America in the Bible

[RANDOR]

DD...quote...And finally, if you have an alternate solution to the Intelligent Design sequence, Iron, Bronze, Clay, Silver, Gold = 4,3,5,2,1 = FIVE, then PLEASE present it. But to ignore this passage, is to ignore GOD HIMSELF.

Who said I'm ignoring it? I simply dont give it the importance you seem to place upon it. Eleswhere the order is different. So why should we make such an issue on this particular one, and ignore the others? Besides, the only grounds for believing the actual sequence, that is the words themselves, is divinely inspired, is to also believe that the entire Bible is word inspired. With this I would disagree. The Bible is thought inspired. The priniples, and standards and life lessons are divinely inspired. The specific words, and their sequences etc, are written by the individual author based on the visions etc he receives from God. The authors of the Bible do not aleways agree on how certain events eventuated, nor in some details, thus it can only be the principles these events teach us that are of Intelligent Design.The words of the Bible are those who wrote them, the thoughts and lessons they teach are God's.

AMEN BRAKELITE....................Only this knowledge can be given by your lord Jesus

Yes..........only a born again Christian who has been touched (physically) by Christ has such knowledge.

Proud of you..................for your testimony in Christ speaks the fruit....which was told...you will know my people by their fruits.

 

[DaDad]

Hi Randor,

Proud of you..................for your testimony in Christ

I guess I'm confused how ignoring Scripture and History is a testimony to anything but intellectual dishonesty. The book of John declares Jesus as the Word. So exactly how is it that YOU defy the Word, but claim to obey Jesus?!?

Dan. 2
41 And as you saw the feet and toes partly of potter’s clay and partly of iron, it shall be a divided kingdom
45 ... the iron, the bronze, the clay, the silver and the gold ... = 4,3,5,2,1 = FIVE


Per the above there are NOT Four world empires, but FIVE, -- with which History agrees.


With Best Regards,
DD

 

[brakelite]

Per the above there are NOT Four world empires, but FIVE, -- with which History agrees.


With Best Regards,
DD

No, they are not 5 world empires...they are four empires and the fourth, Rome, is divided. What you quote above, are the elements that make up those 4 empires. Gold, silver, bronze, iron. The introduction of clay into the mix is what divided the 4th empire, for the iron cotinues till the end. Same iron, same empire. But divided. The empire of Rome has never gone away. Pagan Rome was not conquered. It was assimilated into the clay of Papal Rome.

Your continuing inferences to...... intellectual dishonesty......You are more than welcome to treat Scripture as though it were a buffet line, picking some and disregarding others...... thus you not only discount Scripture, but you also discount History:...... false teaching:.......ignore GOD HIMSELF......

Ro 2:21 Thou therefore which teachest another, teachest thou not thyself? .... or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.

 

[DaDad]

Hi brakelite,

No, they are not 5 world empires...they are four empires ...

You keep using Scripture as the foundation for your argument, but treat GOD's Dan. 2:45 Intelligent Design sequence 4,3,5,2,1 as though it didn't exist. So yet again I invite you, RANDOR, and/or anyone else who promulgates a Scripturally and Historically unsound "four world empire" scenario, -- PLEASE OFFER AN ALTERNATE EXPLANATION FOR THE: Iron, Bronze, Clay, Silver, Gold = 4,3,5,2,1 sequence. (Please note that ignoring Dan. 2:45 is NOT an "alternate explanation".


And in this invitation, I propose that any reader consider what GOD says, versus what the adherents to church doctrines say:

Dan. 2
41 And as you saw the feet and toes partly of potter’s clay and partly of iron, it shall be a divided kingdom
45 ... the iron, the bronze, the clay, the silver and the gold ... = 4,3,5,2,1 = FIVE


FOUR or FIVE, -- let every man be persuaded in his own heart what Scripture says, and whether we now live in a "divided" 3-superpower era, with a pending one-world-government..


