“...and shall eat her flesh,”

[CoreIssue]

To what purpose did you do your study? To what end? What was your motive? Did you make your judgement on the basis of what your read of her works, or on the basis of what others said of her works? And what particular works of hers did you find so cultist, and why?

I studied to learn as I have done many religions, denominations, cults etc.

Read for yourself. Being cult is self evident.

Who was Ellen G. White?

Bible Truth Versus Adventist Truth - Ellen White

 

[charity]

Revelation 17:15-18
[15] And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues. [16] And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire. [17] For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled. [18] And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.

How do they eat her flesh?

'And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast,
these shall hate the whore,
and shall make her desolate and naked,
and shall eat her flesh,
and burn her with fire.'

Hello @VictoryinJesus,

I think it simply means to 'consume' this city called 'Babylon', and to destroy it utterly.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[VictoryinJesus]

'And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast,
these shall hate the whore,
and shall make her desolate and naked,
and shall eat her flesh,
and burn her with fire.'

Hello @VictoryinJesus,

I think it simply means to 'consume' this city called 'Babylon', and to destroy it utterly.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

I agree, but also agree with others that said (I paraphrase here) to eat of her flesh is to eat out of her hand, her works, her ways, her enticements, her desires, and her enchantments...it is kind of unclear who is consuming(devouring) who? Are they devouring her or are those eating of her flesh the ones being devoured(consumed)? As in: Galatians 5:15 But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another. (Devouring each other’s flesh?).

Is it safe to say most here do not take it literal? So why take the “...and burn her with fire” literal?

Also Agree with others who connected it to Christ saying we must eat of “His” flesh. Matthew 11:29 [29] Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. —instead of “...and shall eat of her flesh.”

 

[charity]

I agree, but also agree with others that said (I paraphrase here) to eat of her flesh is to eat out of her hand, her works, her ways, her enticements, her desires, and her enchantments...it is kind of unclear who is consuming(devouring) who? Are they devouring her or are those eating of her flesh the ones being devoured(consumed)? As in: Galatians 5:15 But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another. (Devouring each other’s flesh?).

Is it safe to say most here do not take it literal? So why take the “...and burn her with fire” literal?

Agree with Others who connected it to Christ saying we must eat of His flesh.
Matthew 11:29 [29] Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. —instead of “...and shall eat of her flesh.”

Hi there, @VictoryinJesus,

The context of the reference in Revelation was one of destruction, and it refers to a city, so it cannot be taken literally. It must mean to consume or destroy utterly. In regard to the word of the Lord concerning Himself, it has quite a different context, such as John 6:51, 54-56: and it's meaning is to take of Him, and receive of Him, His life, His doctrine, Himself.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Hi there, @VictoryinJesus,

The context of the reference in Revelation was one of destruction, and it refers to a city, so it cannot be taken literally. It must mean to consume or destroy utterly. In regard to the word of the Lord concerning Himself, it has quite a different context, such as John 6:51, 34, 55, 56.
and it's meaning is to take of Him, and receive of Him, His life, His doctrine, Himself.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

Other verses can’t be ignored though. How often God speaks of unclean flesh. “And they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar.” (1 Corinthians 9:13-14. “...they that preach the gospel should live of the gospel.”

Matthew 15:11
[11] Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.

“...he cannot be partakers of the Lord’s table, and the table of devils.”
“Be not ye therefore partakers with them.”
(Hebrews 12:10) “...that we might be partakers of his holiness.”
Revelation 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

You cannot eat of His flesh and drink of His blood, and also continue to eat of her flesh. 1 Corinthians 11:27-30 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. [28] But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. [29] For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body. [30] For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Isaiah 49:26
[26] And I will feed them that oppress thee with their own flesh; and they shall be drunken with their own blood, as with sweet wine: and all flesh shall know that I the Lord am thy Saviour and thy Redeemer, the mighty One of Jacob.

