The Baptism With The Holy Spirit (A Scriptural Study)

[Anastacia]

I tell you what, you continue to walk in your weak religon. I will keep praying in tongues and seeing the presence of the Holy Spirit operating in my life and you enjoy your walk and I will enjoy mine.

As I have said over and over again. A man with the experience is never at the mercy of the man with the argument.

Blessings to you.

Your saying is a man made wisdom: "A man with the experience is never at the mercy of the man with the arugument." God's word is better than man's. And, you shouldn't assume you know what my experiences are. And one more thing, I don't believe your "Blessings" to me.

"You reject the Truth. I've tried to show you. I'm done now discussing this with you." - Anastacia


Translation: You have no way to refute the scriptures I have provided.
The Bible is powerful stuff in the face of those who do not know it.

That's a lie that you speak. You are obstinate; you refuse to believe and publicly maliged the Way. So I'm leaving this topic. That's why.

Acts 19:8-9 Paul entered the synagogue and spoke boldly there for three months, arguing persuasively about the kingdom of God. But some of them became obstinate: they refused to believe and publicly maligned the Way. So Paul left them.

 

[religusnut]

"You reject the Truth. I've tried to show you. I'm done now discussing this with you." - Anastacia


Translation: You have no way to refute the scriptures I have provided.
The Bible is powerful stuff in the face of those who do not know it.

It sure is. :

 

[Foreigner]

"Acts 19:8-9 Paul entered the synagogue and spoke boldly there for three months, arguing persuasively about the kingdom of God. But some of them became obstinate: they refused to believe and publicly maligned the Way. So Paul left them." - Anastacia


-- Putting yourself on the same level as Paul? Much more effective if you'd have had your facts straight.

The gifts are still present and in use today. I have seen it.




At the First Assembly of God church in Fargo, ND a pastor told the story of a lead of several churches. He was a learned man who spent his entire life studying the Word and seeking God.

He heard of one of his churches having healing services, people with the gift of prophecy and speaking in tongues. He decided to go and visit the church and with an open mind see what was happening and, if necessary, correct the pastors of that church.

He went there, participated in worship, felt the presence of the Holy Spirit and witnessed several people praising and praying in tongues. He went to the front of this church and heard a very young girl, perhaps 8-9 years old, with her hands raised and speaking in a strange tongue not immediately recognized.

He then got the shock of his life to hear this loving little Christian girl speaking in what he recognized as ancient Greek.
He knew she was too young to have studied this language that had been a part of his life for decades. It was flawless.

While it may have sounded like simple 'childish gibberish' to the vast, vast majority of the people there, it was recognized by a scholar as ancient Greek.

Just because you do not recognize it to be a specific language doesn't mean it isn't one of the thousands of different languages currently spoken on earth (they speak roughly 2000 different languages and dialects in Africa today), or one of the thousands of others that have since disappeared over time.

Just because it is gibberish to YOU doesn't mean it is gibberish. God sees the heart and understands the word.

 

[Anastacia]

"Acts 19:8-9 Paul entered the synagogue and spoke boldly there for three months, arguing persuasively about the kingdom of God. But some of them became obstinate: they refused to believe and publicly maligned the Way. So Paul left them." - Anastacia


-- Putting yourself on the same level as Paul? Much more effective if you'd have had your facts straight.

The gifts are still present and in use today. I have seen it.




At the First Assembly of God church in Fargo, ND a pastor told the story of a lead of several churches. He was a learned man who spent his entire life studying the Word and seeking God.

He heard of one of his churches having healing services, people with the gift of prophecy and speaking in tongues. He decided to go and visit the church and with an open mind see what was happening and, if necessary, correct the pastors of that church.

He went there, participated in worship, felt the presence of the Holy Spirit and witnessed several people praising and praying in tongues. He went to the front of this church and heard a very young girl, perhaps 8-9 years old, with her hands raised and speaking in a strange tongue not immediately recognized.

He then got the shock of his life to hear this loving little Christian girl speaking in what he recognized as ancient Greek.
He knew she was too young to have studied this language that had been a part of his life for decades. It was flawless.

While it may have sounded like simple 'childish gibberish' to the vast, vast majority of the people there, it was recognized by a scholar as ancient Greek.

Just because you do not recognize it to be a specific language doesn't mean it isn't one of the thousands of different languages currently spoken on earth (they speak roughly 2000 different languages and dialects in Africa today), or one of the thousands of others that have since disappeared over time.

