When it comes to restrictions during a pandemic though, restrictions to keep people safe, yes we should obey the government, as these laws are meant for good to protect others.
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Salvation is not even the issue, so that should be left aside. But what you have said is NOT freedom to worship, but State-controlled restrictions on Christian liberty. When any government seeks to interfere with Christian evangelism, assembly, and worship, that is tyranny in opposition to what God desires.In most countries like Australia you are still free to worship at home with those living in your household, you are still free to fellowship online, these restrictions don't effect your Salvation.
I would like to make two comments on this if I may...Let me say there are seasons when the righteous thing to do is resist.
Salvation is not even the issue, so that should be left aside. But what you have said is NOT freedom to worship, but State-controlled restrictions on Christian liberty. When any government seeks to interfere with Christian evangelism, assembly, and worship, that is tyranny in opposition to what God desires.
'He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good;A topic that is especially timely today in this fallen world that is getting 'smaller' every year.
Today, many people are in fear whether imagined or true. Some people are resisting government, many are obedient to it.
Should Christians obey government under any circumstance(s)?
Are there times when Christians should resist government? And if so, how are they to conduct themselves?
Please cite scripture where and when possible as the 'glue' of these discussions as in all biblical discussions of debate.
Thank you,
Blessings
APAK
Should Christians obey government under any circumstance(s)? Are there times when Christians should resist government?
'Shall we give, or shall we not give?Having others supplied the Scripture, does any one follow the thought out into the idea of what is God's that Caesar can't have? The answer is obvious. Martin Luther discovered the answer while sitting ridding what the body didn't want.
I agree with this and would just add that our obedience to God should be absolute, but our obedience to government (man) should not be absolute. IOW, as you have said, Backlit, when it comes down to obeying God or man, we should always obey God. Also, our obedience to the State is not blind obedience. We are to keep a wary eye on the policies of those in government and hold them accountable....There are things in which the state has jurisdiction...in those areas the state is to be respected. In those areas where the state has no jurisdiction, men ought to obey God rather than men.
there is this verse in the bible i am not sure what chapterA topic that is especially timely today in this fallen world that is getting 'smaller' every year.
Today, many people are in fear whether imagined or true. Some people are resisting government, many are obedient to it.
Should Christians obey government under any circumstance(s)?
Are there times when Christians should resist government? And if so, how are they to conduct themselves?
Please cite scripture where and when possible as the 'glue' of these discussions as in all biblical discussions of debate.
Thank you,
Blessings
APAK
Apak,
Let me say there are seasons when the righteous thing to do is resist. For example we have most of Christendom in Germany under Hitler being silent in the face of His antisemitism, and hatred, yet a few voices resisted to their own detriment and some even tried to help the Jews survive such as the Ten Boom family. So in the face of atrocity and tyranny we as Christians should never remain silent, but we should always speak the truth in Love to those who are in power... Paul did over and over again, Stephen filled with the Holy Ghost did not hold back, but spoke the truth and was stoned for it. We as Christians are the salt of the earth, when we lose our saltiness is when we are not worth anything. We are the light to a fallen world, we need to let that light shine, not hide it in an earthen vessel. We are not given the spirit of fear, and there is coming a time when we will be brought before councils and tried, when we will have to give our testimony, we will not hold back then as the Holy Spirit will give us unction to speak the truth, we must merely speak what he give us to say.
And then self defense is a whole different question as well. When Tyranny becomes too powerful, there is but one option remaining to fight. When the beast says take the mark or else, it is resistance to authority to refuse the mark. Romans 13 will not apply then, now will it?
Even the preaching of the Gospel in some places is against the authorities of those nations. This country is quickly evolving into that as well even now. What happens then? does Romans 13 apply? or will you Obey God and continue the great commission?
When does romans 13 apply? when the government is not out to destroy you for your faith, when you have freedom to preach the word and speak the truth, even if it offends. Not a popular thing these days, but just remember that our only offensive weapon is the sword of the Spirit which is the word of God Everything else is defensive.... swing the sword till you have no more strength to and even then the Holy Ghost will give you the words when you have none ....See Luke 21:15 For I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.
