holy mountain of God because He was the very image/likeness of the Glory of God. It was Adam who walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire (in the presence of God) in that Garden. In point of fact, the very name "Tyrus" means a stone. So it's quite obvious to me what is being illustrated here. It was in Adam that man was in the image of God and perfect in all his ways in the garden from the day that he was created, until iniquity was found in him (the fall). And the fall of the king of Tyrus in his sinfulness "personifies" this fall from God's image by Adam. God is illustrating to fallen man that we qualify by attempting to be like God in eating of the tree of knowledge without wisdom. Man qualifies for "all" that we read in Ezekiel 28:12-16. But Angels do not qualify!! We interpret scripture by scripture, not by popular assumptions. And not once do we read of "angels" in the Garden of Eden. Not once do we read of "angels" falling in the Garden of Eden. Not once do we read of "angels" being corrupted because of knowledge. Not once do we read of "angels" defiling their sanctuaries by the multitude of their iniquities. On the contrary, we read of man in the garden, man was perfect there from the time he was created, and man is the one who fell there. And let's not forget, did not God say these very things of Adam?

Genesis 3:22

• "And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:"

It is man, not angels, who was corrupted because of knowledge. Period! He sought to be as God by his disobedience in eating of the tree of knowledge, and it was this that caused his fall in the day he transgressed. Satan in the Garden of Eden did NOT have every precious stone his covering, but Adam was made glorious, precious in the sight of the Lord. Satan was not set the anointed Cherub that covereth upon the holy mountain of God, but scripture says Adam (man) was created in the very image of God so that this definition is consistent. In point of fact, everything in the Garden of Eden, including the serpent, was 'under dominion of Adam,' (Genesis 1:26-28;3:1) as He was perfect. Adam was the very likeness or image of God. ..as a Cherub.

(Continue to next post)

 

[TribulationSigns]

(Continue to previous post)

Genesis 1:26-27

• "And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
• So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them."

Letting the scripture be its own interpreter, we must ask WHERE is it written in scripture that Satan was created in the image of God (as a Cherub) in the Garden of Eden, hummm? We don't read that of Satan, but we do read that of man. Scripture does NOT say that Satan was perfect in the day He was created until his fall, but God created Adam (man) perfect, without sin, with free access to the tree of life until the day of his fall. In all of scripture, there is no one (besides Christ, the God man) whom God declares was created perfect, except Adam. This in itself should illustrate to us that the king of Tyrus "personifies" man who had everything, and lost it in the fall. In fact the very language, "perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created," clearly harkens back to the creation of Adam.
Genesis 5:1-2

• "This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him;
• Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created."

So again, it all points to the King of Tyrus as a representation of fallen Man, not of an angel, Satan. Adam walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire and had no reason to hide from God before the fall. All these things which God speaks of concerning the King of Tyrus, applies to Adam before the fall. He was the very image of God (cherub) from the day that he was created, till iniquity was found in him. And by the multitude of his iniquity is there violence, and he has sinned, and therefore will God cast him as profane out of His Mountain.

Please notice that when God says, "Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus," God clearly talked about a lamentation for MAN, not for Satan, nor for fallen angels. When God says, "I will destroy thee, O covering Cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire," it speaks of the judgment of man, and how He is come under the wrath of God.
And so the support for the Cherub being an angel is not really as sound as many people might think. The symbolic image of the Cherubim, that John, Isaiah and Ezekiel saw, were a pictorial figure of the glory of God. And the Ark of the Covenant, the Mercy Seat, and Lord, dwelling with the Cherubim, illustrated that the tabernacle of God is with men, and that He would dwell with them, and they would be his people, and He their God. It's the personal relationship of the Creator, to His people.

2nd Kings 19:15

• "And Hezekiah prayed before the LORD, and said, O LORD God of Israel, which dwellest between the Cherubim, thou art the God, even thou alone, of all the kingdoms of the earth; thou hast made heaven and earth."

Psalms 99:1-2

• The LORD reigneth; let the people tremble: he sitteth between the Cherubim; let the earth be moved.
• The LORD is great in Zion; and he is high above all the people."

Cherubim are the watchers and guardians over the Holiness and person of the Lord. It is their spiritual responsibility to be the fiery judge of anything that is unholy that should come into God's presence (Gen. 3:24). And who could there possibly be as guardian over God, but God? Is there anyone higher, stronger, or who could protect the way of the tree of Life better than God? Does God need "angels" to watch over Him? This was the likeness or image of the Glory of God, just as it is written. And it illustrates God's terribleness, His Kingship over all that Creation, and His personal relationship with His people. The Lord is not making His habitation in the Mercy Seat dwelling with "angels overshadowing Him", He dwells in the Glory of God, in the very Image of God, because He and the Father are one. If anything, He overshadows the messengers of God, MEN, not vice-versa.

