Are you just a mere creature of chance ?

[Thunder1]

Atheists, what are your ideas about it ?

 

[kalixx]

If we are not creatures of chance then we are here by design. If we are here by design then all the evil in this world is also by design. That is a big problem for me - and one that Christianity has never been able to answer. Why does a God of love allow babies to be born severely and painfully handicapped? Why does God allow torture and murder and wickedness on such a huge and monstrous scale, play hide and seek with us when we cry out in pain - and then tell us in the bible how he is a much better father than we could ever be?Is it not small wonder that it is difficult to believe in your God?

 

[Thunder1]

(kalixx;37121)
If we are not creatures of chance then we are here by design. If we are here by design then all the evil in this world is also by design. That is a big problem for me - and one that Christianity has never been able to answer. Why does a God of love allow babies to be born severely and painfully handicapped? Why does God allow torture and murder and wickedness on such a huge and monstrous scale, play hide and seek with us when we cry out in pain - and then tell us in the bible how he is a much better father than we could ever be?Is it not small wonder that it is difficult to believe in your God?
kalixx, which one you 'believe' , think we are ... just by chance or design ?

 

[David161099]

(kalixx;37121)
and one that Christianity has never been able to answer.
It's not up to Christianity to Answer it. You have to seek the answers yourself. I guess that's why you are on this spiritual journey.We all try to understand the reasons behind a lot of things.God and faith can help with that.... but someone won't just give you the answers (as you already know).

 

[Pildit]

What exactly do you mean by "mere creature of chance"?Are we talking evolution here? I'll take it as so, but if not correct me and I'll further my input.Chance has a great deal to do with it, by pure luck/chance many different events happened and circumstances occured that are perhaps very rare in the universe. How rare exactly obviously isn't known.However to some degree atoms, cells and life work together eventually not my chance but survival, learning and intelligence. Intelligence is relative though of course.And now I have to eat, so briefly. That's it.(Of course I'm open-minded, so if you want hard-core athiest. I'm not the person to ask.)

 

[Thunder1]

I meant everything just happened without reason... just happened and there is no purpose.

 

[Pildit]

(Thunder1;37182)
I meant everything just happened without reason... just happened and there is no purpose.
Speaking unreligiously (I'm choosing my words carefully here because I haven't thrown out the idea of religion), part of me believes there is a reason... however then the reasonING comes in heighinsight (I always forgot how to spell that word) so perhaps it's just an after thought of making sense of things.However of course what you do now can and does effect your future, okay maybe not EVERY little thing but things do. for example... had I not joined here, I wouldn't be talking to you now ... I may still have found God in some other way without joining here, but I would not be talking to you now.

 

[Thunder1]

(Pildit;37185)
Speaking unreligiously (I'm choosing my words carefully here because I haven't thrown out the idea of religion), part of me believes there is a reason... however then the reasonING comes in heighinsight (I always forgot how to spell that word) so perhaps it's just an after thought of making sense of things.However of course what you do now can and does effect your future, okay maybe not EVERY little thing but things do. for example... had I not joined here, I wouldn't be talking to you now ... I may still have found God in some other way without joining here, but I would not be talking to you now.
Pildit, do you think it's coincidence that you are in this forum ? I think I need to still go back to sleep for a while. It's 5.10am, I went to sleep late and today we are going to launch some rockets. But I like talking with you, so don't get me wrong. Me feeling sleepy... Hopefully talk to you later.

 

[Pildit]

(Thunder1;37193)
Pildit, do you think it's coincidence that you are in this forum ? I think I need to still go back to sleep for a while. It's 5.10am, I went to sleep late and today we are going to launch some rockets. But I like talking with you, so don't get me wrong. Me feeling sleepy... Hopefully talk to you later.
Coincidence in what way? I personally made the choice to come here.And no problem, I was up until 5-6am myself last night, so I know how that feels. Get some sleep!

