Your Thoughts: 1 Thessalonians 1:2-4

[VictoryinJesus]

(12) For the which cause I also suffer these things:

nevertheless I am not ashamed:
for I know whom I have believed,
and am persuaded that He is able to keep
that which I have committed unto Him against that day.​

(13) Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me,

in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.​

(14) That good thing which was committed unto thee keep

by the Holy Ghost which dwelleth in us.​

Hello @Hidden In Him, (& @VictoryinJesus)

Gr. paratheke = a deposit that is committed unto (1 Timothy 6:20)
Gr, parakatathēkē = deposit (a sacred trust) (1 Timothy 6:20; 2 Timothy 1:14) Translated:- committed.
Gr. paratithēmi = deposit or commit (1 Timothy 1:18; 1 Timothy 2:2)

With respect it is not his soul that Paul commits to God in 1 Timothy 1:12: but the 'form of sound words' which Timothy had heard of Paul, that was the 'deposit' of which Paul speaks in verse 12 (above), and to which he refers in verse 14. We meet with it again in 1 Timothy 6:20; 'O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust ', and immediately following this comes the exposure of the opposite of sound (ie., healthy) doctrine:- 'avoiding profane and vain babblings' - which was false knowledge (2 Timothy 2:16-18; 1 Timothy 6:20). A further reference to this 'deposit' is found in 2 Timothy 2:2:-

'And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses,
the same commit (deposit) thou to faithful men,
who shall be able to teach others also.'
(2 Timothy 2:2)​

This deposit is now thankfully in our possession in the form of the epistles written from prison by Paul. They constitute the ground and hope, the doctrine and practice, and the position held in the purpose of the ages, of the church of the one Body. What an important deposit of truth this is that Paul commits to God's safe keeping, and to Timothy to be made known.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

As I was going to sleep last night Philippians 4:7-9 was on my mind...in relation to That good thing “That good thing which was committed unto thee keep

by the Holy Ghost which dwelleth in us.” ​

Considering not only the “shall guard” but also that “good thing”
“And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus. [8] Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things. [9] Those things, which ye have both learned, and received, and heard, and seen in me, do: and the God of peace shall be with you.

...those things, which you have learned, and received, and heard...(verse 13 Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me,)
...12) For the which cause I also suffer these things: nevertheless I am not ashamed:
for I know whom I have believed,
and am persuaded that He is able to keep
that which I have committed unto Him against that day.
(13) Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me,
in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.
(14) That good thing which was committed unto thee keep by the Holy Ghost which dwelleth in us.

For the which cause I also suffer these things:
nevertheless I am not ashamed:
for I know whom I have believed, Philippians 4:11-13 Not that I speak in respect of want: for I have learned, in whatsoever state I am, therewith to be content. [12] I know both how to be abased, and I know how to abound: every where and in all things I am instructed both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need. [13] I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.

I’m sorry. Realize that may not flow smoothly but it did help last night as yesterday was a tough day...thinking on this topic and those verses. I do wish I had your clarity.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

With respect it is not his soul that Paul commits to God in 1 Timothy 1:12: but the 'form of sound words' which Timothy had heard of Paul, that was the 'deposit' of which Paul speaks in verse 12 (above), and to which he refers in verse 14. We meet with it again in 1 Timothy 6:20; 'O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust ',

in no way disagreeing with you. I think it is beautiful and insightful what you have shared. So I’m not trying to muddy things but only sharing 1 Thessalonians 2:4-9 for consideration also. “But as we were allowed of God to be put in trust with the gospel, even so we speak; not as pleasing men, but God, which trieth our hearts. [5] For neither at any time used we flattering words, as ye know, nor a cloke of covetousness; God is witness: [6] Nor of men sought we glory, neither of you, nor yet of others, when we might have been burdensome, as the apostles of Christ. [7] But we were gentle among you, even as a nurse cherisheth her children: [8] So being affectionately desirous of you, we were willing to have imparted unto you, not the gospel of God only, but also our own souls, because YOU were dear unto us. [9] For ye remember, brethren, our labour and travail: for labouring night and day, because we would not be chargeable unto any of you, we preached unto you the gospel of God.

