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HI Steve, I rephrased the question because I wanted to stay on par with Stone. To answer your question, no, I don't think heaven is the eternal abode of the Christian. As I said, I don't see anything in Scripture that teaches Christians go to heaven, at any time. Granted there are passages in...

Hi Stone, I didn't misunderstand you, I'm wondering where Scripture teaches that.

Hi Stone, But going to God doesn't necessitate going to heaven. If God is omnipresent then wherever one goes at death they are with God. David said, if I make my bed in Hades, you (God) are there.

But that doesn't necessitate that they went to heaven. I know what understood means. The question is, understood by who? And why?

Hi Steve, Where does Scripture teach that Christians go to heaven when they die? You've given me a few passages of Scripture that you believe teach this yet none of them state this. The twenty four elders in Revelation is according to John a future event. Those under the altar are according to...

Hi Stone, How is returned understood in the passage when it doesn't appear in the original language? Jesus had been to the earth prior to His words in John 3:13, however, He said no man other than Himself had gone into heaven. KJV John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that...

How do they have glorified bodies? Do you believe the resurrection has taken place? The word returned is not in the greek text. BGT John 3:13 êáὶ ïὐäåὶò ἀíáâέâçêåí åἰò ôὸí ïὐñáíὸí åἰ ìὴ ὁ ἐê ôïῦ ïὐñáíïῦ êáôáâάò, ὁ õἱὸò ôïῦ ἀíèñώðïõ. (Joh 3:13 BGT)

HI Steve, The Kingdom of Heaven is the kingdom that comes from heaven, it is Christ's kingdom. When Jesus was on earth He say to people, the kingdom of God has come near to you. In Revelation we find John recording the holy city descending from heaven and saying that God will dwell with men...

Hi Stone, I think this is to me? This doesn't say anyone goes to heaven, that's drawn from inference. However, one doesn't need to be in heaven to be present with the Lord, David said, speaking of the Lord, if I make my bed in Hades you are there. KJV Psalm 139:8 If I ascend up into heaven...

I agree! I don't even know why English Bibles use the Masoretic text anymore. If Jesus and the Apostles used the Septuagint, it seems we should too.

Hades, the abode of the dead. I can't find anything in Scripture that teaches Christians go to heaven. I'm not following you here.

I don't believe it's where Christians go so my answer would be nothing.

How are our bodies temporary dwellings when they are going to raised in the resurrection? How can you say our bodies are not who we are when the Scriptures clearly say that God breathed into Adam? It was the body that He breathed into. If you’re talking about spiritual death, I don’t buy that...

I thought that was what you were saying.

Hi Surf, Actually, those God foreknew in Romans were the Jews. Paul makes that clear in chapter 11. KJV Romans 11:1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin. 2 God hath not cast away his people which he...

Hi Stone, In John 3:16 John uses the present tense of believes. Literally it reads the one who "is" (present tense) believing shall not perish. It doesn't speak to whether that belief can be rejected.

I meant I didn't understand your post.

Hi Angelina, I'm a bit confused. You say we don't die, but then say our bodies die. Genesis records that man is a body and a spirit which becomes a living soul. 7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living...

I still don't see how this shows the children are now in possession of eternal life. Yes, the phrase you pointed out, 'so also are those who are heavenly' is present tense. Contextually it appears to contrasted to the earthly. In this context it seems it's a reference to Adam who is now dead...

That brings us back to the first question. If Christians have eternal life now why do they die? I don't think we have it yet.