7 reasons why Peter was not perfect after Pentecost and was guilty of sin.

[farouk]

Frankly I don't know what the big deal is...
today that is.
Maybe in Paul's day with Rome and all and all those Righteous Sadducees and Pharisees, one wouldn't want to rock the boat too much.
Paul did say.. he had meat to share but they couldn't bear it at that time.
Maybe today we can, and finally be willing to put the swords down and begin to plow again.
But if God laid the foundations in this here son, and others come and lay a foundation in that there son.
Maybe thats why there is so much division in the church.
Everybody building their own foundations.. and gospels.. just saying.

@Ziggy "For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ." (! Corinthians 3.11)

 

[Ziggy]

@Ziggy "For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ." (! Corinthians 3.11)

Job 38:4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.

Job 38:6 Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof;
Job 38:7 When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

Rev 22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

Psa 11:3 If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do?

Isa 51:16 And I have put my words in thy mouth, and I have covered thee in the shadow of mine hand, that I may plant the heavens, and lay the foundations of the earth, and say unto Zion, Thou art my people.

2Ki 19:21 This is the word that the LORD hath spoken concerning him; The virgin the daughter of Zion hath despised thee, and laughed thee to scorn; the daughter of Jerusalem hath shaken her head at thee.
2Ki 19:22 Whom hast thou reproached and blasphemed? and against whom hast thou exalted thy voice, and lifted up thine eyes on high? even against the Holy One of Israel.

Sarah Laughed.
And then Denied Him.

But Our God is MERCIFUL!!
Our God is FORGIVING!!
Our God is WONDERFUL!!
Our God is LOVE!!

Hugs

 

[farouk]

Job 38:4 Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.

Job 38:6 Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof;
Job 38:7 When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

Rev 22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

Psa 11:3 If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do?

Isa 51:16 And I have put my words in thy mouth, and I have covered thee in the shadow of mine hand, that I may plant the heavens, and lay the foundations of the earth, and say unto Zion, Thou art my people.

2Ki 19:21 This is the word that the LORD hath spoken concerning him; The virgin the daughter of Zion hath despised thee, and laughed thee to scorn; the daughter of Jerusalem hath shaken her head at thee.
2Ki 19:22 Whom hast thou reproached and blasphemed? and against whom hast thou exalted thy voice, and lifted up thine eyes on high? even against the Holy One of Israel.

Sarah Laughed.
And then Denied Him.

But Our God is MERCIFUL!!
Our God is FORGIVING!!
Our God is WONDERFUL!!
Our God is LOVE!!

Hugs

@Ziggy Good, relevant verses there...

 

[CharismaticLady]

I will call this Paul's sevenfold rebuke of Peters hypocrisy and beak it down with scripture not my opinion.

Paul's words to Peter were as follows:

1) I opposed him to his face, because he stood condemned.
2)he began to draw back and separate himself from the Gentiles because he was afraid of those who belonged to the circumcision group.
3) The other Jews joined him in his hypocrisy,
4) so that by their hypocrisy even Barnabas was led astray.
5)they were not acting in line with the truth of the gospel
6)You are a Jew, yet you live like a Gentile and not like a Jew
7)you force Gentiles to follow Jewish customs

You can read the story in Galatians 2.

And please don't blame me for this blame God, Paul and Peter since God included in His word and Paul confronted Peter.

BTW- if Peter an Apostle could not reach a sinless state post indwelling of the Holy Spirit what on earth makes you think you are above Peter in reaching sinlessness ?

hope this helps !!!

The reason why the sin was on the part of Paul was as follows:

Deuteronomy 19:15
“One witness shall not rise against a man concerning any iniquity or any sin that he commits; by the mouth of two or three witnesses the matter shall be established.

Paul was guilty of committing a divisive accusation with no chance of rebuttal. A sin. Peter forgave him by evidence of calling him our beloved brother.

 

[farouk]

The reason why the sin was on the part of Paul was as follows:

Deuteronomy 19:15
“One witness shall not rise against a man concerning any iniquity or any sin that he commits; by the mouth of two or three witnesses the matter shall be established.

Paul was guilty of committing a divisive accusation with no chance of rebuttal. A sin. Peter forgave him by evidence of calling him our beloved brother.

I think more likely Peter was admitting he had made a mistake... It was all about law-keeping and not imposing it on the Gentiles.

 

[CharismaticLady]

I think more likely Peter was admitting he had made a mistake... It was all about law-keeping and not imposing it on the Gentiles.

Where did Peter admit anything?

 

[Randy Kluth]

All men are sinners in that they have indwelling sin. But not all men are sinners in that, in some, the element of sin has been rendered dead (Romans 6:6, Galatians 5:24, Romans 7:8) so that sin no longer has any dominion over them (Romans 6:14). Entire sanctification is a faithful doctrine (1 Thessalonians 5:23-24 (kjv), Hebrews 10:14 (kjv), 1 John 3:9; Jude 1:24, 2 Peter 1:10, 1 John 2:10; 1 John 3:7, 1 John 3:3, 1 John 2:6; 1 John 3:6, 1 John 2:17; Romans 6:6, Colossians 2:11)..

Words mean what they mean in context. To call someone a "sinner" in one context has to do with a person who willfully pursues the sin nature, and does not attempt to overcome it with righteousness.

In another context, the idea of a "sinner" may simply have to do with identifying him with the rest of the human race, all of whom are tainted with the sin nature, and may have nothing to do with the choice to pursue sinning as a lifestyle.

So we have 2 different senses of "sinner," depending on the context. In one case, all men are "sinners," because all have the sin nature, both saint and sinner. And in another sense, the "sinner" is one who pursues sin as a lifestyle--something saints do not do.

Even the saint is a "sinner" in one sense. In another he is not. I hope you recognize the difference!

 

[farouk]

Where did Peter admit anything?

Peter never went back into law-keeping.

 

[Ziggy]

Peter was eating with the Gentiles.

PERIOD.

Act 15:6 And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter.
Act 15:7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
Act 15:8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
Act 15:9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
Act 15:10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?
Act 15:11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

That's Peter, Not Paul.

Compare to:

Gal 2:11 But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.
Gal 2:12 For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
Gal 2:13 And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.
Gal 2:14 But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?
Gal 2:15 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,

If you don't hear this condenscending .. holier than thou .. I'll be nice..

So, is Peter telling the Gentiles ANYTHING in these verses?
No.. He is eating with them.
Certain of the circumcision came in and made Peter afraid.
It wasn't those sinning Gentiles as Paul so elegantly put it..

So ..
we have Peter's version in Act, and we have Paul's version in Galatians..

rightly dividing the word of truth..

good luck

 

[farouk]

Peter was eating with the Gentiles.

PERIOD.

Act 15:6 And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter.
Act 15:7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
Act 15:8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
Act 15:9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
Act 15:10 Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?
Act 15:11 But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

That's Peter, Not Paul.

Compare to:

Gal 2:11 But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.
Gal 2:12 For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
Gal 2:13 And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.
Gal 2:14 But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?
Gal 2:15 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,

If you don't hear this condenscending .. holier than thou .. I'll be nice..

So, is Peter telling the Gentiles ANYTHING in these verses?
No.. He is eating with them.
Certain of the circumcision came in and made Peter afraid.
It wasn't those sinning Gentiles as Paul so elegantly put it..

So ..
we have Peter's version in Act, and we have Paul's version in Galatians..

rightly dividing the word of truth..

good luck

@Ziggy The Judaizing influence was very strong. This is also why Hebrews was written, to show how "better" the fullness and simplicity of Christ is, instead of law-keeping.

 

[Ziggy]

@Ziggy The Judaizing influence was very strong. This is also why Hebrews was written, to show how "better" the fullness and simplicity of Christ is, instead of law-keeping.

You want to know what else was strong?
Idolatry. The whole world worshipped Diana.. their Goddess.
And so inbetween what was left of Judaism and this Idol worshipping temple that looks a lot like the one Solomon built by the way..
or Herod reburbished.. there was a whole lotta friction going on.
And Rome was King and Artemis/Diana was their Girl..
So it was a time of tribulation for sure.
Just trying to keep Judaism alive while the whole world was trying to destroy HISTORY
Just like their doing today, by the way...

Round and round she goes..
Maybe people sometimes forget who's authority everyone was under at the time..
Rome
same as today..
Come out of her my people!!

 

[justbyfaith]

I think that the key to our understanding in the debate of whether it was Ishmael or Isaac who was the primary ancestor of Jesus, is the statement, that, In Isaac shall thy seed be called (Romans 9:7).

The son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman (Galatians 4:30).

The son of the bondwoman was Ishmael, the son of the freewoman was Isaac.

Ishmael is not the Messiah; but the Messiah would come through Isaac as a descendant of Isaac.

Therefore post #58 (7 reasons why Peter was not perfect after Pentecost and was guilty of sin.) is not based in reality.

 

[Ziggy]

I think that the key to our understanding in the debate of whether it was Ishmael or Isaac who was the primary ancestor of Jesus, is the statement, that, In Isaac shall thy seed be called (Romans 9:7).

The son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman (Galatians 4:30).

The son of the bondwoman was Ishmael, the son of the freewoman was Isaac.

Ishmael is not the Messiah; but the Messiah would come through Isaac as a descendant of Isaac.

Therefore post #58 (7 reasons why Peter was not perfect after Pentecost and was guilty of sin.) is not based in reality.

That's fine I disagree.
When Sarah threw Hagar into the wilderness, she was no longer under bondage of her mistress.
But when the Lord met Hagar in the wilderness he told her to go back and put herself under submission to Sarah.
Hagar obeyed God.
She was free to leave at any time.

But she was also Abraham's wife.. Sarah gave Hagar to Abraham to wife. Thinking that Hagar's son would be her own.
She threw them OUT.

Like I said.. I don't care what Paul said.
I care what God says.
Hugs

 

[justbyfaith]

Paul's doctrine of the Bible is the word of God (holy scripture)...2 Peter 3:15-16.

Hagar, when she went back to Sarah, returned to being a slave of Sarah and Abraham...she was the bondwoman, no matter how you slice it...

 

[Ziggy]

I'm not going to argue with you.

Like I said, what difference does it make?
You either have the root or you don't
Period
Hugs

 

[Ziggy]

Mat 17:24 And when they were come to Capernaum, they that received tribute money came to Peter, and said, Doth not your master pay tribute?
Mat 17:25 He saith, Yes. And when he was come into the house, Jesus prevented him, saying, What thinkest thou, Simon? of whom do the kings of the earth take custom or tribute? of their own children, or of strangers?
Mat 17:26 Peter saith unto him, Of strangers. Jesus saith unto him, Then are the children free.
Mat 17:27 Notwithstanding, lest we should offend them, go thou to the sea, and cast an hook, and take up the fish that first cometh up; and when thou hast opened his mouth, thou shalt find a piece of money: that take, and give unto them for me and thee.


NLT:
On their arrival in Capernaum, the collectors of the Temple tax came to Peter and asked him, “Doesn’t your teacher pay the Temple tax?”
“Yes, he does,” Peter replied. Then he went into the house.
But before he had a chance to speak, Jesus asked him, “What do you think, Peter? Do kings tax their own people or the people they have conquered?
“They tax the people they have conquered,” Peter replied. “Well, then,” Jesus said, “the citizens are free!
However, we don’t want to offend them, so go down to the lake and throw in a line. Open the mouth of the first fish you catch, and you will find a large silver coin. Take it and pay the tax for both of us.”

Luk 19:11 And as they heard these things, he added and spake a parable, because he was nigh to Jerusalem, and because they thought that the kingdom of God should immediately appear.
Luk 19:12 He said therefore, A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom, and to return.
Luk 19:13 And he called his ten servants, and delivered them ten pounds, and said unto them, Occupy till I come.
Luk 19:14 But his citizens hated him, and sent a message after him, saying, We will not have this man to reign over us.

Jhn 19:12 And from thenceforth Pilate sought to release him: but the Jews cried out, saying, If thou let this man go, thou art not Caesar's friend: whosoever maketh himself a king speaketh against Caesar.
Jhn 19:14 And it was the preparation of the passover, and about the sixth hour: and he saith unto the Jews, Behold your King!
Jhn 19:15 But they cried out, Away with him, away with him, crucify him. Pilate saith unto them, Shall I crucify your King? The chief priests answered, We have no king but Caesar.

Who exactly is in bondage?
Isaac or Ishmael?

 

[Truman]

I will call this Paul's sevenfold rebuke of Peters hypocrisy and beak it down with scripture not my opinion.

Paul's words to Peter were as follows:

1) I opposed him to his face, because he stood condemned.
2)he began to draw back and separate himself from the Gentiles because he was afraid of those who belonged to the circumcision group.
3) The other Jews joined him in his hypocrisy,
4) so that by their hypocrisy even Barnabas was led astray.
5)they were not acting in line with the truth of the gospel
6)You are a Jew, yet you live like a Gentile and not like a Jew
7)you force Gentiles to follow Jewish customs

You can read the story in Galatians 2.

And please don't blame me for this blame God, Paul and Peter since God included in His word and Paul confronted Peter.

BTW- if Peter an Apostle could not reach a sinless state post indwelling of the Holy Spirit what on earth makes you think you are above Peter in reaching sinlessness ?

hope this helps !!!

He was guilty of cancelled sin! Off with his head! Lol!

 

[CharismaticLady]

Peter never went back into law-keeping.

Right, but that isn't the issue.

 

[justbyfaith]

I'm not going to argue with you.

Like I said, what difference does it make?
You either have the root or you don't
Period
Hugs

The root is certainly not Ishmael.

Are you attempting to preach Islam on these Christian Message Boards?

 

[marks]

I will call this Paul's sevenfold rebuke of Peters hypocrisy and beak it down with scripture not my opinion.

Paul's words to Peter were as follows:

1) I opposed him to his face, because he stood condemned.
2)he began to draw back and separate himself from the Gentiles because he was afraid of those who belonged to the circumcision group.
3) The other Jews joined him in his hypocrisy,
4) so that by their hypocrisy even Barnabas was led astray.
5)they were not acting in line with the truth of the gospel
6)You are a Jew, yet you live like a Gentile and not like a Jew
7)you force Gentiles to follow Jewish customs

You can read the story in Galatians 2.

And please don't blame me for this blame God, Paul and Peter since God included in His word and Paul confronted Peter.

BTW- if Peter an Apostle could not reach a sinless state post indwelling of the Holy Spirit what on earth makes you think you are above Peter in reaching sinlessness ?

hope this helps !!!

"7 reasons why Peter was not perfect after Pentecost and was guilty of sin."

How can Peter be guilty of sin? Do you not think Peter was justified?

Much love!