Consider closely “So being affectionately desirous of you, we were willing to have imparted unto you, not the gospel of God only, but also our own souls, because YOU were dear unto us.”

Affectionately desiring “not your things but You” we were willing to have imparted unto you ...not the gospel of God only ...but also our own souls ...BECAUSE you were dear to us Mark 8:35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.

Do agree with what you shared but also (imo) there is more there in “we were willing to have imparted unto you not the gospel of God only ...but also our own souls ...BECAUSE you were (that) dear unto us ...Paul’s seeing “whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.”

Acts 4:32 And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul: neither said any of them that ought of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common.

 

[keithr]

I can quote for you something from a commentary I was looking at on this verse, however: "The Lord committed the treasure of the gospel to the apostle for careful management as a steward of God..." (Complete Bible Library, Romans-Corinthians, P.539).

Paul says at the end of the preceding chapter (8 verses earlier - it's part of the same message):

(2Cor 3:18) But we all, with unveiled face seeing the glory of the Lord as in a mirror, are transformed into the same image from glory to glory, even as from the Lord, the Spirit.

God works in us, transforming us into an image of Jesus and Himself - "Of this I am confident, that he who started the good work in you will bring it to completion by the day of Christ Jesus" (Php 1:6 REB).

All true Christians, who have been begotten again as new creatures in Christ (2 Corinthians 5:17), are being changed bit by bit, from glory to glory, under the molding, fashioning influences of the Spirit of God, until in the resurrection they are born again as a perfected new creature, and given an immortal spirit nature, just like Jesus now has.

(Rom 8:29) For whom he foreknew, he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.
(Rev 1:5) from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead

 

[Hidden In Him]

(12) For the which cause I also suffer these things:

nevertheless I am not ashamed:
for I know whom I have believed,
and am persuaded that He is able to keep
that which I have committed unto Him against that day.​

(13) Hold fast the form of sound words, which thou hast heard of me,

in faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.​

(14) That good thing which was committed unto thee keep

by the Holy Ghost which dwelleth in us.​

Hello @Hidden In Him, (& @VictoryinJesus)

Gr. paratheke = a deposit that is committed unto (1 Timothy 6:20)
Gr, parakatathēkē = deposit (a sacred trust) (1 Timothy 6:20; 2 Timothy 1:14) Translated:- committed.
Gr. paratithēmi = deposit or commit (1 Timothy 1:18; 1 Timothy 2:2)

With respect it is not his soul that Paul commits to God in 1 Timothy 1:12: but the 'form of sound words' which Timothy had heard of Paul, that was the 'deposit' of which Paul speaks in verse 12 (above), and to which he refers in verse 14. We meet with it again in 1 Timothy 6:20; 'O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust ', and immediately following this comes the exposure of the opposite of sound (ie., healthy) doctrine:- 'avoiding profane and vain babblings' - which was false knowledge (2 Timothy 2:16-18; 1 Timothy 6:20). A further reference to this 'deposit' is found in 2 Timothy 2:2:-

'And the things that thou hast heard of me among many witnesses,
the same commit (deposit) thou to faithful men,
who shall be able to teach others also.'
(2 Timothy 2:2)​

This deposit is now thankfully in our possession in the form of the epistles written from prison by Paul. They constitute the ground and hope, the doctrine and practice, and the position held in the purpose of the ages, of the church of the one Body. What an important deposit of truth this is that Paul commits to God's safe keeping, and to Timothy to be made known.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

You know what. This makes a strong case. :)

The Received Text actually uses a different word in v.14, but all the better texts repeat the use of paratheke, which all of a sudden has me seeing things differently. I think you've both won your argument. :) I would add that the better translation would actually be "that which I have entrusted unto Him," which Paul then likewise entrusted to Timothy to preserve faithfully.

