Is there salvation outside the Catholic Church?

[Grams]

BreadOfLife,

Do you know for sure were you will be ? When you die ???????

When I was Catholic I never knew for sure ..................
Now reading the bible I sure do ! Know the truth !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[ScottA]

Nobody “worships” Peter OR his successors.
The Pope is the “Servant of the servants of God” – which is something a man of your arrogance will never understand.

You are correct about one thing though. The chaotic mess of a leaderless Church is something that God is NOT the Author of. That’s why His Church has always had a hierarchy – as HE prescribed.

As for the Sheep being divided from the Goats –it doesn’t require an “confusion”. It happens when mere men like yourself begin to believe that they are greater than God . . .

For which you will certainly answer.

 

[JohnPaul]

One of the criminals who were hanged railed at him, saying, “Are you not the Christ? Save yourself and us! But the other rebuked him, saying, “Do you not fear God, since you are under the same sentence of condemnation?

And we indeed justly, for we are receiving the due reward of our deeds; but this man has done nothing wrong

And he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom

And he said to him, “Truly, I say to you, today you will be with me in paradise.”

 

[farouk]

One of the criminals who were hanged railed at him, saying, “Are you not the Christ? Save yourself and us! But the other rebuked him, saying, “Do you not fear God, since you are under the same sentence of condemnation?

And we indeed justly, for we are receiving the due reward of our deeds; but this man has done nothing wrong

And he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom

And he said to him, “Truly, I say to you, today you will be with me in paradise.”

Solemn passage; we were considering this in church recently...

 

[JohnPaul]

Solemn passage; we were considering this in church recently...

This is beautiful strikes emotion in me.

 

[farouk]

This is beautiful strikes emotion in me.

There are indeed moving, doctrinal considerations...

 

[BreadOfLife]

BreadOfLife,

Do you know for sure were you will be ? When you die ???????

When I was Catholic I never knew for sure ..................
Now reading the bible I sure do ! Know the truth !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

First of all, if you were a Catholic and you weren't reading the Bible - shame on YOU, not the Church.
REAL Catholics read the Scriptures.

As for "knowing" where you'll go when you die - you may have a moral certitude, IF you remain faithful to the end. Otherwise - you don't.
The Bible assures us that salvation is a process - not a one-time, slam dunk event.

Aas Christians are ALREADY SAVED (Rom. 5:1, 8:24, Eph. 2:5–8).
This is Initial Salvation – God give us the initial grace to believe.

However, because Salvation is a LIFELONG process – it ALSO says that I am BEING SAVED (1 Cor. 1:8, 2 Cor. 2:15, 7:1, Phil. 2:12, Heb 12:14).
This is Ongoing Sanctification – God is sanctifying us throughout our life as we cooperate with his grace.

Because of this, I have the hope that I WILL BE SAVED (Matt. 24:13, Rom. 5:9–10, 1 Cor. 3:12–15).
This is Final Sanctification/Salvation – We die and go to heaven having endured to the end.

You don't get there without cooperating with God's grace . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

For which you will certainly answer.

Yes, Scott - I will answer for YOUR rejection of Christ.
Good grief . .

 

[Grams]

First of all, if you were a Catholic and you weren't reading the Bible - shame on YOU, not the Church.
REAL Catholics read the Scriptures.

As for "knowing" where you'll go when you die - you may have a moral certitude, IF you remain faithful to the end. Otherwise - you don't.
The Bible assures us that salvation is a process - not a one-time, slam dunk event.

Aas Christians are ALREADY SAVED (Rom. 5:1, 8:24, Eph. 2:5–8).
This is Initial Salvation – God give us the initial grace to believe.

However, because Salvation is a LIFELONG process – it ALSO says that I am BEING SAVED (1 Cor. 1:8, 2 Cor. 2:15, 7:1, Phil. 2:12, Heb 12:14).
This is Ongoing Sanctification – God is sanctifying us throughout our life as we cooperate with his grace.

Because of this, I have the hope that I WILL BE SAVED (Matt. 24:13, Rom. 5:9–10, 1 Cor. 3:12–15).
This is Final Sanctification/Salvation – We die and go to heaven having endured to the end.

You don't get there without cooperating with God's grace . . .

