John 6:66 - Why did many disciples stop following Jesus?

[Spurgeon's Girl]

Romans 11:20-23 says no such thing. It's you imposing your Catholic beliefs upon the scriptures. That's called eisegesis.

20 That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. 22 Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God's kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off. 23 And even they, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God has the power to graft them in again.

Do you never tire of trying to make the Bible say what you want it to say.

The true vine is another parable. I love them. The problem here is that you are again, trying to make it say what it does not say. Give your posts respect.



John Chapter 17, is the prayer that Jesus offered to God the Father on the night before the crucifixion. If you knew your scripture, you would know that the demise of Judas was foretold in the OT. Again, the doctrine of election is something you apparently do not understand.



Do, you a member of the one true church deny that Jesus meant what he said? That is shameful.



This scripture says that believers can be lost if they believed in vain. HELLO.... That means they never really believed. PERIOD. Give your post respect.



This verse does not support a thing you have said. It is therefore ignored.



If you are going to quote scripture, then quote it. These verses tell us about sins that hell worthy, yet in verse 11, you completely lose your point. Paul says that even the likes of these sinners, can be washed and made clean.



Yet more Catholic paraphrase. It is ignored.

We can choose not to cooperate with His grace. More Catholic made up dogma. Salvation is not a free will decision. It's a gift.



Hebrews 10:35 says this:

35 Therefore do not throw away your confidence, which has a great reward.

Why are you adding to scripture?

This is a blatant attempt to misrepresent what the Bible says.

1 John 2:19
19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us. But they went out, that it might become plain that they all are not of us.



If you want to quote scripture, then quote it. Your conclusions regarding the scripture have been shown time and time again to be your own ideas, not the scripture.



Can you tell me what Peter was saying about Paul and whom Peter is addressing? We can be carried away by lawless men such as the Catholic Church, but Jesus protects us.

(Philippians 1:2-6)
Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ. I thank my God upon every remembrance of you, Always in every prayer of mine for you all making request with joy, For your fellowship in the gospel from the first day until now; Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ .

Now, I have asked you to respect your own posts. I do that. I read every scripture for context and proper hermeneutical conclusions. I don't paraphrase the Bible. I care enough about you, to take the enormous amount of time it takes to address the things you say. You should give your own posts the care they require.

In your first post to me you said, no one can lose their salvation. Then you said:

Perseverance of the Saints from the scriptures

Yes, the saints had to persevere and through their perseverance they won the race and received their award.

Yes, I did say 'perseverance'. I then quoted the verses (many, many of them) that say God helps us to persevere. The doctrine of election is part and parcel of this belief grounded in the book known as the Holy Bible.

Many seek to be right, and as a result, they fail to seek the truth. Un-harden your heart and quit with the hatred. Here's a couple more:

This is you putting spin on it, not the Bible.

I don't believe I have ever said anything about hating you of anyone else. You have an imagination that makes you conclude things that aren't true. But I believe calling someone hateful is against the TOS.

What I do hate is the lies the Catholic Church dreams up. Your church has a history of heinous evil that continues to this day. Your Popes have been corrupt and even having their own brothels.

Romans 11:22: “Consider the kindness and severity of God—severity toward those who fell, and kindness toward you, provided you remain in his kindness; if you do not, you too will be cut off.”

Yet again, you purposefully left out verses 19-21 and 23-24. I call this using the Bible to deceive. There is a context which you completely ignored it. Why?

Galatians 6:9: “Let us not grow weary of doing good; if we do not relax our efforts, in due time we shall reap our harvest.”

More of the same. No context provided and one verse cherry picked from their context. Eisegesis to the max.

Philippians 2:12: “So then, my dearly beloved, obedient as always to my urging, work with anxious concern to achieve your salvation.”

Here we go, more Catholic spin. Did you happen to read Philippians 1 on the way to Philippians 2? You have missed this:

Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ. I thank my God upon every remembrance of you, Always in every prayer of mine for you all making request with joy, For your fellowship in the gospel from the first day until now; Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ (Philippians 1:2-6).

