A Mystery Revealed (for the first time).

[ScottA]

God is a god of revelation, and does so in the fulness of time according to His purpose.

A good example is the mystery that Paul was given to reveal several millennia after it was first given by God, which was in the beginning...the mystery of marriage. What was practiced for so long without a full understanding of why, was then revealed only after the coming of the Bridegroom and the announcement (engagement) of Him building His church, the Bride to be.

That is the nature of how God reveals all things in the fulness of time--in His time.

The mystery that I am speaking of here and now is akin to the mystery of things fulfilled "before the foundation of the world." If you understand the concept--that is, when the truth of our timeless God cannot be said any other way but in His own timeless way...that truth comes out as it actually is [with God] rather than the way it would appear [among men]. One example would be the description of the timeless nature of God in worldly terns (as things appear from our perspective), as "the same yesterday, today, and forever"...But when there is no beating around the [burning] bush, He says it like it really is, saying to Moses, "I am." Of course it is not until nearly the end of the scriptures--in the fulness of time, that we find out that with God there is actually "no shadow of turning"--no "yesterday" really, but just "today, and forever."

And this mystery that is now revealed in our time, is not much different. It is the counterpart of the phrase, "before the foundation of the world." Just as those things that were not completely known during that former time but were only eluded to as actually occurring before the world began and only revealed in the fulness of time looking back, we too have what is similarly revealed to us in like manner. But instead of looking back before the birth of mankind in the flesh...what is revealed to us for our time, is before the birth of those who are born of the Spirit of God and Christ the firstfruits, the first of many sons.

This too was eluded to. In fact many passages in the scriptures are stated [correctly] in past tense when it was unavoidable. God is Truth. But it doesn't end with just those things that have only been eluded to, like saying those who are in Christ "were" crucified with Him. No, when "all truth" is commonly understood--all things will find their place in God..."before the foundation of the world"...and..."before the foundation of the new heavens and the new earth" in Christ, and in His time.

This is the complete mystery of "rightly dividing the word of truth."

 

[quietthinker]

What is God really like?.....that's the mystery that has been the centre of all enquiry and conflict through the eons.
Lucifers claim to have a 'better' approach was unmasked for the whole intelligent universe to witness when the two opposing 'ideologies' faced each other at Calvary.

In Jesus, this mystery was unfolded. A mystery that even the angels prior to the incarnation/calvary never really understood.....a 'mystery' which Lucifer exploited with his sophistry and seduced a third of sinless beings.

But now we see his deceptions like never before. We, as well as all created intelligences see how God really is........the which Paul has become a minister of.

There now exists a very real danger of this revelation being diverted and misrepresented under a religious pretension.

Wake up!

 

[ScottA]

What is God really like?.....that's the mystery that has been the centre of all enquiry and conflict through the eons.
Lucifers claim to have a 'better' approach was unmasked for the whole intelligent universe to witness when the two opposing 'ideologies' faced each other at Calvary.

In Jesus, this mystery was unfolded. A mystery that even the angels prior to the incarnation/calvary never really understood.....a 'mystery' which Lucifer exploited with his sophistry and seduced a third of sinless beings.

But now we see his deceptions like never before. We, as well as all created intelligences see how God really is........the which Paul has become a minister of.

There now exists a very real danger of this revelation being diverted and misrepresented under a religious pretension.

Wake up!

You are right to say, wake up. For this is what became of Israel, placed under a type of blindness and slumber, until the fulfillment of the times of the gentiles. And the gentiles and the church were promised much the same: tares among the wheat, wolves among the priests, and strong delusion for having believed the lie that Christ would not "shortly come...quickly." Of whom we are children.

 

[ScottA]

Reprinted from the other thread where this discussion all began, which was regarding salvation and the error in the idea that sin continues in those who are [actually] saved. Please take up that issue there in the other thread if you have comments, as this thread is to be more general and about the mystery and revelation regarding the actual timing of godly events:

What Paul said is good, but does not exactly fit with all that has become. You see, he spoke from both sides and to both sides on the cusp of changing times--literally from and to death and also to life--where time meets eternity. He was a witness for Christ in His death, but also in His resurrection. Therefore he says the words of truth must be rightly divided--something that never before would have ever been considered necessary. And this, looking back we either perceive all that has occurred, or carry on unaware--but I am not unaware, nor need anyone be who can hear what is written and what was to come by the Holy Spirit as promised by Christ who has framed it all.

I did by the way, start a new thread regarding the mystery that causes us to view what is true from two different perspectives: A Mystery Revealed (for the first time). .

