Why do so many Christains treat unbelievers as the enemy of God?

[BreadOfLife]

Ummmm . . . I already showed it by posting Matt. 5:14-16.
I showed you that Jesus states that HIS Church is NOT invisible.

Now - can YOU show me where He says that it IS invisible?
I didn't think so . . .

PS - the laying of hands on sick people is not a "secret".
It is a Sacrament:
From the Catechism of the Catholic Church:
A sacrament of the sick
1511 The Church believes and confesses that among the seven sacraments there is one especially intended to strengthen those who are being tried by illness, the Anointing of the Sick:
This sacred anointing of the sick was instituted by Christ our Lord as a true and proper sacrament of the New Testament. It is alluded to indeed by Mark, but is recommended to the faithful and promulgated by James the apostle and brother of the Lord.125
1512 From ancient times in the liturgical traditions of both East and West, we have testimonies to the practice of anointings of the sick with blessed oil. Over the centuries the Anointing of the Sick was conferred more and more exclusively on those at the point of death. Because of this it received the name "Extreme Unction." Notwithstanding this evolution the liturgy has never failed to beg the Lord that the sick person may recover his health if it would be conducive to his salvation.126

1513 The Apostolic Constitution Sacram unctionem infirmorum,127 following upon the Second Vatican Council,128 established that henceforth, in the Roman Rite, the following be observed:
The sacrament of Anointing of the Sick is given to those who are seriously ill by anointing them on the forehead and hands with duly blessed oil - pressed from olives or from other plants - saying, only once: "Through this holy anointing may the Lord in his love and mercy help you with the grace of the Holy Spirit. May the Lord who frees you from sin save you and raise you up."129
II. WHO RECEIVES AND WHO ADMINISTERS THIS SACRAMENT?
In case of grave illness . . .
1514 The Anointing of the Sick "is not a sacrament for those only who are at the point of death. Hence, as soon as anyone of the faithful begins to be in danger of death from sickness or old age, the fitting time for him to receive this sacrament has certainly already arrived."130

1515 If a sick person who received this anointing recovers his health, he can in the case of another grave illness receive this sacrament again. If during the same illness the person's condition becomes more serious, the sacrament may be repeated. It is fitting to receive the Anointing of the Sick just prior to a serious operation. The same holds for the elderly whose frailty becomes more pronounced.
" . . . let him call for the presbyters of the Church"

 

[BreadOfLife]

obviously there is, if you cannot see it, yet many others can.

Imo a better parable for this is "the kingdom does not come by observation," but of course you believe it does, so i'm not sure how you justify your position here, and the parable you cite has nothing to do with a Visible Church--except for eyes that see.

the entire subject of Matt 5 is personal actions and responsibility; acknowledging that it is Living Stones, believers, who are the Church. And we do not get to define "believers" either, otherwise you are demonstrably going to hell, see.

Ummm, first of all - I didn't cite a "Parable".
I cited a lesson of Jesus.

The plain fact of the matter, My Biblically-challenged friend, is that neither Jesus nor the NT writers teach an "invisible" Church.
The Church is ALWAYS spoken of as being visible (Matt. 5:14-16) and unified (John 17:20-23, 1 Cor. 12).

 

[BreadOfLife]

you must not completely read my post. who do the works? for the flesh profit nothing. and if you think the church is flesh then you're in for a big surprise.

And if YOU think that the Church is made of of invisible beings - YOU are mistaken.
The Church - the Body of Christ, is made up of human beings (1 Cor. 12) and He is the Head (Col. 1:18).

When Jesus said that the "flesh profits nothing" - He wasn't talking about a visible Church. You completely took His words out of context.
This phrase is from John 6, human understanding as it pertained to His words about eating and drinking His flesh and blood.

 

[101G]

Matthew 16:18 "And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it". the ROCK is God himself. and God is Spirit.

John 3:3 "Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God". Exodus 19:6 "And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel". when was fulfilled? on the day of Pentecost. and who function do we as priest do?. physical sacrifices? no.

now as for John 17:20=23 "Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word; 21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. 22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one". it's through the Spirit. listen, Romans 8:13 "For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live".

 

[BreadOfLife]

Matthew 16:18 "And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it". the ROCK is God himself. and God is Spirit.

John 3:3 "Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God". Exodus 19:6 "And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These are the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel". when was fulfilled? on the day of Pentecost. and who function do we as priest do?. physical sacrifices? no.

now as for John 17:20=23 "Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word; 21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. 22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one". it's through the Spirit. listen, Romans 8:13 "For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live".

This entire post is an embarrassing display of Scriptural ignorance.

First of all - NONE of these verses talks about an "invisible" Church:

Matt. 16:18 is about Jesus appointing Peter as earthly Head of His Church.
John 3:3 is talking about those who are not baptized will not see Heaven.
Exodus 19:6 is talking about Israel. As for what priests do - they offer the Holy and eternal Sacrifice of the Eucharist.
As for John 17 20:23 - it is about the UNITY of His Church.

Finally - Rom. 8:13 is talking about denying the body so as to increase the Spirit and has NOTHING to do with an "invisible" Church.

 

[101G]

the Body of Christ, is made up of human beings (1 Cor. 12)

I'm glad you used that verse.
1 Peter 2:5 "Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

 

[101G]

This entire post is an embarrassing display of Scriptural ignorance.

the only embarrassing thing here is one who ignorantly walk after the flesh and please it.

