2 Things to : "study to show yourself approved"

[Behold]

I think the difference lies in our understanding sir, may I ask you to define what born again means?

To be born again, means, that God's Holy Spirit has caused a person's spirit to become in spiritual union with God's Spirit.
God's Holy Spirit births the spirit of a believer in Yeshua INTO God's Spirit.
The NT refers to this born again experience as becoming "in Christ" and "One with God".
The NT refers to this born again by the Holy Spirit..... Spirit in a person, as a "new Creation".

 

[GEN2REV]

-
1.) There are no born again, in Hell

2.) There are no Christ rejectors, in Heaven.


One more time...


1.) There are no born again, in Hell

2.) There are no Christ rejectors, in Heaven

So, here is how to rightly divide The Word in cases like this..

All these rightly divide'ers coming outta the woodwork now.

Rightly divide this:

You are written into the Book of Life, and given garments, at the moment your salvation process begins.

"Thou hast a few names(only) in Sardis(in an entire city, or church) who have not defiled their garments(with unrepented sin); and they(alone) shall walk with Me in white: for they(alone) are worthy."

"He(only) that overcometh (all willful sin), ... shall be clothed in white ... and I will not blot out his name from the Book of Life, ..."

Those names IN the Book are born again Believers.

Revelation 3:4-5

 

[Behold]

All these rightly divide'ers coming outta the woodwork now.

Rightly divide this:

You are written into the Book of Life,

Ok.

Its like this...

Everyone's name, when they are born, is in the "Lamb's Book of LIFE".
Everyone's.
If, while you are on the earth, still breathing, you are born again, (not water baptized) but BORN AGAIN, by the Spirit of God, into the Spirit of God, becoming "IN Christ", a "new Creation"...>"One with God".....then your name will stay in the Lamb's Book of Life.

If however, you die a CHRIST REJECTOR......having only been water baptized, or just being a heathen, unbeliever.....if you die like that, not born again... Jesus said, "you must be born again"....then the instant you hit eternity, having died, your name is removed from the Lamb's book of life because you died not born again.

So, be born again, and your name stays in the book.
Die not born again, and your name is taken out, and you will hit the Great White Throne Judgement, then the Lake of Fire which is the 2nd death.

 

[GEN2REV]

Ok.

Its like this...

Everyone's name, when they are born, is in the "Lamb's Book of LIFE".
Everyone's.

It is absolutely hilarious that you would say that.

I almost included this in my last post to avoid this additional exchange, but here you go.

"... they that dwell on the earth shall wonder (after the beast), whose names were not (EVER) written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world, ..."
Revelation 17:8

Check mate.

Between these two passages Rev. 3:4-5 & 17:8, this thread has no leg to stand upon.

Born again believers lose their salvation if they don't live up to God's conditions of giving up all willful sin and obeying the Commandments.

 

[Behold]

Born again believers lose their salvation if they don't live up to God's conditions of giving up all willful sin and obeying the Commandments.

Gen2rev,

You probably don't realize that your legalsim, isn't related to the Cross or the Blood Atonement.
Its only related to trying to save yourself, and you can't do that, but, you can keep trying, as that is your broken faith.

Listen,
You can never stop being born again....once you are born again.
You can never stop being "The Temple of the Holy Spirit", once you become this Spirituality.
What does that mean?
It means that Salvation, has happened, and being born again is the proof.
You can never stop being born again as this is a Spiritual BIRTH, and you can't stop a birth, once its happened.

Once born again, always born again.