Just because it is gibberish to YOU doesn't mean it is gibberish. God sees the heart and understands the word.

Foreigner, People spend so much time at church and at home speaking and listening to their tongues, so much of that time could of been spent reading and listening to God's Word. Also, you listen to interpreters and the things your church's prophets have to say, maybe if you didn't spend so much time doing those things, you'd know that we are suppose to try to be like Paul.

 

[religusnut]

Foreigner, People spend so much time at church and at home speaking and listening to their tongues, so much of that time could of been spent reading and listening to God's Word. Also, you listen to interpreters and the things your church's prophets have to say, maybe if you didn't spend so much time doing those things, you'd know that we are suppose to try to be like Paul.

The above story was a ONE time experience and they went to CORRECT the people doing it did you not read that?

According the Bible praying in tongues is real.


I will give you another story on this.
On the night of Sept 10, 2001 I was very restless. Had some issues happening but not enough to keep me that restless. I wound up in my office at the church and there I stayed in an agonizing night. I would sit in the office chair and sleep a short time only to wake praying in tongues...... over and over and over.

The next morning I was up sitting in the chair still in the office when the phone rang. I started not to answer it because I had a cell and my wife would have called me on it. I felt a last minute nudge to answer it so I did. It was a lady on the other end that was terrified because the US was under attack.

Now if you got out and asked there were probably numerous people that the Holy Spirit either nudged and they prayed like me that night or should have been....

Irregardless, there should have been what 50,000 people that died Sept 11, 2001 when the planes hit the world trade centers. I have listened to some of the testimonies of how they got side tracked or felt this nudge not to go to work or for what ever reason something came up to get them off track.

I believe that my prayers and the prayers of many others were what made the difference in those lives. Possibly if others that felt the nude to pray in tongues that night had done so more people's lives would have been saved or if enough possibly the entire mess could have been averted.


On the night of May, 7 2003 I was led to prayer the same way. I struggled and struggled and struggled. I was finishing up my final exam tests at a Bible School I was attending and had two more test the next morning. I prayed in the spirit all that I could without sleeping and then exhausted I went to sleep with a very bad night of sleep. That next afternoon which was a Thursday my 17 year old son was in an accident and Saturday which was the 10th we had to make the decision to remove him from the ventilator. I believe without a shadow of a doubt that again I was drawn by the Holy Spirit to pray in the spirit which is praying in tongues to intercede. I only wish I had been physically able to continue. It might have saved his life or kept the accident from happening at all.

I know of many people over the years that have had similar experiences.

If interceding for others in the spirit for things that we have no earthly knowledge of is a waste of time I tell you what. I'll waste my time every time I am able to.

Yielding one's entire self including their mouth to the Holy Spirit is definitely not a waste of time.

Also 5 minutes in a manifest presence of God is better than a day studying. Anybody that has ever been there will tell you that.

 

[religusnut]

Foreigner, People spend so much time at church and at home speaking and listening to their tongues, so much of that time could of been spent reading and listening to God's Word. Also, you listen to interpreters and the things your church's prophets have to say, maybe if you didn't spend so much time doing those things, you'd know that we are suppose to try to be like Paul.

If and or when I pray in tongues I never listen at all. I am focused on Him.

I have probably studied the Word of God as much as anybody I personally know although I do not have as much formal education as many I know.

As for listening to prophets if it does not ring in my spirit and confirm something I already know I do not accept it as prophecy from God becase that is the one area that the enemy attacks the chruch harder than any other. It is the same area through out the Old Testament that he did the same thing. He used false prophets as much as possible to confuse the people. There were real ones then and there are real ones now. There were false ones then and there are false ones now.


I know of one that God told to get on an airplane and go to Germany and speak to the Berlin wall and tell it to come down. Then get on a plane and come home and say nothing to anybody while he was there about it. He did and within a matter of a few months it came down starting where he spoke to the wall if I remember it all correctly. It has been a lot of years since all of that happened but I saw enough evidence to believe that the man was telling the truth. That man said nothing to anybody about a time or prediction of the wall falling. He was just trying to be obedient and he got on a plane and did what he felt he was supposed to do.

He spoke that BEFORE the wall came down and said where he went to speak it. He thought he was crazy when he got a plane ticket and crazy for doing it but knew he was hearing from God.