Selah

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I can see that some people here still think King of Tyrus is Satan or an angel. NOPE!

What are Cherubim? That has been of great controversy. It is the passage where theologians and people like SI and WPM originally got the whole idea of Cherubim being angels in the first place. The source of confusion is the mention of the Cherub in Ezekiel 28:14. The passage in question quite clearly declares that the person it is speaking about as the covering Cherub is the king of Tyrus, not an angel. Nevertheless, certainly we can understand their logic, if not their entrenchment. They "assume" that because the reference here says the king was in the Garden of Eden, it has to refer to Satan as a fallen angel. And from this they surmise that God is using the king as a type of Satan. However, without Biblical warrant, we cannot make such a leap of faith in interpretation. The rule of thumb applies that "assumption is the mother of error." He was called the anointed cherub because he was representative man, created in the likeness of God in Adam, and has fallen to sin and lost all semblance of the image of God. Clearly, the King of Tyrus was not in the Garden of Eden, nor perfect in beauty as Adam was, but he is representative of mankind and his degradation.

LOL! You deny everything that it actually says about him in Ezekiel 28:12-19. It says he was in the garden of Eden. You deny that. It says he was created perfect in beauty and all his ways. You deny that. And so on. And we're supposed to take you seriously about this? Think again. Cherubim are not human beings! That's ridiculous! No human being was created perfect in all his ways as the anointed cherub guardian of the holy mountain of God. You know that and that's why you deny that the king of Tyre was created in perfect beauty and why you deny that he was in the garden of Eden. Your blatant twisting of the text is not something anyone who takes the Bible seriously is going to be fooled by.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I know! He is all over the place. This is what error produces. He just swallows what TS tells him but is unable to support it by hard Scripture. Talk about winging it.

He is extremely evasive when it comes to this topic, which shows that he knows he is just winging it, but is too proud to admit it.

 

[WPM]

(Continue to previous post)

Genesis 1:26-27

• "And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
• So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them."

Letting the scripture be its own interpreter, we must ask WHERE is it written in scripture that Satan was created in the image of God (as a Cherub) in the Garden of Eden, hummm? We don't read that of Satan, but we do read that of man. Scripture does NOT say that Satan was perfect in the day He was created until his fall, but God created Adam (man) perfect, without sin, with free access to the tree of life until the day of his fall. In all of scripture, there is no one (besides Christ, the God man) whom God declares was created perfect, except Adam. This in itself should illustrate to us that the king of Tyrus "personifies" man who had everything, and lost it in the fall. In fact the very language, "perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created," clearly harkens back to the creation of Adam.
Genesis 5:1-2

• "This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him;
• Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created."

So again, it all points to the King of Tyrus as a representation of fallen Man, not of an angel, Satan. Adam walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire and had no reason to hide from God before the fall. All these things which God speaks of concerning the King of Tyrus, applies to Adam before the fall. He was the very image of God (cherub) from the day that he was created, till iniquity was found in him. And by the multitude of his iniquity is there violence, and he has sinned, and therefore will God cast him as profane out of His Mountain.

Please notice that when God says, "Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus," God clearly talked about a lamentation for MAN, not for Satan, nor for fallen angels. When God says, "I will destroy thee, O covering Cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire," it speaks of the judgment of man, and how He is come under the wrath of God.
And so the support for the Cherub being an angel is not really as sound as many people might think. The symbolic image of the Cherubim, that John, Isaiah and Ezekiel saw, were a pictorial figure of the glory of God. And the Ark of the Covenant, the Mercy Seat, and Lord, dwelling with the Cherubim, illustrated that the tabernacle of God is with men, and that He would dwell with them, and they would be his people, and He their God. It's the personal relationship of the Creator, to His people.

2nd Kings 19:15

• "And Hezekiah prayed before the LORD, and said, O LORD God of Israel, which dwellest between the Cherubim, thou art the God, even thou alone, of all the kingdoms of the earth; thou hast made heaven and earth."

Psalms 99:1-2

• The LORD reigneth; let the people tremble: he sitteth between the Cherubim; let the earth be moved.
• The LORD is great in Zion; and he is high above all the people."