 

[michaelvpardo]

Your theology is way off. You have no concept the human spirit. You believe we are in heaven already! LOL Tell me, what does heaven look like? Are you conscious of your surroundings in heaven? I guess you think we are all asleep in spirit up there ... or something?
WHEN WE DIE WE GO TO HEAVEN. I AM STILL HERE. THERE ARE PEOPLE IN HEAVEN NOW - PROBABLY OVER A BILLION.
YOU NEED TO STUDY THIS PASSAGE OVER AND OVER AGAIN:

"For we know that if the earthly tent we live in is destroyed, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. For in this tent we groan, longing to be clothed with our heavenly dwelling— if indeed, when we have taken it off we will not be found naked. For while we are still in this tent, we groan under our burden, because we wish not to be unclothed but to be further clothed, so that what is mortal may be swallowed up by life. He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who has given us the Spirit as a guarantee.
So we are always confident; even though we know that while we are at home in the body we are away from the Lord— for we walk by faith, not by sight. Yes, we do have confidence, and we would rather be away from the body and at home with the Lord." 2 COR. 5:1-8

Hi Ron, I see where "behold" is coming from:
4 But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5 even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6 and raised us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, 7 that in the ages to come He might show the exceeding riches of His grace in His kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. Ephesians 2:4-7
We don't typically experience this bodily, but our spirits are ushered into God's presence when He indwells us. We meet Him in prayer and we have this exhortation:
Let us therefore come boldly to the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need. Hebrews 4:16
This could be called metaphor, but metaphor for what?
Paul wrote:
26 Likewise the Spirit also helps in our weaknesses. For we do not know what we should pray for as we ought, but the Spirit Himself makes intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered. 27 Now He who searches the hearts knows what the mind of the Spirit is, because He makes intercession for the saints according to the will of God. Romans 26-27
When we receive His Spirit through faith in our Lord and asking through prayer, He doesn't come and go like a messenger boy, but supplies us with direct entry into God's presence. We don't physically go anywhere, yet are there with Him through prayer.
The kingdom of God is in us.
Now when He was asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God would come, He answered them and said, “The kingdom of God does not come with observation; nor will they say, ‘See here!’ or ‘See there!’ For indeed, the kingdom of God is within you.” Luke 17:20-21
I don't believe that Jesus was talking about His millenial reign here or the Lord's prayer wouldn't make much sense.
These are things we don't see with our eyes, but receive by faith. That doesn't make them less real or less present.
I'm unfamiliar with the original languages, but the translation we have of Ephesians 2:6 is in the past tense: "and raised us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus,"
This is a hard verse to wrap your mind around, but if we've received His Spirit, then we are "connected" to Him. However I believe that abiding in Him is a choice and act of our will (now freed from bondage) or there would be no exhortation by the Lord to abide in Him, or exhortation by Paul to live according to the Spirit and be found "in him."
I think your conversational adversary is missing our freedom of choice. Receiving His Spirit doesn't turn us into religious automatons, but empowers us to live as sons of God.

 

[Behold]

Receiving His Spirit doesn't turn us into religious automatons, but empowers us to live as sons of God.

How we live ....after we are born again.....does not affect what we have become, as to become a Son of God, is not based on how we live.
Becoming a Son of God......Is God causing us to be birthed, spiritually, as a Son of God.
So, how we live after we become a Son of God......has no effect on us BECOMING ONE....already.

Reader........its just like this........You had no control regarding being born.... and here you are.
So, if you are a horrible person, or a nice person.......this has no effect on you being BORN.

And its the same with being BORN again..
You didnt cause this.....You just became it......and now if you are born again Spiritually, then you are.....and thats it.
So, if you now behave badly today, and much better tomorrow, this has no effect on your BIRTH in the SPIRIT, exactly as it has no effect on being born of your mother.

Once you are born, you are born......both by your mother and by the Spirit of God as born again.

You can't stop being born or stop being born again by your behavior that you choose to do, later.

This is pretty obvious.

 

[michaelvpardo]

How we live ....after we are born again.....does not affect what we have become, as to become a Son of God, is not based on how we live.
Becoming a Son of God......Is God causing us to be birthed, spiritually, as a Son of God.
So, how we live after we become a Son of God......has no effect on us BECOMING ONE....already.