With Best Regards,
DD

 

[Eric E Stahl]

Ezekiel 38:13
13 Sheba, and Dedan, and the merchants of Tarshish, with all the young lions thereof, shall say unto thee, Art thou come to take a spoil? hast thou gathered thy company to take a prey? to carry away silver and gold, to take away cattle and goods, to take a great spoil?

Sheba and Dedan are Arab tribes in oil rich Arabia. Tarshish and its Young Lions are the revived Roman (Iron) empire with colonies (Including America). After Magog (Russia) and her allies are conquered the clay will be part of the empire again. The empire will go on to devoure the whole world. Apostate Christianity (Harlot Babylon) will ride on the back of the Empire where ever it conqueres.

Ezekiel 38:13
13 Sheba, and Dedan, and the merchants of Tarshish, with all the young lions thereof, shall say unto thee, Art thou come to take a spoil? hast thou gathered thy company to take a prey? to carry away silver and gold, to take away cattle and goods, to take a great spoil?

Sheba and Dedan are Arab tribes in oil rich Arabia. Tarshish and its Young Lions are the revived Roman (Iron) empire with colonies (Including America). After Magog (Russia) and her allies are conquered the clay will be part of the empire again. The empire will go on to devour the whole world. Apostate Christianity (Harlot Babylon) will ride on the back of the Empire where it conquers.

 

[DaDad]

Hi Eric,

I agree with your assessment regarding Arabia, but would also point out that "Tarshish" is England, and the "Young Lions" are NOT some ancient dead empire, but are the living Canada, Australia, and the United States, possibly with others, typical of Scotland.


With Best Regards,
DD

 

[Eric E Stahl]

Hi Eric,

I agree with your assessment regarding Arabia, but would also point out that "Tarshish" is England, and the "Young Lions" are NOT some ancient dead empire, but are the living Canada, Australia, and the United States, possibly with others, typical of Scotland.


With Best Regards,
DD

In Isaiah 23 Tyre whent back to her mother tarshish when Babylon destroyed Tyre. From history we know the people of Tyre went to Carthage in North Africa. There were colonies in England and Spain and the Island of Rhoads also. They all were taken over by Rome.

 

[DaDad]

In Isaiah 23 Tyre whent back to her mother tarshish when Babylon destroyed Tyre. From history we know the people of Tyre went to Carthage in North Africa. There were colonies in England and Spain and the Island of Rhoads also. They all were taken over by Rome.

In Psalms 48, "Tarshish" (the English Occupation forces) were removed, just as they had been by the "east wind" of the 1945 East India removal. Furthermore England is knows for it's seafaring heritage, exactly as Psalms 45 mirrors, "ships of Tarshish".

And finally, exactly who is resisting the Russian invasion of Ukraine, except for the U.S., U.K., and France?!?


With Best Regards,
DD

 

[Floyd]

In Psalms 48, "Tarshish" (the English Occupation forces) were removed, just as they had been by the "east wind" of the 1945 East India removal. Furthermore England is knows for it's seafaring heritage, exactly as Psalms 45 mirrors, "ships of Tarshish".

And finally, exactly who is resisting the Russian invasion of Ukraine, except for the U.S., U.K., and France?!?


With Best Regards,
DD

Interesting.
Floyd.

 

[DaDad]

To All,

... the "Young Lions" are NOT some ancient dead empire, but are the living Canada, Australia, and the United States, possibly with others, typical of Scotland.

For validation, one might wish to consider Daniel 11:5

5 “Then the king of the south shall be strong, but one of his princes shall be stronger than he and his dominion shall be a great dominion.

To keep in context, this verse follows the WWII depiction of Hitler's conquest (N, E., W., S.) with the loss of the same, and the division of Germany to the Western allies, and the Russians:

3 Then a mighty king shall arise, who shall rule with great dominion and do according to his will. 4 And when he has arisen, his kingdom shall be broken and divided toward the four winds of heaven, but not to his posterity, nor according to the dominion with which he ruled; for his kingdom shall be plucked up and go to others besides these.