Every one you read about on the Old Testament was thought to be a nut case by everybody they came in contact wtih even if the people loved them they were weird.



You speak of things you have no clue about an ridicule what you do not know.

The man with the experience is never at the mercy of the man with the argument.

 

[Anastacia]

Religusnut,

I'm deeply saddened to hear about your 17 year old son.

You blaming yourself for your son's accident and death shows me that not all your thoughts about praying are correct. Sometimes bad happens no matter how much we pray, and sometimes wonderful things happen to us when we might of not prayed very much for it at all. Praying in what you call "tongues" is not praying in the Spirit. You surely might of felt anxious and felt the need to pray, but you could of spoke and prayed in understandable English.

I don't believe the man who took an airplane just to pray in "tongues" in front of the Berlin wall had anything to do with it coming down. If that man's faith is strong enough to make the Berlin wall come down...then he could of prayed at his house, and he could of prayed in understandable English.

I wish we could become more like minded in Christ. When I read about your son, it reminds me of the the many hardships that can and do happen to all families. We still need to speak the truth about false doctrines. I will not ever go back to believing that speaking in tongues is still active today. Speaking in tongues was for a sign to the Jews, Jews from many different nations. The Bible even tells us that tongues will be stilled. Many believe their glossolalia makes them feel closer to God and Jesus, but what makes us closer to God and Jesus is believing the Truth.

God bless you

 

[religusnut]

Religusnut,

I'm deeply saddened to hear about your 17 year old son.

You blaming yourself for your son's accident and death shows me that not all your thoughts about praying are correct. Sometimes bad happens no matter how much we pray, and sometimes wonderful things happen to us when we might of not prayed very much for it at all. Praying in what you call "tongues" is not praying in the Spirit. You surely might of felt anxious and felt the need to pray, but you could of spoke and prayed in understandable English.

I don't believe the man who took an airplane just to pray in "tongues" in front of the Berlin wall had anything to do with it coming down. If that man's faith is strong enough to make the Berlin wall come down...then he could of prayed at his house, and he could of prayed in understandable English.

I wish we could become more like minded in Christ. When I read about your son, it reminds me of the the many hardships that can and do happen to all families. We still need to speak the truth about false doctrines. I will not ever go back to believing that speaking in tongues is still active today. Speaking in tongues was for a sign to the Jews, Jews from many different nations. The Bible even tells us that tongues will be stilled. Many believe their glossolalia makes them feel closer to God and Jesus, but what makes us closer to God and Jesus is believing the Truth.

God bless you

I don't blame myself and never did. I blame the enemy that comes to steal kill and destroy. Always did always will.

I never said the man went to Germany to pray in tongues.

Dude you are the one that is clueless. Sorry do not mean it as a attack. You are just clueless.

You ridicule things you do not know and speak of things you do not know with authority you do not have.

You are C L U E L E S S sorry you just do not know what you are talking about.

Sad thing is you are one of those people that is unteachable as well. I see them from time to time. Your desire is to find those weak in Christ and then turn them into a white washed tomb ffull of dead men's bones. Form of Godliness denying the POWER there of.

 

[Anastacia]

The above story was a ONE time experience and they went to CORRECT the people doing it did you not read that?

According the Bible praying in tongues is real.


I will give you another story on this.
On the night of Sept 10, 2001 I was very restless. Had some issues happening but not enough to keep me that restless. I wound up in my office at the church and there I stayed in an agonizing night. I would sit in the office chair and sleep a short time only to wake praying in tongues...... over and over and over.

The next morning I was up sitting in the chair still in the office when the phone rang. I started not to answer it because I had a cell and my wife would have called me on it. I felt a last minute nudge to answer it so I did. It was a lady on the other end that was terrified because the US was under attack.

Now if you got out and asked there were probably numerous people that the Holy Spirit either nudged and they prayed like me that night or should have been....

Irregardless, there should have been what 50,000 people that died Sept 11, 2001 when the planes hit the world trade centers. I have listened to some of the testimonies of how they got side tracked or felt this nudge not to go to work or for what ever reason something came up to get them off track.

I believe that my prayers and the prayers of many others were what made the difference in those lives. Possibly if others that felt the nude to pray in tongues that night had done so more people's lives would have been saved or if enough possibly the entire mess could have been averted.


