Must Christians obey government

[OzSpen]

Post #7
"We are nothing compared to North Korea."

We are allowed to own Bibles in Australia, USA, Canada, New Zealand, UK, Europe and a number of other countries.

Josho,

I have a friend in Gideons International. They are business people who fund the distribution of Bibles in hospitals, motel rooms and to school students.

Previously, they were allowed to hand New Testaments to students who wanted them. Not anymore here in Qld. They have to place the NTs on a table and the students can take one if they desire. It's a further dumbing down of open distribution of the Bible.

At least we still are able to conduct 30 mins of religious education in curriculum time in State Schools here in Qld. Here is the requirement in Victorian schools. It's an opt in situation where parents have the right to agree to the child going to RE.

Oz

 

[OzSpen]

We are nothing compared to North Korea or China.

If the Holy Spirit leads then that's fine.

But what we are also seeing is far right wingers going against the law, because they are missing getting drunk with their mates and having wild times and wild parties.

As I said in the other thread, the current covid-19 restrictions are to prevent a far bigger spread of the virus and to keep people safe.

There have even been reports of some in churches/church groups that have caught covid-19. @Giuliano would know about that.

In most countries like Australia you are still free to worship at home with those living in your household, you are still free to fellowship online, these restrictions don't effect your Salvation.

As in Romans chapter 13, it says do what is right, by obeying the law to keep others safe, that is doing what is right.

An all out dangerous move to lift all restrictions could potentially see an extra tens of millions, maybe even a hundred million extra of people dying around the world, there would be many cases of infected people not even getting ventilators or the oxygen that they need. Due to restrictions though the amount of people that have been dying because of Covid-19 is still under a million, it's still a lot of deaths though.

I am pro-life so I support the restrictions they have in place here in Victoria. I am glad to be living in Australia, where they have dealt with the virus quickly and effectively.

Josho,

Why don't we listen to the research authorities such as the leading British medical journal, The Lancet, which concluded 'the U.S.'s major weapons against the Coronavirus–––lockdowns and wide testing––do not reduce death rates'?

See recent Lancet research, 'A country level analysis measuring the impact of government actions, country preparedness and socioeconomic factors on COVID-19 mortality and related health outcomes' (latest issue published 4 August 2020).

The Lancet study's assessment was:

In our study, an increasing number of days to border closures was associated with a higher caseload, and more restrictive public health measures (such as a full lockdown compared to partial or curfew only measures) were associated with an increase in the number of recovered cases per million population. These findings suggest that more restrictive public health practices may indeed be associated with less transmission and better outcomes. However, in our analysis, full lockdowns and widespread COVID-19 testing were not associated with reductions in the number of critical cases or overall mortality.​

The conclusion to this research was that the Queensland government's approach of full lockdowns and widespread Covid-19 testing is not associated with a reduction of serious medical cases and deaths (taken from my article published this week in On Line Opinion, A better way of dealing with Covid-19)

I can provide statistical information to show that there were more deaths in 2019 (with a vaccine) than from Covid-19 in 2020 (without a vaccine). Why can't the world wake up to this fact?

Do you realise there are infectious diseases around the world for which there are no vaccines. These include: Dengue, HIV/AIDS, and Malaria. Why aren't we hearing about these infection rates?

Lockdowns and widespread testing do not work to tame this disease.

Oz

 

[bbyrd009]

Southern Ontario wasn't exactly a breeding ground for anarchy during the 70s. If I had run into the wrong people, that may have been a different story. The Man and the military were my opponents.
Ideologically I was far left. As it turned out, so was my father. No surprise my uncles and grandfather were Orangemen. What is happening today is over the top. What we see isn't just counterculture, it's Marxism at its worse. Shalom.

yeh, so you were a Chaos Agent imo, not an Anarchist

 

[historyb]

I live in a country where most still believe that the government does some things for the better of people, they might make some wrong decisions, but they still do make right decisions as well, even the left wing governments still make some right decisions.

Eery western governments wants to destroy our lives, every western power has liberals trying to do a coup right now with the population think the government just ants the good. We all been lied to and bend over and take it, we don't deserve freedom but subjugation since no one values freedom anymore.