As such, where the England's off-spring nations are depicted in Ezekiel 38 as "young lions", these are approximately the same nations are depicted in Daniel 11 "princes". And of course we know that between these off-spring nations that the United States came out of WWII as pre-eminent, and essentially became the "king of the south".

-- Please note that Russia (Bear) is the "king of the north", and England (Lion) is the "king of the south" with respect to lattitude; with China (Leopard, -- actually a "Tiger") as the "kings of the east", longitude. The "kings" plural would appear to suggest a dependence upon North Korea which has an enormous conventional arms inventory.


And finally, of one were to validate these above assignments, one could consider Rev. 13, where we see:

Mouth of the Lion, -- England, having commerce, finance, technology
Body of the Leopard (actually a "Tiger"), -- China, having a mass of population
Feet of the Bear, -- Russia, having 8M sq. miles, versus U.S., Canada, & China all having only 3M



With Best Regards,
DD

 

[brakelite]

To All,


For validation, one might wish to consider Daniel 11:5

5 “Then the king of the south shall be strong, but one of his princes shall be stronger than he and his dominion shall be a great dominion.

To keep in context, this verse follows the WWII depiction of Hitler's conquest (N, E., W., S.) with the loss of the same, and the division of Germany to the Western allies, and the Russians:

3 Then a mighty king shall arise, who shall rule with great dominion and do according to his will. 4 And when he has arisen, his kingdom shall be broken and divided toward the four winds of heaven, but not to his posterity, nor according to the dominion with which he ruled; for his kingdom shall be plucked up and go to others besides these.


As such, where the England's off-spring nations are depicted in Ezekiel 38 as "young lions", these are approximately the same nations are depicted in Daniel 11 "princes". And of course we know that between these off-spring nations that the United States came out of WWII as pre-eminent, and essentially became the "king of the south".

-- Please note that Russia (Bear) is the "king of the north", and England (Lion) is the "king of the south" with respect to lattitude; with China (Leopard, -- actually a "Tiger") as the "kings of the east", longitude. The "kings" plural would appear to suggest a dependence upon North Korea which has an enormous conventional arms inventory.


And finally, of one were to validate these above assignments, one could consider Rev. 13, where we see:

Mouth of the Lion, -- England, having commerce, finance, technology
Body of the Leopard (actually a "Tiger"), -- China, having a mass of population
Feet of the Bear, -- Russia, having 8M sq. miles, versus U.S., Canada, & China all having only 3M



With Best Regards,
DD

Hi. There is so much with which I disagree I do not know where to start. So what I shalloffer ia simply an alternative perspective of the prophecy (in particular that of Daniel 11 and leave it at that. I don't care to go into a debate over details, as we both view prophecy from entirely different perspectives...you from purely a futurist perspective, me from an historicist perspective. You see the majority of prophecy as pertaining to the end times, whereas I see prophecy as an unfolding of histroy from the time it was given, until the end of time. It is popintless to argue and debate with one another over details when we are coming from different directions.
So below I offer a short transcript from a historicist perspective of Daniel 11 and leave the readers to decide its relevance to the current discussion. This comes froma book writen over a hundred years ago by one Uriah Smith. He uses a number of historical rescources for this work, and the short piece I give here is only a small sample of the chapter 11 of Daniel...that part of the chapter which you see as pertinent to today, and which Smith affixes to ancient history.