On the night of May, 7 2003 I was led to prayer the same way. I struggled and struggled and struggled. I was finishing up my final exam tests at a Bible School I was attending and had two more test the next morning. I prayed in the spirit all that I could without sleeping and then exhausted I went to sleep with a very bad night of sleep. That next afternoon which was a Thursday my 17 year old son was in an accident and Saturday which was the 10th we had to make the decision to remove him from the ventilator. I believe without a shadow of a doubt that again I was drawn by the Holy Spirit to pray in the spirit which is praying in tongues to intercede. I only wish I had been physically able to continue. It might have saved his life or kept the accident from happening at all.

I know of many people over the years that have had similar experiences.

If interceding for others in the spirit for things that we have no earthly knowledge of is a waste of time I tell you what. I'll waste my time every time I am able to.

Yielding one's entire self including their mouth to the Holy Spirit is definitely not a waste of time.

Also 5 minutes in a manifest presence of God is better than a day studying. Anybody that has ever been there will tell you that.

Religusnut, you said :"I don't blame myself and never did. I blame the enemy that comes to steal kill and destroy. Always did always will."

I highlighted in red what you said about praying. I think many can see from what you said that you hold yourself responsible.

You are getting to angry with me right now. Maybe we can talk more about this another time.

 

[religusnut]

Religusnut, you said :"I don't blame myself and never did. I blame the enemy that comes to steal kill and destroy. Always did always will."

I highlighted in red what you said about praying. I think many can see from what you said that you hold yourself responsible.

You are getting to angry with me right now. Maybe we can talk more about this another time.

I am not angry with you. I have run into numerous others like you. I understand that we are in a war. We were born in that war and we will die in that war. I understand what the enemy is and I understand that he plays by no rules. I also understand what I said. I still did not say I blamed myself. At the time I did not understand what was happening. One more blind side by the enemy. The point of the statements was that intercessory prayer is spirit prayer many times and when the Holy Spirit is drawing you it could have life and death implications. Apparently you do not have ears to hear or eyes to see. I regret that. Have a nice day.

 

[242006]

Someone once said, If you believe something no evidence is necessary. If you do not believe something no evidence is sufficent.

There have never been any truer words spoken about the infilling of the Holy Spirit. If you have not experienced it you will argue till your face is blue against it most times. If you have you will never be the same.

A man with the experience is never at the mercy of the man with the argument.

You tongue twisters are all the same. At all costs, you will ignore the fact that the Bible [manuscripts] do not support your religion. There is no such thing as 'spriritual gifts', 'manifestations' given by the Holy Spirit, and 'unknown tongues' in the Bible manuscripts. There is no way that your religion can be deemed viable [as Christian] without these items being considered true. Since all three do not exist in the Word of God, your religion is a farce.

That is why Satan's spirit is referred as 'seducing' in 1 Tim. 4:1. Instead of allowing Bible facts to guide those in the tongue twisting religion, the seducing [Satanic] spirit guides tongue twisters to ignore the Bible.

 

[Foreigner]

Foreigner, People spend so much time at church and at home speaking and listening to their tongues, so much of that time could of been spent reading and listening to God's Word. Also, you listen to interpreters and the things your church's prophets have to say, maybe if you didn't spend so much time doing those things, you'd know that we are suppose to try to be like Paul.

-- Honestly Anastacia, you really need to make up your mind.

On 10/29 you said: "You reject the Truth. I've tried to show you. I'm done now discussing this with you. "

That was your response when I provided scripture supporting the idea of speaking in tongues and prophecy.

Since you have obviously changed your mind, I ask you to please address it:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"-- Here we go again...

Please actually read this this time and try to focus:


From 10/27:


"If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal." - 1 Cor. 13:1

-- Read it yourself. It says that if you do these things but do not have love, THEN AND ONLY THEN are they "a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal." If you have love in your heart then when you do these things they are NOT that way.


"If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing." - 1 Cor. 13:2

-- This states that having these things are worthless ONLY if you do not have love. That implies they exist, are of value and will discontinue if you do not have love.


"If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing." - 1 Cor. 13:3

-- The very next verse and again listing things of value that will mean little to God if you do not have love. The scripture puts this on the same footing as the previous two verses.


"Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away." -- 1 Cor. 13: 4-8

-- All the continuation of the same idea. It is warning that if we lose love THEN those gifts will be lost. For you to be correct Paul had to have thrown in a random, unrelated statement instead of staying with the theme. Not likely.


