The Restrainer

[brakelite]

well, ty for opening Erasmus for me

Yeah, that was interesting.

 

[bbyrd009]

Yeah, that was interesting.

ha don't you ever sleep bl?

 

[brakelite]

ha don't you ever sleep bl?

Lol yeah I do, but I'm too lazy to log off. And I can't remember my password. So....I stay "awake".

 

[bbyrd009]

Lol yeah I do, but I'm too lazy to log off. And I can't remember my password. So....I stay "awake".

I saw a reply at like midnight and that was at maybe 5 am?

 

[brakelite]

I saw a reply at like midnight and that was at maybe 5 am?

It's now 8pm wed

 

[bbyrd009]

It's now 8pm wed

hmm. according to the time stamp on that post its 5:55 am, and there's a great reflection to be said on "time" in there somewhere I bet
prolly one on "facts" too I guess

bc the fact is, from my pov--which is of course the right one--you just stayed up all night I guess right

pls just agree, or I will have to ignore your next post I guess ok

 

[brakelite]

hmm. according to the time stamp on that post its 5:55 am, and there's a great reflection to be said on "time" in there somewhere I bet
prolly one on "facts" too I guess

bc the fact is, from my pov--which is of course the right one--you just stayed up all night I guess right

pls just agree, or I will have to ignore your next post I guess ok

hahaha, okay, I agree. Although there may be a perfectly logical explaination for that...I get up early to leave for work...I was posting while having breakfast.

 

[Harvest 1874]

Definition of persecution
1 : the act or practice of persecuting especially those who differ in origin, religion, or social outlook
2 : the condition of being persecuted, harassed, or annoyed

Applying this definition to oneself, which end of the persecution stick do you believe you are on?

Many soon forget that the greatest persecutions which have come to the true Church and continue to come, come from those who profess themselves to be believers, the people of God (Christians), not from non-believers or worldly people. This latter group has only been used as tools by the professing church all throughout the age even as Jezebel used Ahab, and as the Scribes and Pharisees used the people more specifically the Roman government to do much of their dirty work. This however in no way excuses those who instigated this persecution in the first place, the Lord holds them all the more accountable.

Keep this in mind when you speak ill of others on this forum who differ from you in belief, faith, and interpretation of the Scriptures, it may very well be that it is you who are the one in error and you may be inadvertently persecuting one of the Lord's little ones who was only sent to help you see the truth. In persecuting them you are persecuting the one who sent them.

 

[Phoneman777]

KJV versus Modern Translations

"Who but those with Roman Catholic sympathies could ever be pleased with the notion that God preserved the true New Testament text in secret for almost 1,000 years and then finally handed it over to the the Roman pontiff for safe keeping?" -Les Garrett

CoreIssue, that would be you, my Jesuit Futurist friend

 

[Phoneman777]

Care to provide information on who spreadingdword is?.

Anonymous doesn't work.

I think the documentary speaks for itself. Plenty of well documented statements, historic facts, first person accounts, and Biblical truth galore. Of course, you won't watch it because truth to a Jesuit sympathizer is like spinach to a fat kid.

 

[Phoneman777]

So the SDA thinks it is a remnant church.

Sounds like Mormon and other cult claims.

"And the dragon was wroth with the woman and went to make war with the remnant of her seed which keep the commandmetns of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ (which is the Spirit of prophecy) and the faith of Jesus." Revelation 12:17; 14:12; 19:10

 

[Phoneman777]

Can I suggest that the reason there is no real persecution in western nations is because the Christianity practiced there is no threat...in fact so favourable to the devil he is quite happy to see it continue?

That is EXACTLY why there's no persecution here. Oh, but Jesuit Futurists will argue that the "Holy Spirit filled church is here restraining the Antichrist" is the reason...which is just stupid.

Are we to believe that Christians in other countries where there is just one step between them and death by their choice to "fear God and give glory to Him for the hour of His Judgment is come, and worship Him Who made the heaven, earth, sea, and the fountains of waters"...are in the sight of God profane? While we here in the West bow down to the gods of Jesuit Futurism, idolatrous entertainment, and worldly wise higher criticism of the very Bible that those others risk their lives daily to possess and cherish?

 

[CoreIssue]

I know @CoreIssue what the Bible says. It says that we should consider ourselves blessed if we are persecuted for righteousness sake. I simply question whatever you are currently going through, persecution?

I see a lot and have seen a lot of Christians persecuted for their faith.

 

[CoreIssue]

"And the dragon was wroth with the woman and went to make war with the remnant of her seed which keep the commandmetns of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ (which is the Spirit of prophecy) and the faith of Jesus." Revelation 12:17; 14:12; 19:10

That is in the tribulation.

 

[CoreIssue]

That is EXACTLY why there's no persecution here. Oh, but Jesuit Futurists will argue that the "Holy Spirit filled church is here restraining the Antichrist" is the reason...which is just stupid.