Daniel 11.
Verse1 Also I in the first year of Darius the Mede, even I, stood to confirm and to strengthen him. 2 And now will I show thee the truth. Behold, there shall stand up yet three kings in Persia; and the fourth shall be far richer than they all: and by his strength through his riches he shall stir up all against the realm of Grecia.
We now enter upon a prophecy of future events, clothed not in figures and symbols, as in the visions of Daniel 2, 7, and 8, but given mostly in plain language. Many of the signal events of the world's history from the days of Daniel to the end of the world, are here brought to view. This prophecy, as Thomas Newton says, may not improperly be said to be a comment on and explanation of Daniel 8, a statement showing how clearly he perceived the connection between that vision and rest of the book of Daniel. [1]
Daniel's Last Vision Interpreted.--The angel Gabriel, after stating that he had stood in the first year of Darius to confirm and strengthen him, turns his attention to the future. Darius was dead, and Cyrus was now reigning. Three kings would yet stand up, or reign, in Persia, doubtless the immediate successors of Cyrus. These were Cambyses, son of Cyrus; Smerdis, an impostor; and Darius Hystaspes.
Xerxes Invades Greece.--The fourth king after Cyrus was Xerxes, son of Darius Hystaspes. He was famous for his wealth, a direct fulfillment of the prophecy stating that he should be "far richer than they all." He was determined to conquer the Greeks; therefore he set about organizing a mighty army, which Herodotus says numbered 5,283,220 men.

Xerxes was not content to stir up the East alone. He also enlisted the support of Carthage in the West. The Persian king fought Greece successfully at the famous battle of Thermopylae; but the mighty army was able to overrun the country only when the three hundred brave Spartans who held the pass were betrayed by traitors. Xerxes finally suffered disastrous defeat at the battle of Salamis in the year 480 B.C., and the Persian army made its way back again to its own country.
Verse 3 And a mighty king shall stand up, that shall rule with great dominion, and do according to his will. 4 And when he shall stand up, his kingdom shall be broken, and shall be divided toward the four winds of heaven; and not to his posterity, nor according to his dominion which he ruled: for his kingdom shall be plucked up, even for others beside those.
Xerxes was the last Persian king to invade Greece; and now the prophecy passes over six minor rulers to introduce the "mighty king." Alexander the Great.
After overthrowing the Persian Empire, Alexander "became absolute lord of that empire in the utmost extent in which it was ever possessed by any of the Persian kings." [2] His dominion comprised "the greater portion of the then-known habitable world." How well he has been described as "a mighty king,. . . that shall rule with great dominion, and do according to his will"! But he exhausted his energies in rioting and drunkenness, and when he died in 323 B.C., his vainglorious and ambitious projects when into sudden and total eclipse. The Grecian Empire did not go to Alexander's sons. Within a few years after his death, all his posterity had fallen victims to the jealousy and ambition of his leading generals, who tore the kingdom into four parts. How short is the transit from the highest pinnacle of earthly glory to the lowest depths of oblivion and death! Alexander's four leading generals--Cassander, Lysimachus, Seleucus, and Ptolemy--took possession of the empire.