Thanks for sharing, Charity. I appreciate that. As stated, I've never fully looked into this specific question before, and didn't have a complete witness about it in my spirit. This, however, I do.

God bless!

 

[Hidden In Him]

in no way disagreeing with you. I think it is beautiful and insightful what you have shared. So I’m not trying to muddy things but only sharing 1 Thessalonians 2:4-9 for consideration also. “But as we were allowed of God to be put in trust with the gospel, even so we speak; not as pleasing men, but God, which trieth our hearts. [5] For neither at any time used we flattering words, as ye know, nor a cloke of covetousness; God is witness: [6] Nor of men sought we glory, neither of you, nor yet of others, when we might have been burdensome, as the apostles of Christ. [7] But we were gentle among you, even as a nurse cherisheth her children: [8] So being affectionately desirous of you, we were willing to have imparted unto you, not the gospel of God only, but also our own souls, because YOU were dear unto us. [9] For ye remember, brethren, our labour and travail: for labouring night and day, because we would not be chargeable unto any of you, we preached unto you the gospel of God.

Consider closely “So being affectionately desirous of you, we were willing to have imparted unto you, not the gospel of God only, but also our own souls, because YOU were dear unto us.”

Affectionately desiring “not your things but You” we were willing to have imparted unto you ...not the gospel of God only ...but also our own souls ...BECAUSE you were dear to us Mark 8:35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.

Do agree with what you shared but also (imo) there is more there in “we were willing to have imparted unto you not the gospel of God only ...but also our own souls ...BECAUSE you were (that) dear unto us ...Paul’s seeing “whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.”

Acts 4:32 And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul: neither said any of them that ought of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common.

This is also plausible, Victory, and had I not read Charity's post I might have agreed with you. But the immediate context of v.12-14, when the same word is used in the Greek twice, suggests very strongly that Paul's message is what's being referred to throughout. :)

 

[Hidden In Him]

Paul says at the end of the preceding chapter (8 verses earlier - it's part of the same message):

(2Cor 3:18) But we all, with unveiled face seeing the glory of the Lord as in a mirror, are transformed into the same image from glory to glory, even as from the Lord, the Spirit.

God works in us, transforming us into an image of Jesus and Himself - "Of this I am confident, that he who started the good work in you will bring it to completion by the day of Christ Jesus" (Php 1:6 REB).

All true Christians, who have been begotten again as new creatures in Christ (2 Corinthians 5:17), are being changed bit by bit, from glory to glory, under the molding, fashioning influences of the Spirit of God, until in the resurrection they are born again as a perfected new creature, and given an immortal spirit nature, just like Jesus now has.

(Rom 8:29) For whom he foreknew, he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brothers.
(Rev 1:5) from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead

Keith, not sure if you have been keeping up with everyone else's posts, but consider what is said in Posts #120 and #124. I'm now convinced Charity is correct in her interpretation.

God bless,
- H

 

[VictoryinJesus]

This is also plausible, Victory, and had I not read Charity's post I might have agreed with you. But the immediate context of v.12-14, when the same word is used in the Greek twice, suggests very strongly that Paul's message is what's being referred to throughout. :)

So many being looked at when you say immediate context of v12-14...which passage do you mean? Regarding “when the same word is used in the Greek twice, suggests very strongly that Paul's message is what's being referred to throughout. :)“ don’t disagree I think...as in not another gospel.

 

[Hidden In Him]

So many being looked at when you say immediate context of v12-14...which passage do you mean? Regarding “when the same word is used in the Greek twice, suggests very strongly that Paul's message is what's being referred to throughout. :)“ don’t disagree I think...as in not another gospel.

I know what you mean. I get lost myself.

2 Timothy 1:12-14.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I know what you mean. I get lost myself.

2 Timothy 1:12-14.

Still confused. Yes. “To give light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ" I’m sorry not understanding “But the immediate context of v.12-14, when the same word is used in the Greek twice, suggests very strongly that Paul's message is what's being referred to throughout. :)“ is it not Jesus Christ message?