Are we to believe that Christians in other countries where there is just one step between them and death by their choice to "fear God and give glory to Him for the hour of His Judgment is come, and worship Him Who made the heaven, earth, sea, and the fountains of waters"...are in the sight of God profane? While we here in the West bow down to the gods of Jesuit Futurism, idolatrous entertainment, and worldly wise higher criticism of the very Bible that those others risk their lives daily to possess and cherish?

I already refuted your futurist claims. Jesuits are amillennialist.

Persecution is not require being martyred.

You are trying to desperately to defend your cult.

 

[CoreIssue]

"Who but those with Roman Catholic sympathies could ever be pleased with the notion that God preserved the true New Testament text in secret for almost 1,000 years and then finally handed it over to the the Roman pontiff for safe keeping?" -Les Garrett

CoreIssue, that would be you, my Jesuit Futurist friend

KJV versus Modern Translations

 

[CoreIssue]

Applying this definition to oneself, which end of the persecution stick do you believe you are on?

Many soon forget that the greatest persecutions which have come to the true Church and continue to come, come from those who profess themselves to be believers, the people of God (Christians), not from non-believers or worldly people. This latter group has only been used as tools by the professing church all throughout the age even as Jezebel used Ahab, and as the Scribes and Pharisees used the people more specifically the Roman government to do much of their dirty work. This however in no way excuses those who instigated this persecution in the first place, the Lord holds them all the more accountable.

Keep this in mind when you speak ill of others on this forum who differ from you in belief, faith, and interpretation of the Scriptures, it may very well be that it is you who are the one in error and you may be inadvertently persecuting one of the Lord's little ones who was only sent to help you see the truth. In persecuting them you are persecuting the one who sent them.

Says a follower of the false prophet Russell.

 

[Lady Crosstalk]

Absolutely! The feminist movement is terrible! And men who try and join up are a joke and are doing, I think, the same thing Adam did...standing back...or even supporting...while women charge headlong into places they shouldn't go.
Now, don't get me wrong...I'm all for biblical equality, but the latest wave of 'men are terrible, if we women shriek the loudest surely we shall prevail!, it's our bodies let's kill anything and everything that comes near it' feminism makes me sick.
Everybody just needs to hush down a bit and read some bible!

I say a hearty amen to that!

 

[Davy]

This particular passage is speaking in plural. Saying "here, or there" is talking about multiple claims by multiple people.

Christ is synonymous with saviour. It's another way of saying many false saviours will be present at the time. Christian's (who actually read and study the bible) will recognize MoS for who he is, otherwise it wouldn't be written in 2 Thessalonians 2:3 that he will be "revealed." How can he be revealed if you're suggesting he's going to deceive a majority of Christian's? No, it's we who will be able to identify him, the rest of the world's religious adherents will be blinded and accept him as a new spiritual leader, turning all other religions and forms of worldly spirituality into a melting pot against Christianity, which will stand out in its refusal to conform, turning itself into an obstacle.

It truly is not in the plural. The 19th British scholar E.W. Bullinger in his Companion Bible (a KJV study Bible), capitalized the "He" in the Matthew 24:26 verse to show our Lord Jesus was speaking of a singular false-Christ...

Matt 24:26
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, "He is in the desert"; go not forth: behold, "He is in the secret chambers"; believe it not.
KJV


Dr. James Strong in his Strong's Exhaustive Concordance translated the KJV phrase "false Christs" in verse 24 as 'a spurious Messiah', showing the subject is about a singular false Christ.

NT:5580
pseudochristos (psyoo-dokh'-ris-tos); from NT:5571 and NT:5547; a spurious Messiah:
KJV - false Christ.
(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright (c) 1994, Biblesoft and International Bible Translators, Inc.)


Then of course there's old fashioned common sense English grammar. The tense of verse 26 is singular, because Christ's warning to not be deceived by that "He" they will say is Christ requires it to be about a singular false Christ.

Because you refuse to see the simplicity in that Scripture, it can only mean that you are listening to a doctrine of men instead of reading the Scripture in simplicity as written.

 

[Davy]

This particular passage is speaking in plural. Saying "here, or there" is talking about multiple claims by multiple people.

Christ is synonymous with saviour. It's another way of saying many false saviours will be present at the time. Christian's (who actually read and study the bible) will recognize MoS for who he is, otherwise it wouldn't be written in 2 Thessalonians 2:3 that he will be "revealed." How can he be revealed if you're suggesting he's going to deceive a majority of Christian's? No, it's we who will be able to identify him, the rest of the world's religious adherents will be blinded and accept him as a new spiritual leader, turning all other religions and forms of worldly spirituality into a melting pot against Christianity, which will stand out in its refusal to conform, turning itself into an obstacle.