And while we are in Corinthians...

"Follow the way of love and eagerly desire spiritual gifts, especially the gift of prophecy. For anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God. Indeed, no one understands him; he utters mysteries with his spirit." - 1 Cor 14:1-2

-- Paul encourages people to seek the very gift that you state is going away. Where exactly did he mention a time stamp where they should stop?

Also, you notice he mentions "for anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God."


-- Anastacia please address these verses and quit the round and round."






"You tongue twisters are all the same. At all costs, you will ignore the fact that the Bible [manuscripts] to do not support your religion. There is no such thing as 'spriritual gifts', 'manifestations' given by the Holy Spirit, and 'unknown tongues' in the Bible manuscripts. There is no way that your religion can be deemed viable without these items being considered true. Since all three do not exist in the Word of God, your religion is a farce." - Watchman

-- Watchman, it is alright that you are wrong. But it is not alright that you are this rude and insulting. Even pretending you are right that is not a very Christian response.

I shudder to think of how you speak to non-Christians.

 

[Anastacia]

-- Watchman, it is alright that you are wrong. But it is not alright that you are this rude and insulting. Even pretending you are right that is not a very Christian response.

I shudder to think of how you speak to non-Christians.

Foreigner, Surely you don't see it but, you are rude yourself. How you can try to judge Watchman about rudeness is just, well, ridiculous.

 

[Anastacia]

-- Honestly Anastacia, you really need to make up your mind.

Foreigner, I will reply in this post to you in blue.

Oh stop, maybe you need to make up your mind and stop with your UNsupernatural speaking in tongues.



On 10/29 you said: "You reject the Truth. I've tried to show you. I'm done now discussing this with you. "

That was your response when I provided scripture supporting the idea of speaking in tongues and prophecy.

Since you have obviously changed your mind, I ask you to please address it:


I've explained it to you already. I will try again.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"-- Here we go again...

Please actually read this this time and try to focus:

Can you leave the sarcasm out of it?


From 10/27:


"If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal." - 1 Cor. 13:1

-- Read it yourself. It says that if you do these things but do not have love, THEN AND ONLY THEN are they "a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal." If you have love in your heart then when you do these things they are NOT that way.

Before you said that you will lose the ability to speak in tongues and prohpecy if you do not have love. If you still believe that is what 1 Corinthians 13:1 means, then you are wrong.

"If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but have not love, I am nothing." - 1 Cor. 13:2

-- This states that having these things are worthless ONLY if you do not have love. That implies they exist, are of value and will discontinue if you do not have love.

This scripture does not say they will discontinue if you do not have love. You are mistaken. This scripture is showing that love is greater than all of these things.

"If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing." - 1 Cor. 13:3

-- The very next verse and again listing things of value that will mean little to God if you do not have love. The scripture puts this on the same footing as the previous two verses.


"Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away." -- 1 Cor. 13: 4-8

-- All the continuation of the same idea. It is warning that if we lose love THEN those gifts will be lost. For you to be correct Paul had to have thrown in a random, unrelated statement instead of staying with the theme. Not likely.
You do not understand these scriptures. Paul does not say what you say he says. Paul says exactly what he says. You just refuse to see it so that you can hang on to your false doctrine.

And while we are in Corinthians...

"Follow the way of love and eagerly desire spiritual gifts, especially the gift of prophecy. For anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God. Indeed, no one understands him; he utters mysteries with his spirit." - 1 Cor 14:1-2

-- Paul encourages people to seek the very gift that you state is going away. Where exactly did he mention a time stamp where they should stop?

Seriously, how many times does this have to be explained to you?! Again, Speaking in tongues were for a sign prophezied to the Jews. Foreigner, was not the prophecy fulfilled?
Speaking in tongues was a gift given during the laying of the foundation. Foreigner, is the foundation not laid?

Now for once, answer those two questions.

Also, you notice he mentions "for anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God."

When there were no foreigner Jews around to hear what they were speaking...the gift continued, during the laying of the foundation, yet if no one was around to understand, then the speaker was speaking to God only. Why is that so hard for you to understand?


-- Anastacia please address these verses and quit the round and round."

You stop going round and round. Answer my questions.

 

[Foreigner]

It would seem that you are the one again needing to be corrected.
The scriptures DO NOT say what you think they do.