"After the death of Antigonus [301 B.C.], the four confederated princes divided his dominions between them; and hereby the whole empire of Alexander became parted, and settled into four kingdoms. Ptolemy had Egypt, Libya, Arabia, Coele-Syria, and Palestine; Cassander, Macedon and Greece; Lysimachus, Thrace Bithynia, and some other of the provinces beyond the Hellespont and the Bosphorus; and Selecus all the rest. And these four were the four horns of the he-goat mentioned in the prophecies of the prophet Daniel, which grew up after the breaking off of the first horn. That first horn was Alexander, king of Grecia, who overthrew the kingdom of the Medes and Persians; and the other four horns were these four kings, who sprung up after him, and divided the empire between them. And these also were the four heads of the leopard, spoken of in another place of the same prophecies. And their four kingdoms were the four parts, into which, according to the same prophet, the 'kingdom of the mighty king (i.e., of Alexander) should be broken, and divided toward (i.e., according to the number of) the four winds of heaven,' among those four kings, 'who should not be of his posterity,' as neither of the four above-mentioned were. And therefore, by this last partition of the empire of Alexander, were all these prophecies exactly fulfilled." [3]
Verse 5 And the king of the south shall be strong, and one of his princes; and he shall be strong above him, and have dominion; his dominion shall be a great dominion.
King of the South.--The king of the north and the king of the south are many times referred to in the rest of this chapter. Therefore it is essential to an understanding of the prophecy to identify these powers clearly. when Alexander's empire was divided, the portions lay toward the four winds of heaven--north, south, east, est. These divisions may well be reckoned from Palestine, the central part of the empire. That division of the empire lying west of Palestine would thus constitute the kingdom of the west; that lying north, the kingdom of the north; that lying east, the kingdom of the east; and that lying south, the kingdom of the south.
During the wars and revolutions which followed for long ages, geographical boundaries were frequently changed or obliterated; old ones were wiped out, and new ones instituted. But whatever changes might occur, these first division of the empire must determine the names which these portions of territory should ever afterward bear, or we have no standard by which to test the application of the prophecy. In other words, whatever power at any time should occupy the territory which at first constituted the kingdom of the north, that power would be king of the north as long as it occupied that territory. Whatever power should occupy that which at first constituted the kingdom of the south, that power would so long be the king of the south. We speak of only these tow, because they are the only ones afterward spoken of in the prophecy, and because, in fact, almost the whole of Alexander's empire finally resolved itself into these two division.
The successors of Cassander were very soon conquered by Lysimachus, and his kingdom, Greece and Macedon, was annexed to Thrace. Lysimachus was in turn conquered by Seleucus, and Macedon and Thrace were annexed to Syria.
These facts prepare the way for an application of the text before us. The king of the south, Egypt, shall be strong. Ptolemy Soter annexed Cyprus, Phoenicia, Caria, Cyrene, and many islands and cities to Egypt. Thus was his kingdom made strong. But another of Alexander's princes is introduced in the expression, "one of his princes." This must refer to Seleucus Nicator, who, as already stated, by annexing Macedon and Thrace to Syria became possessor of three parts out of four of Alexander's dominion, and established a more powerful kingdom than that of Egypt.
Verse 6 And in the end of years they shall join themselves together; for the king's daughter of the south shall come to the king of the north to make an agreement: but she shall not retain the power of the arm; neither shall he stand, nor his arm: but she shall be given up, and they that brought her, and he that begat her, and he that strengthened her in these times.
King of the North.--There were frequent wars between the kings of Egypt and of Syria. Especially was this the case with Ptolemy Philadelphus, the second king of Egypt, and Antiochus Theos, third king of Syria. They at length agreed to make peace upon condition that Antiochus should put away his former wife, Laodice, and her two sons, and should marry Berenice, the daughter of Ptolemy Philadelphus. Ptolemy accordingly brought his daughter to Antiochus, bestowing with her an immense dowry.
"But she shall not retain the power of the arm;" that is, her interest and power with Antiochus. So it proved; for shortly afterward, Antiochus brought back to the court his former wife Laodice and her children. Then says the prophecy, "Neither shall he [Antiochus] stand, nor his arm," or posterity. Laodice, being restored to favor and power, feared lest in the fickleness of his temper Antiochus should again disgrace her by recalling Berenice. Concluding that nothing short of his death would be an effectual safeguard against such a contingency, she caused him to be poisoned shortly afterward. Neither did his children by Berenice succeed him in the kingdom, for Laodice so managed affairs as to obtain the throne for her eldest son Seleucus Callinicus.
"But she [Berenice] shall be given up." Laodice, not content with poisoning her husband Antiochus, caused Berenice and her infant son to be murdered. "They that brought her." All of her Egyptian women and attendants, in endeavoring to defend her, were slain with her. "He that begat her," margin, "whom she brought forth," that is, her son, who was murdered at the same time by order of Laodice. "He that strengthened her in these times," was doubtless her husband, Antiochus, or those who took her part and defended her.
Verse 7 But out of a branch of her roots shall one stand up in his estate, which shall come with an army, and shall enter into the fortress of the king of the north, and shall deal against them, and shall prevail: 8 and shall also carry captives into Egypt their gods, with their princes, and with their precious vessels of silver and of gold; and he shall continue more years than the king of the north. 9 So the king of the south shall come into his kingdom, and shall return into his own land.
The branch out of the same root with Berenice was her brother, Ptolemy Euergetes. He had no sooner succeeded his father Ptolemy Philadelphus in the kingdom of Egypt, than, burning to avenge the death of his sister Berenice, he raised an immense army and invaded the territory of the king of the north, Seleucus Callinicus, who with his mother Laodice reigned in Syria. He prevailed against them, even to the conquering of Syria, Cilicia, the upper parts beyond the Euphrates, and eastward to Babylon. But hearing that a sedition was raised in Egypt requiring his return home, he plundered the kingdom of Seleucus by taking forty thousand talents of silver and precious vessels and two thousand five hundred images of gods. Among these were the images which Cambyses had formerly taken from Egypt and carried into Persia. The Egyptians, being wholly given to idolatry, bestowed upon Ptolemy the title Euergetes, or the Benefactor, as a compliment for restoring their captive gods after many years.
"There are authors still extant," says Thomas Newton, "who confirm several of the same particulars. Appian informs us that Laodice having killed Antiochus, and after him both Berenice and her child, Ptolemy the son of Philadelphus to revenge these murders invaded Syria, slew Laodice, and proceeded as far as to Babylon. From Polybius we learn that Ptolemy, surnamed Euergetes, being greatly incensed at the cruel treatment of his sister, Berenice, marched with an army into Syria, and took the city of Seleucia, which was kept for some years afterward by the garrisons of the kings of Egypt. Thus did he 'enter the fortress of the king of the north.' Polyaenus affirms that Ptolemy made himself master of all the country from Mount Taurus as far as to India without war or battle; but he ascribes it by mistake to the father instead of the son. Justin asserts that if Ptolemy had not been recalled by a domestic sedition into Egypt, he would have possessed the whole kingdom of Seleucus. So the king of the south came into the kingdom of the north, and then returned into his own land. He likewise 'continued more years than the king of the north;' for Seleucus Callinicus died in exile of a fall from his horse, and Ptolemy Euergetes survived him about four or five years."

