freewill is bogus

[twinc]

Hi,

Did God ALLOW you to write this?

Or was it your choice?

IHS....Mary

this vault of heaven under which we move is but a magic lantern this to prove - the sun there is the flame the world the lamp and we the comic figures that dance and sing and jig and move[Fitzgerald] - twinc

 

[DPMartin]

if there is no free will, then there is no choice, seems to me.

in the case I speak of, that is absolutely true. again this isn't about coke and pepsi challenge. but will is one thing, and choice is another.

simple if God chooses to make you willing then you will, if not then you'll go the way of your own judgement, which is by the way the life that was chosen for you by Adam and Eve, and God left them have. and take note here Adam and Eve now go by their own judgement of what is good and evil. so God says:

Gen 3:22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

thing is man has now taken God's job, or it seems to man that he has. therefore in the case of people choosing God, not so, God choses. and it is God's Judgement of what is good that is good for his creation, no exceptions.

 

[DPMartin]

I kinda think that it is an oxymoron in Christ but those without Christ ~ we think that perhaps, we are free to will and to act but everything we do whether believer or not is subject within the bounds of good and evil or/and life and death...

well going a little off subject maybe, but; subject to who's judgement of what is good and evil for one, and then there is the fact that man's judgment always results in death.

 

[bbyrd009]

but will is one thing, and choice is another.

i don't think you could demonstrate this very effectively tbh, at least not without getting extremely philosophical lol.

 

[Marymog]

what am I talking about here whether or not you can pick your nose or not in public? you can't be serious.

the only choice other than God's choice is death, you can pick your nose or not pick your nose in public the life you received being born into the world will result in the same. you can be mr wonderful and a supper dad and mr community or you can be a rancid criminal of the worst kind and you still didn't choice the life your received in the flesh, and the result is the same for mr wonderful or the criminal. and freewillers think to choice their gods to meet their own judgement of what a god ought to be, if they think there be a god.

and this is the facts according to the Beloved Son of God who is salvation:

Joh_6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

so coke and pepsi so what, God chose whether or not such things could exist or not, and that they would be within your reach or not.

The life we receive?

Are you saying we a predestined? I am not trying to be confrontational. I am just having trouble understanding what your belief is.

It seems you are saying we have choices i.e. Pick our nose or pick our nose in public, Coke or Pepsi but it also seems you are saying we are predestined which means we don't have a choice. Mr. wonderful and MR. Rancid criminal didn't choose their life? That is how I am reading what you wrote. I could be wrong.

I guess you are saying we can choose the little things we do in life but when it comes to choosing if I want to be saved or not, I don't have a choice?

Everyone who glorifies God does so THRU the Son. Everyone who follows the Son does so because God DRAWS him and the Holy Spirit moves him. That does not mean God CHOOSES who is drawn to Him.

IHS...Mary

 

[Marymog]

It is an interesting question, Mary. One I don't know the answer to. I am a writer, or use to be. I use to write stuff not suitable for children, then lesions in my brain shut down my ability to focus or process thoughts. Whenever I tried; for years...I hit a wall. I beat this wall everyday, but couldn't get through. The only time I can focus or think clearly now is when I am focused on Him. The past couple of days I have been ate up with bitterness. Distracted. It has been a long time since I have felt such distance from Him. In this state, depressed and irritated...I can't read His word or hardly make sense of simple thoughts. So you tell me: who opens up His word for understanding? Who shuts us down when we are not going in the right direction, but rather returning to our old ways? Who decides if you take your next breath? Who decides if you are productive, or laid flat on your back?

Going to spend time with my family; obviously...it is His choice.

The Holy Spirit opens up his word for understanding.

A kind word from a friend, your spouse, your preacher, a stranger or just watching the news and learning that 59 people were killed by a gunman could change our direction. Does that mean God had those 59 people killed so that I, Mary, would change my direction?

Breathing is automatic. When it stops being automatic we have to think about it and force it.

I decide if I am productive or lay flat on my back. It's called personal responsibility.

If we have no choice, then we are just puppets.

IHS....Mary

 

[Marymog]

this vault of heaven under which we move is but a magic lantern this to prove - the sun there is the flame the world the lamp and we the comic figures that dance and sing and jig and move[Fitzgerald] - twinc

This ball we live on is glowing due to the sun. I can not dance or sing or jig without the Son. {Mary}

 

[Angelina]

well going a little off subject maybe, but; subject to who's judgement of what is good and evil for one, and then there is the fact that man's judgment always results in death.