We were not ever told to read the bible.........!!!!!!
We went to mass 6 day's a week back then....
And we did what the nuns told us to do......... "Or we were in trouble"

We had prayer books, and that was that ! And the rosary .........
Any thing else the nuns put on the black board or spoke to us....

Things were different back in the 40's....... and the church we went to.
I had a cousin who went to another Catholic church and that was better ! But to far away for me......

 

[Yehren]

First of all, if you were a Catholic and you weren't reading the Bible - shame on YOU, not the Church.
REAL Catholics read the Scriptures.

Amen.

 

[ScottA]

First of all, if you were a Catholic and you weren't reading the Bible - shame on YOU, not the Church.
REAL Catholics read the Scriptures.

Typical hypocrisy...an advocate for greater authority of the Priests and Leaders, blaming and shaming their subjects/victims.

Amen.

And those who join in.

 

[Yehren]

Don't you love it when non-Catholics think they're empowered to tell Catholics what they have to believe? Not that there very many of them, but the few who are like that, stand out like a clown in a choir loft.

 

[BreadOfLife]

We were not ever told to read the bible.........!!!!!!
We went to mass 6 day's a week back then....
And we did what the nuns told us to do......... "Or we were in trouble"

We had prayer books, and that was that ! And the rosary .........
Any thing else the nuns put on the black board or spoke to us....

Things were different back in the 40's....... and the church we went to.
I had a cousin who went to another Catholic church and that was better ! But to far away for me......

And in the 40’s you were not told to NOT read the Bible.
If you weren’t reading it – that’s on YOU. Don’t blame the Church because YOU were a lazy Catholic.

And – if you were going to mass six days a week – you were HEARING the Scriptures being read SIX TIMES a week during the Liturgy of the Word. Faith comes by HEARING the Word of God (Rom. 10:17).

Your arguments are a complete cop-out by a transparently lazy former Catholic . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Typical hypocrisy...an advocate for greater authority of the Priests and Leaders, blaming and shaming .

Sooooopo, you’re saying that @Grams is a “victim” because she was “forced” not to read the Bible??

How typically arrogant of you to assume that you automatically know everybody’s past.

The Church doesn't “forbid” people from reading the Scriptures – and certainly never did during her lifetime.

Probably better for you to get the facts before you open your mouth next time . . .

 

[Grams]

OK ! One other thing I missed about telling you....

My parents came from another country and were not able to quite read English.
I guess they expected the nuns to teach us what we needed.......

 

[ScottA]

Sooooopo, you’re saying that @Grams is a “victim” because she was “forced” not to read the Bible??

How typically arrogant of you to assume that you automatically know everybody’s past.

The Church doesn't “forbid” people from reading the Scriptures – and certainly never did during her lifetime.

Probably better for you to get the facts before you open your mouth next time . . .

Her story is very common, the cause and misguiding of Priests and Leaders.

If the truth is "arrogant", then I'm arrogant. But, coming from you, it's obviously just more use of confounded language and lack of understanding. God is great, making fools of the wise. Hallelujah!

 

[Philip James]

Her story is very common, the cause and misguiding of Priests and Leaders.

We went to mass 6 day's a week back then....

Yeah, what a shame, catechism and Mass 6 days a week...

The horror....

 

[ScottA]

Yeah, what a shame, catechism and Mass 6 days a week...

The horror....

Mocking helps.

 

[Philip James]

I guess they expected the nuns to teach us what we needed.......

Hello Grams,
And I expect they did. Perhaps you just don't remember what that was.
It's never to late to return to the feast dear sister.

Pax et Bonum

 

[BreadOfLife]

Her story is very common, the cause and misguiding of Priests and Leaders.

If the truth is "arrogant", then I'm arrogant. But, coming from you, it's obviously just more use of confounded language and lack of understanding. God is great, making fools of the wise. Hallelujah!

Unfortunately, you are correct.
Her story is VERY common.

There are FAR too many lazy Catholics who are seduced out of the Church for a feel-good, “easy-believism” message that simply isn’t Biblical.

We must cooperate with God’s grace in order for it to work. It is not something that it thrust upon us against out will. It is a gift that must be received.

The cause of her being “misguided” was ignorance of her faith . . .