Absent from the Body, what did Paul mean?

[Hobie]

Here is the verse in question..
2 Corinthians 5:8 King James Version (KJV)
8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

We were studying how in the Bible how there are difficult passages and we kind of came to the following point. That no truly honest reader of the scriptures would deny the fact that there are things in the Bible that are difficult to understand, and this issue seems to be one of them, but lets take a look. There are many who ask if the text in 2 Corinthians 5:8 does not say that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. One does not equal the other. Here is the verses from 2 Corinthians 5:1-8:

2 Corinthians 5:1-8 King James Version (KJV)
"1 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.
2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven:
3 If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked.
4 For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life.
5 Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit.
6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:
7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight
8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord."

Paul appears to many people to be saying that something better than our current lives, namely being in the presence of God, awaits us after death. The language he uses seems to imply that life after death exists apart from our bodies and will continue on in spiritual form. To understand what Paul is saying, we must look at the comparison of being clothed as we go through the verses.

Paul introduces an earthly house and a heavenly house in verse 1, and in verse 2 states our condition while in the earthly house. He tells us in verse 2 and 3 what we desire in that state, to be "clothed upon with our house which is from heaven:" and "If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked". Paul in verse 4 then states the result of being clothed with the house from heaven. Now in verse 5 he says God "hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit", with "earnest" meaning a assurance or pledge. So the Spirit is pledge that mortality shall eventually be swallowed up of life. Verse 6, Paul states the grounds of his confidence, and verse 7 how a Christian should live. In verse 8, Paul just repeats a willingness to be absent from the body and to be with the Lord.

Paul uses clothing metaphors, and likens our existing mortal bodies with an "earthly house" or tent, and says we should not worry if it is destroyed because we have a building from God that awaits us. It doesn't say we will be in God's presence without a body; rather, Paul simply says we will not have this body. As we read in verse 4, Paul specifically says he does not want to be "unclothed" (without a body), but rather further clothed or different body. We currently wear a mortal body, but in God's presence after the resurrection we 'must put on' an immortal one.

So Paul is saying he prefers to be absent from the body which is the corrupted mortal one and present with the Lord when we will be clothed in a changed one, which we find is after the resurrection. When we stand in God's presence, we will not be in the same body we have now. The house from heaven is eternal or immortal and represents the state of immortality that awaits the redeemed beyond the resurrection.

1 Corinthians 15:51-53 King James Version (KJV)
"51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality."

We will all see the truth for sure at the resurrection...

 

[Hobie]

No one is immortal and do not receive what is a conditional gift and become immortal until the resurrection, the first resurrection of the righteous as after that is the resurrection of damnation of the wicked going to perdition.

1 Timothy 6:16
Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

God alone is immortal, and scripture shows that man is not, and awaits the resurrection.
1 Corinthians 15:51-54
51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

So if God alone has immortality, then the human soul cannot. The idea that every human being that is born into the world will exist for eternity from that point on, whether in the flesh, or in some other form, is not biblical. If in fact, there were no death, that is the end of life, nonexistence, then why do the scriptures make the promise of eternal life to the believer so very many times? This would be a silly promise to make to beings that are already immortal.

I John 5:10-12
10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.
11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
12 He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

God has given us eternal life through his Son. This is not something we posses in and of ourselves, but only as we believe in the Son of God. The Lord Jesus Christ, who became one of us, is also verily God and therefore immortal. If we attach ourselves to him, then we to have immortality. This is not however, on account of anything in us, but only because we have accepted the death of the Lord Jesus Christ in our own lives, that the life of the Son might also be in us. Thus the believer inherits eternal life on account of the Son.

John 3:14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:
15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.
16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

per·ish (pµr“¹sh) v. per·ished, per·ish·ing, per·ish·es. --intr. 1. To die or be
destroyed, especially in a violent or untimely manner. 2. To pass from existence; disappear gradually. 3. Chiefly British. To spoil or deteriorate. --tr. To bring to destruction; destroy. --idiom. perish the thought. Used to express the wish that one not even think about something.

The contrast made in the above verses cannot be mistaken. Those who believe in the Son of man will not perish, but will have eternal life. To perish, is to die, to be destroyed, to pass from existence. This truth is repeated two times in a row by the Son of God. The opposite of eternal life, is death, which is non existence. To perish, and to live on through eternity burning in hell, are two very different things. If you have life, then you are alive. It doesn't matter where you are, or what is happening to you, life is life. Non existence is not life. These two things are opposites, and the Lord Jesus Christ uses them to show the difference between believers, and non believers. Non believers will not have life in any form. Now look at verse 54 again:

1 Corinthians 15:54
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

The apostle Paul points out clearly when the saved will receive immortality. It is at the resurrection, that is the second coming of Christ, that the saved will receive immortality. Those who must receive immortality, obviously do not posses it in and of themselves. It is at Christ's appearing that death is swallowed up in victory, not before.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Paul meant to be physically dead! It is that simple YOu misquote 1 Cor. 15. OUr souls and reborn spirits are immortal, at the rapture for teh church and then at teh first resurrection at Rev. 20 peoples mortal bodies will be given immortality.