Before the time of Christ the Roman republic was considered god. The state was god. Everything and everybody was subordinate to the state. The state ruled all. By the time Christ came, the state had reposed in the person of Caesar. Caesar was at the time of Christ considered divine, as the state was divine, so now is Caesar. So when Christ said "Render to Caesar that which is Caesars, and to God that which is God's, Jesus was placing an impenetrable barrier between the state, and God, and was a direct affront to the divine claims of statehood or kingly power over the individual conscience. It is up to the individual conscience to decide what things pertain to God, and what things pertain to the state. Yet Jesus nor Paul suggested that the state had no place at all. The scripture merely proposes that the state take its rightful place, and stay there. The moment the state encroaches upon territory rightly belonging to God, it takes upon itself authority to which it has no legal claim. There are things in which the state has jurisdiction...in those areas the state is to be respected. In those areas where the state has no jurisdiction, men ought to obey God rather than men.
Caesar of course can own and kill the body although he cannot possess or own a true believer's soul. I hope you are not suggesting we all die and this is the standing order of the Spirit for all Christians today; even when the enemy and tyranny is at our doorsteps. ready to kill?Having others supplied the Scripture, does any one follow the thought out into the idea of what is God's that Caesar can't have? The answer is obvious. Martin Luther discovered the answer while sitting ridding what the body didn't want.
ha well problem is see is that our govs got co-opted long time ago eh; if you got a Central Bank, you got a corrupted gov, as your example even demonstrates imo.When it comes to restrictions during a pandemic though, restrictions to keep people safe, yes we should obey the government, as these laws are meant for good to protect others.
1 Corinthians 15:24 Lexicon: then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power.Christ comes when all rulers, authorities and powers have been destroyed
On the one hand that you have revealed, you are 100 percent correct. This is our normal day to day mode of living as Christians in this world under various governments and authorities.Must Christians obey government?
'Thou therefore, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus.
And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses,
the same commit thou to faithful men, who shall be able to teach others also.
Thou therefore endure hardness, as a good soldier of Jesus Christ.
No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life;
that he may please Him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.'
(2 Tim. 2:1-4)
Hello @APAK,
Surely our citizenship is no longer in this world, and our minds should be engaged on matters to do with where our citizenship lies now (Ephesians 2:19), and not with a world which is passing away. We are to seek peace with all men, and to show forth the love of Christ within our sphere. The affairs of this life are something we are not to become entangled in.
'Brethren, be followers together of me,
and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample.
(For many walk, of whom I have told you often,
and now tell you even weeping,
that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ:
Whose end is destruction, whose God is their belly,
and whose glory is in their shame, who mind earthly things.)
For our conversation is in heaven;
from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:
(Php 3:17+)
Within the love of Christ our Saviour
Chris
I think that by the time the world, and I mean the entire planet ( hated of all Nations for My name sake) gets around to seeking our destruction, there will be nothing for us to defend nor any reason to defend it. Just leave it behind, take what you can carry, and head for the hills. It is no glory to God if at this time you are martyred. None will gain by your death, none will be encouraged by it, none will be uplifted by such a testimony. So God will not permit such a senseless death. Psalm 91.
Hi. Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego replied to him, "King Nebuchadnezzar, we do not need to defend ourselves before you in this matter. If we are thrown into the blazing furnace, the God we serve is able to deliver us from it, and He will deliver us from Your majesty's hand. But even if He does not, we want you to know, Your Majesty, that we will not serve your gods or worship your image of gold you have set up." Daniel 3:16-18 NIVA topic that is especially timely today in this fallen world that is getting 'smaller' every year.
Today, many people are in fear whether imagined or true. Some people are resisting government, many are obedient to it.
Should Christians obey government under any circumstance(s)?
Are there times when Christians should resist government? And if so, how are they to conduct themselves?
Please cite scripture where and when possible as the 'glue' of these discussions as in all biblical discussions of debate.
Thank you,
Blessings
APAK