This mystery revealed pertains to much of the scriptures, but specifically regarding this topic (Once Saved Always Saved). Just as it is somewhat common for those living in the times of the writing of the Bible to look back from the crucifixion and say certain things were so since "before the foundation of the world"--our own times are also the days of future past. In other words, if we are to fully understand the crucifixion we must consider the greater truth to be in that timeless context of God rather than on the created timeline within the kingdom of God where there exists no time, except that those things were revealed to us in that manner. Likewise then, if we are to fully understand where and when sin was finished in all who "were" crucified with Christ, there remains no further argument that those whom God has allowed to be alive and remain until His work is finished on that would-be timeline, continue in sin where time does not exist--for they are with and in God in Christ. Which things are not only true, but written, only to unfold to these last generations in their time.​

 

[ScottA]

Three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

One such timeless mystery portrayed in the events of these times and days of revelations from God, is that which Jesus eluded to and was portrayed by his death and burial, which He foretold in this way, saying:

For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. Matthew 12:40​

Of which He first revealed as the overall master plan for salvation, saying:

‘Behold, I cast out demons and perform cures today and tomorrow, and the third day I shall be perfected.’ Luke 13:32​

Which are those same times defining the nature of God spread out over the times of men and this world by Christ, as elaborated by Paul, saying:

Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever. Hebrews 13:8​

This is the way of revelations from God through the scriptures, "precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept, Line upon line, line upon line, Here a little, there a little.” By which the Holy Spirit connects all the dots leading us unto "all truth", as promised and arranged by Jesus.

So then, the sign of the three days and nights like that of Jonah foretold and fulfilled by Christ in the heart of the earth, refers to the complete times of His work within our times for salvation, past, present, future, and forever. Which is not to say that the actual three days and nights that Jesus spent within the heart of the earth only portray all that He has actually done. But rather that they mean so much more, and that the context is not limited to the times of this world--even all the world, but is a thing of God forever. For which Paul explained further adding this line upon those previously given, saying:

Now this, “He ascended”—what does it mean but that He also first descended into the lower parts of the earth? He who descended is also the One who ascended far above all the heavens, that He might fill all things. Ephesians 4:9-10​

From which it is then correct to say that the above three days and nights include "all things." Which is to say, that what God has portrayed in the sign of Jonah, and in the three days and nights that Jesus spent in the heart of the earth, all portray God's salvation plans for all time, made perfect on the third day...which are these last times of the Holy Spirit.

Then comes the end.

 

[robert derrick]

Three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

One such timeless mystery portrayed in the events of these times and days of revelations from God, is that which Jesus eluded to and was portrayed by his death and burial, which He foretold in this way, saying:

For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. Matthew 12:40​

Of which He first revealed as the overall master plan for salvation, saying:

‘Behold, I cast out demons and perform cures today and tomorrow, and the third day I shall be perfected.’ Luke 13:32​

Which are those same times defining the nature of God spread out over the times of men and this world by Christ, as elaborated by Paul, saying:

Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever. Hebrews 13:8​

This is the way of revelations from God through the scriptures, "precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept, Line upon line, line upon line, Here a little, there a little.” By which the Holy Spirit connects all the dots leading us unto "all truth", as promised and arranged by Jesus.

So then, the sign of the three days and nights like that of Jonah foretold and fulfilled by Christ in the heart of the earth, refers to the complete times of His work within our times for salvation, past, present, future, and forever. Which is not to say that the actual three days and nights that Jesus spent within the heart of the earth only portray all that He has actually done. But rather that they mean so much more, and that the context is not limited to the times of this world--even all the world, but is a thing of God forever. For which Paul explained further adding this line upon those previously given, saying:

Now this, “He ascended”—what does it mean but that He also first descended into the lower parts of the earth? He who descended is also the One who ascended far above all the heavens, that He might fill all things. Ephesians 4:9-10​

From which it is then correct to say that the above three days and nights include "all things." Which is to say, that what God has portrayed in the sign of Jonah, and in the three days and nights that Jesus spent in the heart of the earth, all portray God's salvation plans for all time, made perfect on the third day...which are these last times of the Holy Spirit.

Then comes the end.

The third day was on the cross, where He was perfected by death of His soul in baring our sins and separated from God for three hours: he hung there bodily for three hours experiencing being a sinner that sinned, thought not by His own sin. This the what He feared in the garden, and so was made perfect in the fear of the Lord to obey anyway.

And then He was made a quickening living Spirit in the mortal body once again, as being born again, and finally said it was enough and departed from the body, to leave it dead and hanging on the cross.

Like Jesus, them born again can know what it is like to be dead souls in sins and trespasses, and then again a living soul in mortal bodies. But unlike Jesus, He is that quickening Spirit that we have, and He was able to then depart His own mortal body at will, which is why the Centurion declared Him to be the Son of God.

The normal death of crucifixion is a final breath after much prolonged suffering and wearing away the will to live, not a by a crying out: anyone with enough strength to still be crying out is not ready to die on a cross.