 

[complete]

in no way disagreeing with you. I think it is beautiful and insightful what you have shared. So I’m not trying to muddy things but only sharing 1 Thessalonians 2:4-9 for consideration also. “But as we were allowed of God to be put in trust with the gospel, even so we speak; not as pleasing men, but God, which trieth our hearts. [5] For neither at any time used we flattering words, as ye know, nor a cloke of covetousness; God is witness: [6] Nor of men sought we glory, neither of you, nor yet of others, when we might have been burdensome, as the apostles of Christ. [7] But we were gentle among you, even as a nurse cherisheth her children: [8] So being affectionately desirous of you, we were willing to have imparted unto you, not the gospel of God only, but also our own souls, because YOU were dear unto us. [9] For ye remember, brethren, our labour and travail: for labouring night and day, because we would not be chargeable unto any of you, we preached unto you the gospel of God.

Consider closely “So being affectionately desirous of you, we were willing to have imparted unto you, not the gospel of God only, but also our own souls, because YOU were dear unto us.”

Affectionately desiring “not your things but You” we were willing to have imparted unto you ...not the gospel of God only ...but also our own souls ...BECAUSE you were dear to us Mark 8:35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.

Do agree with what you shared but also (imo) there is more there in “we were willing to have imparted unto you not the gospel of God only ...but also our own souls ...BECAUSE you were (that) dear unto us ...Paul’s seeing “whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel's, the same shall save it.”

Acts 4:32 And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul: neither said any of them that ought of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common.

Hello @VicroryinJesus,

Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I am glad that you have the joy of going to sleep with the word of God on your mind. How necessary it is to have the word of God dwelling in us richly, isn't it? For the Holy Spirit is able to use those moments of quiet, to bring to our minds those verses which He would have us consider.

I looked at 1 Thessalonians 2:4-9 that you quoted, and particularly verse 8 that you underlined:-

'So being affectionately desirous of you,
we were willing to have imparted unto you,
not the gospel of God only,
but also our own souls,
because ye were dear unto us.'
(1Thess. 2:8)

What warmth and affection emanates from these words of Paul: yes, it would appear that Paul and his fellow-workers would gladly have given themselves (their 'souls' or lives) to the Thessalonians, as a Father or as a nursing Mother would to their children (vv.11 & 7), such was the love of Christ which was in them for these people (Philippians 1:8). This passage in it's entirety portrays the difficulties that had to be overcome and the degree of effort that was expended by them, in the endeavour to impart the gospel of God to the Thessalonians.

This letter I believe, was one of the first Paul wrote, and it was years later that he wrote his last letter to Timothy that we were considering earlier. In His letter to the Thessalonian believers Paul relates his visit to them, when he had ministered the gospel of God to them (Romans 1:1-4), which they had believed and received to the saving of their souls.

In 2 Timothy 1:12-14, that we were looking at earlier, it was not the gospel of God that comprised 'the form of sound words' that was committed to Timothy, [ though that was the ground of truth that had saved him, and upon which he stood before God ]; No, the deposit of truth that was committed (ie., deposited) to Timothy and to God Himself (to keep or guard) by Paul, was that which we now have in the epistles to the Ephesians, Philippians and Colossians and in 1 & 2 Timothy and Titus. The deposit of truth that was being turned away from, along with Paul, by those in Asia (2 Timothy 1:15), that He had himself received by revelation of God (Ephesians 3:3). - God did 'keep' it! He did preserve it!

Praise His Holy Name!