I will happily furnish the remainder of this chapter of this interesting account of history and its fulfilment of prophecy for any who may be interested, or can provide a link that yt ou may read for yourself. It is only the last 5 verses of chapter 11 of Daniel that are yet to be fulfilled, although they are in the process of being fulfilled as we speak.

 

[DaDad]

Hi brakelite,

Hi. There is so much with which I disagree I do not know where to start. ...

Daniel 11.
Verse1 Also I in the first year of Darius the Mede, even I, stood to confirm and to strengthen him.

... The angel Gabriel, after stating that he had stood in the first year of Darius to confirm and strengthen him ...

I'm always surprised how so many "disagree" with a doctrine, but provide an explanation which defies intelligent thought.

How is it that a VICTORIOUS "Darius" needs strengthening?!?

After the U.S. defeated Germany and Japan, did we need someone to tell us how powerful we were?!?

When Muhammad Ali beat the more powerful George Foreman, did he need someone to say he's the Greatest?!?

After all his racing success, did Dale Earnhardt need someone to tell him is a Great race car driver?!?

Does Jesus need us to tell him that HE is LORD of all?!?


Conversely, losers need strengthening, and such was the foreboding future of Darius.


And if you're not convinced, please feel free to resolve 1:21 versus 10:1 where 1:21 says Daniel was "broken", haiah, which Calvin perceived, but discounted due to his confusion regarding Dan. 10:1, and FALSE rendering of Daniel 11.

Expositors are puzzled with this verse, because, as we shall afterwards see, the Vision occurred to Daniel in the third year of Cyrus’s reign. Some explain the word haiah, by to be “broken;” but this is by no means in accordance with the history.

The TRUTH is, Calvin and the expositors have the haiah exactly correct.



With Best Regards,
DD

 

[brakelite]

Hi brakelite,


I'm always surprised how so many "disagree" with a doctrine, but provide an explanation which defies intelligent thought.