The creator of course.

 

[DPMartin]

The creator of course.

not if one lives the life given through Adam and Eve.

 

[Angelina]

not if one lives the life given through Adam and Eve.

Even Adam and Eve had a choice...

 

[FHII]

Even Adam and Eve had a choice...

God sent the solution to the problem Adam and Eve created before they made a choice. Christ was slain before the foundation of the world. God didn't wait for them to make that choice.

And no... He didn't just foreknow. He declared it from the beginning.

 

[DPMartin]

The Holy Spirit opens up his word for understanding.

A kind word from a friend, your spouse, your preacher, a stranger or just watching the news and learning that 59 people were killed by a gunman could change our direction. Does that mean God had those 59 people killed so that I, Mary, would change my direction?

Breathing is automatic. When it stops being automatic we have to think about it and force it.

I decide if I am productive or lay flat on my back. It's called personal responsibility.

If we have no choice, then we are just puppets.

IHS....Mary

one the Holy Spirit is the Presence of God, Jesus says God is Spirit.


the Lord God brought Egypt to it's knees deliberately stating to Moses more than once the He hardened Pharaoh's heart to bring Egypt to almost total destruction and then wiped out Pharaoh's army in the sea. just to show His chosen (Israel) that He is Lord.

what's breathing got to do with it? and again you are not paying attention, choices like coke and pepsi, being a workaholic or being a shiftless lay about has nothing to do with the subject at hand, does it? this subject is about freewill and how its applies to choosing God or wiliness to serve God, and its not so.

 

[Angelina]

God sent the solution to the problem Adam and Eve created before they made a choice. Christ was slain before the foundation of the world. God didn't wait for them to make that choice.

And no... He didn't just foreknow. He declared it from the beginning.

Please quote the scripture you're referring to regarding "slain before the foundation of the world"

 

[DPMartin]

Even Adam and Eve had a choice...

death isn't much of one but they did, and now you've received that same life (sin, condemnation, so on and so forth) that you didn't chose, when you came into the world.

and God choses whom He shall have mercy on.


Rom 9:15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. 16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy. 17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth. 18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.

mind you that's NT teaching from an apostle, not some philosopher jargon, or Christian feel good theology for self wellness hoopla.

 

[Angelina]

Please quote the scripture you're referring to regarding "slain before the foundation of the world"

 

[FHII]

Please quote the scripture you're referring to regarding "slain before the foundation of the world"

Revelation 13:8 KJV
And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

1 Peter 1:19-20 KJV
But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot: [20] Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

 

[twinc]

This ball we live on is glowing due to the sun. I can not dance or sing or jig without the Son. {Mary}

yes of course in Him we move and live and have our being - most don't understand but don't understand they just don't understand and are determined they do understand and being misled are busy misleading others = we do not even breathe but think we do when we do not even think since thoughts occur - we are guilty of the greatest sin of all viz the sin of pride i.e.taking the glory away from God and claiming it for ourselves when we should be submissive not like robots but like little children but it seems we must all pass through the gates of Gethsemane and kneel alone in darkness there and battle with this fierce despair - God pity those who cannot say not mine but thine will be done who only pray let this cup pass but cannot see the purpose for Gethsemane[Wilcox] - twinc

 

[FHII]

yes of course in Him we move and live and have our being - most don't understand but don't understand they just don't understand and are determined they do understand and being misled are busy misleading others = we do not even breathe but think we do when we do not even think since thoughts occur - we are guilty of the greatest sin of all viz the sin of pride i.e.taking the glory away from God and claiming it for ourselves when we should be submissive not like robots but like little children but it seems we must all pass through the gates of Gethsemane and kneel alone in darkness there and battle with this fierce despair - God pity those who cannot say not mine but thine will be done who only pray let this cup pass but cannot see the purpose for Gethsemane[Wilcox] - twinc

The Bible I understand... But your one sentence lost me.

 

[Helen]

if there is no free will, then there is no choice, seems to me.

God gives us the test, and then gives us the answer too...
"I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life.."

 

[Job]

If freewill is just an illusion, I wonder how many of us will hear these words?

"I never knew you"