Thank you
With love in Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I looked at 1 Thessalonians 2:4-9 that you quoted, and particularly verse 8 that you underlined:-

'So being affectionately desirous of you,
we were willing to have imparted unto you,
not the gospel of God only,
but also our own souls,
because ye were dear unto us.'
(1Thess. 2:8)

What warmth and affection emanates from these words of Paul: yes, it would appear that Paul and his fellow-workers would gladly have given themselves (their 'souls' or lives) to the Thessalonians, as a Father or as a nursing Mother would to their children (vv.11 & 7), such was the love of Christ which was in them for these people (Philippians 1:8). This passage in it's entirety portrays the difficulties that had to be overcome and the degree of effort that was expended by them, in the endeavour to impart the gospel of God to the Thessalonians.

so confused which makes it nearly impossible to respond. When I’m not even sure what I’m confused about nor can I put a finger on the difference you and Hidden seem to be saying is there (unless I’ve misunderstood). I notice your underlining “the gospel of God” which suggest your wanting attention there. I’m not sure what you are wanting me to see. What seems to be being said is there is not harmony there between the things the Lord taught and Paul’s keeping of those things taught ...but a division of Yea but not quite although like I said I’m not seeing it. You said: What warmth and affection emanates from these words of Paul: yes, it would appear that Paul and his fellow-workers would gladly have given themselves (their 'souls' or lives) to the Thessalonians, as a Father or as a nursing Mother would to their children (vv.11 & 7),
Are you saying this is not the gospel of God?
John 10:17-18 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again. [18] No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.


John 7:16-17 Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me. [17] If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.

This letter I believe, was one of the first Paul wrote, and it was years later that he wrote his last letter to Timothy that we were considering earlier. In His letter to the Thessalonian believers Paul relates his visit to them, when he had ministered the gospel of God to them (Romans 1:1-4), which they had believed and received to the saving of their souls.

Romans 1:1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,

But then “In 2 Timothy 1:12-14, that we were looking at earlier, it was not the gospel of God that comprised 'the form of sound words' that was committed to Timothy, [ though that was the ground of truth that had saved him, and upon which he stood before God ]; No, the deposit of truth that was committed (ie., deposited) to Timothy and to God Himself (to keep or guard) by Paul...”

so confused at “it was not the gospel of God that comprised 'the form of sound words' that was committed to Timothy”

confused because is the Revelation of Jesus Christ, not the gospel of God? Hebrews 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;

“That comprised ‘the form of sound words’ and the foundation the ground of truth that had saved him, and upon which he stood before God
...The deposit of truth that was being turned away from, along with Paul, by those in Asia (2 Timothy 1:15), that He had himself received by revelation of God (Ephesians 3:3). - God did 'keep' it! He did preserve it!”

 

[complete]

so confused which makes it nearly impossible to respond. When I’m not even sure what I’m confused about nor can I put a finger on the difference you and Hidden seem to be saying is there (unless I’ve misunderstood). I notice your underlining “the gospel of God” which suggest your wanting attention there. I’m not sure what you are wanting me to see. What seems to be being said is there is not harmony there between the things the Lord taught and Paul’s keeping of those things taught ...but a division of Yea but not quite although like I said I’m not seeing it. You said: What warmth and affection emanates from these words of Paul: yes, it would appear that Paul and his fellow-workers would gladly have given themselves (their 'souls' or lives) to the Thessalonians, as a Father or as a nursing Mother would to their children (vv.11 & 7),
Are you saying this is not the gospel of God?
John 10:17-18 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again. [18] No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.


John 7:16-17 Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me. [17] If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.

Romans 1:1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,

But then “In 2 Timothy 1:12-14, that we were looking at earlier, it was not the gospel of God that comprised 'the form of sound words' that was committed to Timothy, [ though that was the ground of truth that had saved him, and upon which he stood before God ]; No, the deposit of truth that was committed (ie., deposited) to Timothy and to God Himself (to keep or guard) by Paul...”

so confused at “it was not the gospel of God that comprised 'the form of sound words' that was committed to Timothy”

confused because is the Revelation of Jesus Christ, not the gospel of God? Hebrews 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;

“That comprised ‘the form of sound words’ and the foundation the ground of truth that had saved him, and upon which he stood before God
...The deposit of truth that was being turned away from, along with Paul, by those in Asia (2 Timothy 1:15), that He had himself received by revelation of God (Ephesians 3:3). - God did 'keep' it! He did preserve it!”