 

[Job]

Show me ONE verse of Scripture that speaks of an "invisible" Church

John 4
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

 

[BreadOfLife]

I'm glad you used that verse.
1 Peter 2:5 "Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

WHERE does this even hint at an "invisible" Church.
The fact that we are spiritual beings does NOT negate the fact that we are also physical beings.

We are the light of the world - a city on a hill that cannot be hidden (Matt. 5:14-16).

 

[BreadOfLife]

the only embarrassing thing here is one who ignorantly walk after the flesh and please it.

And WHO is doing that??

Look - if you're going to make Scripturally-bankrupt claims about an "invisible" Church - then the onus is on YOU to provide the evidence - not by making false accusations about me . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

John 4
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Worshiping God in spirit doesn't mean that the Church is "invisible."

Just because GOD is invisible doesn't mean that His Church is.
Jesus said that HIS Church is the light of the world. A city on a hill that CANNOT be hidden.

You are grasping at straws here . . .

 

[101G]

John 4
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

This is correct, this is mount Zion new Jerusalem, not old physical Jerusalem. the church is not physical. example, Psalms 87:2 "The LORD loveth the gates of Zion more than all the dwellings of Jacob". this gate is the door. and we know who the door is. also like the pillar of the TEMPLE in the City, scripture, Revelation 3:12 "Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name". continue to speaking of the New Jerusalem. Revelation 21:12 "And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel: 13 On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates. 14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb". And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. where have we hear this number before, 12 X 12 =144,00 Revelation 14:1 "And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads". if anyone think the church that the Lord is building is physical, is still walking after the flesh. 12X12 =144,000 is not a cubic city. no a city is also symbolic for people. this is how one can tell that the city Jerusalem is that beast, the synagogue of Satan. just watch who the bible says is that "GREAT CITY". not Rome.

 

[BreadOfLife]

This is correct, this is mount Zion new Jerusalem, not old physical Jerusalem. the church is not physical. example, Psalms 87:2 "The LORD loveth the gates of Zion more than all the dwellings of Jacob". this gate is the door. and we know who the door is. also like the pillar of the TEMPLE in the City, scripture, Revelation 3:12 "Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name". continue to speaking of the New Jerusalem. Revelation 21:12 "And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel: 13 On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates. 14 And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb". And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb. where have we hear this number before, 12 X 12 =144,00 Revelation 14:1 "And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads". if anyone think the church that the Lord is building is physical, is still walking after the flesh. 12X12 =144,000 is not a cubic city. no a city is also symbolic for people. this is how one can tell that the city Jerusalem is that beast, the synagogue of Satan. just watch who the bible says is that "GREAT CITY". not Rome.

This isn't a conversation about whether or not the Church is physical. It's about whether or not it is INVISIBLE.
The Church is NOT invisible - it is the light of the world and a city on a hill that CANNOT be hidden.

This is a false, Protestant doctrine.
Either the Protestants are correct - or Jesus is (Matt. 5:14-16).

I put all of MY trust in Jesus . . .

 

[101G]

The Church is NOT invisible - it is the light of the world and a city on a hill that CANNOT be hidden.

Light is knowledge, and Godly Wisdom with knowledge gives the hearer understanding. this LIGHT, which cannot be hidden. how ignorant can one be. ok, ok, let's make it simple. breadof life answer me this, 1 John 1:7 "But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin". now instead of asking, we will give answers. listen. if someone come to you and say, "did you know that so in so had a baby out of wedlock?" one might respond, " no, I was keep in the dark about that". now was you in a room without physical LIGHT?. NO. it was that you had no KNOWLEDGE of the subject.

 

[BreadOfLife]

FACT:
The Church is the Body of Christ.

FACT:
The BODY is made up of people - not invisible entities.

FACT:
The HEAD of the Body is Jesus who, although being God, is ALSO a man - a person.

FACT:
The Church is a VISIBLE entity as well as a spiritual one but it is not "invisible".

 

[BreadOfLife]

Light is knowledge, and Godly Wisdom with knowledge gives the hearer understanding. this LIGHT, which cannot be hidden. how ignorant can one be. ok, ok, let's make it simple. breadof life answer me this, 1 John 1:7 "But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin". now instead of asking, we will give answers. listen. if someone come to you and say, "did you know that so in so had a baby out of wedlock?" one might respond, " no, I was keep in the dark about that". now was you in a room without physical LIGHT?. NO. it was that you had no KNOWLEDGE of the subject.

Light is NOT just Knowledge and wisdom - but kindness and love and mercy.
You cannot exemplify those things without being visible.

 

[101G]

FACT:
The Church is the Body of Christ.

FACT:
The BODY is made up of people - not invisible entities.

FACT:
The HEAD of the Body is Jesus who, although being God, is ALSO a man - a person.

FACT:
The Church is a VISIBLE entity as well as a spiritual one but it is not "invisible".

LOL, LOL, ok person, I ask is a person visible or not. I'm talking about the real you, not your house you dwell in.................... (smile). and when you finish telling that none truth read John 1:4 and see what Light MEANS..

 

[Job]

Light is NOT just Knowledge and wisdom - but kindness and love and mercy.
You cannot exemplify those things without being visible.

Why not?

 

[Job]

Just because GOD is invisible doesn't mean that His Church is.

So of all the churches in the world, which one does He claim for His own?

 

[bbyrd009]

invisible beings

lol. i have already just recently stated the Church is made of Living Stones to you, so could you do me a fave and just tell me how many words--if any--you even read before you reply, that would be great.

surely you are already aware of the concept, and just do not want to admit that anyone who is not Catholic is damned in your opinion, which must naturally proceed from a visible (physical, fleshly, worldly) "institution" such as you postulate.