2 Thessalonians 2:7

  • Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Elihoenai

Member
Mar 2, 2020
161
16
18
London, England
Faith
Christian
Country
United Kingdom
I mean "keep it simple", Mystery Babylon is being exposed.

We perceive ourselves as the hallmark of Simplicity.

You, @logabe, appear to be afraid and/or a counterfeit fooling many people. I asked you a Powerful and Plain question that you failed to answer.

The Question:
Are Rome, Venice, Washington, London and Switzerland centres of Dark Satanic Power?
 

logabe

Active Member
Aug 28, 2008
880
47
28
66
We perceive ourselves as the hallmark of Simplicity.

You, @logabe, appear to be afraid and/or a counterfeit fooling many people. I asked you a Powerful and Plain question that you failed to answer.

The Question:
Are Rome, Venice, Washington, London and Switzerland centres of Dark Satanic Power?

Yes... and they all answer to Jesus the Christ!!!

Logabe
 

Elihoenai

Member
Mar 2, 2020
161
16
18
London, England
Faith
Christian
Country
United Kingdom
Yes... and they all answer to Jesus the Christ!!!

Logabe

Matthew 28:18 King James Version (KJV)

18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.


Amen!!!

All Power is given to Yeshua Messiah/Jesus Christ in heaven and in earth.
 
  • Like
Reactions: logabe

logabe

Active Member
Aug 28, 2008
880
47
28
66
So we are not supposed to support people?

We support every nation in need no matter who it is

What many Christians have been doing is giving Jews the support to come back to Jerusalem to be
destroyed (Jeremiah 19:10-11). So in essence, they would be supporting them by not allowing them
to go back to Jerusalem with their support.

If we believe that Jeremiah's prophecy will come to pass why should we want people in harms way?

Jesus told the people in Jerusalem to go to the mountains when they seen the armies surrounding the
city of Jerusalem. The ones that listened were spared, but the ones that were patriotic died when the
Romans destroyed Jerusalem in 70 A.D. to 73 A.D.

My point is, we should love them enough to tell them the truth.

Logabe
 

Eternally Grateful

Well-Known Member
Feb 27, 2020
14,470
8,189
113
58
Columbus, ohio
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
What many Christians have been doing is giving Jews the support to come back to Jerusalem to be
destroyed (Jeremiah 19:10-11). So in essence, they would be supporting them by not allowing them
to go back to Jerusalem with their support.

If we believe that Jeremiah's prophecy will come to pass why should we want people in harms way?

Jesus told the people in Jerusalem to go to the mountains when they seen the armies surrounding the
city of Jerusalem. The ones that listened were spared, but the ones that were patriotic died when the
Romans destroyed Jerusalem in 70 A.D. to 73 A.D.

My point is, we should love them enough to tell them the truth.

Logabe
I agree, we should give the truth

But your wrong about being destroyed

god said he will protect the woman, not destroy her
 

logabe

Active Member
Aug 28, 2008
880
47
28
66
I agree, we should give the truth

But your wrong about being destroyed

god said he will protect the woman, not destroy her


God said, "cast out the bond woman and her son; for the son of the bond woman shall not be heir
with the son of the free woman. What does that mean?

Both Sarah and Hagar were wives of Abraham. Paul said that they were an allegory of the New and Old Covenants.
Sarah represented the New Jerusalem and Hagar represents the old Jerusalem that we see today. The New City of
Jerusalem is coming down from God to whosoever will accept it. The old Jerusalem represent the flesh or the thought
that if you are a Jew you are automatically God's chosen people. But Paul said in Romans 2:28-29 that a real Jew isn't
one outwardly, but a real Jew is one inwardly. We become spiritual Jews when we accept the King of the Jews "Jesus Christ",
that is the New Covenant that God has presented to everyone that believes even genealogical Jews. Everyone has to accept
Jesus Christ in order to be an inheritor of the New Covenant.

Hagar was a bond woman (slave) and she wasn't free. When we believe that God is going back to the old Jerusalem to set
up animal sacrifices in the Tabernacles Age, we are disqualifying ourselves of the 1st resurrection (Rev. 20:4-6) also (Hebrews
11:36).