The third day is not that of the heart of the earth, where He simply went by the Spirit to preach to them in hell and them in Abraham's bosom, 'imprisoned' until the time of reformation.

He was there three days, because He prophesied it of Himself on earth.

Scripture interprets itself.

 

[ScottA]

Christ Jesus is the apex and center of "a time, times, and half a time" spoken of by Daniel, wherein the midst He made an end of sacrifices. Which are the seventy weeks appointed.

What was before revealed regarding that which was "before the foundation of the world", pertained to all things before the cross. What is now also revealed is that all that is written of these times since the cross, was before the foundation laid by Christ the Cornerstone, Christ the firstfruits. As it is written:

Galatians 2:20
I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.​

 

[robert derrick]

If you understand the concept--that is, when the truth of our timeless God cannot be said any other way but in His own timeless way.

Apparently, for new mysteries to now be revealed, they can only be revealed in no other way than new mystery-speak, and no more with the plainness of speech of the simple prophets and apostles of old.

The mystery that I am speaking of here and now is akin to the mystery of things fulfilled "before the foundation of the world." If you understand the concept--that is, when the truth of our timeless God cannot be said any other way but in His own timeless way...that truth comes out as it actually is [with God] rather than the way it would appear [among men].

I.e. The mystery for the first time revealed, is how God is now revealing in His own timeless way, new revelation of truth, known from the beginning, which comes out now spiritually only, which is God, and not in the way it would appear among men on paper: Scripture.

I.e.e. New revelation of truth from God today, need not be confirmed by writings of prophets and apostles of old, already appearing on paper among men.

This is an old concept of false prophecy and apostleship, only written in a new mystery-speak way, With a dash of Scripture, though entirely unnecessary, to bring it out.

A false prophet and apostle is anyone preaching any new truth of the gospel of God, that is not plainly confirmed in the full truth of Scripture already given and appearing among men with ink and paper.

This old concept I reject. I prefer bickering over letters of Scripture, that appear before my very own eyes.

Yes, I am a spiritual coward that refuses to fly above the clouds, where things do not appear in sight of man, to receive truth by God Himself, to show to man beneath the clouds, that has never before appeared on paper before, including old unfinished letters of Scripture.

In fact many passages in the scriptures are stated [correctly] in past tense when it was unavoidable.

It's good to know at least some Scriptures are written correctly on paper appearing among men.

But it doesn't end with just those things that have only been eluded to, like saying those who are in Christ "were" crucified with Him. No, when "all truth" is commonly understood--all things will find their place in God..."before the foundation of the world"...and..."before the foundation of the new heavens and the new earth" in Christ, and in His time.

Whoa. I had not suspected something quite so revelationary: the foundation of the new heaven and earth is now being revealed in Christ?

However, there is already the heresy of the resurrection is past, including receiving immortal resurrected bodies, which would mean that the reign of Christ with His resurrected saints has already been on this earth, which would mean that the time at hand now, is the judgment of the dead, and founding of the new heavens and new earth.

Now, since some preach the resurrection is past with immortal spiritual bodies, and the reign with them is passing, then this founding of the new heavens and earth, is while this old heaven and earth remains!

Now that is cool. Beyond delusion, but cool. Truly this is where no man has gone so far before, The new heavens and earth being founded now at this time on this earth.

That would make it the newer mystery revealed in this time, even greater than the first mystery of the foundation of old, so much greater than the first, as is the new heavens and earth are greater than the old heaven and earth!!

It's so much more fun once the mystery-speak code is cracked, than to be sitting around scratching our heads wondering, "wha?"

 

[robert derrick]

The title is correct. This is the first time I have ever heard anyone ever flying so high, as to declare the mystery of their establishing the foundation of the new heavens and earth by personal revelation of God, while the old earth is still standing.

Is that because it is the greatest heresy of all time, or because it is just so laughable, that God does not even bother rebuking it in Scripture of the apostles?

 

[ScottA]

Apparently, for new mysteries to now be revealed, they can only be revealed in no other way than new mystery-speak, and no more with the plainness of speech of the simple prophets and apostles of old.



I.e. The mystery for the first time revealed, is how God is now revealing in His own timeless way, new revelation of truth, known from the beginning, which comes out now spiritually only, which is God, and not in the way it would appear among men on paper: Scripture.

I.e.e. New revelation of truth from God today, need not be confirmed by writings of prophets and apostles of old, already appearing on paper among men.

This is an old concept of false prophecy and apostleship, only written in a new mystery-speak way, With a dash of Scripture, though entirely unnecessary, to bring it out.

A false prophet and apostle is anyone preaching any new truth of the gospel of God, that is not plainly confirmed in the full truth of Scripture already given and appearing among men with ink and paper.

This old concept I reject. I prefer bickering over letters of Scripture, that appear before my very own eyes.

