Reason for The Crusades explained

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Armour of God

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Here’s one where I used AI (concerning the issue of Crusader atrocities in general). Are you able to follow the link to my post (#269) and read it?

Post in thread 'Reason for The Crusades explained'
Reason for The Crusades explained
That's fair enough.

Remember that I did concede that Christians did fight against each other.

My claim is simply that the objective of the Crusades were to defend against Muslim invasion and recapture the Holy Land from Islam.
 

Matthias

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You will be amazed at what hyper-grace, overly-spiritualized people deny. They've chosen to make themselves irrelevant in the public square, abandoning all soul-full responsibilities and allow themselves to be directed by enemies of God - and they think they have the moral high ground!

What he will find is that I told him the truth.
 

Matthias

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That's fair enough.

Remember that I did concede that Christians did fight against each other.

My claim is simply that the objective of the Crusades were to defend against Muslim invasion and recapture the Holy Land from Islam.

My question to you (post #1179) was concerning why the Crusaders also killed Christians and Jews.
 

Armour of God

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You will be amazed at what hyper-grace, overly-spiritualized people deny. They've chosen to make themselves irrelevant in the public square, abandoning all soul-full responsibilities and allow themselves to be directed by enemies of God - and they think they have the moral high ground!
It's not about any moral high ground it's about historical facts.

The objective of the crusade was to stop the spread of Islam and I proved that with 5 sources

I'm not sure why they killed each other, probably greed
 

Armour of God

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I have to go to sleep.
To conclude the crusades objective was to stop islamic invasion. I am happy that Islam didn't not take Europe as I would not be here today, neither would you considering your American
God bless
 

Matthias

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I have to go to sleep.
To conclude the crusades objective was to stop islamic invasion. I am happy that Islam didn't not take Europe as I would not be here today, neither would you considering your American
God bless

I’m a Jewish monotheist who believes that Jesus of Nazareth is the Messiah, Son of the living God. I would not have taken up weapons of the world against the Crusaders. They would have happily slit my throat and moved on. I reside in the United States but I’m a resident alien in the world.

A question for your consideration when you return: Were the actions taken by the Crusaders in accordance with the apostolic teaching contained in 2 Corinthians 10:3-5?
 

Wrangler

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It's not about any moral high ground it's about historical facts.
Agreed.

It's analogous to why the Roman Empire fell. While you and I would discuss the historical facts, this guy, @Matthias, argues ad infinitum that it shouldn't have fallen based on his interpretation of a book!

Imagine another mundane topic, such as why we moved away from the Model T. He'll write 100's of posts of why we should NOT have moved away from the Model T.

The objective of the crusade was to stop the spread of Islam and I proved that with 5 sources

You could have provided 100 sources and it wouldn't matter to this guy, @Matthias, who totally hijacks such threads, turning them into his overly-spiritualized shoulda, woulda, coulda rather than address the actual historical OP question. Sure, he claims he answered it. But that is not true and not his passion.

Not only does he remain morally opposed to centuries of Christian nations using violence to survive, being a passivist, he pulls out words like "real" or "true" Christians won't do that, claiming it violates Scripture, So obsessed is he with his own passivist dogma, he can't acknowledge the Christians for centuries up to the present day reject his passivism. So, he repeats his arguments, refusing to admit he lost again with the Christian nation of America defending herself against Iran.

The answer is a historical fact, not overly-spiritualized, passivist ongoing argument.
I'm not sure why they killed each other, probably greed

One problem with these overly-spiritualized types fail to acknowledge is people have more than one motivation, more than one obligation. We have an obligation to ever widening circles as Thomas Aquinas wrote regarding Ordo amoris. They're not dealing with the real world, where we don't Sabbath 7 days per week, don't have only 1 obligation.
 
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Matthias

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@Wrangler isn’t telling you the truth about me @Armour of God. If you want to know my view on followers of Jesus participating in war - or any other subject - it would be wise of you to ask me rather than rely on him to tell you.
 

Wrangler

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@Wrangler isn’t telling you the truth about me @Armour of God. If you want to know my view on followers of Jesus participating in war - or any other subject - it would be wise of you to ask me rather than rely on him to tell you.
Yea, I'm sure you'll use different words in the theory but mean the same thing in practice as what I wrote.
 

Armour of God

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@Wrangler isn’t telling you the truth about me @Armour of God. If you want to know my view on followers of Jesus participating in war - or any other subject - it would be wise of you to ask me rather than rely on him to tell you.
Ok what do you think the Christians should of done about the Islamic invasion?

Because if they had not defended themselves Europe would of all been Islam. America would of probably been founded by Islam or maybe China.

I don't think they had a choice.
I hear what your saying, atrocities against Christisns and Jews wasn't a nice thing to do, they didn't have to do that, I agree.
But I think they had to defend against Islamic invasion, don't you?
 

Matthias

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Ok what do you think the Christians should of done about the Islamic invasion?

Follow the teaching of Jesus and the apostles.

Because if they had not defended themselves Europe would of all been Islam. America would of probably been founded by Islam or maybe China.

I don't think they had a choice.
I hear what your saying, atrocities against Christisns and Jews wasn't a nice thing to do, they didn't have to do that, I agree.
But I think they had to defend against Islamic invasion, don't you?
 

Armour of God

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Follow the teaching of Jesus and the apostles.
What do you mean?
You think they should of just allowed Islam to take over Europe?

Come and kill me, take my land and rape my wife... Your crazy. We have the right to defend our selves and families at least.
 
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Matthias

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Armour of God

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I mean in all circumstances, follow the teaching of Jesus and the apostles in how to treat their enemies.



I think it’s the responsibility of secular government to defend their citizens.



I didn’t say anything even remotely like that.
Aren't you just saying to surrender?