Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
Go ahead and work your way to heaven
not of works. Eph 2 and titus 3:5.
Baptism is a work of righteousness
Only baptism by immersion?
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not of works. Eph 2 and titus 3:5.
Baptism is a work of righteousness
Satan used scripture a lot for trying to persuade Jesus into doing the wrong things.
Just wondering....
Just wondering....
April_Rose
Well-Known Member
baptism is not water? That’s a good one
John the preacher came to prepare the way by saying accept Christ as your personal lord and savior and it’s all you need to do! Whatever!
Context of Jn 3:5 “born again”
John1:26 John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not; (John prepared the way by baptism)
John 2:6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece. (Old covenant prefiguring of baptism, purification from sin)(His disciples believed because the ever Virgin mother of God interceded Jn 2:11)
John3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. (Baptism)
John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized. 23 And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.(Baptism)
John 4:4 When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John.
Born again means Baptismal regeneration!
Alright baptism and river I.e.; water in Jn 1, 2, 3, & 4
baptism is not works, you cannot baptize yourself???
eph 2 refers to redemption not justification or salvation
Redemption, Justification, Sanctification, and Salvation!
Redemption: 100 percent the work of God, thru the life, death, resurrection, and ascension of Jesus Christ! All mankind are redeemed in Christ! Eph 2
Galatians 2:16 3:13
Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law...
Justification: our acceptance of redemption thru faith and baptism! Become a disciple and member of Christ and His Church! Jn 3:5 acts 2:38 Mk 16:16 He who believes and is baptized shall be saved. 1 Corinthians 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
Sanctification: the life of grace in the holy sacrifice of the mass and sacraments, prayer, virture, and good works, the just living by faith, and faith working thru love! Phil 1:29 called to suffer with Christ.
All done in Christ thru His grace! Jn 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
Salvation: a christian in the state if grace at the moment of death we enter into the salvation of the Lord! Mt 24:44-47 faithful servant! Jn 15:1-5 abide in me. Mt 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
Heb 4:14 For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;
Rom 13:11 ...for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.
Then Once saved always saved!
1 Pet 3:20
Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark all died and outside the church there is no salvation!)
April_Rose
Well-Known Member
Oh well in that case you quoted me that you were responding to by mistake. My apologies.
mailmandan
Well-Known Member
That salvation is by grace through faith and is not by works (Ephesians 2:8,9) is not hard to understand. It’s just hard for works-salvationists to ACCEPT. It’s a shame that human pride will not allow work-salvationists to place their faith in Jesus Christ as the all-sufficient means of their salvation. Instead they turn to supplements as their hands are full of their works and they will not let go in order to receive Christ through faith.
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
I will not ask again
show me where Jesus used the word baptism in John 3
if the water meant baptism, when Jesus told nicodemus HOW to be born again, why did he not use the word baptism
WHO DID HE NOT SAY god so loved the world whoever believes and is baptized,
why did he not say, he who believes and is baptized is not condemned etc etc
please show me where Jesus said it, not just your interpretation of what the word water means,
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
Actually yeah it is a work, you could bot circumcize yourself either, but trying to add that to the gospel paul called a gospel of works
You pastor can no more baptize you into Christ as a Jewish priest could cleans a Jewish baby by cutting his forskin
it’s the circumcision otero baptism done by the hand of God which saved, the spiritual baptism
water baptism gets you wet, not saved,
atpollard
Well-Known Member
Umm ... the word actually MEANS immersion.
G907 βαπτίζω baptízō, bap-tid'-zo; from a derivative of G911; to immerse, submerge; to make whelmed (i.e. fully wet)
G911 βάπτω báptō, bap'-to; a primary verb; to whelm, i.e. cover wholly with a fluid
- [Mat 3:6, 11, 13-14, 16 NASB] 6 and they were being baptized[G907] by him in the Jordan River, as they confessed their sins. ... 11 "As for me, I baptize[G907] you with water for repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, and I am not fit to remove His sandals; He will baptize[G907] you with the Holy Spirit and fire. ... 13 Then Jesus arrived from Galilee at the Jordan [coming] to John, to be baptized[G907] by him. 14 But John tried to prevent Him, saying, "I have need to be baptized[G907] by You, and do You come to me?" ... 16 After being baptized,[G907] Jesus came up immediately from the water; and behold, the heavens were opened, and he saw the Spirit of God descending as a dove [and] lighting on Him,
- [Mat 28:19 NASB] 19 "Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing[G907] them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,
- [Mar 1:4-5, 8-9 NASB] 4 John the Baptist[G907] appeared in the wilderness preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins. 5 And all the country of Judea was going out to him, and all the people of Jerusalem; and they were being baptized[G907] by him in the Jordan River, confessing their sins. ... 8 "I baptized[G907] you with water; but He will baptize[G907] you with the Holy Spirit." 9 In those days Jesus came from Nazareth in Galilee and was baptized[G907] by John in the Jordan.