How is it that a VICTORIOUS "Darius" needs strengthening?!?

After the U.S. defeated Germany and Japan, did we need someone to tell us how powerful we were?!?

When Muhammad Ali beat the more powerful George Foreman, did he need someone to say he's the Greatest?!?

After all his racing success, did Dale Earnhardt need someone to tell him is a Great race car driver?!?

Does Jesus need us to tell him that HE is LORD of all?!?


Conversely, losers need strengthening, and such was the foreboding future of Darius.


And if you're not convinced, please feel free to resolve 1:21 versus 10:1 where 1:21 says Daniel was "broken", haiah, which Calvin perceived, but discounted due to his confusion regarding Dan. 10:1, and FALSE rendering of Daniel 11.

Expositors are puzzled with this verse, because, as we shall afterwards see, the Vision occurred to Daniel in the third year of Cyrus’s reign. Some explain the word haiah, by to be “broken;” but this is by no means in accordance with the history.

The TRUTH is, Calvin and the expositors have the haiah exactly correct.



With Best Regards,
DD

LOL, I think you pulled the trigger before you loaded the rifle...all I hear is a diminutive click, not even the surprise of a blank.
Are you aware that the numbering and chapter insertions weren't added until a couple of thousand years after Daniel penned these words? So before you so hastily criticise, you may need to go back just a smidgeon and find out who precisely is doing the strengthening, and who precisley it is who needs it.

Daniel 10:18 Then there came again and touched me one like the appearance of a man, and he strengthened me,
19 And said, O man greatly beloved, fear not: peace be unto thee, be strong, yea, be strong. And when he had spoken unto me, I was strengthened, and said, Let my lord speak; for thou hast strengthened me.
20 Then said he, Knowest thou wherefore I come unto thee? and now will I return to fight with the prince of Persia: and when I am gone forth, lo, the prince of Grecia shall come.
21 But I will shew thee that which is noted in the scripture of truth: and there is none that holdeth with me in these things, but Michael your prince.
1 ¶ Also I in the first year of Darius the Mede, even I, stood to confirm and to strengthen him.

 

[DaDad]

Good luck.

DaDad

 

[Floyd]

Brakelight:

I will happily furnish the remainder of this chapter of this interesting account of history and its fulfilment of prophecy for any who may be interested, or can provide a link that yt ou may read for yourself. It is only the last 5 verses of chapter 11 of Daniel that are yet to be fulfilled, although they are in the process of being fulfilled as we speak.


From Floyd.
Dr Ginsburg and Dr.Bullinger agree with your historic account.
They comment that from 11:21 to 12:3 is future (1912).
Floyd.

 

[DaDad]

To All who might be interested,

Daniel 11 is NOT an ancient prophecy.

1. The 10:1 context demands a Babylonian era.
2. Darius was the LAST Babylonian king, thus he had to be "strengthened".
3. The "three more" and "fourth" speak to the Silver - Medo/Persian; Bronze - Grecian; Iron - Roman; and Clay - "d ivided".
4. Newton readily discounted a Hellenistic fulfillment, and wrote a Roman fulfillment with also failed. Thus he refused to publish.
5. The prophecy is contiguous. (I.e., there is no "pause" between an ancient fulfillment and an end-time fulfillment.)
6. Daniel 2:39 explains the significance of "Greece".
7. Daniel's Chapters 5, 6, & 9 confirm Darius as a Babylonian king.
8. Daniel 7 agrees that the Lion, Bear, & Leopard (actually a "Tiger") are concurrent, in alignment with the King of the South, the King of the North, and the Kings of the East.
9. Daniel 7 agrees that the "dreadful" will be judged, in alignment with the verse 45 "he", -- United Nations --, judgement.
10. History confirms the Scriptural specifics as a modern interpretation.


If anyone follows an ancient fulfillment doctrine, they are forewarned, and do so at their own peril

Hope this helps,
DD

 

[shturt678]

To All who might be interested,

Daniel 11 is NOT an ancient prophecy.