1 Timothy 1:19: “Some men, by rejecting the guidance of conscience, have made shipwreck of their faith.”

1 Timothy 4:16: “Watch yourself and watch your teaching. Persevere at both tasks. By doing so you will bring to salvation yourself and all who hear you.”

Hebrews 4:1: “Therefore, while the promise of entrance into his rest still holds, we ought to be fearful of disobeying lest any one of you be judged to have lost his chance of entering.”

Hebrews 4:11: “Let us strive to enter into that rest, so that no one may fall.”

How did you miss Hebrews 12:1-2

Hebrews 12:1-2
English Standard Version

12 Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight, and sin which clings so closely, and let us run with endurance the race that is set before us, 2 looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is seated at the right hand of the throne of God.


If you could present a cogent argument for point of view, you would have done so. Instead you resort to the gross mishandling of scripture.

 

[bbyrd009]

It happened when Esau traded his right of birth for a bowl of stew (Genesis 25:29-34). And later just before Isaac died their father Isaac passed the blessing down to Jacob (Genesis 27:37) making him Lord over Esau. Just as God told Rebekah would happen.

well you say that, yesss, but the story quite plainly has Esau holding the land, right, and it is Jacob who leaves?
So the "predestination" part has not been understood either, at least imo

This illustrates God's wi

ok, ty

 

[Enoch111]

I would like to see this info. Will you provide a link?

THE NEW ADVENT CATHOLIC ENCYCLOPEDIA
"The word Mass (missa) first established itself as the general designation for the Eucharistic Sacrifice in the West after the time of Pope Gregory the Great (d. 604), the early Church having used the expression the "breaking of bread" (fractio panis) or "liturgy" (Acts 13:2, leitourgountes); the Greek Church has employed the latter name for almost sixteen centuries."
[Note: in the Bible λειτουργέω (leitourgeo) or liturgy simply means Christian ministry or service. It certainly does not have the Catholic connotation]

Thayer's Greek Lexicon
STRONGS NT 3008: λειτουργέω
2. universally, to do service, to perform a work;Vulg.ministro (A. V. to minister);

When Catholics refer to the "Eucharistic Sacrifice" it is meant to be taken in a literal sense -- a literal priest at a literal altar making a literal sacrifice of Christ, who is literally present through transubstantiation! Since Christ made ONE SACRIFICE FOR SINS FOR EVER, this interpretation is an abomination.

John Wyclif (Wycliffe) was actually the first *Protestant Reformer*, even though he remained within the Catholic Church. He TOTALLY REJECTED the false doctrine of transubstantiation. Even Augustine rejected that idea.

Archives: Wycliffe Causes Controversy Over Eucharist
Although Wycliffe questioned many practices of the church of his day, his most controversial position was on transubstantiation. This was the belief that, upon the words of the priestly consecration in the Mass, the eucharistic elements of the bread and wine became the substance of the body and blood of Jesus Christ while keeping the appearance of bread and wine. Typical of Wycliffe’s comments on the Eucharist were the following:

“The nature of the bread is not destroyed by what is done by the priest, it is only elevated so as to become a substance more honored. The bread while becoming by virtue of Christ’s words the body of Christ does not cease to be bread. When it has become sacramentally the body of Christ, it remains bread substantially. Nobody on earth is able to see Christ in the consecrated Host with the bodily eye, but by faith.

This same opinion is confirmed by blessed Augustine’s statement (in Decretum): ‘What is seen is the bread and the cup which the eyes renounce; but what faith demands is that the bread is the body of Christ and the cup is his blood. These are called sacramental elements for this reason that in them one thing is seen and another is understood. What is seen has bodily appearance, what is understood has a spiritual fruit.The consecrated Host we priests make and bless is not the body of the Lord but an effectual sign of it. It is not to be understood that the body of Christ comes down from heaven to the Host consecrated in every church.