So why would we support a nation that God left and said He would do old Jerusalem just like He done Shiloh (Jeremiah
7:12-15). What did he do to Shiloh? His Spirit left Shiloh and never returned and His Spirit left Jerusalem and will never
return. In Jeremiah 26:6 it says,

26 then I will make this house like Shiloh, and this city I will make
a curse to all the nations of the earth.” ’ ”

Logabe
 

Eternally Grateful

Well-Known Member
Feb 27, 2020
14,470
8,189
113
58
Columbus, ohio
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
God said, "cast out the bond woman and her son; for the son of the bond woman shall not be heir
with the son of the free woman. What does that mean?

Both Sarah and Hagar were wives of Abraham. Paul said that they were an allegory of the New and Old Covenants.
Sarah represented the New Jerusalem and Hagar represents the old Jerusalem that we see today. The New City of
Jerusalem is coming down from God to whosoever will accept it. The old Jerusalem represent the flesh or the thought
that if you are a Jew you are automatically God's chosen people. But Paul said in Romans 2:28-29 that a real Jew isn't
one outwardly, but a real Jew is one inwardly. We become spiritual Jews when we accept the King of the Jews "Jesus Christ",
that is the New Covenant that God has presented to everyone that believes even genealogical Jews. Everyone has to accept
Jesus Christ in order to be an inheritor of the New Covenant.

Hagar was a bond woman (slave) and she wasn't free. When we believe that God is going back to the old Jerusalem to set
up animal sacrifices in the Tabernacles Age, we are disqualifying ourselves of the 1st resurrection (Rev. 20:4-6) also (Hebrews
11:36).

So why would we support a nation that God left and said He would do old Jerusalem just like He done Shiloh (Jeremiah
7:12-15). What did he do to Shiloh? His Spirit left Shiloh and never returned and His Spirit left Jerusalem and will never
return. In Jeremiah 26:6 it says,

26 then I will make this house like Shiloh, and this city I will make
a curse to all the nations of the earth.” ’ ”

Logabe
Wrong woman. I am talking about the woman in rev 13 who gave birth to the child
 

BARNEY BRIGHT

Well-Known Member
Oct 29, 2017
4,032
1,119
113
67
Thomaston Georgia
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
You are ignoring the Scriptures that clearly state that there will be a general falling away before the second coming of the Lord, and that false prophets will arise performing signs and wonders to lead even the very elect away from Christ if that is possible.[/QUOTE\]

That general falling away happened after the Apostles and 1st centuries Christians died. After these people had died the church that most people acknowledge as the church of God was actually the Apostate Church. This Church had fallen away from the truth that the Apostles and first centuries Christians were spreading. If you read the scriptures you see that many antichrists that existed when the Apostles and 1st Century Christians were living but they were able to hold off their full influence when alive, but when they died off the influence of the antichrist movement was able to spread like wildfire. So many of the doctrines today that so many people who honestly believe themselves to be Christians are actually antichrist doctrines. We have to remember that Satan can come to people with his influence as an Angel of light, so we should not be amazed that Satan's disciples his followers and what they preach and teach appears to come from light, but it's actually from a false light.[/QUOTE\]
 
Last edited:

logabe

Active Member
Aug 28, 2008
880
47
28
66
Wrong woman. I am talking about the woman in rev 13 who gave birth to the child

Mary was the woman, but she represented all living as Eve did. In Adam all die. In Christ, in which God was the Father
of Jesus represents all the living. That's why I spoke of Hagar (flesh) and Sarah (living) which Paul used as an allegory
so we could understand the old man and the new man.

Jesus was the first man in the new creation, but He is calling many sons into glory through the wilderness, which represents
the trials and tribulations of the Overcomer. These Overcomers will rule and reign with Him in the Tabernacles Age that is upon
us. The whole creation is waiting for the manifestation of the "Man Child" company, so the whole world can be filled with the
presence of God (Romans 8:19).

Logabe
 

Joseph77

Well-Known Member
Apr 1, 2020
5,673
1,325
113
Tulsa, OK
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. in your opinion who is he who letteth
It appears to be a commonly accepted mis-translation.

In the original languages, apparently, nothing, no one, is "taken out of the way".

Rather, in proper use of the Hebrew thought and life, and Greek language,

the enemy is gradually, and then finally, "birthed" on earth....
 

BARNEY BRIGHT

Well-Known Member
Oct 29, 2017
4,032
1,119
113
67
Thomaston Georgia
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
The text appears very difficult to understand, but let's examine each word or idea and see how it all fits together. In the King James Version Bible it reads: “And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.” And in the Catholic Douay Bible you read it this way: “And now you know what withholdeth, that he may be revealed in his time. For the mystery of iniquity already worketh; only that he who now holdeth, do hold, until he be taken out of the way.” What does it mean? The words individually can be understood but the meaning is something else. Analyze it idea by idea now.

