Christians and guns (2nd Amendment)

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ScaliaFan

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I had this friend yrs ago who said that if someone broke into her house and wanted to kill her family, she would just let him!!!!!!!

can u believe that. She was a SDA but i do not believe SDAs teach that.

So anyway, what is the proper attitude for christians to have re guns?

Well, guns save lives.

thank you, John Kasich for not bending to the liberals and fake conservatives who wanted to temporarily REVOKE (rescind... whatever) the open carry laws in Ohio during the RNC convention!!!!

yeh, every time there is some "concern" we suspend the constitution! Right... not much of a Constitution if you can suspend it...

and if they find a reason to suspend it for this or that, they can find a reason to suspend it for ANYTHING...

yeh, take the arms away from the law-abiding... The criminals who couldn't care less about gun laws just LOVE that kind of thing... They are sicko cowards who love nothing better than sitting ducks...

you know, another thing is... there really are corrupt cops who ... of course have guns... There may be FEW who are corrupt but it only takes one... So... again, do we disarm law abiding citizens so they are helpless to protect themselves?

absolutely not
 

lforrest

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It actually makes sense, assuming she is 200% confident every one of her family is saved and they are all prepared to die. If she doubts even the slightest then she should defend her family with deadly force.
 

Dan57

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ScaliaFan said:
I had this friend yrs ago who said that if someone broke into her house and wanted to kill her family, she would just let him!!!!!!!
What a sweetheart :). Maybe she just hates her family?

I have a sister who said the same thing. There are people who are just extreme pacifist... And a pacifist is just a victim waiting to happen.

Sometimes people who have that mind-set, have had a safe sheltered life, so they say things like that because they think they're immune to violence.
 

ScaliaFan

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lforrest said:
It actually makes sense, assuming she is 200% confident every one of her family is saved and they are all prepared to die. If she doubts even the slightest then she should defend her family with deadly force.
oh great. What a lovely society it would be if all of us did this kind of thing.. let the Satan followers kill all the God followers...

Beam me up, Scotty

no intelligent life down here
 

ScaliaFan

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Dan57 said:
What a sweetheart :). Maybe she just hates her family?

I have a sister who said the same thing. There are people who are just extreme pacifist... And a pacifist is just a victim waiting to happen.

Sometimes people who have that mind-set, have had a safe sheltered life, so they say things like that because they think they're immune to violence.
well, the sheltered and the spoiled do say odd and shallow sounding things all the time, but this friend was far from sheltered. She had a hard life. I think she was just trying to be a good SDA, but again, i doubt the SDA teach this kind of thing..

In any case, she (as most fanatics eventually do) gave up on religion altogether... ran off w/ some younger guy (old enough to be his mother), ditched her young children and... really sad story... the romance died soon enough as they always do... etc...
 

lforrest

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ScaliaFan said:
oh great. What a lovely society it would be if all of us did this kind of thing.. let the Satan followers kill all the God followers...

Beam me up, Scotty

no intelligent life down here
We aught to be living for life up there, in heaven. Logically if someone is willing to murder they are going to Hell if you kill them. Their only chance comes with time, that God's grace would catch on in them. The Christian whom they murder is going to heaven.

If you are concerned about your progeny, there is the resurrection.

Concerned about justice possibly being avoided? Vengeance belongs to the Lord.

Concerned about society? God is handing it over to a depraved mind.
 

Dcopymope

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lforrest said:
We aught to be living for life up there, in heaven. Logically if someone is willing to murder they are going to Hell if you kill them. Their only chance comes with time, that God's grace would catch on in them. The Christian whom they murder is going to heaven.

If you are concerned about your progeny, there is the resurrection.

Concerned about justice possibly being avoided? Vengeance belongs to the Lord.

Concerned about society? God is handing it over to a depraved mind.

And I would gladly pump those of a depraved mind full of hot sexy lead if they feel they should act on that depravity at my sufferance. This isn't about vengeance, this is about common sense justice and self-defense.
 