1. The 10:1 context demands a Babylonian era.
2. Darius was the LAST Babylonian king, thus he had to be "strengthened".
3. The "three more" and "fourth" speak to the Silver - Medo/Persian; Bronze - Grecian; Iron - Roman; and Clay - "d ivided".
4. Newton readily discounted a Hellenistic fulfillment, and wrote a Roman fulfillment with also failed. Thus he refused to publish.
5. The prophecy is contiguous. (I.e., there is no "pause" between an ancient fulfillment and an end-time fulfillment.)
6. Daniel 2:39 explains the significance of "Greece".
7. Daniel's Chapters 5, 6, & 9 confirm Darius as a Babylonian king.
8. Daniel 7 agrees that the Lion, Bear, & Leopard (actually a "Tiger") are concurrent, in alignment with the King of the South, the King of the North, and the Kings of the East.
9. Daniel 7 agrees that the "dreadful" will be judged, in alignment with the verse 45 "he", -- United Nations --, judgement.
10. History confirms the Scriptural specifics as a modern interpretation.


If anyone follows an ancient fulfillment doctrine, they are forewarned, and do so at their own peril

Hope this helps,
DD

Thank you again for caring!

Only a head's up. Dan.10 sets the ground for chapters 11 & 12 regarding the suffereing of the people of God which is the burden of practically the entire revelation - the things they must suffer at the hand of the Antichrist.

Old Jack, ie, waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay beyond and after the Babylonian era.

 

[DaDad]

To All,

If you wish to comment on the following points, but don't have anything to say, please wait until you have something to say.


Daniel 11 is NOT an ancient prophecy.

1. The 10:1 context demands a Babylonian era.
2. Darius was the LAST Babylonian king, thus he had to be "strengthened".
3. The "three more" and "fourth" speak to the Silver - Medo/Persian; Bronze - Grecian; Iron - Roman; and Clay - "divided".
4. Newton readily discounted a Hellenistic fulfillment, and wrote a Roman fulfillment which also failed. Thus he refused to publish.
5. The prophecy is contiguous. (I.e., there is no "pause" between an ancient fulfillment and an end-time fulfillment.)
6. Daniel 2:39 explains the significance of "Greece".
7. Daniel's Chapters 5, 6, & 9 confirm Darius as a Babylonian king.
8. Daniel 7 agrees that the Lion, Bear, & Leopard (actually a "Tiger") are concurrent, corresponding with the King of the South, the King of the North, and the Kings of the East.
9. Daniel 7 agrees that the "dreadful" will be judged, corresponding with the verse 45 "he", -- United Nations --, judgement.
10. History confirms the Scriptural specifics as a modern interpretation.


If anyone follows an ancient fulfillment doctrine, they are forewarned, and do so at their own peril

Hope this helps,
DD

 

[Floyd]

Thank you again for caring!

Only a head's up. Dan.10 sets the ground for chapters 11 & 12 regarding the suffereing of the people of God which is the burden of practically the entire revelation - the things they must suffer at the hand of the Antichrist.

Old Jack, ie, waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay beyond and after the Babylonian era.

Have you changed tack Jack?
Floyd.

 

[shturt678]

Have you changed tack Jack?
Floyd.

Thank you for your response again!

I try to keep to "America's last warning" which I adamantly agree with, however agreeing to disagree regarding the Biblical composition of the "warning" in the last nation on the planet that collectively still has some Biblical truths in the essentials of the faith. I'm trying to allow others to grasp that the "Kingdom of God" grounded in Daniel is first and foremost regarding Daniel then other concepts such as the Antichrist and etc.

The "composition of the warning" is and has been in Revelation chapter 9 in today's time for sure in preliminary judgments which only expound IIThess.2:11, 12. I keep trying to bring others back to this area to include IIThess.2:3, etc, and away from Daniel, ie, using Daniel as only the ground work.

Old agaping the Kingdom of God Jack