Eternal Security
- Thread starter Rollo Tamasi
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1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
Go to one and see for yourself, you might come off with a different opinion.
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
I spent a good decade chasing the arcane art's, it just messed my head up.
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
gadar perets
Well-Known Member
Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God (Father YHWH) hath made that same Yeshua, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Messiah.
The "only true God" made Yeshua to be Lord and Messiah over us. He did NOT make Himself to be our Lord and Messiah. YHWH has always been the "Lord of Heaven and Earth". He did not need to be made "Lord". Did the Father send Himself to be beat Himself up and put Himself to death for us? According to Isaiah 53, YHWH (the Father) had Yeshua beaten and smitten to death.
I can say with a true heart that "Yeshua is Lord" as the Greek of 1 Corinthians 12:3 says. I cannot say, "Jesus is that Lord" as you think I should be able to say.
gadar perets
Well-Known Member
Not one of those references, nor any other reference in the entire Bible, calls Yeshua "God Almighty" or even "the Almighty". It is NOT a title of Yeshua. In fact, the following verses make a clear distinction between the Almighty and Yeshua.
Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he [Yeshua] shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he [Yeshua] treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God [YHWH].
Rev 21:22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty [YHWH] and the Lamb [Yeshua] are the temple of it.
Rev 21:22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty [YHWH] and the Lamb [Yeshua] are the temple of it.
The words Lord and LORD have made a confusion in the O.T.
This is due to the fact that the first English bibles were not translated correctly.
Lord means master,,,but isn't Jesus our master?
LORD, instead, refers to God the Father. But when the O.T. was first written both words were used incorrectly.
Would you say that it's correct to call Jesus LORD, or Yaweh?
No he didn't -- we still have a sinful nature even after the cross.
The Gospel provides for forgiveness of sins, adoption and the New Nature - but we still have the old one as well which is why Paul describes it as a struggle a battle - in Romans 7 and 1 Cor 9. "I buffet my body and make it my slave".
We no longer are enslaved to walking in the flesh - so in the spirit we walk in the spirit.
The new nature does not desire sin - but born again Christians do sin at times.
Totally false.
All of Adam's children had sinful nature and imputed sin as well as imparted guilt of sin due to their own sin.
mankind sinned - to this very day.
mankind has a sinful nature to this very day
the Bible "defines sin" as "Transgression of the LAW" 1 John 3:4 - by definition.
That is actually true.
That is to deny the NEW Covenant which GOD says includes "The LAW of God written on the heart and mind" Jer 31:31-33, Hebrews 8:6-11
I prefer the Bible on that one.
true. But we have free will and can choose to let the Spirit rule or to turn to our sinful nature.
True. So for example for Abraham
1. No taking God's name in vain
2. No bowing down to images
3. No dishonor to parents
etc.
1. Or taking a bath
2. or refusing to take God's name in vain
3. or looking at a tree
4. or seeing the life of Christ
5. or hearing the gospel that we have today.
Yet the NT tells us He DID in fact "see Christ" John.
And the NT tell us He DID receive the Gospel - the ONE Gospel that we have today Gal 3:7
Your point above does not rise above the level of "creative writing" --
Making stuff up again? Not compelling. Sabbath is "made for mankind" Mark 2:27 and mentioned when mankind is made in Genesis 2:1-3.
Less creative writing on that point -- more Bible.
The Gospel is the SAME "AFTER Adam sinned, and BEFORE Christ died, and AFTER Christ died"
No text says "until the law came into effect" you are using creative writing to mix in with the Bible... not a good idea.
"Where there is no LAW NEITHER is there transgression" Romans 4. Choose the Bible
making stuff up again -- and mixing it with the Bible. in all ages the "wages of sin IS death"
in all ages "sin IS transgression of the LAW"
in all ages "mankind are sinners with a sinful nature"
And they are also the LAW of liberty written on the heart under the NEW Covenant.
Thus it is "still" a sin to take God's name in vain ... even to this very day.
(don't have time this AM to untangle every mix of your creative writing into a Bible text... might pick up later from this point)
"BobRyan, post: 440138, member: 7908"]No he didn't -- we still have a sinful nature even after the cross.