Hello @VictoryinHim

Forgive me, for I can see that I have indeed confused you, I am sorry.

I don't see how I can really rectify it, except to take away the underlining, and ask you to read it as it stands, without emphasis on anything in particular. If you find it still causes confusion, please lay it on one side, and don't trouble yourself about it, or attempt to respond to it, for you are God's workmanship and precious in His sight, and anything that causes you confusion, written by anyone, should be avoided.

I am so grateful for your posts, for in responding to them I have been truly blessed.

Thank you.
With my love to you, ViH,
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Hello @VictoryinHim

Forgive me, for I can see that I have indeed confused you, I am sorry.

Don’t take in on you. it is not your fault. I confuse myself.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Still confused. Yes. “To give light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ" I’m sorry not understanding “But the immediate context of v.12-14, when the same word is used in the Greek twice, suggests very strongly that Paul's message is what's being referred to throughout. :)“ is it not Jesus Christ message?

One and the same there. :)

 

[keithr]

Keith, not sure if you have been keeping up with everyone else's posts, but consider what is said in Posts #120 and #124. I'm now convinced Charity is correct in her interpretation.

How do you interpret (in bold), "But we have this treasure in clay vessels, that the exceeding greatness of the power may be of God, and not from ourselves"? You need to take it in the context of the whole of the preceding chapter (chapters and verses were invented hundreds of years after the Scriptures were completed, don't forget), for it's all part of one speech/subject. At the very least start from verse 7 of the previous chapter:

(2Co 3:7) But if the service of death, written engraved on stones, came with glory, so that the children of Israel could not look steadfastly on the face of Moses for the glory of his face, which was passing away;
(2Co 3:8) won’t service of the Spirit be with much more glory?
(2Co 3:9) For if the service of condemnation has glory, the service of righteousness exceeds much more in glory.
(2Co 3:10) For most certainly that which has been made glorious has not been made glorious in this respect, by reason of the glory that surpasses.
(2Co 3:11) For if that which passes away was with glory, much more that which remains is in glory.
(2Co 3:12) Having therefore such a hope, we use great boldness of speech,
(2Co 3:13) and not as Moses, who put a veil on his face, that the children of Israel wouldn’t look steadfastly on the end of that which was passing away.
(2Co 3:14) But their minds were hardened, for until this very day at the reading of the old covenant the same veil remains, because in Christ it passes away.
(2Co 3:15) But to this day, when Moses is read, a veil lies on their heart.
(2Co 3:16) But whenever one turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.
(2Co 3:17) Now the Lord is the Spirit and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.
(2Co 3:18) But we all, with unveiled face seeing the glory of the Lord as in a mirror, are transformed into the same image from glory to glory, even as from the Lord, the Spirit.
(2Co 4:1) Therefore seeing we have this ministry, even as we obtained mercy, we don’t faint.
(2Co 4:2) But we have renounced the hidden things of shame, not walking in craftiness, nor handling the word of God deceitfully; but by the manifestation of the truth commending ourselves to every man’s conscience in the sight of God.
(2Co 4:3) Even if our Good News is veiled, it is veiled in those who are dying;
(2Co 4:4) in whom the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelieving, that the light of the Good News of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should not dawn on them.
(2Co 4:5) For we don’t preach ourselves, but Christ Jesus as Lord, and ourselves as your servants for Jesus’ sake;
(2Co 4:6) seeing it is God who said, “Light will shine out of darkness,” who has shone in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.
(2Co 4:7) But we have this treasure in clay vessels, that the exceeding greatness of the power may be of God, and not from ourselves.

So we are transformed into the same image of the glory of the Lord - as it shines in his face so it would shine in our (new creature's) face. But it is hidden in a clay vessel (human body) so that the greatness of the power of the Gospel may be seen to be of God and not from us.