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Dan57

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Dcopymope said:
And I would gladly pump those of a depraved mind full of hot sexy lead if they feel they should act on that depravity at my sufferance. This isn't about vengeance, this is about common sense justice and self-defense.
I'd say the same thing, vengeance belongs to God, but self defense is up to us. When Jesus told his disciples that 2 swords ought to be enough, I doubt he meant for chopping wood (Luke 22:38). And providing for ones own family would certainly entail keeping them safe; "But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel." (1 Timothy 5:8).
 

ScaliaFan

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lforrest said:
We aught to be living for life up there, in heaven. Logically if someone is willing to murder they are going to Hell if you kill them. Their only chance comes with time, that God's grace would catch on in them. The Christian whom they murder is going to heaven.

If you are concerned about your progeny, there is the resurrection.

Concerned about justice possibly being avoided? Vengeance belongs to the Lord.

Concerned about society? God is handing it over to a depraved mind.
well, i think God gave us a brain for a reason. Brains are used (supposed to be used) for logic and etc..

I am NOT going to let someone kill the ones i love. If i can shoot to wound rather than kill, i will do that. But if the person keeps coming @ me (Us), forget it.. He is toast
 
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tooldtocare

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The Wild west had stricter gun control laws than we have today.

NRA Stick this where the sun don't shine!!!

In 1840 Alabama court that, in upholding its state ban, ruled it was a state's right to regulate where and how a citizen could carry, and that the state constitution's allowance of personal firearms “is not to bear arms upon all occasions and in all places.”

Gun Control Is as Old as the Old Wild West

Contrary to the popular imagination, bearing arms on the frontier was a heavily regulated business

It's October 26, 1881, in Tombstone, and Arizona is not yet a state. The O.K. Corral is quiet, and it's had an unremarkable existence for the two years it's been standing—although it's about to become famous.

Marshall Virgil Earp, having deputized his brothers Wyatt and Morgan and his pal Doc Holliday, is having a gun control problem. Long-running tensions between the lawmen and a faction of cowboys – represented this morning by Billy Claiborne, the Clanton brothers, and the McLaury brothers – will come to a head over Tombstone's gun law.

The laws of Tombstone at the time required visitors, upon entering town to disarm, either at a hotel or a lawman's office.

The “Old West” conjures up all sorts of imagery– such as Tombstone, Deadwood, Dodge City, or Abilene, to name a few. One other thing these cities had in common: strict gun control laws.

Laws regulating ownership and carry of firearms, apart from the U.S. Constitution's Second Amendment, were passed at a local level rather than by Congress. “Gun control laws were adopted pretty quickly in these places,” says Winkler. “Most were adopted by municipal governments exercising self-control and self-determination.”

Carrying any kind of weapon, guns or knives, was not allowed other than outside town borders and inside the home. When visitors left their weapons with a law officer upon entering town, they'd receive a token, like a coat check, which they'd exchange for their guns when leaving town.

The practice was started in Southern states, which were among the first to enact laws against concealed carry of guns and knives, in the early 1800s. -- The Battle Over the Right to Bear Arms in America, points to an 1840 Alabama court that, in upholding its state ban, ruled it was a state's right to regulate where and how a citizen could carry, and that the state constitution's allowance of personal firearms “is not to bear arms upon all occasions and in all places.”

Dodge City in 1878 (Wikimedia Commons)

It's October 26, 1881, in Tombstone, and Arizona

The laws of Tombstone at the time required visitors, upon entering town to disarm, either at a hotel or a lawman's office. (Residents of many famed cattle towns, such as Dodge City, Abilene, and Deadwood, had similar restrictions.)

image: https://public-media.si-cdn.com/fil...d-4fac-8fc0-7ff859b10f21/mclauriesclanton.jpg

"Tombstone had much more restrictive laws on carrying guns in public in the 1880s than it has today,”

Dodge City, Kansas, formed a municipal government in 1878. According to Stephen Aron, a professor of history at UCLA, the first law passed was one prohibiting the carry of guns in town, cultivating a reputation of peace and stability was necessary, even in boisterous towns, if it were to become anything more transient than a one-industry boom town.