 

[Truman]

yeh, so you were a Chaos Agent imo, not an Anarchist

Chaos Agent, you mean like Maxwell Smart's enemies? Lol Seriously, I've never heard it put that way before. It's a good day, I learned something new. My son says I'm vintage. He even got me a pair of Vintage Jeans for me once. Mouthy kids Lol BTW, what does imo mean?

 

[bbyrd009]

Chaos Agent, you mean like Maxwell Smart's enemies? Lol Seriously, I've never heard it put that way before. It's a good day, I learned something new. My son says I'm vintage. He even got me a pair of Vintage Jeans for me once. Mouthy kids Lol BTW, what does imo mean?

In My Opinion

 

[bbyrd009]

 

[Josho]

Josho,

Why don't we listen to the research authorities such as the leading British medical journal, The Lancet, which concluded 'the U.S.'s major weapons against the Coronavirus–––lockdowns and wide testing––do not reduce death rates'?

See recent Lancet research, 'A country level analysis measuring the impact of government actions, country preparedness and socioeconomic factors on COVID-19 mortality and related health outcomes' (latest issue published 4 August 2020).

The Lancet study's assessment was:

In our study, an increasing number of days to border closures was associated with a higher caseload, and more restrictive public health measures (such as a full lockdown compared to partial or curfew only measures) were associated with an increase in the number of recovered cases per million population. These findings suggest that more restrictive public health practices may indeed be associated with less transmission and better outcomes. However, in our analysis, full lockdowns and widespread COVID-19 testing were not associated with reductions in the number of critical cases or overall mortality.​

The conclusion to this research was that the Queensland government's approach of full lockdowns and widespread Covid-19 testing is not associated with a reduction of serious medical cases and deaths (taken from my article published this week in On Line Opinion, A better way of dealing with Covid-19)

I can provide statistical information to show that there were more deaths in 2019 (with a vaccine) than from Covid-19 in 2020 (without a vaccine). Why can't the world wake up to this fact?

Do you realise there are infectious diseases around the world for which there are no vaccines. These include: Dengue, HIV/AIDS, and Malaria. Why aren't we hearing about these infection rates?

Lockdowns and widespread testing do not work to tame this disease.

Oz

Well with no restrictions, this could have been as bad as the Spanish Flu. And the earth has a bigger population and is more densely populated now. I believe the medical experts and governments did not want to see a repeat of the Spanish flu.

 

[historyb]

Well with no restrictions, this could have been as bad as the Spanish Flu. And the earth has a bigger population and is more densely populated now. I believe the medical experts and governments did not want to see a repeat of the Spanish flu.

Experts didn't know anything, they went by a guy's model in England who was a sinful adulterous and made sure he could meet his lover all the while making models that were absolute lies. All his models turned out wildly wrong and he got fired but instead of the government saying that they were wrong going by this idiot's models they still keep us locked down like sheep and we just love it. The lock downs were and still are a farce, 98 percent of the people that get it are fine.

 

[Josho]

Well with no restrictions, this could have been as bad as the Spanish Flu. And the earth has a bigger population and is more densely populated now. I believe the medical experts and governments did not want to see a repeat of the Spanish flu.

So these are laws to keep people safe and prevent a lot more people from dying. It's not about control, but it's about saving and protecting as many human lives as possible from the pandemic.

And we can do the right thing by obeying the law in this situation and obeying the restrictions to keep people safe.

As I have said somewhere before my dad's cousin's wife died from covid-19 in Louisiana.

And for those who complain and oppose mask wearing, what do you have to complain about? Nurses wear them for long periods of time, furniture polishers wear them for long periods of time, some painters wear them for long periods of time. So what we have is a minority against OH & S it seems.

And because I am pro-life I agree with these restrictions that are preventing tens of millions more people from dying.

 

[Josho]

I would like to see what @Rita thinks about this topic.....

 

[kcnalp]

The big problem I have seen is that we can't believe what the true causes of death are. Politics are heavily involved. They want to dump Trump and blame him for the virus and therefore want to blame Trump for people dying.