 

[charity]

Other verses can’t be ignored though. How often God speaks of unclean flesh. “And they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar.” (1 Corinthians 9:13-14. “...they that preach the gospel should live of the gospel.”

Matthew 15:11
[11] Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.

“...he cannot be partakers of the Lord’s table, and the table of devils.”
“Be not ye therefore partakers with them.”
(Hebrews 12:10) “...that we might be partakers of his holiness.”
Revelation 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

You cannot eat of His flesh and drink of His blood, and also continue to eat of her flesh. 1 Corinthians 11:27-30 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. [28] But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. [29] For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body. [30] For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.

Hello @VictoryinJesus,

With respect, what has the quotation of these verses done to further your understanding regarding the verse in Revelation 17:16, which was your reason for initially enquiring as to the meaning of the words, 'and shall eat her flesh'.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Hello @VictoryinJesus,

With respect, what has the quotation of these verses done to further your understanding regarding the verse in Revelation 17:16, which was your reason for initially enquiring as to the meaning of the words, 'and shall eat her flesh'.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

honestly? Because I wonder every day...am I cursed or am I blessed? That might be horrible to admit. But sometimes it seems God is against me and my family rather than for us. Most days I know that is not true. I read the Word. I hear it. But am I deceived? So I read, Deuteronomy 29:19
[19] And it come to pass, when he heareth the words of this curse, that he bless himself in his heart, saying, I shall have peace, though I walk in the imagination of mine heart, to add drunkenness to thirst:

And I ask: is that me? Do I walk in the imagination of my heart? adding drunkenness to thirst. Because I still thirst and I don’t know why...

I’m sure you will say that is only for Israel but He says all the word is profitable for correction.

In regard to why the OP? I want to know whose flesh I am eating.

 

[quietthinker]

honestly? Because I wonder every day...am I cursed or am I blessed? That might be horrible to admit. But sometimes it seems God is against me and my family rather than for us. Most days I know that is not true. I read the Word. I hear it. But am I deceived? So I read, Deuteronomy 29:19
[19] And it come to pass, when he heareth the words of this curse, that he bless himself in his heart, saying, I shall have peace, though I walk in the imagination of mine heart, to add drunkenness to thirst:

And I ask: is that me? Do I walk in the imagination of my heart? adding drunkenness to thirst. Because I still thirst and I don’t know why...

I’m sure you will say that is only for Israel but He says all the word is profitable for correction.

In regard to why the OP? I want to know whose flesh I am eating.

I have found self doubt not such a bad thing ViJ. It comes very naturally to me to think that I'm above it and that for various reasons.
Recognising the different voices is helpful when I don't forget. They are often accusing which I have come to understand are not mine.
The promise is, I will never leave you or forsake you. This has greater weight than the accusing voices
Strange isn't it how the pendulum swings from thinking I'm hopeless to thinking I'm above it and that in short spacing.

For those who have the courage to be honest here about their brokenness I gain much encouragement and identification. It is like Paul says, when I am weak then I am strong.
When I get the opportunity which is not that often because of distance I frequent 12 step meetings. These are encouraging. In fact many of the participants have no idea the power for good they share in telling their stories, if they did pride would possibly destroy it.

 

[ScottA]

Revelation 17:15-18
[15] And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues. [16] And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire. [17] For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled. [18] And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.

How do they eat her flesh?

This is allegory. To "eat" means "to feed upon" or "devour", which is the death of them, fulfilling the judgement of God: "once to die."

 

[brakelite]

I studied to learn as I have done many religions, denominations, cults etc.

Read for yourself. Being cult is self evident.

Who was Ellen G. White?

Bible Truth Versus Adventist Truth - Ellen White

So got questions is your authority. Okay. So reading got questions you call personal study, and thus your conclusion becomes self evident?