Laws regulating ownership and carry of firearms, apart from the U.S. Constitution's Second Amendment, were passed at a local level rather than by Congress.

Gun control laws were adopted pretty quickly in these places,” says Winkler. “Most were adopted by municipal governments exercising self-control and self-determination.” Carrying any kind of weapon, guns or knives, was not allowed other than outside town borders and inside the home. When visitors left their weapons with a law officer upon entering town, they'd receive a token, like a coat check, which they'd exchange for their guns when leaving town.

Louisiana, too, upheld an early ban on concealed carry firearms. When a Kentucky court reversed its ban, the state constitution was amended to specify the Kentucky general assembly was within its rights to, in the future, regulate or prohibit concealed carry.

Still, Winkler says, it was an affirmation that regulation was compatible with the Second Amendment. The federal government of the 1800s largely stayed out of gun-law court battles.

“People were allowed to own guns, and everyone did own guns [in the West], for the most part, but when you came into town, you had to either check your guns if you were a visitor or keep your guns at home if you were a resident.”

Gun Control Is as Old as the Old West | History | Smithsonian

Did the Wild West Have More Gun Control Than We Do Today?

A check? That’s right. When you entered a frontier town, you were legally required to leave your guns at the stables on the outskirts of town or drop them off with the sheriff, who would give you a token in exchange. You checked your guns then like you’d check your overcoat today at a Boston restaurant in winter. Visitors were welcome, but their guns were not. Towns barred anyone but law enforcement from carrying guns in public.

The most common cause of arrest was illegally carrying a firearm. Sheriffs and marshals took gun control seriously.

Did the Wild West Have More Gun Control Than We Do Today? | HuffPost

Today---Illinois town bans assault weapons, will fine those who keep them

The town of Deerfield, Ill., has moved to ban assault weapons, including the AR-15 used in the school shooting in Parkland, Florida, claiming the measure will make the town more safe from mass shootings.

The ordinance was passed unanimously; "the normative value that assault weapons should have no role or purpose in civil society."

It also takes a swing at a popular reading of the Second Amendment, stating the weapons are "not reasonably necessary to protect an individual's right of self-defense" or to preserve a well-regulated militia.

Illinois town bans assault weapons, will fine those who keep them

Chicago suburb bans assault weapons in response to Parkland shooting

Chicago suburb this week took the aggressive step of banning assault weapons within its borders, in what local officials said was a direct response to the mass shooting at a Parkland, Fla., high school earlier this year.

Officials in Deerfield, Ill., unanimously approved the ordinance, which prohibits the possession, manufacture or sale of a range of firearms, as well as large-capacity magazines. Residents of the 19,000-person village have until June 13 to remove the guns from village limits or face up to $1,000 per day in fines.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...hooting/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.95db16134355

Seattle will require gun owners to lock up their firearms, after the City Council voted unanimously Monday to pass legislation proposed by Mayor Jenny Durkan.

Starting 180 days after Durkan signs the legislation, it will be a civil infraction to store a gun without the firearm being secured in a locked container.

The legislation will apply only to guns kept somewhere, rather than those carried by or under the control of their owners.

Also under the legislation, it will be a civil infraction when an owner knows or should know that a minor, “at-risk person” or unauthorized user is likely to access a gun and such a person actually does access the weapon.

The legislation allows fines up to $500 when a gun isn’t locked up, up to $1,000 when a prohibited person accesses a firearm and up to $10,000 when a prohibited person uses the weapon to hurt someone or commit a crime.

Gun owners face fines up to $10,000 for not locking up their guns under new Seattle law

:)-
 

Stranger

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The Wild west had stricter gun control laws than we have today.

NRA Stick this where the sun don't shine!!!

In 1840 Alabama court that, in upholding its state ban, ruled it was a state's right to regulate where and how a citizen could carry, and that the state constitution's allowance of personal firearms “is not to bear arms upon all occasions and in all places.”