Some expressions in Scripture must be understood plainly and without figure, but there are others that must be understood in a figurative sense. Just as Christ calls John the Baptist Elias, and St. Paul says that Christ was a rock, and Moses in Genesis 41 that the seven good kine are seven years, and the seven good ears are seven years. You will meet with such modes of expression constantly in Scripture and in these expressions, without a doubt, the production is made figuratively.”

Archives: Wycliffe Causes Controversy Over Eucharist | Christian History Magazine

 

[Eternally Grateful]

• You never answered my question? Why did the disciples stop following Jesus?[/QUOTE]
  

  Yup, they "broke bread from house to house." No indication that an apostle or other church leader officiated over the process, certainly not a "priest." The following scriptures are the main ones that talk about "communion," aka the "Lord's Supper."
  
  Acts 2:41-47--So those who accepted his message were baptized, and that day about 3,000 people were added to them. And they devoted themselves to the apostles’ teaching, to the fellowship, to the breaking of bread, and to the prayers.
  Then fear came over everyone, and many wonders and signs were being performed through the apostles. Now all the believers were together and held all things in common. They sold their possessions and property and distributed the proceeds to all, as anyone had a need. Every day they devoted themselves to meeting together in the temple complex, and broke bread from house to house. They ate their food with a joyful and humble attitude, praising God and having favor with all the people. And every day the Lord added to them those who were being saved.
  
  1 Cor 11:17-32--Now in giving the following instruction I do not praise you, since you come together not for the better but for the worse. For to begin with, I hear that when you come together as a church there are divisions among you, and in part I believe it. There must, indeed, be factions among you, so that those who are approved may be recognized among you. Therefore, when you come together, it is not really to eat the Lord’s Supper. For at the meal, each one eats his own supper ahead of others. So one person is hungry while another gets drunk! Don’t you have houses to eat and drink in? Or do you look down on the church of God and embarrass those who have nothing? What should I say to you? Should I praise you? I do not praise you for this!
  For I received from the Lord what I also passed on to you: On the night when He was betrayed, the Lord Jesus took bread, gave thanks, broke it, and said, “This is My body, which is for you. Do this in remembrance of Me.”
  In the same way, after supper He also took the cup and said, “This cup is the new covenant established by My blood. Do this, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of Me.” For as often as you eat this bread and drink the cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death until He comes.
  Therefore, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy way will be guilty of sin against the body and blood of the Lord. So a man should examine himself; in this way he should eat the bread and drink from the cup. For whoever eats and drinks without recognizing the body, eats and drinks judgment on himself. This is why many are sick and ill among you, and many have fallen asleep. If we were properly evaluating ourselves, we would not be judged, but when we are judged, we are disciplined by the Lord, so that we may not be condemned with the world.

  remember, Paul had to scold a church because they were allowing people to hoard all the FOOD, and were getting drunk off the wine. While people got nothing
  
  breaking bread and drinking the cup was done at dinner time, not at church, and nothing like you see in the Roman Catholic or many other churches

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I think people just forget, passover was an OT traditions passed down from generation as a meal I. Which they broke bread and ate, it was done to “remember the passover” or the day this tiny nation, who had no army, was freed from the most powerful army on earth, not by their power, but by gods power

it was this same meal they were observing when Jesus broke bread and the cup was passed (a tradition where a cup is passed from one person to the next) and Jesu said instead of continuing with that tradition, he wanted them to so the same but for a different reason, And not on a particular day, but “often” in remembrance on the day God freed us from the power of sin, and freed us from satans domain, adopting us into his family “do this often in remembrance of me)

the one major flaw is they see flesh and blood in John 6 and assume it is the same. But it’s not

1. no mention of doing often, in John 6 the command is do it and after you do it you will never have to again,
2. In John 6 unlike manna which they ate and died, again, do this one and you will never die
3. In the communion or lords supper it is a cup and bread, in John 6 it is the words of eternal life which the spirit spoke through Jesus,

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Hello PW,

What I was saying, is that it is demonstrable that the Church has believed and taught this from the very beginning.

