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Discussion in 'Christian Theology Forum' started by HARK!, May 19, 2020.

  1. Hypocrite

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  2. Paul immitated Messiah in obedience,

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  3. Scofflaw

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  4. Forgery

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  1. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Exo 20:10, But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

    Jhn 5:8, Jesus saith unto him, Rise, take up thy bed, and walk.
    Jhn 5:9, And immediately the man was made whole, and took up his bed, and walked: and on the same day was the sabbath.
    Jhn 5:10, The Jews therefore said unto him that was cured, It is the sabbath day: it is not lawful for thee to carry thy bed.
    Jhn 5:11, He answered them, He that made me whole, the same said unto me, Take up thy bed, and walk.
    Jhn 5:12, Then asked they him, What man is that which said unto thee, Take up thy bed, and walk?
    Jhn 5:13, And he that was healed wist not who it was: for Jesus had conveyed himself away, a multitude being in that place.
    Jhn 5:14, Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.
    Jhn 5:15, The man departed, and told the Jews that it was Jesus, which had made him whole.
    Jhn 5:16, And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day.
    Jhn 5:17, But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work.
    Jhn 5:18, Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2020
  2. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    The real crux of the matter is we are to follow Jesus in His Resurrection, by being born again of His Holy Spirit.
    Rev. 20
    [6] Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power,...
    > Please notice that the word "hath" is in the present tense, as in now.

    > Who was/is the first Resurrection?
    Ans. Jesus"- I am the resurrection..."

    Are you are participant in His Resurrection?
    YOU ARE!! That is if 2 Peter 1:4 applies to you.
    2 Peter 1[4] Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
     
  3. HARK!

    HARK! Active Member

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    You've made a very interesting point. We should be rehearsing the resurrection in our lives; just as we rehearse the Moedim.


    (CLV) 1Jn 3:9
    Everyone who is begotten of God is not doing sin, for His seed is remaining in him, and he can not be sinning, for he is begotten of God.
     
  4. MattMooradian

    MattMooradian Member

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    I believe the scriptures tell us that we will all be priests when we get to Heaven. (1Pet.2:5-9; Rev. 1:6; 1Pet. 2:4-10).
     
  5. lforrest

    lforrest Well-Known Member Staff Member Admin

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    We are priests now, because the Holy Spirit is in us and we have direct access to the throne of God. Even our bodies are his temple. Unlike the ancient times when people would come from all over the world to bring their offerings to the Levite priests in the temple at Jerusalem, we no longer need to do that.
     
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  6. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    Actually the more truthful understanding in the Spirit is, everyone who is born again of God's Holy Spirit, is forgiven of all sin by the shed Blood of Christ. The Holy Spirit then takes up permanent residence in the believer, and because the Holy Spirit is HOLY, so then is the believer in that moment also holy thereafter.

    From the point of repentence towards God, and faith in Jesus, no longer does the Father see the sin of they who convert through God's Son. They are made to be a NEW creature literally.

    Therefore they ARE now forever sin-less before the Father, but while still dwelling in their flesh and bodies, they are NOT
    sin-free!
    That day of being "sin-free" will not take place until Jesus returns in all His Glory, wherein we are changed into His likeness of immortality.
     
  7. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    ^ correction: flesh and blood bodies...
     
  8. HARK!

    HARK! Active Member

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    More truthful than John....Wow!

    I'll just stick with scripture.

    (CLV) Mt 5:20
    For I am saying to you that, if ever your righteousness should not be superabounding more than that of the scribes and Pharisees, by no means may you be entering into the kingdom of the heavens.

    Definition of righteous

    1 : acting in accord with divine or moral law : free from guilt or sin
    Definition of RIGHTEOUS
     
  9. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Righteous can also be defined as right standing and relationship with God.

    Phl 3:9, And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2020
  10. HARK!

    HARK! Active Member

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    Here's what YHWH says:

    Deuteronomy 6:25

    And if we are careful to obey all this law before the LORD our God, as he has commanded us, that will be our righteousness."

    What's your source?
     
  11. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    The New Testament.

    Heb 8:13, In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

    2Co 3:6, Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.
    2Co 3:7, But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:
    2Co 3:8, How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?
    2Co 3:9, For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.
    2Co 3:10, For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.
    2Co 3:11, For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.
    2Co 3:12, Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:
    2Co 3:13, And not as Moses, which put a vail over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:
    2Co 3:14, But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.
    2Co 3:15, But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.
    2Co 3:16, Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.

    Which is not to say that the OT is completely unuseful.