 

[charity]

honestly? Because I wonder every day...am I cursed or am I blessed? That might be horrible to admit. But sometimes it seems God is against me and my family rather than for us. Most days I know that is not true. I read the Word. I hear it. But am I deceived? So I read, Deuteronomy 29:19
[19] And it come to pass, when he heareth the words of this curse, that he bless himself in his heart, saying, I shall have peace, though I walk in the imagination of mine heart, to add drunkenness to thirst:

And I ask: is that me? Do I walk in the imagination of my heart? adding drunkenness to thirst. Because I still thirst and I don’t know why...

I’m sure you will say that is only for Israel but He says all the word is profitable for correction.

Hello @VictoryinJesus,

* There is no possibility of you being cursed: and you have, in Christ Jesus, been wondrously blessed; but unlike the children of Israel who were blessed 'in basket and store', or in regard to the substance of their earthly lives: with good harvests etc., (Deut. 28:5 &17): we have been blessed with every blessing that is spiritual (Ephesians 1:3). In regard to our circumstances, 'in the natural', we have to simply live it as best we can, like everyone else: however, the advantage we have, as believers in the Lord Jesus Christ, is that we have open access to God, in Christ, and a supply of strength, comfort and assurance that only He can give, haven't we?

In regard to why the OP? I want to know whose flesh I am eating.

* You have eaten of Christ, in taking into your heart, and believing, the gospel concerning Him: and continue to feast of Him, in taking and digesting His written Word, by His Spirit. If you thirst - praise God! For He alone can satisfy that thirst, and will: for He only is the fountain of living water. It is the unbeliever who has no thirst, and does not realise his need.

* Regarding Deuteronomy 29:19, look at it within it's context, and you will see that the state of mind of that man, can never be said to be yours: for he was refusing to acknowledge the voice of God, whereas you are open to Him, and confess your need.

I wrote quite another response, which I include below, though it seems a bit bizarre to sent both, something within it may be useful to you.

With love in Christ Jesus
Chris
-----------------------------------

Hello @VictoryinJesus,

Thank you for the privilege of being party to your thoughts. I saw your entry last night when I checked my phone before going to sleep, but by that time the internet link was switched off, and I was unable to respond straight away. I woke at around 5.0am, and thought about what you had said, and prayed for you. This experience is not unique to you, I have had times like this too.

* My thoughts were, in regard to Deut. 29:19: that you are too close to the page, and can't see the context, because the words are in the way. You need to zoom out, or stand back. This applies to your situation in life too, and your family, take time to 'zoom-out', or 'stand-back' and take your eyes off yourself, and your confusion of thought, and see yourself as God sees you, in Christ Jesus. The two things that Paul was anxious that the Colossian believers should have (Col.2:2-9) , was assurance and confidence, and this is what the enemy of our souls seeks to destroy, doesn't he?

* Regarding our circumstances in life and our family situation, I remembered a friend of mine, who is sadly no longer with us, she was very much older than myself, and died in her nineties. She loved the Lord, and regarding our lot in life, she would say, 'In the natural, we just have to get on with things', in other words being a believer is not going to change circumstances, and we have to simply live our lives as best we can, the same as everyone else: the only difference being that we have the support and encouragement of the knowledge of a loving God and Saviour. I am sure I am not saying anything that you yourself don't know, and can't acknowledge.

* Psalm 73 and 77 came to mind as I sat in the wee small hours thinking of you, and the words of Asaph, in which he looks within, and without, and it is not until he finally comes before God that peace comes, as he sees things through God's eyes.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

Two for the price of one, what a bargain!!

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Hello @VictoryinJesus,

* There is no possibility of you being cursed: and you have, in Christ Jesus, been wondrously blessed; but unlike the children of Israel who were blessed 'in basket and store', or in regard to the substance of their earthy lives, with good harvests etc., (Deut. 28:5 &17) we have been blessed with every blessing that is spiritual (Ephesians 1:3). In regard to our circumstances, 'in the natural', we have to simply live it as best we can, like everyone else: the advantage we have, as believers in the Lord Jesus Christ, is that we have open access to God, in Christ, and a supply of strength, comfort and assurance that only He can give.

