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  1. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    By what authority to you equate Jesus is the word in John 1:14? John 1:1? If so, then by what authority do you equate Jesus with the word in John 1:1? You can't assign one word for another in one verse by doing the same in some other verse. Was Jesus not a perfect image of God? Sure he was...
  2. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    Admittedly, there are in fact some verses that could be taken in a Trinitarian way. Perhaps Titus 2:13 is an example. However, these verses can also be taken in a non-Trinitarian way. How to tell which is which? Compare these somewhat unclear verses with the many clear verses on the same...
  3. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    It seems that for Trinitarians history means nothing. But that doesn't change history! We have Philo to thank (more like blame) for "homoousiosm," without which the trinity would be seen for what it is; illogical, meaningless, nonsense. I think you already pointed out that Philo was a Jewish...
  4. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    You make some good points and raise some interesting questions. While "pros" sometimes can be translated as "with," it's usual meaning indicates motion towards an object. It points to or refers to the object, in the case of John 1:1, it points to or refers to God. The Greek in John 1:1 is...
  5. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    I don't think APAK or JohnPaul introduced Greek philosophy into the scriptures. That would actually have been the "church fathers," beginning with Philo, whose express aim was to harmonize the scriptures with Greek philosophy. All done quote some time before APAK or JohnPaul hit the scene...
  6. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    Well, you still have the problem of someone being "with" someone makes two people, or in this case, two gods. Even Trinitarian scholars admit that is a huge problem. We also see Jesus talking to his Father, which again indicates two people, or in this case supposedly two gods. How to solve it...
  7. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    People can only go as far as they are taught. Trinitarians are taught a long standing, 2,000+ years which is hard for humans in our fallen world to shake. God certainly knows that and I don't see Trinitarians getting "punishment" per say, but I do think they miss our on the greatness of God for...
  8. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    You are correct in saying the word "word" is used in both John and Luke, but in both cases it's "word" (logos), not "Jesus." To get the Bible message we must read what's written, free from preconceptions that may not be scriptural. You can't arbitrarily assign a meaning of a word (in this case...
  9. Rich R

    Who is Jesus to a Non-Trinitarian?

    Good point. That's exactly what the heresy of Docetism says, i.e., Jesus only "appeared" to be human. He wasn't a "real" human." Docetism - Wikipedia
  10. Rich R

    Who is Jesus to a Non-Trinitarian?

    Not all unitarians think that John 1:1 says Jesus is, "a god." At least not me. According to Greek Grammar John 1:1c could be read to say that the "word" was God Himself ("...and the word was God"). Since we know from many other verses that only the Father is God, John 1:1 says nothing about...
  11. Rich R

    Who is Jesus to a Non-Trinitarian?

    When you get down to the nuts and bolts of the matter, I would say that by and large you have a very good point. As long as we are saved by faith, born again children of God, we will someday know the truth and nothing but the truth. Guaranteed! But I'm not sure about, "The rest of the stuff is...
  12. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    You don't seem to understand much of what I say. How in the world you have me saying Jesus is a lunatic is beyond me.
  13. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    Whatever you think Jesus thought about his relationship with God, we are to think thing the same (verse 5). If Jesus thought he was God, then so should we?
  14. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    Well, there are not hundreds of verses that preclude the donkey from talking, nor a virgin birth. The trinity is another story.
  15. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    I always understood that their are those who deny the Trinity but still claim Jesus to be God, but that's beside the point. I'm just pointing out that Philippians does not say, "Who being God, thought it not robbery to be God." I also said that those who do believe the trinity must resort to...
  16. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    Here's what I said, "Setting aside all the arguments made for Philippians, one thing it certainly does NOT say is, "who, being God, thought it not robbery to be God." Reading into the text that which is clearly not their was a specialty of the Gnostics. The claim of many is that...
  17. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    Who told you that? I'd do like the Bereans did in Acts 17 and search the scriptures to see if what they told you is true or not. For what it's worth, I can tell you that what they told you is absolutely false. According to the scriptures, you can learn even the deep things of God. Eph...
  18. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    Setting aside all the arguments made for Philippians, one thing it certainly does NOT say is, "who, being God, thought it not robbery to be God." Reading into the text that which is clearly not their was a specialty of the Gnostics. The claim of many is that Non-trinitarians do not have the...
  19. Rich R

    John 1:1 - Jesus is the Father or he's not the one true God?

    Thanks for the invite, but I haven't been outside of San Diego County for 20 years. I was a professional Pilot and traveled all over the world for many years. I was always gone. Once I retired, I just wanted to stay put. Kind of weird I suppose, but that's where I'm at as of now. Having said...