Setting aside the very fact that speaking in tongues and prophecy are taking place as we speak, what you say Paul is trying to say is incorrect, and blatantly so.

You are twisting to fit what you want to believe.

In order for you to be correct then this scripture would mean that these are also past events that are now obsolete:
""If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing." - 1 Cor. 13:3"


You have provided no scripture that actually supports what you say and refutes what I say, while the very scripture I provided refutes you easily.


"Speaking in tongues is not what people do nowadays." - Anastacia

-- Christians do it today by the MILLIONS. It is done during praise and worship at church and during their personal prayer life.
And save your wind about it being satanic. It occurs during worship when they are feeling the presence of the Holy Spirit.




As far as rudeness, as soon as I start calling your faith a 'farce' and "As far as my will is concerned, you tongue twisters can all be on your merry way to hell -- leaves more blessings for we Christians." implying that those millions who practice this aren't Christians, then you should feel free to talk to me about rudeness.

In the meantime, why not be non-hypocritical and criticize Watchman. A perusal of this thread will see I have never called anyone's faith a farce or say they are going to hell because they do not believe what I do.

 

[Anastacia]

As far as rudeness, as soon as I start calling your faith a 'farce' and "As far as my will is concerned, you tongue twisters can all be on your merry way to hell -- leaves more blessings for we Christians." implying that those millions who practice this aren't Christians, then you should feel free to talk to me about rudeness.

In the meantime, why not be non-hypocritical and criticize Watchman. A perusal of this thread will see I have never called anyone's faith a farce or say they are going to hell because they do not believe what I do.

Just because you didn't say the exact thing word for word as Watchman, that doesn't mean you are not saying rude things too. Just stop now because you know you are trying to be offensive too.

 

[Anastacia]

It would seem that you are the one again needing to be corrected.
The scriptures DO NOT say what you think they do.

The scriptures say what they say; I'm not interpretting. Just read it and believe.
1 Corinthians 13:8 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away.

Stop denying, ignoring and twisting the scriptures. 1 Corinthians tells us that love never fails. We read love never fails---then we are told "But," it means love never fails, but that prophecies and tongue and knowledge will fail. Prophecy, tongues and knowledge will not only just fail, but---prophecy will "cease," tongues will be "stilled," knowledge will "pass away." Not that they were not active when Paul said that, but that they WILL.. Stop denying the Word of God.


Setting aside the very fact that speaking in tongues and prophecy are taking place as we speak, what you say Paul is trying to say is incorrect, and blatantly so.

I want you to answer this: What prophecies are you and your church saying that the Bible has not already said?! If you and your church are telling new prophecies, then it is ADDING to the Word of God. If your church is not telling new prophecies, then it is only REPEATING prophecies the Bible has ALREADY given. So which is it? Are you and your church adding to the Word of God? Or are you FALSELY calling yourselves prophesizing, when in fact you are JUST REPEATING THE WORDS OF GOD THAT ARE ALREADY IN THE BIBLE? If anyone tells me that Jesus told them something...I will compare what they say to the written word.

You are twisting to fit what you want to believe.

In order for you to be correct then this scripture would mean that these are also past events that are now obsolete:
""If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing." - 1 Cor. 13:3"

No. Not everything would then mean it is obsolete! How do you even figure like that? That is nonsensical.


You have provided no scripture that actually supports what you say and refutes what I say, while the very scripture I provided refutes you easily.

I have given you scripture. You just refuse to see it. You would rather keep your false tongue language then believe the Word of God. You choose what man has taught you over what the Word of God says.

"Speaking in tongues is not what people do nowadays." - Anastacia

-- Christians do it today by the MILLIONS. It is done during praise and worship at church and during their personal prayer life.
And save your wind about it being satanic. It occurs during worship when they are feeling the presence of the Holy Spirit.

I have not said it was satanic. But, many non Christian religions do this, even satanic religions. Surely the demons are being entertained by the UNsupernatural speaking you and millions do.

 

[Foreigner]

"Follow the way of love and eagerly desire spiritual gifts, especially the gift of prophecy. For anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God. Indeed, no one understands him; he utters mysteries with his spirit." - 1 Cor 14:1-2"

-- And when, pray tell, did this message from Paul become null and void? Please be specific.


"Love never ends. As for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will pass away." - 1 Cor 13:8

-- And when - specifically please - did they "pass" and "cease?"