Don't confuse nature with law. If we still had a sin nature then we would not feel horrible after sinning...since it would be in our nature to sin. But that is not the state of a converted person to Christ. it denies the new divine nature implanted in our hearts by regeneration of the Spirit. But there is a law in our members that is contrary to our new natures. That can only be overcome by entering INTO Christ.
The Gospel provides for forgiveness of sins, adoption and the New Nature - but we still have the old one as well which is why Paul describes it as a struggle a battle - in Romans 7 and 1 Cor 9. "I buffet my body and make it my slave".
See above.
Don't confuse nature with law. If we still had a sin nature then we would not feel horrible after sinning...since it would be in our nature to sin. But that is not the state of a converted person to Christ. it denies the new divine nature implanted in our hearts by regeneration of the Spirit. But there is a law in our members that is contrary to our new natures. That can only be overcome by entering INTO Christ.
The Gospel provides for forgiveness of sins, adoption and the New Nature - but we still have the old one as well which is why Paul describes it as a struggle a battle - in Romans 7 and 1 Cor 9. "I buffet my body and make it my slave".
See above.
gadar perets
Well-Known Member
What leads you to believe that other than reading the Son into John 1:1?
Yes, YHWH is one (the Father). He is not two (the Father and the Son).
I can't explain it better than my post number 1226.
It seems to me that John is referring to Jesus as the Word.
Have you read it?
I believe he does this in verse 14.
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
Echad....Oneness.
John 10:30 "I and the Father are one."
John 17:21" that they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me."
Zech. 2:9 ..."Then you will know that the Lord of hosts has sent Me."
10 “Sing and rejoice, O daughter of Zion! For behold, I am coming and I will dwell in your midst,” says the Lord. 11 “Many nations shall be joined to the Lord in that day, and they shall become My people. And I will dwell in your midst. Then you will know that the Lord of hosts has sent Me to you."
Epi: John 10:30 and John 17:21 are classic misused verses by trinitarians to 'prove' that God is Jesus or vi se versa.
It is another case of cherry-picking verses, thrown together in haste as grenades that have only one purpose - destroy the truth. They usually then get the heck out of the room, as they hold their ears tight because they do not want anyone throwing a bigger grenade back at them that may pierce their minds and hearts to the truth.
Again, in context:
(Joh 10:28) And I give to them eternal life; and they shall never perish, and no one shall snatch them out of my hand.
(Joh 10:29) My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand.
(Joh 10:30) I and the Father are one. (NEV)
(Joh 17:20) Neither for these only do I pray, but for those also that believe in me through their word;
(Joh 17:21) that they may all be one, even as You, Father, are in me and I in You, that they may also be one in us; that the world may believe You did send me.
(Joh 17:22) And the glory which You have given me, I have given to them, that they may be one, even as we are one.
(Joh 17:23) I in them and You in me, that they may be perfected into one, that the world may know You did send me and that You have loved them just as You loved me. (NEV)
Jesus, knowing that the Father's spirit was in him and working within him, requested of the Father to have believers be also in him (Jesus) as well. This of course would happen in the near future.
It is very naïve to say that Verse 10:30 meant that Jesus was God. He was saying that his Father and he were bonded in spirit and purpose, since his birth (the first true born believer). Jesus allowed his Father's will to work within him to the cross and beyond as scripture clearly states in MANY places. Jesus was then saying that those that 'believed' in Christ to salvation, should also be in him (Jesus) in spirit and purpose. And of course we know this is true of a true believer.
Using the crooked logic of trinitarians to its end in these verses, we then must be Jesus and Jesus is us. This is nonsense right. WE ARE NOT JESUS or VISA VERSA as JESUS IS NOT GOD ALMIGHTY!!
As 10:29 states RIGHT BEFORE verse 30," My Father (that is Jesus' Father)...IS GREATER THAN ALL.." I guess to trinitarians then Jesus is saying he is God...Quite remarkable, eh? Creative and SELF-styled thinking is what I call it...
Anyone with any basic scripture knowledge guided by the spirit should easily see that Jesus did not suddenly present himself as God. This is not was Jesus was saying concerning future believers.
Anyway, the beat goes on......
Bless you,
APAK
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