 

[whirlwind]

(Pildit;37198)
Coincidence in what way? I personally made the choice to come here.And no problem, I was up until 5-6am myself last night, so I know how that feels. Get some sleep!
You may think you "personally made the choice to come here," but that is how He works. The more mature you become in His Word and with Him the more you see how He works.....this is no coincidence. I was born and raised in Mobile, Alabama. I married and we raised our two girls here. My husband's job required us moving to Houston but our girls were in college then and remained in Mobile.After a ten year period the business my husband worked for was sold and he found himself without employment. After much too long a period one of the "head hunters" called with a job offer....a good job offer. She said the bad part of this is you'll have to relocate....to Mobile,Alabama. So...it was back home for us where all of our family lives, exactly where we want to be, exactly where He wants us to be.There are no coincidences. If He guided you here just put on your seat belt because you may be in for quite a ride. Keep searching and you will find Him.Revelation 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear My voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with Me.Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:.....Whirlwind

 

[Pildit]

(whirlwind;37240)
You may think you "personally made the choice to come here," but that is how He works. The more mature you become in His Word and with Him the more you see how He works.....this is no coincidence. I was born and raised in Mobile, Alabama. I married and we raised our two girls here. My husband's job required us moving to Houston but our girls were in college then and remained in Mobile.After a ten year period the business my husband worked for was sold and he found himself without employment. After much too long a period one of the "head hunters" called with a job offer....a good job offer. She said the bad part of this is you'll have to relocate....to Mobile,Alabama. So...it was back home for us where all of our family lives, exactly where we want to be, exactly where He wants us to be.There are no coincidences. If He guided you here just put on your seat belt because you may be in for quite a ride. Keep searching and you will find Him.Revelation 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear My voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with Me.Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:.....Whirlwind
When I believed, I would have said the same thing "I was lead here" or something to that degree.But you know I have free will and as much as I maybe in his guidence. Guidence isn't force. He didn't force me to come here, I chose to.

 

[whirlwind]

(Pildit;37249)
When I believed, I would have said the same thing "I was lead here" or something to that degree.But you know I have free will and as much as I maybe in his guidence. Guidence isn't force. He didn't force me to come here, I chose to.
He doesn't "force" anyone Pildit....He gently leads, guides and directs. That is the same way He watches over us. How many times have you had a close call and wondered how you avoided an accident?......there are no coincidences....Whirlwind

 

[Wakka]

(kalixx;37121)
If we are not creatures of chance then we are here by design. If we are here by design then all the evil in this world is also by design. That is a big problem for me - and one that Christianity has never been able to answer. Why does a God of love allow babies to be born severely and painfully handicapped? Why does God allow torture and murder and wickedness on such a huge and monstrous scale, play hide and seek with us when we cry out in pain - and then tell us in the bible how he is a much better father than we could ever be?Is it not small wonder that it is difficult to believe in your God?
Copy and pasted from my post back in September.
Study the soil for a moment. It naturally produces weeds. No one plants them; no one waters them. They even stubbornly push through cracks of dry sidewalk. Millions of useless weeds sprout like there's no tomorrow, strangling our crops and ruining our lawns. Pull them out by the roots, and there will be more tomorrow. They are nothing but a curse!Consider how much of earth is uninhabitable. There are millions of square miles of barren deserts in Africa and other parts of the world. Most of Australia is nothing but miles and miles of useless desolate land.Not only that, but the earth is constantly shaken with massive earthquakes. Its shores are lashed with hurricanes; tornadoes rip though creation with incredible fury; devastating floods soak the land; and terrible droughts parch the soil. Sharks, tigers, lions, snakes, spiders, and disease-carrying mosquitoes attack humanity and suck its life's blood. The earth's inhabitants are afflicted with disease, pain, suffering, and death.Think of how many people are plagued with cancer, Alzheimer's, multiple sclerosis, heart disease, emphysema, Parkinson's, and a number of other debilitating illnesses. Consider all of the children with leukemia, or people born with crippling diseases or without the mental capacity to even feed themselves. All these things should convince thinking minds that something is radically wrong.Did God blow it when He created humanity? What sort of tyrant must our Creator be if this was His master plan?Sadly, many use the issue of suffering as an excuse to reject and thought of God, when its existence is the very reason we should accept Him. Suffering stands as terrible testimony to the truth of explanation given by the Word of God.But how can we know that the Bible is true? Simply by studying the prophecies of Matthew 24, Luke 21, and 2 Timothy 3. A few minutes of openhearted inspection will convince any honest skeptic that this is no ordinary book. It is the supernatural testament of our Creator about why there is suffering... and what we can do about it.The Bible tells us that God cursed the earth because of Adam's transgression. Weeds are a curse. So is disease. Sin and suffering cannot be separated. The Scriptures inform us that we live in a fallen creation. In the beginning, God created man perfect, and he lived in a perfect world without suffering. It was heaven on earth. When sin came into the world, death and misery came with it.Those who understand the message of Holy Scripture eagerly await a new heaven and a new earth wherein dwells righteousness. In that coming Kingdom there will be no more pain, suffering, disease, or death. We are told that no eye has ever seen, nor has any ear heard, neither has any man's mind ever imagined the wonderful things that God has in store for those who love Him (1 Corinthians 2:9). Think for a moment what it would be like if food grew with the fervor of weeds. Consider how wonderful it would be if the deserts became incredibly fertile, if creation stopped devouring humanity. Imagine if the weather worked for us instead of against us, if disease completely disappeared, if pain was a thing of the past, if death was no more.The dilemma is that we are like a child whose insatiable appetite for chocolate has cause his face to break out with ugly sores. He looks in the mirror and sees a sight that makes him depressed. But instead of giving up his beloved chocolate, he consoles himself by stuffing more into his mouth. Yet, the source of his pleasure is actually the cause of his suffering.The whole face of the earth is nothing but ugly sores of suffering. Everywhere we look we see unspeakable pain. But instead of believing God's explanation and asking Him to forgive us and change our appetite, we run deeper into sin's sweet embrace. There we find solace in it's temporal pleasures, thus intensifying our pain, both in this life and in the life to come.