Another Scripture parameter given about the coming pseudo-Christ being a singular fake Christ is the comparison of his false working of great signs and wonders, being linked between the one Jesus gave in His Olivet discourse, and the one Paul gave in 2 Thessalonians 2, and the one John gave in Revelation 13. They are all the same entity, the "antichrist" (singular) of 1 John 2:18 that the brethren had already heard shall come...

Matt 24:24
24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
KJV

2 Thess 2:3
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
KJV

2 Thess 2:8-10
8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:
9 Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
KJV

Rev 13:11-14
11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.
13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
KJV


From On Christ and Antichrist, by Hippolytus (170-235 A.D.), (a disciple of Irenaeus who was a disciple of Polycarp, who was a disciple of Apostle John):

"5. But as time now presses for the consideration of the question immediately in hand, and as what has been already said in the introduction with regard to the glory of God, may suffice, it is proper that we take the Holy Scriptures themselves in hand, and find out from them what, and of what manner, the coming of Antichrist is; on what occasion and at what time that implores one shall be revealed; and whence and from what I tribe (he shall come); and what his name is, which is indicated by the number in the Scripture; and how he shall work error among the people, gathering them from the ends of the earth; and (how) he shall stir up tribulation and persecution against the saints; and how he shall glorify himself as God; and what his end shall be; and how the sudden appearing of the Lord shall be revealed from heaven; and what the conflagration of the whole world shall be; and what the glorious and heavenly kingdom of the saints is to be, when they reign together with Christ; and what the punishment of the wicked by fire.

6. Now, as our Lord Jesus Christ, who is also God, was prophesied of under the figure of a lion, on account of His royalty and glory, in the same way have the Scriptures also aforetime spoken of Antichrist as a lion, on account of his tyranny and violence. For the deceiver seeks to liken himself in all things to the Son of God. Christ is a lion, so Antichrist is also a lion; Christ is a king,John 18:37 so Antichrist is also a king. The Saviour was manifested as a lamb; John 1:29 so he too, in like manner, will appear as a lamb, though within he is a wolf. The Saviour came into the World in the circumcision, and he will come in the same manner. The Lord sent apostles among all the nations, and he in like manner will send false apostles. The Saviour gathered together the sheep that were scattered abroad, and he in like manner will bring together a people that is scattered abroad. The Lord gave a seal to those who believed on Him, and he will give one like manner. The Saviour appeared in the form of man, and he too will come in the form of a man. The Saviour raised up and showed His holy flesh like a temple, John 2:19 and he will raise a temple of stone in Jerusalem. And his seductive arts we shall exhibit in what follows. But for the present let us turn to the question in hand."
(from CHURCH FATHERS: On Christ and Antichrist (Hippolytus))

Hippolytus gave direct comparisons between our Lord Jesus and the coming Antichrist, showing he will try to mimic The Christ.


In the Matt.24, 2 Thess.2, and 1 John 2:18 Scriptures, they all have the examples of a singular antichrist, and the idea of many antichrists (his followers). Different terminology is used, but it's the same Message.

In Matt.24:5, Jesus warns of "many" coming saying they are Christ. But in the Matt.24:23-26 passage, He is warning about a specific false one of the Book of Daniel associated with placing the idol abomination per Daniel 11, (which Daniel is minus the idea of his working great signs and wonders to deceive). In our Lord Jesus' Olivet discourse is where He gave us more info about that prophecy of the "vile person" in the Daniel 11 setting up the abomination of desolation, with the new info of that false one's working great signs and wonders that would if possible, deceive even Christ's elect.

In 1 John 2:18, John mentioned how the brethren there had already heard that "antichrist" shall come. In that part John was speaking of a singular false Christ, or instead-of-Christ. Where had they already heard that? From our Lord Jesus in John 14 where He pointed to after His crucifixion, He wouldn't speak with His disciples much, because "the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in Me" (John 14:30). That's about the "antichrist" John was speaking of in 1 John 2:18. In the latter part of 1 John 2:18, John gave the brethren new information, the idea that already in their day, their were "many antichrists". That does not mean there is no singular "antichrist" that shall come. It simply means the Antichrist has followers here on earth already at work. In the OT they were called "the workers of iniquity".

In 2 Thessalonians 2, Apostle Paul first warns of a singular false one coming to sit in the temple of God (in Jerusalem), and exalt himself as God, working those signs and wonders. Paul then later also said the "mystery of iniquity" is already at work, which is the same idea John said about the "many antichrists" already being at work. Our Lord Jesus was speaking the same info in His Olivet discourse about the singular pseudo-Christ (pseudochristos of Matt.24:24), and the "many" of verse 5 He said would come only claiming to be Him. In the Matt.24:24 singular false Christ, that one is actually working MIRACLES to show the difference!