Gun Control Is as Old as the Old Wild West

Contrary to the popular imagination, bearing arms on the frontier was a heavily regulated business

It's October 26, 1881, in Tombstone, and Arizona is not yet a state. The O.K. Corral is quiet, and it's had an unremarkable existence for the two years it's been standing—although it's about to become famous.

Marshall Virgil Earp, having deputized his brothers Wyatt and Morgan and his pal Doc Holliday, is having a gun control problem. Long-running tensions between the lawmen and a faction of cowboys – represented this morning by Billy Claiborne, the Clanton brothers, and the McLaury brothers – will come to a head over Tombstone's gun law.

The laws of Tombstone at the time required visitors, upon entering town to disarm, either at a hotel or a lawman's office.

The “Old West” conjures up all sorts of imagery– such as Tombstone, Deadwood, Dodge City, or Abilene, to name a few. One other thing these cities had in common: strict gun control laws.

Laws regulating ownership and carry of firearms, apart from the U.S. Constitution's Second Amendment, were passed at a local level rather than by Congress. “Gun control laws were adopted pretty quickly in these places,” says Winkler. “Most were adopted by municipal governments exercising self-control and self-determination.”

Carrying any kind of weapon, guns or knives, was not allowed other than outside town borders and inside the home. When visitors left their weapons with a law officer upon entering town, they'd receive a token, like a coat check, which they'd exchange for their guns when leaving town.

The practice was started in Southern states, which were among the first to enact laws against concealed carry of guns and knives, in the early 1800s. -- The Battle Over the Right to Bear Arms in America, points to an 1840 Alabama court that, in upholding its state ban, ruled it was a state's right to regulate where and how a citizen could carry, and that the state constitution's allowance of personal firearms “is not to bear arms upon all occasions and in all places.”

Dodge City in 1878 (Wikimedia Commons)

It's October 26, 1881, in Tombstone, and Arizona

The laws of Tombstone at the time required visitors, upon entering town to disarm, either at a hotel or a lawman's office. (Residents of many famed cattle towns, such as Dodge City, Abilene, and Deadwood, had similar restrictions.)

image: https://public-media.si-cdn.com/fil...d-4fac-8fc0-7ff859b10f21/mclauriesclanton.jpg

"Tombstone had much more restrictive laws on carrying guns in public in the 1880s than it has today,”

Dodge City, Kansas, formed a municipal government in 1878. According to Stephen Aron, a professor of history at UCLA, the first law passed was one prohibiting the carry of guns in town, cultivating a reputation of peace and stability was necessary, even in boisterous towns, if it were to become anything more transient than a one-industry boom town.

Laws regulating ownership and carry of firearms, apart from the U.S. Constitution's Second Amendment, were passed at a local level rather than by Congress.

Gun control laws were adopted pretty quickly in these places,” says Winkler. “Most were adopted by municipal governments exercising self-control and self-determination.” Carrying any kind of weapon, guns or knives, was not allowed other than outside town borders and inside the home. When visitors left their weapons with a law officer upon entering town, they'd receive a token, like a coat check, which they'd exchange for their guns when leaving town.

Louisiana, too, upheld an early ban on concealed carry firearms. When a Kentucky court reversed its ban, the state constitution was amended to specify the Kentucky general assembly was within its rights to, in the future, regulate or prohibit concealed carry.

Still, Winkler says, it was an affirmation that regulation was compatible with the Second Amendment. The federal government of the 1800s largely stayed out of gun-law court battles.

“People were allowed to own guns, and everyone did own guns [in the West], for the most part, but when you came into town, you had to either check your guns if you were a visitor or keep your guns at home if you were a resident.”

Gun Control Is as Old as the Old West | History | Smithsonian

Did the Wild West Have More Gun Control Than We Do Today?

A check? That’s right. When you entered a frontier town, you were legally required to leave your guns at the stables on the outskirts of town or drop them off with the sheriff, who would give you a token in exchange. You checked your guns then like you’d check your overcoat today at a Boston restaurant in winter. Visitors were welcome, but their guns were not. Towns barred anyone but law enforcement from carrying guns in public.

The most common cause of arrest was illegally carrying a firearm. Sheriffs and marshals took gun control seriously.