 

[Pildit]

(whirlwind;37259)
He doesn't "force" anyone Pildit....He gently leads, guides and directs. That is the same way He watches over us. How many times have you had a close call and wondered how you avoided an accident?......there are no coincidences....Whirlwind
That can be explained by physics. Coincidence doesn't play a part.I'm not ruling out God here either, but I'm also aware that it can be explained by Physics.

 

[Thunder1]

Hi Pildit,How do you explain God's guidance by physics ?

 

[Wakka]

(Pildit;37270)
That can be explained by physics. Coincidence doesn't play a part.I'm not ruling out God here either, but I'm also aware that it can be explained by Physics.
How did physics come into existence? How did energy come into existence? Where did all of our life, all matter, the fact that little waves of energy give off color and light? It's God. The idea that it all happened by chance is stupid. And to be an atheist, and evolution takes much more faith believing in that lie than being a Christian.

 

[Pildit]

(Thunder1;37372)
Hi Pildit,How do you explain God's guidance by physics ?
Gods guidence COULD be explained by pyschology and to a degree the domino effect of events before the event in question.

 

[Pildit]

(Wakka;37373)
How did physics come into existence? How did energy come into existence? Where did all of our life, all matter, the fact that little waves of energy give off color and light? It's God. The idea that it all happened by chance is stupid. And to be an atheist, and evolution takes much more faith believing in that lie than being a Christian.
The word physics obviously comes from man, that's the simple naming of something that's always been around us we just didn't know of it before.Where did all this come from... well I think I've explained this before, science doesn't know that yet. The idea that it all just happened by chance isn't any more stupid than the idea that someone/some being created it all. As we don't know WHICH it is.Evolution doesn't take more faith than being a Christian, there is far more evidence for evolution than there is of the bible and the existence of God at this time. Proving that the bible was based on real people and places, even some events to some degree is far different that proving that Jesus is the son of God and that God exists. Granted that perhaps it's a step in the right direction but there would be much bigger steps and many more to take.

 

[Wakka]

(Pildit;37394)
The word physics obviously comes from man, that's the simple naming of something that's always been around us we just didn't know of it before.Where did all this come from... well I think I've explained this before, science doesn't know that yet. The idea that it all just happened by chance isn't any more stupid than the idea that someone/some being created it all. As we don't know WHICH it is.Evolution doesn't take more faith than being a Christian, there is far more evidence for evolution than there is of the bible and the existence of God at this time. Proving that the bible was based on real people and places, even some events to some degree is far different that proving that Jesus is the son of God and that God exists. Granted that perhaps it's a step in the right direction but there would be much bigger steps and many more to take.
No, you're just too blind to see the real truth offered to you. I'm being blunt and to the point.

 

[Pildit]

(Wakka;37414)
No, you're just too blind to see the real truth offered to you. I'm being blunt and to the point.
You've shown me NO evidence. The only thing that keeps being repeated to me is the fact that no-one knows how the universe came into existence therefore it MUST be God. God must have created it. Now I'm sorry but there is NO evidence for this either so to believe it anyway, is blind.