- [Mar 6:14, 24 NASB] 14 And King Herod heard [of it,] for His name had become well known; and [people] were saying, "John the Baptist[G907] has risen from the dead, and that is why these miraculous powers are at work in Him." ... 24 And she went out and said to her mother, "What shall I ask for?" And she said, "The head of John the Baptist."[G907]
- [Mar 10:38-39 NASB] 38 But Jesus said to them, "You do not know what you are asking. Are you able to drink the cup that I drink, or to be baptized[G907] with the baptism with which I am baptized?"[G907] 39 They said to Him, "We are able." And Jesus said to them, "The cup that I drink you shall drink; and you shall be baptized[G907] with the baptism with which I am baptized.[G907]
- [Mar 16:16 NASB] 16 "He who has believed and has been baptized[G907] shall be saved; but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned.
- [Luk 3:7, 12, 16, 21 NASB] 7 So he [began] saying to the crowds who were going out to be baptized[G907] by him, "You brood of vipers, who warned you to flee from the wrath to come? ... 12 And [some] tax collectors also came to be baptized,[G907] and they said to him, "Teacher, what shall we do?" ... 16 John answered and said to them all, "As for me, I baptize[G907] you with water; but One is coming who is mightier than I, and I am not fit to untie the thong of His sandals; He will baptize[G907] you with the Holy Spirit and fire. ... 21 Now when all the people were baptized,[G907] Jesus was also baptized,[G907] and while He was praying, heaven was opened,
- [Luk 7:29-30 NASB] 29 When all the people and the tax collectors heard [this,] they acknowledged God's justice, having been baptized[G907] with the baptism of John. 30 But the Pharisees and the lawyers rejected God's purpose for themselves, not having been baptized[G907] by John.
- [Luk 11:38 NASB] 38 When the Pharisee saw it, he was surprised that He had not first ceremonially[G907] washed[G907] before the meal.
- [Luk 12:50 NASB] 50 "But I have a baptism to undergo,[G907] and how distressed I am until it is accomplished!
- [Jhn 1:25-26, 28, 31, 33 NASB] 25 They asked him, and said to him, "Why then are you baptizing,[G907] if you are not the Christ, nor Elijah, nor the Prophet?" 26 John answered them saying, "I baptize[G907] in water, [but] among you stands One whom you do not know. ... 28 These things took place in Bethany beyond the Jordan, where John was baptizing.[G907] ... 31 "I did not recognize Him, but so that He might be manifested to Israel, I came baptizing[G907] in water." ... 33 "I did not recognize Him, but He who sent me to baptize[G907] in water said to me, 'He upon whom you see the Spirit descending and remaining upon Him, this is the One who baptizes[G907] in the Holy Spirit.'
- [Jhn 3:22-23, 26 NASB] 22 After these things Jesus and His disciples came into the land of Judea, and there He was spending time with them and baptizing.[G907] 23 John also was baptizing[G907] in Aenon near Salim, because there was much water there; and [people] were coming and were being baptized[G907]-- ... 26 And they came to John and said to him, "Rabbi, He who was with you beyond the Jordan, to whom you have testified, behold, He is baptizing[G907] and all are coming to Him."
- [Jhn 4:1-2 NASB] 1 Therefore when the Lord knew that the Pharisees had heard that Jesus was making and baptizing[G907] more disciples than John 2 (although Jesus Himself was not baptizing,[G907] but His disciples were),
- [Jhn 10:40 NASB] 40 And He went away again beyond the Jordan to the place where John was first baptizing,[G907] and He was staying there.
- [Act 1:5 NASB] 5 for John baptized[G907] with water, but you will be baptized[G907] with the Holy Spirit not many days from now."
- [Act 2:38, 41 NASB] 38 Peter [said] to them, "Repent, and each of you be baptized[G907] in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. ... 41 So then, those who had received his word were baptized;[G907] and that day there were added about three thousand souls.
- [Act 8:12-13, 16, 36, 38 NASB] 12 But when they believed Philip preaching the good news about the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, they were being baptized,[G907] men and women alike. 13 Even Simon himself believed; and after being baptized,[G907] he continued on with Philip, and as he observed signs and great miracles taking place, he was constantly amazed. ... 16 For He had not yet fallen upon any of them; they had simply been baptized[G907] in the name of the Lord Jesus. ... 36 As they went along the road they came to some water; and the eunuch said, "Look! Water! What prevents me from being baptized?"[G907] ... 38 And he ordered the chariot to stop; and they both went down into the water, Philip as well as the eunuch, and he baptized[G907] him.
- [Act 9:18 NASB] 18 And immediately there fell from his eyes something like scales, and he regained his sight, and he got up and was baptized;[G907]
- [Act 10:47-48 NASB] 47 "Surely no one can refuse the water for these to be baptized[G907] who have received the Holy Spirit just as we [did,] can he?" 48 And he ordered them to be baptized[G907] in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked him to stay on for a few days.