Reader........its just like this........You had no control regarding being born.... and here you are.
So, if you are a horrible person, or a nice person.......this has no effect on you being BORN.

And its the same with being BORN again..
You didnt cause this.....You just became it......and now if you are born again Spiritually, then you are.....and thats it.
So, if you now behave badly today, and much better tomorrow, this has no effect on your BIRTH in the SPIRIT, exactly as it has no effect on being born of your mother.

Once you are born, you are born......both by your mother and by the Spirit of God as born again.

You can't stop being born or stop being born again by your behavior that you choose to do, later.

This is pretty obvious.

As a believer you can still live according to the flesh and die for it. I don't think you loose your salvation for it, but I wouldn't bet my soul on it either. Anyone could be self deceived about their relationship with God, but the witness within us confirms our relationship with Him.
Ananias and Saphira were believers in the Lord, but died by Peter's prophetic word for trying to lie to the Holy Spirit about the portion of the profit from their home sale that they tried to conceal. That was their choice and they were struck down for it.

 

[GEN2REV]

How we live ....after we are born again.....does not affect what we have become, as to become a Son of God, is not based on how we live.
Becoming a Son of God......Is God causing us to be birthed, spiritually, as a Son of God.
So, how we live after we become a Son of God......has no effect on us BECOMING ONE....already.

Reader........its just like this........You had no control regarding being born.... and here you are.
So, if you are a horrible person, or a nice person.......this has no effect on you being BORN.

And its the same with being BORN again..
You didnt cause this.....You just became it......and now if you are born again Spiritually, then you are.....and thats it.
So, if you now behave badly today, and much better tomorrow, this has no effect on your BIRTH in the SPIRIT, exactly as it has no effect on being born of your mother.

Once you are born, you are born......both by your mother and by the Spirit of God as born again.

You can't stop being born or stop being born again by your behavior that you choose to do, later.

This is pretty obvious.

What you're claiming is literally ridiculous. You are saying that once somebody begins the process of salvation (it is a process), they can then conduct themselves any old way they like and completely sully the garments they are given in the spirit when this process begins, and be accepted into heaven when they physically die.

That they can sin up one side and down the other and then be allowed by Holy God Almighty into the most holy realm of existence along side all the holy angels while they are covered in filth from living in habitual sin.

Literally NOBODY, past the age of about 12 years old, would believe that nonsense unless it was brainwashed into them. And absolutely NOBODY who reads scripture for themselves, without somebody instructing them what each part "really means", would come to these conclusions. ALSO, nobody who truly loves God would even WANT that to be true. They DESIRE to be good to Him. They DESIRE to obey and honor and revere Him.

You are peddling absolute nonsense and mocking the Word of God.

 

[Behold]

As a believer you can still live according to the flesh and die for it..

All that can die is your body.
you're spirit is eternal......even if you are an unbeliever.

Jesus said that we must be born again, so that we enter into the Family of God, as a Son.

If you don't, then you go to the other "father", eventually, after you die.

See, being born again, is changing FATHER's.

Jesus said..>"you are of YOUR FATHER, the DEVIL".....and that is all those who are not born again, into GOD's Spirit so that HE is now their Father.

Unbelievers, die, and meet God as JUDGE.......not as FATHER, as their father is this one.........'Jesus said....."You are of YOUR FATHER..... the devil.">

So, if you dont change that by being born again by FATHER GOD, the Father of Jesus and all the born again....then you end up with your "father" who is the father of all the unbelievers.
That is HELL.
Then the white Throne Judgement.
Then the Lake of Fire.

 

[Behold]

salvation (it is a process),

What im saying seems "crazy" to you, becauseyou are not person who understands "born again".
You dont understand "The gospel of the Grace of God"
You dont understand.>"The blood atonment"
You dont understand "Justification by FAITH, without works".
You dont understand...>"faith is counted as righteous".
You dont understand why Abraham is the "father of our faith".
And a whole lot more.

See, im a Pauline Theology Teacher, and you have no idea what this is.....
You would have to read WIKIPEDIA, to found out the definition of "Pauline Theology", and then you'll pretend you knew it, as that is your nature.

However, you dont know it, or any of that which i posted, and that is why "paul's gospel", or "The gospel of the Grace of God", hits your ears like a broken cymbal.
How could it not?

 

[GEN2REV]

You can never stop being born again as this is a Spiritual BIRTH, and you can't stop a birth, once its happened.

Once born again, always born again.

We are born again into the True Vine and we branch out from there.
Jesus speaking:
"I am the True Vine and My Father is the Husbandman. Every branch IN ME that beareth not fruit He taketh away: ... If a man abide not IN ME, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men (angels) gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned."
John 15:1,2 & 6

 

[GEN2REV]

What im saying seems "crazy" to you, becauseyou are not person who understands "born again".
You dont understand "The gospel of the Grace of God"
You dont understand.>"The blood atonment"
You dont understand "Justification by FAITH, without works".
You dont understand...>"faith is counted as righteous".
You dont understand why Abraham is the "father of our faith".
And a whole lot more.

See, im a Pauline Theology Teacher, and you have no idea what this is.....
You would have to read WIKIPEDIA, to found out the definition of "Pauline Theology", and then you'll pretend you knew it, as that is your nature.

However, you dont know it, or any of that which i posted, and that is why "paul's gospel", or "The gospel of the Grace of God", hits your ears like a broken cymbal.
How could it not?

As I'm proving via scripture, what you are preaching is another gospel.

It's not what the Bible teaches at all. Not even close.

Galatians 1:8

 

[Behold]

We are born again into the True Vine

No verse in the entire bible says you are "born again into the vine".

So, you need to burn your commentaries, as they are lying to you, and you need to leave your "church" , as it has cost you years of spiritual blindness.

 

[Behold]

As I'm proving via scripture,

Galatians 1:8

You are only talking to yourself proving that you have twisted verses, to suit yourself.

You are typical of a person found on a forum, who posts verses, then says....>"see there, proved it".

Well, you only proved that have no idea what you are doing here, and you proved you can post verses to prove it.
And you'll do it again.

 

[farouk]

Just to remember: "Other sheep" usually = "Jehovah's Witness".....

 

[Behold]

As I'm proving via scripture, what you are preaching is another gospel.

Here is the Gospel..

"Believe on the Lord Jesus, and you shall be saved".
"all that call on the name of Jesus shall be saved".
"as many as received Jesus, to them God gave the power to become the sons of God".

Jesus said....>"you must be born again".....and to receive this....to be born again, you have to do the WILL of God.

""""The WILL of God is that you BELIEVE ON JESUS WHOM GOD SENT"

You must have FAITH In Jesus... you must BELIEVE.....and the verse says...>"Faith come by hearing, and hearing BY the word of God".

Hearing what? "The Gospel"...which is. "The preaching of the Cross".

Why Faith? because FAITH is : "counted as Righteousness".

Also, the "gospel", is "Paul's Gospel", as he gave it to us........This is the Gospel of the Grace of God. = "Justification by Faith".

 

[michaelvpardo]

No one can change who they are. God does that. No one chooses to be born again. God does that. We might think that we play some part in that, but faith comes by hearing the word of God and it is God who opens the hearing ear. Regeneration is the work of His Spirit. Repentance is the fruit of His Spirit. No one seeks God, He seeks us and draws us to Jesus. No one chooses to be born. God forms the spirit within us. No one chooses to be born of the Spirit of God. The unregenerate soul is at enmity with God. (Our fallen nature makes us hate the true God and reinvent Him to be like us.) It's true that you must be born again in order to enter the kingdom of heaven, but that's His marvelous work, not ours.

25 When His disciples heard it, they were greatly astonished, saying, “Who then can be saved?”

26 But Jesus looked at them and said to them, “With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.” Matthew 19:25-26

 

[Behold]

No one chooses to be born again.