* You have eaten of Christ, in taking into your heart and believing the gospel concerning Him: and continue to feast of Him, in taking and digesting His written Word, by His Spirit. If you thirst - praise God! For He alone can satisfy that thirst, and will, for He only is the fountain of living water. It is the unbeliever who has no thirst, and does not realize his need.

* Regarding Deuteronomy 29:19, look at it within it's context, and you will see that the state of mind of that man, can never be said to be yours: for he was refusing to acknowledge the voice of God, whereas you are open to Him, and confess your need.

I wrote quite another response, which I include below, though it seems a bit bizarre to sent both, something within it may be useful to you.

With love in Christ Jesus
Chris
-----------------------------------

Hello @VictoryinJesus,

Thank you for the privilege of being party to your thoughts. I saw your entry last night when I checked my phone before going to sleep, but by that time the internet link was switched off, and I was unable to respond straight away. I woke at around 5.0am, and thought about what you had said, and prayed for you. This experience is not unique to you, I have had times like this too.

* My thoughts were, in regard to Deut. 29:19: that you are too close to the page, and can't see the context, because the words are in the way. You need to zoom out, or stand back. This applies to your situation in life too, and your family, take time to 'zoom-out', or 'stand-back' and take your eyes off yourself, and your confusion of thought, and see yourself as God sees you, in Christ Jesus. The two things that Paul was anxious that the Colossian believers should have (Col.2:2-9) , was assurance and confidence, and this is what the enemy of our souls seeks to destroy, doesn't he?

* Regarding our circumstances in life and our family situation, I remembered a friend of mine, who is sadly no longer with us, she was very much older than myself, and died in her nineties. She loved the Lord, and regarding our lot in life, she would say, 'In the natural, we just have to get on with things', in other words being a believer is not going to change circumstances, and we have to simply live our lives as best we can, the same as everyone else: the only difference being that we have the support and encouragement of the knowledge of a loving God and Saviour. I am sure I am not saying anything that you yourself don't know, and can't acknowledge.

* Psalm 73 and 77 came to mind as I sat in the wee small hours thinking of you, and the words of Asaph, in which he looks within, and without, and it is not until he finally comes before God that peace comes, as he sees things through God's eyes.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

Two for the price of one, what a bargain!!

Thank you for the encouragement. I’m sorry it took me so long to respond ...been reading the Psalms you recommended; So beautiful and comforting.

* There is no possibility of you being cursed: and you have, in Christ Jesus, been wondrously blessed; but unlike the children of Israel who were blessed 'in basket and store', or in regard to the substance of their earthy lives, with good harvests etc., (Deut. 28:5 &17) we have been blessed with every blessing that is spiritual (Ephesians 1:3).

Agree and can see this also. Which is greater? To be healed physically in a moment only to still decay, or to be healed (restored) to God and made whole completely. It is hard because we sometimes don’t see with our eye all the Spiritual blessings like they who were blessed ‘in basket and store’”...but the Spiritual blessings are far greater than the physical abundance.

 

[bbyrd009]

Do I walk in the imagination of my heart? adding drunkenness to thirst. Because I still thirst and I don’t know why...

nice imo, keep seeking here and you will be finding. Define this "I" that thirsts and get rid of that guy imo; his thirsts will never be satisfied, etc. i could point out how completely spoiled we are here in the West or something maybe, but then someone would mention Poor People i guess. As if Rich Ppl were not thirsty for the same thing

 

[bbyrd009]

I’m sure you will say that is only for Israel but He says all the word is profitable for correction.

ty

 

[charity]

Thank you for the encouragement. I’m sorry it took me so long to respond ...been reading the Psalms you recommended; So beautiful and comforting.

Agree and can see this also. Which is greater? To be healed physically in a moment only to still decay, or to be healed (restored) to God and made whole completely. It is hard because we sometimes don’t see with our eye all the Spiritual blessings like they who were blessed ‘in basket and store’”...but the Spiritual blessings are far greater than the physical abundance.