Did the Wild West Have More Gun Control Than We Do Today? | HuffPost

Today---Illinois town bans assault weapons, will fine those who keep them

The town of Deerfield, Ill., has moved to ban assault weapons, including the AR-15 used in the school shooting in Parkland, Florida, claiming the measure will make the town more safe from mass shootings.

The ordinance was passed unanimously; "the normative value that assault weapons should have no role or purpose in civil society."

It also takes a swing at a popular reading of the Second Amendment, stating the weapons are "not reasonably necessary to protect an individual's right of self-defense" or to preserve a well-regulated militia.

Illinois town bans assault weapons, will fine those who keep them

Chicago suburb bans assault weapons in response to Parkland shooting

Chicago suburb this week took the aggressive step of banning assault weapons within its borders, in what local officials said was a direct response to the mass shooting at a Parkland, Fla., high school earlier this year.

Officials in Deerfield, Ill., unanimously approved the ordinance, which prohibits the possession, manufacture or sale of a range of firearms, as well as large-capacity magazines. Residents of the 19,000-person village have until June 13 to remove the guns from village limits or face up to $1,000 per day in fines.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...hooting/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.95db16134355

Seattle will require gun owners to lock up their firearms, after the City Council voted unanimously Monday to pass legislation proposed by Mayor Jenny Durkan.

Starting 180 days after Durkan signs the legislation, it will be a civil infraction to store a gun without the firearm being secured in a locked container.

The legislation will apply only to guns kept somewhere, rather than those carried by or under the control of their owners.

Also under the legislation, it will be a civil infraction when an owner knows or should know that a minor, “at-risk person” or unauthorized user is likely to access a gun and such a person actually does access the weapon.

The legislation allows fines up to $500 when a gun isn’t locked up, up to $1,000 when a prohibited person accesses a firearm and up to $10,000 when a prohibited person uses the weapon to hurt someone or commit a crime.

Gun owners face fines up to $10,000 for not locking up their guns under new Seattle law

:)-

Seattle is synonomous with Stupid. What are you going to do with a locked up gun that you can't get to when you need it? It's hard enough to get to your gun when you need it without it being locked up. It is the lunacy of the atheistic liberal left.

Stranger
 
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tooldtocare

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Seattle is synonomous with Stupid. What are you going to do with a locked up gun that you can't get to when you need it?

Find one article showing where someone used his/her gun to defend themselves and then, maybe it will convince me guns are needed.

waiting :)-
 

aspen

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Guns are a serious problem in our society. I used to own several rifles, but I gave them up. I am much more likely to survive any situation without a gun.
 
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Stranger

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Find one article showing where someone used his/her gun to defend themselves and then, maybe it will convince me guns are needed.

waiting :)-


Oh please. It takes about a second to google to find articles about how guns have saved people. From the "Investors Business Daily" at www.investors.com/politics/columnists/how-many-lives-are-saved-by-guns-and-why-dont-gun-controllers-care/

Interestingly enough in this article it states that the CDC tracks all gun related deaths in the U.S each year. But regulations don't allow it to do studies on how many guns save people's lives each year. More stupidity.

The article also states that Gary Kleck, who is a criminologist, conducted phone surveys and estimated that 1.2 million times each year people have used guns to defend themselves and believe had they not had the gun someone would have been killed. That is 1 in 6 Americans.

Stranger
 
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Stranger

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Guns are a serious problem in our society. I used to own serval rifles, but I gave them up. I am much more likely to survive any situation without a gun.

Criminals are a serious problem in our society. Gave them up? What did you do with them?

Why are you more likely to survive any situation without a gun?

Stranger
 
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aspen

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Criminals are a serious problem in our society. Gave them up? What did you do with them?

Why are you more likely to survive any situation without a gun?

Stranger

Gave them to my father - he gave them to me in the first place.
I am better at de-escalating people than shooting them
 
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Stranger

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Gave them to my father - he gave them to me in the first place.
I am better at de-escalating people than shooting them

Should the police give up their guns? And, did you read the article in post #(17)?

Stranger
 
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