 

[APAK]

APAK,

Acts 5:25-29 (NIV) makes it crystal clear what the Christian's responsibility is with civil government:

25 Then someone came and said, ‘Look! The men you put in jail are standing in the temple courts teaching the people.’ 26 At that, the captain went with his officers and brought the apostles. They did not use force, because they feared that the people would stone them.

27 The apostles were brought in and made to appear before the Sanhedrin to be questioned by the high priest. 28 ‘We gave you strict orders not to teach in this name,’ he said. ‘Yet you have filled Jerusalem with your teaching and are determined to make us guilty of this man’s blood.’

29 Peter and the other apostles replied: ‘We must obey God rather than human beings!'​

When the laws of the government clash with laws of God, 'we must obey God'. Therefore, here in Australia we have some examples of this clash:

• killing unborn babies, right up until the time of birth.
  
• One State has legalised euthanasia and another two are considering this legislation.
• Legalising same-sex marriage.
• Making transgender legitimate.

Oz

Sure OzSpen and there are more you add to this list. I agree with you scripture support and there are others.

What I see today though is a real immediate threat to many countries and also urgent for Christians to understand it and even act upon it. It is a direct threat of good order governments and the oppression and the attack of people in one swoop. It treads on God's turf and must be opposed on many fronts. I do see an attack of God-fearing governments especially in the West. The threat of an anti-God, collectivism type global governance is arising out of this obviously by now, false flag called COVID-19.

Cheers,

APAK

 

[historyb]

The big problem I have seen is that we can't believe what the true causes of death are. Politics are heavily involved. They want to dump Trump and blame him for the virus and therefore want to blame Trump for people dying.

Exactly, it has been political from the beginning. All they have done is lie to us and even people in this thread are gullible enough to believe them. I believe the young are gullible to believe the lying government because they were not taught proper respect and love for freedom. The outh have been primed for government takeover and the youth are very happy to comply

 

[historyb]

Sure OzSpen and there are more you add to this list. I agree with you scripture support and there are others.

What I see today though is a real immediate threat to many countries and also urgent for Christians to understand it and even act upon it. It is a direct threat of good order governments and the oppression and the attack of people in one swoop. It treads on God's turf and must be opposed on many fronts. I do see an attack of God-fearing governments especially in the West. The threat of an anti-God, collectivism type global governance is arising out of this obviously by now, false flag called COVID-19.

Cheers,

APAK

Amen. Pray that others figure that out

 

[Enoch111]

There are mental health services out there that are trying their best to deal with people's depression and prevent them from taking their lives.

And these mental heath problems were created by the bogus panic promotion and fear-mongering. Had all governments simply said "Maintain normal hygiene and carry on" suicides would not have skyrocketed through the roof.

CDC Director Compares Rate of Suicides to COVID-19 Deaths
Center for Disease Control Director Robert Redfield said in a Buck Institute webinar that suicides and drug overdoses have surpassed the death rate for COVID-19 among high school students. Redfield argued that lockdowns and lack of public schooling constituted a disproportionally negative impact on young peoples’ mental health.
CDC Director Compares Rate of Suicides to COVID-19 Deaths

Of course, Redfield is as much to blame as Fauci and Birx. But this was all under Trump's watch and the buck stops there.

 

[historyb]

And these mental heath problems were created by the bogus panic promotion and fear-mongering. Had all governments simply said "Maintain normal hygiene and carry on" suicides would not have skyrocketed through the roof.

Exactly. Society has never acted so kooky in other pandemic or epidemics. In the late 60's there was a huge epidemic here as bad as COVID did we shut down? No we just increased hygiene and carried on.

 

[pompadour]

The USA is different then any other country in the world. In the USA, WE THE PEOPLE are SOVEREIGN.
WE created the government to represent the will of the people. Not to be our rulers. WE can change them every 2 yrs.

Pomp.

 

[kcnalp]

WE created the government to represent the will of the people. Not to be our rulers.
Pomp.

TOTAL failure!

 

[historyb]

The USA is different then any other country in the world. In the USA, WE THE PEOPLE are SOVEREIGN.
WE created the government to represent the will of the people. Not to be our rulers. WE can change them every 2 yrs.

Pomp.

Exactly. They work for us, we do not work for them.