Cherubim are the watchers and guardians over the Holiness and person of the Lord. It is their spiritual responsibility to be the fiery judge of anything that is unholy that should come into God's presence (Gen. 3:24). And who could there possibly be as guardian over God, but God? Is there anyone higher, stronger, or who could protect the way of the tree of Life better than God? Does God need "angels" to watch over Him? This was the likeness or image of the Glory of God, just as it is written. And it illustrates God's terribleness, His Kingship over all that Creation, and His personal relationship with His people. The Lord is not making His habitation in the Mercy Seat dwelling with "angels overshadowing Him", He dwells in the Glory of God, in the very Image of God, because He and the Father are one. If anything, He overshadows the messengers of God, MEN, not vice-versa.

Selah

• Was the king of Tyrus an "anointed cherub" (Ezekiel 28:14&16)?
• Was he at one time in the "Eden, the garden of God" (Ezekiel 28:13)?
• Did he protect "the holy mountain of God" (Ezekiel 28:14)?
• Was he created "perfect" in his ways "from the day" he was "created" till "iniquity was found in" him (Ezekiel 28:15)?
• Do you not believe in the total depravity of man anymore?

 

[stevesonthebay]

I relate to the psychological aspect and how there is a deeper spiritual basis for psychological disorders. In some ways mental illness is a possession of the person. A fixated mind state like a defense or attack depending on the situation.

But I think the person knows what is happening. They often verbalise the reality of the situation they are in. Yet still resist or indulge in the unreality. More like a belief and self fullfilling prophesy in their own heads.

We know that people can learn to overcome psychological disordered thinking with cognotive therapy. But this is only addressing the psychological aspect. I think unless a person addresses the spiritual aspect then they will always be supceptible to spiritual attacks.

 

[WPM]

(Continue to previous post)

Genesis 1:26-27

• "And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
• So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them."

Letting the scripture be its own interpreter, we must ask WHERE is it written in scripture that Satan was created in the image of God (as a Cherub) in the Garden of Eden, hummm? We don't read that of Satan, but we do read that of man. Scripture does NOT say that Satan was perfect in the day He was created until his fall, but God created Adam (man) perfect, without sin, with free access to the tree of life until the day of his fall. In all of scripture, there is no one (besides Christ, the God man) whom God declares was created perfect, except Adam. This in itself should illustrate to us that the king of Tyrus "personifies" man who had everything, and lost it in the fall. In fact the very language, "perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created," clearly harkens back to the creation of Adam.
Genesis 5:1-2

• "This is the book of the generations of Adam. In the day that God created man, in the likeness of God made he him;
• Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created."

So again, it all points to the King of Tyrus as a representation of fallen Man, not of an angel, Satan. Adam walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire and had no reason to hide from God before the fall. All these things which God speaks of concerning the King of Tyrus, applies to Adam before the fall. He was the very image of God (cherub) from the day that he was created, till iniquity was found in him. And by the multitude of his iniquity is there violence, and he has sinned, and therefore will God cast him as profane out of His Mountain.

Please notice that when God says, "Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus," God clearly talked about a lamentation for MAN, not for Satan, nor for fallen angels. When God says, "I will destroy thee, O covering Cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire," it speaks of the judgment of man, and how He is come under the wrath of God.
And so the support for the Cherub being an angel is not really as sound as many people might think. The symbolic image of the Cherubim, that John, Isaiah and Ezekiel saw, were a pictorial figure of the glory of God. And the Ark of the Covenant, the Mercy Seat, and Lord, dwelling with the Cherubim, illustrated that the tabernacle of God is with men, and that He would dwell with them, and they would be his people, and He their God. It's the personal relationship of the Creator, to His people.

2nd Kings 19:15

• "And Hezekiah prayed before the LORD, and said, O LORD God of Israel, which dwellest between the Cherubim, thou art the God, even thou alone, of all the kingdoms of the earth; thou hast made heaven and earth."

Psalms 99:1-2

• The LORD reigneth; let the people tremble: he sitteth between the Cherubim; let the earth be moved.
• The LORD is great in Zion; and he is high above all the people."

Cherubim are the watchers and guardians over the Holiness and person of the Lord. It is their spiritual responsibility to be the fiery judge of anything that is unholy that should come into God's presence (Gen. 3:24). And who could there possibly be as guardian over God, but God? Is there anyone higher, stronger, or who could protect the way of the tree of Life better than God? Does God need "angels" to watch over Him? This was the likeness or image of the Glory of God, just as it is written. And it illustrates God's terribleness, His Kingship over all that Creation, and His personal relationship with His people. The Lord is not making His habitation in the Mercy Seat dwelling with "angels overshadowing Him", He dwells in the Glory of God, in the very Image of God, because He and the Father are one. If anything, He overshadows the messengers of God, MEN, not vice-versa.

Selah

This is delusional.

 

[rwb]

This is delusional.

So, says you! If this is true, why haven't you proven from the Word of God that this reply is delusional?