'And He said unto me,
"My grace is sufficient for thee:
.. for My strength is made perfect in weakness."
Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities,
.. that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
.... Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities,
...... in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake:
........ for when I am weak, then am I strong.'
(2 Corinthians 12:9)

Hello @VictoryinJesus,

I am glad you have responded, for I wondered if I had perhaps said the wrong thing.

Yes, our blessings are spiritual, but they are ALL spiritual blessings, all will be ours in Christ Jesus, not just a part. Which is wonderful, isn't it? Yet, I know that the Lord meets my needs, not necessarily my wants (Ha!), but my needs: for He knows my feeble frame, He knows that I am but dust.

Looking back on my life, I see God's hand at work, and acknowledge that He has been the provider every step of the way. Though at the time, I have not been conscious of it. As that is the case, I should be anxious for nothing, now: and should be able to trust Him to deal with every eventuality; but I do get anxious, and I do get unnecessarily depressed about seemingly impossible situations within the lives of my family members. Yet they are on a journey as I have been: they are being tested and tried, as I have been; with one purpose, and that is that our faith may be strengthened and our inner man made strong to receive the presence of the indwelling of Christ in our hearts; that we may be rooted and grounded in love. For perfect love casts all fear, and His love for us is indeed perfect. Praise His Holy Name!

'That He would grant you,
.. according to the riches of His glory,
.... to be strengthened with might by His Spirit in the inner man;
...... That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith;
........ that ye, being rooted and grounded in love,
.......... May be able to comprehend with all saints
............ what is the breadth, and length, and depth, and height;
And to know the love of Christ,
.. which passeth knowledge,
.... that ye might be filled
...... with all the fulness of God.'
(Ephesians 3:16-19)

Praise His Holy Name!

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[charity]

'Eat of Him' - How?

* By knowing and acknowledging that the sacrificial work of God, in Christ, is sufficient for us, by His grace: that His work is a finished work, in both word and deed. That we are, in Him, indeed 'holy and without blame' before the Father: for 'our sins have been forgiven us'; and we 'have been redeemed' by the outpouring of the life of the Lord Jesus Christ unto death for us, that we might live. That we have been given the spirit of Sonship whereby we can call the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, 'Father'. That we have been 'accepted in the Beloved', made 'complete in Him', and 'made meet to partake of the inheritance of the saints in light'.

We have been brought 'out of darkness into light', out from under the law and dominion of sin and death,' into the law of the spirit of life which is in Christ Jesus'. We have 'the promise of life in Christ Jesus', and 'sin shall no longer have dominion over us'.

* How wonderful is that!!
* We can drink deep, and eat and be satisfied, filled with all he fulness of God in Christ Jesus.

Praise God!

In Christ Jesus
Chris

Ephesians 1; Colossians 2:10; Romans 8:2 & 15;
1 Peter 2:9; 2 Corinthians 4:6; Colossians 1:12;
John 7:37; John 7:38; Rev.21:6 - in their context.

 

[bbyrd009]

so then we read an image of an ideal, and then include ourselves in it arbitrarily, or via some means anyway, and then we are doing God's will, bada-bing? hmm

 

[bbyrd009]

for 'our sins have been forgiven us';

i mean, so have the world's right, so wadr who is this "we" and "our" do you think?
View attachment 4497

 

[Hidden In Him]

The language is the same as when Jesus said 'Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me, and I in them". John 6:56
Its principle is ingesting Jesus's reality ie, values, priorities, objectives, purpose.
Scripture must be used to interpret scripture. This case is clear.

Yes Quiet, but the Right scriptures must be used to interpret scriptures, and that's just a twisted mess IMO, LoL. Jesus was the word made flesh and His words are Spirit and truth. Hence to eat His flesh was to receive His Spirit through His word. It has nothing to do with "values, priorities, objectives and purposes." That's just something your denomination cooked up to fit their "paradigm."