"And these signs will follow those who believe: In My name they will cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues;" - Mark 16:17

-- So, according to you, they should now not speak in new tongues but we will still cast out demons. That about right?
Again, then, when exactly did the "speak with new tongues" become null and void and why doesn't that also refer to casting out demons then?





"I want you to answer this: What prophecies are you and your church saying that the Bible has not already said?! If you and your church are telling new prophecies, then it is ADDING to the Word of God. If your church is not telling new prophecies, then it is only REPEATING prophecies the Bible has ALREADY given." - Anastacia

-- You are kidding, right? Do you believe that God shares visions for specific people, groups, events, churches, etc?
How very sad.


"If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing." - 1 Cor. 13:3"

-- Not nonsensical. That chapter speaks about what will be lost or cease if you do not have love. This is among that list. You would have us believe that as per that chaper that all other things are going to cease no matter what, but this scripture is some different, even though it is listed smack dab in the middle.



"I have not said it was satanic. But many non Christian religions do this, even satanic religions." - Anastacia

-- They are different because they are not communing/speaking with the Holy Spirit.
Many other religions - including satanic religions - pray, as well. Should we not pray because it is something they do, as well? I bet you are going to say no because of who they are praying to compared to who we are praying to......Exactly!


"Surely the demons are being entertained by the UNnatural speaking you and millions do." - Anastacia

-- Surely this is an opinion that you have but cannot support. Especially since this practice is done during praise and worship of Jesus in an environment blessed by the Holy Spirit. If you do not see the contradiction, I cannot help you.
Praise and worship in the spirit deepens your relationship with Jesus and make you desire Him even more.
Am sure that is very entertaining to demons.



"Your religion is a farce!" - Watchman
"Since Rapturists, who hold true to form, will reject Christ and will worship Satan in the endtime" - Watchman
"Certainly, the first resurrection is out of the question for endtime Rapturists, as they have taken the Mark of the Beast." - Watchman
"Then, you have the audacity to claim your religion is 'Christian'. Since your religion is not of Christ, the default position is that it is of Satan. So, spare me your ignorant comments on 'reasoning'. My reasoning here is flawless." - Watchman
"On the other hand, your religion is Satanic." - Watchman
"Frankly, since this is the 'General Christian Forum, I don't understand why you tongue twisters are allowed to post here. After all, you are not Christian" - Watchman
"You see, all tongue twisters are thumb-sucking babies in that they think they are so special" - Watchman
"Likewise, there is no compromise with Satan's church. You tongue twisters represent the great endtime apostasy" - Watchman
"As far as my will is concerned, you tongue twisters can all be on your merry way to hell -- leaves more blessings for we Christians. I certainly know that your religion is of Satan;" - Watchman


-- Now Anastacia, if you would point out exactly where I have said anything like this about your or Watchman's faith or him personally, I will be glad to apologies.
Otherwise, perhaps you should admit your error.
Pointing out that someone is being judgemental and pointing to the above-listed comments as proof is hardly insulting someone.



What it comes down to is this. In seeking God with your whole heart these things have been the next step. And they only enhanced a person's relationship with Jesus. Increased its intimacy. By that very fact what you say cannot be is simply wrong.


The simple fact is that millions of people do pray in the spirit and are growing closer to Jesus Christ because of it. You saying that it is wrong, demonic, etc. is not supported by the fruit that would have to be born if it were true.

An increased closeness and deeper love of Jesus as well as an increased desire to serve him and ensure that others come to him is hardly the fruit of a 'demonic' activity.

 

[Anastacia]

"Follow the way of love and eagerly desire spiritual gifts, especially the gift of prophecy. For anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God. Indeed, no one understands him; he utters mysteries with his spirit." - 1 Cor 14:1-2"

-- And when, pray tell, did this message from Paul become null and void? Please be specific.

My replies to Foreigner in blue.

Don't say Paul's message is null and void. You saying that is more proof that you would give up all of Paul's message just to keep your false man-made doctrine. Tongues were probably stilled some time after the laying of the foundation. Probably around the destruction of the temple in Jerusalem.
I've read that the nowadays speaking in tongue didn't start until a couple hundred years ago.


"Love never ends. As for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will pass away." - 1 Cor 13:8

-- And when - specifically please - did they "pass" and "cease?"


So, you are not in doubt that Paul said they would "pass" and "cease," but more about when? Like I said before, the nowadays tongue speaking just came about some couple hundred years ago.