First the context. Paul wrote this letter to help the Thessalonians keep their faith alive. He tells them: “Faith is not a possession of all people . . . the Lord is faithful, and he will make you firm . . . we hear certain ones are walking disorderly among you, not working at all but meddling with what does not concern them.”.(2 Thess. 3:2, 3,11) Paul had commended them because of their growth in faith (2 Thess. 1:3), but he was concerned that something or someone would deaden that faith; in fact, he said it was “already at work.”—2 Thess. 2:7.

The two letters, First and Second Thessalonians, were written to the congregation of Christians at Thessalonica, Macedonia. (c. 50-51 C.E.) (1 Thess. 1:1; 2 Thess. 1:1) So the first “ye” or “you” would be those Christians there at that time and, of course, the pronoun applies with equal force to Christians now. (Rom. 15:4) What is the meaning of “What withholdeth”? Webster’s New Collegiate Dictionary says on “Withhold”: “To hold back; to check; restrain. To refrain from granting, allowing, or the like; as to withhold assent.” The Christian apostles received their authority from Jesus Christ to act as a restraint. (Matt. 10:1) “As long as the twelve apostles of Christ lived and oversaw the Christian congregation, they held up or slowed down the apostasy, the falling away to Babylonish religion. They acted as a restraint upon the development of a religious organization that professed to be Christian but that was really antichristian and Babylonish.”—“Babylon the Great Has Fallen!” God’s Kingdom Rules!, page 474.

The apostles had the authority to keep the congregation subject to Christ; but they, who acted as a restraint upon lawless action in the congregation, would be taken away in death and then the congregation would fall away to lawlessness and false teachings. (2 Cor. 10:2-6;2 Thess. 2:3-12; 2 Tim. 4:3, 4; Acts 20:29, 30) Again, at Matthew 18:18, Jesus clearly shows the restraining force these mature men, operating under Jehovah’s spirit, would have in the congregation. See also Ephesians 4:11-13 andActs 20:28. Paul, one of such men, was acting as a restraint, as shown at 2 Thessalonians 3:6: “Now we are giving you orders, brothers, in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, to withdraw from every brother walking disorderly and not according to the tradition you received from us.”—See also 2 Thessalonians 3:10-15;1 Thessalonians 4:1-8; Colossians 2:8; Acts 20:31;Ephesians 4:17–6:9; 1 Corinthians 5:1-5;2 Corinthians 10:2-6.

“He”—this is the one to be revealed. “He” is the one referred to in 2 Th 3 verse three as “that man of sin,” “the son of perdition.” Notice how Paul describes them at Acts 20:29, 30: “I know that after my going away oppressive wolves will enter in among you and will not treat the flock with tenderness, and from among you yourselves men will rise and speak twisted things to draw away the disciples after themselves.” These apostate leaders of professed Christians were to grow in strength and influence, and as soon as the restraint was out of the way they would take over.

This class of professed Christians came on the scene since Pentecost of 33 C.E. and particularly after the death of the twelve faithful apostles of Jesus Christ. They are organized into the religious clergy of Christendom and form a dominant part of Babylon the Great. Since Babylon the Great is still operating, this “man of sin” or “man of lawlessness” is still here.

“Revealed.” Says Webster’s New Collegiate Dictionary: “To communicate or impart by supernatural means or agency. To divulge (something secret or hidden); to disclose. To open up to view; as, a painting reveals the painter. Implies an unveiling, as of something not clear to human vision or beyond one’s knowledge.” Therefore, this class of professed Christians came out into the open at the death of the apostles; “he” was revealed in his time.—2 Pet. 2:1-3.

“Mystery of iniquity doth already work.” When Paul wrote his second letter to the Thessalonians about 51 C.E. this “mystery” or secret falling away from true Bible doctrines was already in operation. Men of influence in the congregation were already bowing down to Babylonish worship.

“He who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.” In 1611, when the King James Version Bible was written, “let” still carried the thought of restraint. Webster’s New Collegiate Dictionary gives this archaic definition: “To hinder; impede; prevent.” That is the meaning we will have to keep in mind. At Acts 20:29 Paul says: “I know that after my going away oppressive wolves will enter in among you.” See also 2 Peter 1:12 to 2:3. At the death of the apostles the restraining force was out of the way, the stop sign was down and the wolves came in with full power.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Joseph77