Yes, I am a spiritual coward that refuses to fly above the clouds, where things do not appear in sight of man, to receive truth by God Himself, to show to man beneath the clouds, that has never before appeared on paper before, including old unfinished letters of Scripture.



It's good to know at least some Scriptures are written correctly on paper appearing among men.



Whoa. I had not suspected something quite so revelationary: the foundation of the new heaven and earth is now being revealed in Christ?

However, there is already the heresy of the resurrection is past, including receiving immortal resurrected bodies, which would mean that the reign of Christ with His resurrected saints has already been on this earth, which would mean that the time at hand now, is the judgment of the dead, and founding of the new heavens and new earth.

Now, since some preach the resurrection is past with immortal spiritual bodies, and the reign with them is passing, then this founding of the new heavens and earth, is while this old heaven and earth remains!

Now that is cool. Beyond delusion, but cool. Truly this is where no man has gone so far before, The new heavens and earth being founded now at this time on this earth.

That would make it the newer mystery revealed in this time, even greater than the first mystery of the foundation of old, so much greater than the first, as is the new heavens and earth are greater than the old heaven and earth!!

It's so much more fun once the mystery-speak code is cracked, than to be sitting around scratching our heads wondering, "wha?"

I am not going to entertain your mockery of what Jesus clearly explained was "not revealed by flesh and blood but by My Father in heaven."

Weeping and gnashing of teeth await.

 

[ScottA]

The title is correct. This is the first time I have ever heard anyone ever flying so high, as to declare the mystery of their establishing the foundation of the new heavens and earth by personal revelation of God, while the old earth is still standing.

Is that because it is the greatest heresy of all time, or because it is just so laughable, that God does not even bother rebuking it in Scripture of the apostles?

I guess that means you have not read of Paul's revealing of mysteries, true since the beginning but reserved until the appointed time.

 

[robert derrick]

I am not going to entertain your mockery of what Jesus clearly explained was "not revealed by flesh and blood but by My Father in heaven."

Weeping and gnashing of teeth await.

Jesus explained that confessing Him as Christ, is not by a carnal mind figuring that out by sight, but is only revealed in the heart by the Spirit to believe and obey Him as such.

It does not mean that we have new revelation of truth of Christ and His gospel, that is not already revealed by the Scriptures already written by flesh and blood prophets and apostles.

Be careful with your accusations of mocking Jesus. I may have to report you for that. You are not Jesus. Nor His new revelation of truth apostle.

I guess that means you have not read of Paul's revealing of mysteries, true since the beginning but reserved until the appointed time.

And so, it is not denied that new revelation of truth to found the new heaven and earth is here. Now, we look forward to hearing what that foundation is.

And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.

I guess this ends the debate about who the new revelation 12th apostle of the Lamb is.

I really didn't expect that the resurrection has passed, including obtaining immortals spiritual bodies, would only be a stepping stone to the new revelation of the new Jerusalem.

Well, it's always better to jump high, than to jump low.

 

[ScottA]

Jesus explained that confessing Him as Christ, is not by a carnal mind figuring that out by sight, but is only revealed in the heart by the Spirit to believe and obey Him as such.

It does not mean that we have new revelation of truth of Christ and His gospel, that is not already revealed by the Scriptures already written by flesh and blood prophets and apostles.

Be careful with your accusations of mocking Jesus. I may have to report you for that. You are not Jesus. Nor His new revelation of truth apostle.

Okay...let's nail it down then:

Do you accept or reject that Christ has arranged leading us unto "all truth" by the Spirit of Truth during these times, which was not yet "all" when the gospels were written or is even "all" to this day?
​

 

[robert derrick]

Okay...let's nail it down then:

Do you accept or reject that Christ has arranged leading us unto "all truth" by the Spirit of Truth during these times, which was not yet "all" when the gospels were written or is even "all" to this day?
​

I appreciate plainness of speech. Thanks.

Of course I reject it, because Scripture teaches against another gospel being revealed by angels or men.

The only truth of the gospel and doctrine of Christ revealed to man by God, is found only in Scripture already written by the prophets and the apostles.

All the truth, that the Spirit of truth guides us into, is the truth written and revealed in Scripture only.

Anything taught as truth of the gospel of salvation and justification by Christ, that is not already written, it is another gospel of a false christ.

If you or any man thinks an angel or spirit has revealed something true about the gospel of Jesus Christ, that is not already preached in the Scriptures, then it is cursed, and is the depths of Satan taught for the deep things of God.

I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.

But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

Now, if you have seen things of the heavens, then fine, but if you begin to teach it as gospel, and it is not confirmed by Scripture, not fine.

And one thing is certain for sure: the resurrection is not past, and no man has yet to receive his immortal spiritual body, except for Jesus.

And if anyone teaches it as a manner of soul separation from ongoing sinning of the mortal body, then it is spiritualized delusion from the prince and power of the air.