If you are honest, state your question for all to see. And I will answer it for all to see.
Who is Jesus Christ?
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Zero doctrine. Paul was a murderous Pharisee (Antichrist) when God took him over through the New Birth on the road to Damascus. It was after that he learned the truth.
Gee Dave, I thought you were going to really answer my question. You said you would. Were you lying? I was honest and did present the question again as you asked. Yet, no answer. That can only mean you are dishonest in your request to me about the question. And in your statement that you would answer for all to see, you have answered nothing.
Your theology is full of holes. I guess you can always say your theology is 'holy'.
Stranger
What better answer could a person give? Salvation by grace and not works? Why not answer it for us so we can see what you are expecting for an answer?
I'm confused...I understand that it says: today I have begotten you. But this doesn't negate that John says the Son existed with God from the beginning and that He WAS God. Born in bodily form at a point in time, yes, but the poster wasn't giving an opinion to say Christ existed from the beginning with God. You can actually show from the bible what you've said he cannot show. And John specifically echoes Genesis in the way he chose to write the beginning of his book, and he also tries to underscore that Jesus is the light first spoken of in Genesis.
This is how I read it. As always, there may be some different ideas on what John was trying to convey...
And think too, about how the Baptist could say Jesus existed before him when the Baptist was born first!
And I'm aware of how mindboggling it gets to try to conceive of God and Jesus as one as Jesus stated. It's trippy for sure!
Another thought - God Himself has said He is one God, and that we are to worship no other God. But in Revelation, they worship the Lamb/Word of God/Jesus. So trying to imagine it all becomes blurred at some point...
The fact remains that God said...TODAY I have begotten you. If both Father and Son always existed....could Jesus say...TODAY I have made a Father for myself?
No, the text shows that The Son comes from the Father...and not the other way around. The Father does not come from the Son. That's why the text shows this distinction. Otherwise it would be the God twins or something like that. God chose to reveal Jesus as His Son...because the Father came first. We need to stick with the biblical imagery.
When you consider that the Godhead is the family of God....Father and Son. These are One (family). The mystery is that a remnant of human beings will join that family as adopted sons and fellow heirs with Christ. The glory goes to the Father and to His only begotten Son Jesus Christ.
So you do not think Jesus existed before He was born as a human? But how then did the Baptist say Jesus existed before He himself did when we know he was born first?
When you say God chose to reveal Jesus as His Son, I can understand this. And The Son did not consider it robbery to be born in human flesh and to give up His place and power to accomplish what He did in the weaknesses of mortal flesh.
But at the same time, He existed before He was born in the flesh, because everything was created through Him and the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world.
I put in the weaknesses of human flesh in the wrong place in my sentence. Didn't mean for it to sound the way it came out there.
Why have you omitted the Holy Spirit? He too is within the Godhead (Mt 28:19)
The term *adoption* in the NT is not the same as the common meaning of adoption, i.e. children from one unrelated family being adopted into another family, with no blood relationship, and no right of heirship.
Since the Bible says that those who have been regenerated are literally *born of God* and *born of the Spirit*, the saints are literally children of God through the New Birth. Therefore their *adoption* has a different meaning. Every child of God is given the position and all the privileges which normally go only to the heir within a family. Therefore "we are heirs of God and joint-heirs" with Christ, and God has reserved an eternal inheritance for each of His children.
Correct. Jesus -- God the Word, and the only begotten Son of God -- has existed with God the Father and God the Holy Spirit from eternity past. He was not *begotten* some time later, or at His incarnation.
But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting. (Micah 5:2)
@101G
Thank you for the explanation in post #159. It is as I guess that I understand it although expressing it in words may be difficult. When I hear someone else say it sometimes it helps clarify my own vision even though it may remain in a measure "through a glass darkly".
Give God the glory!
Thank you for the explanation in post #159. It is as I guess that I understand it although expressing it in words may be difficult. When I hear someone else say it sometimes it helps clarify my own vision even though it may remain in a measure "through a glass darkly".
Give God the glory!
CoreIssue
Well-Known Member
Not correct.
We discussed this before. You are misusing the word Word.
The word is the logos one time the whole Bible and is only used one time in the whole Bible.
The Meaning of 'Logos' in the Prologue of John's Gospel
Jesus, the incarnate flesh and blood who died on the cross and resurrected is not the second person of the Trinity. God cannot die. God is not flesh.
Micah 5:2 New International Version (NIV)
2 “But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah,
though you are small among the clansa]">[a] of Judah,
out of you will come for me
one who will be ruler over Israel,
whose origins are from of old,
from ancient times.”
His origins we decided from ancient times, but it does not say his flesh existed. From ancient times
Nor does it say the name of God is Jesus.
Claiming such says God died on the cross. That God paid the sin price when the Bible clearly says only a man and pay the sin price.
Jesus is the second Adam, meaning he was created by God and his body fully human.
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