    It does in fact contain exceeding great and precious promises by which we can become partakers of the divine nature (2 Peter 1:3-4). And all of scripture is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, and for instruction in righteousness (2 Timothy 3:16).

    However, the Old Testament means of coming to God is no longer what we go by. The Old Testament is in the New Testament revealed; and the New Testament is in the Old Testament concealed.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2020
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  12. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    The concept to understand is that if one does not have the righteousness of Christ within them, they shall not enter into the KoH/KoG.
    Romans 8:9 explains that concept also.
     
  13. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    There is, also, grace for the sinner who will in due time come to the knowledge of Christ's righteousness in his heart.

    As he continues in God's word, there is much therein that will minister to him that there is hope while he continues to be a sinner; that God will yet bring him through into the promised land if he will simply quietly hope in faith (Lamentations 3:26): and also continue to seek the LORD until that time comes when he will search after Him with all of his heart (Jeremiah 29:13)
     
  14. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    That is correct! You will have the righteousness which is of the Law, but THAT is not the Righteousness of God Himself!!
    Please see the simplicity of Christ in Romans 8:9.
    Remember, ONLY God is good!!
    Therefore one MUST HAVE the Spirit of God within themselves, in order to be declared by God, as ourselves as being good!
     
  15. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    So then, if you only have the righteousness of the Law, to God you are not "good" enough, and therefore are destined to destruction forever!
     
  16. HARK!

    HARK! Active Member

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    That verse make d no mention of the righteousness of YHWH. Let's not change the subject. It speaks of our righteousness.

    Deuteronomy 6:25

    And if we are careful to obey all this law before the LORD our God, as he has commanded us, that will be our righteousness."

    (CLV) Ec 1:9
    What occurred once, it shall occur again, And what was done, it shall be done again. There is nothing at all new under the sun.



    (CLV) 1Jn 5:3
    For this is the love of God, that we may be keeping His precepts. And His precepts are not heavy,



    (CLV) Dt 30:10
    when you hearken to the voice of Yahweh your Elohim to observe His instructions and His statutes, the ones written in this scroll of the law, once you return to Yahweh your Elohim with all your heart and with all your soul.

    (CLV) Dt 30:11
    For this instruction that I am enjoining on you today, it is neither too difficult for you, nor is it too far off.

    (CLV) Dt 30:12
    It is neither in the heavens for you to say: Who shall ascend to the heavens for us and take it for us and announce it to us that we may do it?

    (CLV) Dt 30:13
    Nor is it across the sea for you to say: Who shall cross across the sea for us and take it for us and announce it to us that we may do it?

    (CLV) Dt 30:14
    For the word is exceedingly near to you, in your mouth and in your heart, to do it.

    (CLV) Dt 30:15
    See! I have set before you today life and good, death and evil.

    (CLV) Dt 30:16
    If you should hearken to the instructions of Yahweh your Elohim that I am enjoining on you today, to love Yahweh your Elohim, to walk in His ways and to observe His instructions, His statutes and His ordinances, then you will live and multiply, and Yahweh your Elohim will bless you in the land where you are entering to tenant it.
     
  17. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Again,

    Phl 3:1, Finally, my brethren, rejoice in the Lord. To write the same things to you, to me indeed is not grievous, but for you it is safe.
    Phl 3:2, Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the concision.
    Phl 3:3, For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.
    Phl 3:4, Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more:
    Phl 3:5, Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;
    Phl 3:6, Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.
    Phl 3:7, But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.
    Phl 3:8, Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
    Phl 3:9, And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
     
  18. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    As "JBF" just quoted, in order to convince the "doubter" that the Law/Torah has nothing to do with the Salvation of God, through faith in Jesus, I emphasize the importance of understanding Phl 3:9,
    And be found in him,
    not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law,
    but [rather having] that which is through the faith of Christ, the
    righteousness which is of God by faith:
     
  19. HARK!

    HARK! Active Member

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    (CLV) Mt 7:21
    "Not everyone saying to Me `Lord! Lord!' will be entering into the kingdom of the heavens, but he who is doing the will of My Father Who is in the heavens.
    (CLV) Mt 7:22
    Many will be declaring to Me in that day, `Lord! Lord! Was it not in Your name that we prophesy, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name do many powerful deeds?'

    (CLV) Mt 7:23
    And then shall I be avowing to them that `I never knew you! Depart from Me, workers of lawlessness!'
     
  20. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Mat 5:20, For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

    Gal 2:21, I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

    Phl 3:9, And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
     
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