For example Ignatius, Bishop of the Church in Antioch writes:

"They abstain
from eucharist (thanksgiving) and prayer, because they
allow not that the eucharist is the flesh of our
Saviour Jesus Christ, which flesh suffered for our
sins, and which the Father of His goodness raised up."

( St. Ignatius of Antioch to the Smyrnaeans (Lightfoot translation) )

Now one could rightly say that this also demonstrates there were those who disbelived, what of them?

Where are their communities today? Lost, gone, forgotten,
perished just as Ignatius said they would be:

" They therefore that gainsay the good gift of God
perish by their questionings. But it were expedient
for them to have love, that they may also rise again."



Because the Truth does not change. What was True for our brother s and sisters in 100 AD..200AD...500 AD... 1000 AD... Must still be True today.

Peace!

1 Corinthians 8:8
8But food does not bring us closer to God: We are no worse if we do not eat, and no better if we do.

 

[Prayer Warrior]

Ty. I also appreciate civil discourse. So that's at least two things we agree on ;)



Kind of like no one can show a 2000 year old community that does NOT believe the Eucharist is truly the Body and Blood of Christ?
I understand the frustration.. ;)

I will attempt to answer your question but first I think I need to address what I mean by terms like literal, symbolic, real, physical, spirtual and natural.. For the Eucharist is all these things (except natural)

Argh look at the time... I'll have to expand tomorrow..

Have a blessed night!

Okay, I'm an English teacher. Perhaps defining terms is in order here. BUT, I don't think you can spin this to my satisfaction. It's a fact that the Catholic Church teaches that the wafer (it's not even bread anymore, lol) and wine BECOME the flesh and blood of Jesus Christ. Now, you can use the word literal or real or whatever you want, but that wafer and wine never change in their chemical composition. And this is what I look at. They are clearly symbols of His body; they do not change into His literal, physical body in any way.

If you read the article I posted an excerpt from, you would have seen that the "early church fathers" were very aware of the erroneous Gnostic view that all matter is evil.... They wanted to refute this thinking. The author of the article had this to say:

Such is especially true with regard to the quotes cited above from Ignatius and Irenaeus. During their ministries, both men found themselves contending against the theological error of docetism (a component of Gnostic teaching), which taught that all matter was evil. Consequently, docetism denied that Jesus possessed a real physical body. It was against this false teaching that the apostle John declared, "For many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is the deceiver and the antichrist" (2 John 7).​

In order to combat the false notions of docetism, Ignatius and Irenaeus echoed the language Christ used at the Last Supper (paraphrasing His words, “This is My body” and "This is My blood"). Such provided a highly effective argument against docetic heresies, since our Lord's words underscore the fact that He possessed a real, physical body.

Source: Did the Early Church Teach Transubstantiation?​

 

[Eternally Grateful]

1 Corinthians 8:8
8But food does not bring us closer to God: We are no worse if we do not eat, and no better if we do.

 

[Prayer Warrior]

Well, it may be that God is trying to tell me something! You guys have my last comment sandwiched between the same verse! Maybe it's diet time for me!

 

[Ferris Bueller]

well you say that, yesss, but the story quite plainly has Esau holding the land, right, and it is Jacob who leaves?

Jacob is a great nation, literally and spiritually, to this day. And Esau? Well.....uh....umm...

So the "predestination" part has not been understood either, at least imo

In what way?

 

[Philip James]

Okay, I'm an English teacher. Perhaps defining terms is in order here. .

As an English teacher, (please go easy on my grammatical and spelling errors ;) ) I'm sure you're keenly aware of how easily people can be misunderstood and/or have difficulty communicating their thoughts to another in an understandable manner. How much more when discussing the mysteries of God?

It's a fact that the Catholic Church teaches that the wafer (it's not even bread anymore, lol) and wine BECOME the flesh and blood of Jesus Christ

Yes. But what does that mean?

It is interesting that you mentioned the Docetists, because they denied the Incarnation. That the Word truly became flesh, That He is truly man, with a man's body...