"And these signs will follow those who believe: In My name they will cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues;" - Mark 16:17

-- So, according to you, they should now not speak in new tongues but we will still cast out demons. That about right?
Again, then, when exactly did the "speak with new tongues" become null and void and why doesn't that also refer to casting out demons then?

Unless you can show me using scripture that demons cannot be cast out. You seem to have a real difficult time accepting that the laying of the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Jesus Christ himself as chief cornerstone, was in fact a special time.

And so far, it seems you are only answering my questions with questions. This alone though, is very telling. Maybe you are coming to understand?

"I want you to answer this: What prophecies are you and your church saying that the Bible has not already said?! If you and your church are telling new prophecies, then it is ADDING to the Word of God. If your church is not telling new prophecies, then it is only REPEATING prophecies the Bible has ALREADY given." - Anastacia

-- You are kidding, right? Do you believe that God shares visions for specific people, groups, events, churches, etc?
How very sad.

What in the world is "very sad"? You are the one that said you have people in your church who prophecy. Answer my question about the people who you said prophesize in your church. Answer, please.

"If I give all I possess to the poor and surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing." - 1 Cor. 13:3"

-- Not nonsensical. That chapter speaks about what will be lost or cease if you do not have love. This is among that list. You would have us believe that as per that chaper that all other things are going to cease no matter what, but this scripture is some different, even though it is listed smack dab in the middle.

You don't make sense. Explain better what you mean. Read what Paul says. That's what it means. "If I give all I possess to the poor..., but have not love, I gain nothing." "...surrender my body to the flames, but have not love, I gain nothing." Where does he say here that "what will be lost or cease if you don't have love" as you say?
Paul doesn't say a person loses the ability to give...if you don't have love. Paul doesn't say you can't surrender your body to the flames...if you don't have love. You are so not understanding these scriptures!

"I have not said it was satanic. But many non Christian religions do this, even satanic religions." - Anastacia

-- They are different because they are not communing/speaking with the Holy Spirit.
Many other religions - including satanic religions - pray, as well. Should we not pray because it is something they do, as well? I bet you are going to say no because of who they are praying to compared to who we are praying to......Exactly!

We are not talking about praying....we are talking about speaking in tongues.

"Surely the demons are being entertained by the UNnatural speaking you and millions do." - Anastacia

-- Surely this is an opinion that you have but cannot support. Especially since this practice is done during praise and worship of Jesus in an environment blessed by the Holy Spirit. If you do not see the contradiction, I cannot help you.
Praise and worship in the spirit deepens your relationship with Jesus and make you desire Him even more.
Am sure that is very entertaining to demons.

Your praising and worshiping in gibberish is NOT supernatural. I did it at one time. I even interpreted what I was saying. The Holy Spirit prompted me to read about it, because I had only just did what man taught and didn't bother to check on everything they said. I studied about it and it was revealed to me that what people are doing in the churches and their private lives is not biblical.


-- Now Anastacia, if you would point out exactly where I have said anything like this about your or Watchman's faith or him personally, I will be glad to apologies.
Otherwise, perhaps you should admit your error.
Pointing out that someone is being judgemental and pointing to the above-listed comments as proof is hardly insulting someone.

You are rude yourself.


What it comes down to is this. In seeking God with your whole heart these things have been the next step. And they only enhanced a person's relationship with Jesus. Increased its intimacy. By that very fact what you say cannot be is simply wrong.

The truth will make you closer to God. Your relationship probably stagnated when you began to practice this falseness more routinely. I know you can't seem to read and understand scriptures concerning this, for sure.

 

[Anastacia]

Foreigner, I do want to say that I do not agree with Watchman when he says there are no gifts from the Holy Spirit. At first I didn't want to correct Watchman in this thread because there isn't any one else going against false speaking in tongues. But now I want to say that I don't agree with what he says about there not ever being any gifts from the Holy Spirit. There are many scriptures saying there are gifts of the Holy Spirit.
.....This salvation, which was first announced by the Lord, was confirmed to us by those who heard him. [sup]4[/sup] God also testified to it by signs, wonders and various miracles, and by gifts of the Holy Spirit distributed according to his will. Hebrews 2:3-4.

As I have been saying before, that speaking in tongues were for a sign to the Jews, during the laying of the foundation. Just wanted to speak up when I see error....