- [Act 11:16 NASB] 16 "And I remembered the word of the Lord, how He used to say, 'John baptized[G907] with water, but you will be baptized[G907] with the Holy Spirit.'
- [Act 16:15, 33 NASB] 15 And when she and her household had been baptized,[G907] she urged us, saying, "If you have judged me to be faithful to the Lord, come into my house and stay." And she prevailed upon us. ... 33 And he took them that [very] hour of the night and washed their wounds, and immediately he was baptized,[G907] he and all his [household.]
- [Act 18:8 NASB] 8 Crispus, the leader of the synagogue, believed in the Lord with all his household, and many of the Corinthians when they heard were believing and being baptized.[G907]
- [Act 19:3 NASB] 3 And he said, "Into what then were you baptized?"[G907] And they said, "Into John's baptism."
- [Act 19:4-5 NASB] 4 Paul said, "John baptized[G907] with the baptism of repentance, telling the people to believe in Him who was coming after him, that is, in Jesus." 5 When they heard this, they were baptized[G907] in the name of the Lord Jesus.
- [Act 22:16 NASB] 16 'Now why do you delay? Get up and be baptized,[G907] and wash away your sins, calling on His name.'
- [Rom 6:3 NASB] 3 Or do you not know that all of us who have been baptized[G907] into Christ Jesus have been baptized[G907] into His death?
- [1Co 1:13-17 NASB] 13 Has Christ been divided? Paul was not crucified for you, was he? Or were you baptized[G907] in the name of Paul? 14 I thank God that I baptized[G907] none of you except Crispus and Gaius, 15 so that no one would say you were baptized[G907] in my name. 16 Now I did baptize[G907] also the household of Stephanas; beyond that, I do not know whether I baptized[G907] any other. 17 For Christ did not send me to baptize,[G907] but to preach the gospel, not in cleverness of speech, so that the cross of Christ would not be made void.
- [1Co 10:2 NASB] 2 and all were baptized[G907] into Moses in the cloud and in the sea;
- [1Co 12:13 NASB] 13 For by one Spirit we were all baptized[G907] into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit.
- [1Co 15:29 NASB] 29 Otherwise, what will those do who are baptized[G907] for the dead? If the dead are not raised at all, why then are they baptized[G907] for them?
- [Gal 3:27 NASB] 27 For all of you who were baptized[G907] into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ.
Eternally Grateful
Well-Known Member
I am dumfounded how a person can think we can add anything to the blood of Christ to wash our sins and make us white as snow.
2nd Timothy Group
Well-Known Member
Romans 3:27-31 NLT - "Can we boast, then, that we have done anything to be accepted by God? No, because our acquittal is not based on obeying the law. It is based on faith. So we are made right with God through faith and not by obeying the law. After all, is God the God of the Jews only? Isn't he also the God of the Gentiles? Of course he is. There is only one God, and he makes people right with himself only by faith, whether they are Jews or Gentiles. Well then, if we emphasize faith, does this mean that we can forget about the law? Of course not! In fact, only when we have faith do we truly fulfill the law."
No, nothing worldly, no worldly act can justify us to God. Paul is conclusively saying that no act of the Law can redeem us from the Sinful Nature and subsequent sins. This means that even physical circumcision does nothing, nor does it's brother, Baptism. Neither physical circumcision or baptism can save a person, for these are mere reflections of the exact same thing . . . Circumcision of Heart. - It is so clear, that Salvation is the free gift of God, issuing the New Heart and Spirit, a Spirit who causes us to obey and be Justified before and to the Lord. Without Circumcision of Heart, no one can come to the Lord and become His Child. The fact that verse 29 indicates that God is also the God of the Gentiles, who do not practice physical circumcision, this too proves that physical circumcision counts for nothing, nor does water baptism.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Behold
Well-Known Member
The Blood of Jesus, Faith, and the Holy Spirit, are necessary for Salvation.
Water and works need not apply for those positions.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Behold
Well-Known Member
Being immersed in water has no effect on being saved, as it can't cause it.
Its simply a symbolic event that we should partake of, after we are born again, as its meaning has true significance.
What we can't do is believe that water has the power to cause the new birth.
It doesn't.
mailmandan
Well-Known Member
In regards to faith, works-salvationists fail to understand that there is a deeper, more substantive aspect of faith which is trusting in Jesus Christ as the ALL-sufficient means of their salvation and they cannot seem to distinguish between mere intellectual belief or mental assent from personal faith that is trusting in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. This also explains why such people have so much faith in water and works.
Behold
Well-Known Member
Yes.
Also, its self righteousness that fights always against God's Righteousness.
Its Self Righteousness that has a carnal need to try to get some of the credit for salvation, by insisting that Its NOT JUST JESUS but it has to include me, me me, me, me me, ....look at me......see what i can do.
And what legalists dont understand is when you try to add your works to the "finished work of Jesus on the Cross", you become an enemy of the Truth.
This is why Paul wrote : Galatians 1:8
To rebuke and correct and highlight these deceived people.
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