 

[marks]

You know what. This makes a strong case. :)

The Received Text actually uses a different word in v.14, but all the better texts repeat the use of paratheke, which all of a sudden has me seeing things differently. I think you've both won your argument. :) I would add that the better translation would actually be "that which I have entrusted unto Him," which Paul then likewise entrusted to Timothy to preserve faithfully.

Thanks for sharing, Charity. I appreciate that. As stated, I've never fully looked into this specific question before, and didn't have a complete witness about it in my spirit. This, however, I do.

God bless!

So between @Hidden In Him , @charity , and @VictoryinJesus , now I'm going back and forth on this.

I still wonder though that Paul, in saying what he's committed to God, that being his eternal life, or himself, if this is meant to refer to Paul's confidence in the outcome of the words he's committed to Timothy.

I'll have to read through this again . . .

Much love!

 

[complete]

So between @Hidden In Him , @charity , and @VictoryinJesus , now I'm going
I still wonder though that Paul, in saying what he to God, that being his eternal life, or himself, if this is meant to refer to Paul's confidence in the outcome of the words he's committed to Timothy.

I'll have to read through this again . . .

Much love!

Hi @marks

I believe it to be the deposit of truth, which was revealed to Paul by God, which He is committing to God to guard, for it is being turned away from as he is. He has committed it also to Timothy to make known 'to faithful men', and Timothy is also urged to 'keep' it. For Paul as steward of this truth of God was anxious that it should not be buried beneath the division and strife of tongues, that was in evidence all around him in the assemblies in relation to it. The wolves had entered and were causing havoc among the redeemed in his care, as he had told them they would, and there was internal opposition too, from the perverse among them.

It has only within relatively recent times been finding the light of day again, so I can understand his anxiety.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[marks]

1 Corinthians 9:16-17
16) For though I preach the gospel, I have nothing to glory of: for necessity is laid upon me; yea, woe is unto me, if I preach not the gospel!
17) For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.

I'm not so sure that it's the Gospel that Paul committed to God.

It really seems to me that the Gospel was committed to Paul, and he was distributing it.

I have this idea that we are to care for what others need, and let God care for us, and it seems to me that I can commit myself to Him, and know that He will keep me, as I then forget about myself and do what I'm here to do.

I can commit myself to His to care for, knowing that he will keep me safe to salvation to be revealed in that day.

Thoughts?

Much love!

 

[marks]

Of course the reality is, Paul didn't specify. But it just makes no sense to me that Paul would "commit the truth of the Gospel" to God, considering that God had committed it to Paul.

Much love!

 

[complete]

1 Corinthians 9:16-17
16) For though I preach the gospel, I have nothing to glory of: for necessity is laid upon me; yea, woe is unto me, if I preach not the gospel!
17) For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.

I'm not so sure that it's the Gospel that Paul committed to God.

It really seems to me that the Gospel was committed to Paul, and he was distributing it.

I have this idea that we are to care for what others need, and let God care for us, and it seems to me that I can commit myself to Him, and know that He will keep me, as I then forget about myself and do what I'm here to do.

I can commit myself to His to care for, knowing that he will keep me safe to salvation to be revealed in that day.

Thoughts?

Much love!

Hello again, @marks,

No, it is not the Gospel of salvation, though it is very 'good news'. It was a word for believers. It is the deposit of truth committed by God to Paul by revelation, and which he was instructed and empowered to impart to the believers in His care. It is the truth that we now have in the epistles written from prison, (Eph. Phil, Col, 1 & 2 Tim, Titus and Philemon). Paul was committing (or depositing) it to God for safekeeping I believe, in the light of the fact that it was not being received; for as he tells Timothy, that all in Asia had turned away from Him, (and that would have included the message he was administering) of which Ephesus, Philippi and Colossi formed a part. Paul had committed this 'form of sound words' to Timothy at Ephesus, and instructed that he should entrust it to faithful men. For Paul would soon have his life taken away from Him, and he would not be able therefore to continue the ministry.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris