read Galatians 2 where Paul explains it and let me know where you agree or disagree with Paul confronting Peter about his hypocrisy. Thanks !
7 reasons why Peter was not perfect after Pentecost and was guilty of sin.
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Hi JBF,
Yes, this is not Krino or Katakrino, for judgment/condemnation, instead, kategnosmenos, knowledge against yourself.
Perhaps in today's vernacular, he should have known better.
Much love!
@Christophany
So with this in mind . . . are you still holding to the translation "stood condemned"?
Much love!
Ronald David Bruno
Well-Known Member
Paul rebuked him, so? It was a correction ... iron sharpens iron. How many times have all of us erred in regards to righteousness, holiness? It just means that Peter and the rest of us make mistakes. They are not sins unto death. Spiritually our sins past, present and future have been forgiven.
Peter had a habit of sticking his foot in his mouth. He erred often. Christ showed him mercy even though he would deny that he knew Jesus three times. Just because Peter and the rest of them were ordained and baptized by the Holy Spirit doesn't mean they all of sudden were perfect super-spiritual men without fault, like a programed robot with no glitches. He was still learning. God didn't show them everything they needed to know in a moments time. As we grow and learn through experiences, they did too. God had to bring them through life to grow them, to teach them.
I see Peter's slower transition into "Grace through Faith and not by works" from the Jewish laws and traditions as God's purpose - must have been, God allowed it. Jews needed Peter not to be as strict as Paul, ripping off the band-aid quickly or so to speak and let it happen gradually, let the Jews slowly purge their ways. It wasn't easy for them. Then at the right time, God sent Paul in to correct them.
That's not what he did so far as I can see.
Clearly deny Scripture? Where exactly? Shouldn't you be a little more precise when leveling these charges against others? Making such accusations?
Much love?
One time in our home fellowship, we were about to go through 1 & 2 Peter. Before beginning, we went through the Bible and read every instance where Peter was mentioned, or included, whatever. Every last word about Peter in the Bible. I have to say . . . I walked away from that little exersize with a different impression of Peter from when we started. I'm not going to be the one to bag on him!! I want to be like him!!!Is it Peter's turn??
I had a pow wow with Paul a little ways back. It didn't go over too well. But that's how you get to the root of the problem.
Pulling teeth never feels good. I know, I don't have any left. But I don't get toothaches no more either.
You have to go back to the Gospels... follow Peter. Just follow him, watch.
Then move on to Paul.
Is Paul justified in his accusations?
I find them both questionable as to being "perfect" .
If Peter supposed to be out spreading the Gospel, why is he spending so much time in Jerusalem in the hot seat?
I thought Jesus said if you want to be a leader, you need to be a servant instead.
And not to take the best seats in the house.
Peter, James and Joses... because Joses is John, James's brother.
These 3 always together.. pillars.. even..
Get in the ring and go thrash it out. If you don't it will drive you crazy for years.
Something about 3 frogs... idk.. just thinking
Good Luck
Hugs
Much love!
Agreed and my point is even the Apostle Peter post Pentecost ( decade later ) needed correction for sin. This goes against the proponents of sinless perfectionism and they MUST make the plain reading of the text in Galatians 2 say something else to defend their heretical position regarding reaching the state of sinless perfection on this side of the Resurrection.
hope this helps !!!
Agreed and the bible does not paint a good picture of the saints in both testaments but reveals their human weaknesses. Point being we all need Gods grace and mercy for none of us are perfect/ sinless although we strive to be like Him in obedience and yielding our will to His will.
Already answered that and there is a difference between a private sin between 2 people and a public sin in front of many.
BTW I'm not going to re answer the same questions over again. Read my previous answers as they have already been addressed from every possible angle already.
Did Paul sin ?
Did Paul contradict Jesus and his own teaching (which is identical with Jesus teaching) on rebuking a brother in sin ?
Who isn't hypocritical in some way?
Is everyone here completely consistent throughout their being??
And what sin is not forgiven in Christ?
Much love!
The biblical command of 2 or 3 witnesses.
1 Corinthians 5
It is actually reported that there is immorality among you, and immorality of such a kind as does not exist even among the Gentiles, that someone has his father’s wife. 2 You have become arrogant and have not mourned instead, so that the one who had done this deed would be removed from your midst.
3 For I, on my part, though absent in body but present in spirit, have already judged him who has so committed this, as though I were present. 4 In the name of our Lord Jesus, when you are assembled, and I with you in spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus, 5 I have decided to deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
6 Your boasting is not good. Do you not know that a little leaven leavens the whole lump of dough? 7 Clean out the old leaven so that you may be a new lump, just as you are in fact unleavened. For Christ our Passover also has been sacrificed. 8 Therefore let us celebrate the feast, not with old leaven, nor with the leaven of malice and wickedness, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
9 I wrote you in my letter not to associate with immoral people; 10 I did not at all mean with the immoral people of this world, or with the covetous and swindlers, or with idolaters, for then you would have to go out of the world. 11 But actually, I wrote to you not to associate with any so-called brother if he is an immoral person, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or a swindler—not even to eat with such a one. 12 For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Do you not judge those who are within the church? 13 But those who are outside, God judges. Remove the wicked man from among yourselves.
Paul's teaching above lines up with Jesus teaching on the subject of Judging sin in a believer and removing them from fellowship if they do not repent by the witness/testimony principle of 2 or 3 witnesses let every fact be confirmed. God is in your midst(with you) in this disciplinary action because of the testimony of the witnesses. The binding and loosing below has to do with sin and discipline. People so often abuse this passage where 2 or 3 are gathered in Jesus name and He is in their midst. The context in sin and church discipline.
Matthew 18:15-20
“If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother. 16 But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every fact may be confirmed. 17 If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. 18 Truly I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven.
19 “Again I say to you, that if two of you agree on earth about anything that they may ask, it shall be done for them by My Father who is in heaven. 20 For where two or three have gathered together in My name, I am there in their midst.”
Deuteronomy 19:15
A lone witness is not sufficient to establish any wrongdoing or sin against a man, regardless of what offense he may have committed. A matter must be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.
2 Corinthians 13:1
This is the third time I am coming to you. EVERY FACT IS TO BE CONFIRMED BY THE TESTIMONY OF TWO OR THREE WITNESSES.
hope this helps !!!
1 Corinthians 5
It is actually reported that there is immorality among you, and immorality of such a kind as does not exist even among the Gentiles, that someone has his father’s wife. 2 You have become arrogant and have not mourned instead, so that the one who had done this deed would be removed from your midst.
3 For I, on my part, though absent in body but present in spirit, have already judged him who has so committed this, as though I were present. 4 In the name of our Lord Jesus, when you are assembled, and I with you in spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus, 5 I have decided to deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
6 Your boasting is not good. Do you not know that a little leaven leavens the whole lump of dough? 7 Clean out the old leaven so that you may be a new lump, just as you are in fact unleavened. For Christ our Passover also has been sacrificed. 8 Therefore let us celebrate the feast, not with old leaven, nor with the leaven of malice and wickedness, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
9 I wrote you in my letter not to associate with immoral people; 10 I did not at all mean with the immoral people of this world, or with the covetous and swindlers, or with idolaters, for then you would have to go out of the world. 11 But actually, I wrote to you not to associate with any so-called brother if he is an immoral person, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or a swindler—not even to eat with such a one. 12 For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Do you not judge those who are within the church? 13 But those who are outside, God judges. Remove the wicked man from among yourselves.
Paul's teaching above lines up with Jesus teaching on the subject of Judging sin in a believer and removing them from fellowship if they do not repent by the witness/testimony principle of 2 or 3 witnesses let every fact be confirmed. God is in your midst(with you) in this disciplinary action because of the testimony of the witnesses. The binding and loosing below has to do with sin and discipline. People so often abuse this passage where 2 or 3 are gathered in Jesus name and He is in their midst. The context in sin and church discipline.
Matthew 18:15-20
“If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother. 16 But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every fact may be confirmed. 17 If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector. 18 Truly I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall have been loosed in heaven.
19 “Again I say to you, that if two of you agree on earth about anything that they may ask, it shall be done for them by My Father who is in heaven. 20 For where two or three have gathered together in My name, I am there in their midst.”
Deuteronomy 19:15
A lone witness is not sufficient to establish any wrongdoing or sin against a man, regardless of what offense he may have committed. A matter must be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses.
2 Corinthians 13:1
This is the third time I am coming to you. EVERY FACT IS TO BE CONFIRMED BY THE TESTIMONY OF TWO OR THREE WITNESSES.
hope this helps !!!
My understanding is something like this . . .
That as we seek to be justified by faith of Christ, and not by works of Law, that should we then be found to be sinners, was that Jesus' doing? No. If we start all that again, that's on us.
I'd suggest a more literal translation. I like this one myself . . .
scripture4all.org
I present myself as a transgressor if I'm found to be a sinner, because it was me who rebuilt my old home. Christ didn't do that.
Much love!
By my reading, the Law both increases sin, and makes it worse. The law suppresses sin in the culture, but personally, the Law increases sin.
Much love!
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