A body that was born of a woman, suffered died and was buried, and that rose again; transformed, the corruptible flesh now incorruptible, the mortal now immortal, the natural now spiritual!

His Incarnation is eternal, Jesus forever now God and man, with a man's body, glorified..

So when I say that He literally has a body, I am saying that He really, or truly has a body. These are synonomous.

it is no longer a natural body but a supernatural body which can yet be touched and handled..

Just so, the Eucharist, when transformed by the power of The Holy Spirit, is no longer natural bread but spiritual bread, the Bread of Life Himself, who's body we receive into our bodies... 'the two made one flesh'.

'This is a great mystery', Paul says and so it is... how can we grasp with our puny human brains divine realities and speak of them other than in words/symbols familiar to our shared experience? And how can we even begin to comprehend them?

A man and his wife being the image of Christ and His Church cannot fully describe the joy of being intimately united with Christ!

Our spiritual food and drink which nourishes our souls and unites our flesh with His, that it too might participate in the ressurection..



But how then is the Eucharist a symbol?

The Bread and the Cup represent Christ's blood poured out, separated from His body at the cross. Somewhere Paul speaks of this when he says 'when Christ was shown crucified before your very eyes'..

But Christ is not re-crucified.. He died once and now lives forever! Where His Body is, there also is His whole person.. Body,Blood, Soul and Divinity..

It is no dead flesh that lies upon the altar, but the Living Lamb who was slain and yet lives!


How's that for a whole pile of symbols, metaphors and declarations, all to try and communicate 'what is it?'


Now to answer your question: 'How can it be Jesus Body and yet still look, taste smell (etc) like bread..'?

The answer is the doctrine of transubtantiation. which to understand we need to talk about what 'substance' means..

but that will be another post metaphysics and philosopical language dont come easily to me and I wouldnt want to be misunderstood ;)

Peace!

 

[Philip James]

1 Corinthians 8:8
8But food does not bring us closer to God: We are no worse if we do not eat, and no better if we do.

Hello Ferris,

natural food yes.. But the Spiritual food that is the Bread of Life Himself?...

Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him on the last day.


For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink.

Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I in him.

You too! Are welcome to come to the wedding feast of the Lamb of God!

Peace be with you!

 

[Tong2020]

Hello Ferris,

natural food yes.. But the Spiritual food that is the Bread of Life Himself?...

Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him on the last day.


For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink.

Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I in him.

You too! Are welcome to come to the wedding feast of the Lamb of God!

Peace be with you!

Spiritual food is not natural food transformed. Besides, nowhere can you find in scriptures that the flesh and blood of man is given as food by God. So, it is not likely that Jesus meant for you to literally eat his literal flesh and literally drink his literal blood, more so do a miracle of transforming bread into His literal flesh and the fruit of the vine into His literal blood.

Spiritual food is the word of God.

John 6:63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.

This comes to mind, when Jesus rebuked the devil saying:

Matthew 4:4 But He answered and said, “It is written, ‘Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.’ ”

Before Jesus even spoke those words you quoted in John 6, He said:

John 6:35 And Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life. He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst.

You too, feed not on bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God, which are spirit and are life.

Are you hungry? Are you thirsty? Believe in Jesus, and you shall be filled and never go hungry and thirsty ever again!

Tong
R1232

 

[Tong2020]

Hi @Philip James

I have a few questions for you, though any of those concerned are welcome as well. I hope you can give your answers. Thanks in advance.

1. Is bread broken and shared among the participants in the Mass? If not, why not bread when that is the proper element Jesus used to represent His body?

2. Is fruit of the vine shared among the participants in the Mass? If not, why not fruit of the vine, when that is the proper element Jesus used to represent His blood?

3. Do those who have eaten the wafer also get to drink of the wine?

4. Upon what you believe, the transubstantiation of the wafer and the wine into the flesh and blood of Jesus Christ, does the wafer and wine becomes imperishable?

Tong
R1233

 

[Philip James]

Besides, nowhere can you find in scriptures that the flesh and blood of man is given as food by God.

For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink.

Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I in him.

John 6:63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life

How ironic that you quote this while relying on the perceptions of your flesh to deny the words of God...

This is my body, take and eat.

 

[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said:
Besides, nowhere can you find in scriptures that the flesh and blood of man is given as food by God.

For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink.

Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me and I in him.

I am sure you are aware that I am speaking of material food that goes into the mouth when I said "Besides, nowhere can you find in scriptures that the flesh and blood of man is given as food by God." So, I don't understand why you just repeated quoting that which I commented about. Perhaps you don't believe the scriptural truth that the flesh and blood of man was never given as food by God from the beginning? In fact, it was not only given, but it was not permitted even, especially the blood. Well, if you don't believe that, so be it with you. Just pointing out the truth about that to you.

<<<For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink.>>>

Not saying there that his flesh is literal food and his blood is literal drink.

Could it be said perhaps that His disciples did not understand Him what He said in John 6 concerning the eating of His flesh and drinking of His blood, that they did not literally ate His literal flesh and literally drank His blood, instead of burying Him? Silly isn't it? But should they have done so, according to your belief, they would have by that abided in Him and had eternal life, right?
_________________
Tong2020 said:
John 6:63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life

How ironic that you quote this while relying on the perceptions of your flesh to deny the words of God...

This is my body, take and eat.

Nothing ironic there PJ.

Apparently you don't believe that the words of God is the spiritual food that God said we should live by. Well, that shows. Nothing can be done about that?

Are you hungry? Are you thirsty?

What is scripture's answer? Is it, eat the flesh of Jesus Christ in the form of wafer? Or is it , believe in Jesus Christ? Apparently you have chosen the former. And I guess you keep eating the wafer? The same I guess with your thirst which you try to quench with the drinking of Jesus' blood in the form of wine? And I guess, if you are a priest, you keep drinking it? That sounds like you don't believe in the words of Jesus Christ when He said "I am the bread of life. He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst."

Also waiting for your response to my post #314 to you.

Tong
R1234

 

[bbyrd009]

Jacob is a great nation, literally and spiritually, to this day. And Esau? Well.....uh....umm...

ok but now youve skipped ahead eh

In what way?

well, not sure i could say, as it depends on ones understanding of the Esau cycle i guess. But there def is some laughter involved, as per Romans 9...but if you "believe in" predestination today, and dont believe in it tomorrow, what changes?

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Hello Ferris,

natural food yes.. But the Spiritual food that is the Bread of Life Himself?...

I thought you might answer this way. The problem is you have been asserting that the elements are changed into actual, literal, real food. And Paul makes it clear that actual, real food has no bearing one way or the other in regard to bringing one closer to God.

I go with Prayer Warriors point that it's quite obvious that there is absolutely no measurable or visual chemical or physical change to the elements whatsoever to somehow support that they have been changed into the actual, real body and blood of Christ.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

..but if you "believe in" predestination today, and dont believe in it tomorrow, what changes?

I believe in predestination. Just not the way Calvin has wrongly defined it. I understand it exactly the way Paul presents it. Believers are predestined to be conformed to the image of Christ. That's the plan. He ordained that future for the church right from the beginning. It's predetermined.

The implications derived from Calvin's (mis)understanding of predestination have pretty much ruined the church.

 

[Philip James]

I go with Prayer Warriors point that it's quite obvious that there is absolutely no measurable or visual chemical or physical change to the elements whatsoever to somehow support that they have been changed into the actual, real body and blood of Christ.

Hello Ferris,

Do you not see that you are demanding that the perceptions of your flesh establish reality rather than the words of Jesus?

This is why it takes supernatual faith to believe in the Bread of Life and the Cup of Salvation.

The One Bread broken and shared, the One cup passed down faithully through out the centuries..

And it is offered freely to all that would come...

The Spirit and the bride say, "Come." Let the hearer say, "Come." Let the one who thirsts come forward, and the one who wants it receive the gift of life-giving water

Peace be with you!

Christ is risen!
Alleluia!