So you think that God grabs you by the hair and shoves the Holy Spirit into you, by force?

C'mon fella. Get off the hobby horse. Christianity is not a hobby. Theology is not a farce.
Your responses are both.

Listen,

Everyone who is born again, chose it.
Everyone who is born again HEARD the message of the Cross, and DECIDED what they will do.
"faith come by HEARING"......and you make a CHOICE.

Next Sunday morning, all over the world, Pastors are giving an "invitation", an "alter call", and the Holy Spirit is Drawing hearts to the Truth of the Gospel of Christ.
The choice is to believe or to ignore, or to resist, but its a choice, every time someone becomes a BELIEVER... or not.
If you die having not CHOSEN to BELIEVE in Jesus and be born again, God will judge you for your REJECTION of Christ.
Thats a CHOICE you made on earth and God will honor your CHOICE after you die, for as long as God LIVES.
Believe it.

Jesus said..."if i be lifted up (on the Cross) i will DRAW ALL men to me"..

The "drawing" is the Holy Spirit revealing the truth..... John 14:6, when the Gospel is preached or shared.
People hear it, and are touched by the Holy Spirit, and Christ is revealed, and they make a choice.
God will honor that choice NOW< and forever.

 

[michaelvpardo]

So you think that God grabs you by the hair and shoves the Holy Spirit into you, by force?

C'mon fella. Get off the hobby horse. Christianity is not a hobby. Theology is not a farce.
Your responses are both.

Listen,

Everyone who is born again, chose it.
Everyone who is born again HEARD the message of the Cross, and DECIDED what they will do.
"faith come by HEARING"......and you make a CHOICE.

Next Sunday morning, all over the world, Pastors are giving an "invitation", an "alter call", and the Holy Spirit is Drawing hearts to the Truth of the Gospel of Christ.
The choice is to believe or to ignore, or to resist, but its a choice, every time someone becomes a BELIEVER... or not.
If you die having not CHOSEN to BELIEVE in Jesus and be born again, God will judge you for your REJECTION of Christ.
Thats a CHOICE you made on earth and God will honor your CHOICE after you die, for as long as God LIVES.
Believe it.

Jesus said..."if i be lifted up (on the Cross) i will DRAW ALL men to me"..

The "drawing" is the Holy Spirit revealing the truth..... John 14:6, when the Gospel is preached or shared.
People hear it, and are touched by the Holy Spirit, and Christ is revealed, and they make a choice.
God will honor that choice NOW< and forever.

Read the scriptures and stop playing the fool.

43 Jesus therefore answered and said to them, “Do not murmur among yourselves. 44 No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day. 45 It is written in the prophets, ‘And they shall all be taught by God.’ Therefore everyone who has heard and learned from the Father comes to Me. John 6:43-45
See, I've put the relevant phrase in great big print so even someone with eyes as old as mine can see it.
Now, the verse doesn't say draws by the hair, but it could have and still be saying effectively the same thing.
Believe the scripture. STOP denying the word of our Lord.

David wrote under the power of the Holy Spirit:
The Lord looks down from heaven upon the children of men, To see if there are any who understand, who seek God. They have all turned aside, They have together become corrupt; There is none who does good,
No, not one. Psalm 14:2-3
So, are you claiming to be the exception?

10 He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him. 11 He came to His own, and His own did not receive Him. 12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. John 1:10-13
Was the Apostle John mistaken? Are you planning on correcting him at the judgment? Or are you implying that you are neither flesh or man, but God Himself?
I don't know the original language, but in English this passage says that only those who are born again by the will of God believe Him. The belief is the result of being born again. The "choice" is the result of being born again. Jesus believed in God's election, do you?
25 When His disciples heard it, they were greatly astonished, saying, “Who then can be saved?”
26 But Jesus looked at them and said to them, “With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.” Matthew 19:25-26
What is it about "impossible " that you don't understand?