Aspen and Tigger 2 discuss 'who is God?'

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face2face

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I agree that no one verse spells out the Trinity, especially as you want to demand.

And possibly the way you would like it.
However, the point here is that Jesus is clearly portrayed here as having the same essence as God. I don't know how you can say this is a "fanciful notion" when the very word for essence/nature is used in this verse referring to Jesus and God. I mean, what word would you want the author of Hebrews to say if he were to appease your demands for the essence of Jesus being the same as God?

Your bold assumption requires closer examination.

If you believe that the Son is “the very image of the hypostasis of God”— you seem to like the Greek "the χαρακτὴρ τῆς ὑποστάσεως αὐτοῦ" if we are strictly analyzing the original Greek the term ὑπόστασις, can be argued....that it must imply something the Son is not!

(pause to consider)

Jesus cannot be said to be the image of something He already is. When we say image, we suggest two distinct things: firstly, the thing imaged and the thing imaging it. If the Son is the image of God’s hypostasis, then the hypostasis of God must be something which the Son does not share; it must be rather something which He is like. You say "The Son shares the Divine essence", however, hypostasis here cannot mean essence. It must be taken then in its alternative sense of “person”, which of course establishes the Biblical principle of God manifestation i.e Jesus manifested, revealed, made known the Character, or Person of God perfectly...to which, on some level you must agree. What the author of the Epistle is saying is that the Son is exactly like the Father in person.

Rather than dealing with your list of "Jesus is...", to which I could provide an equally long list of Scriptures proving Jesus' humanity - lets establish the above argument as an equally tenable interpretation of Hebrews 1:3.

In the Spirit of this OP which aims to consider "Who is God'...I put forth that God is Someone who delights in His Children "imitating" His Character and Person. God deems this imitating as being righteousness and therefore being justified in His eyes.

[Exodus 34:6,7 identifies the characteristics of God which should have been reflected (imaged) by the Israelite's as they administered the judgement of God, defending the fatherless and the widow. They transgressed and revealed the characteristics of the flesh.

For us we have been shown a Son of Man who obeyed His God and through obedience was given (not previously held) Hebrews 1:4 - an inherited name and position in the Heavens - made eternal and exalted therefore it can be said....

"Having become...." to mean, you cannot inherit something which is already your possession.

1 Corinthians 8:6 yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we live, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are all things and through whom we live.

I perceive if we conversed long enough you will learn the subtle difference between "from whom are all things and for whom we live" cmp "through whom are all things and through whom we live"

A difference discernible only by those to whom it has been revealed.

F2F
 
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101G

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Jesus cannot be said to be the image of something He already is. When we say image, we suggest two distinct things: firstly, the thing imaged and the thing imaging it. If the Son is the image of God’s hypostasis, then the hypostasis of God must be something which the Son does not share; it must be rather something which He is like. You say "The Son shares the Divine essence", however, hypostasis here cannot mean essence. It must be taken then in its alternative sense of “person”, which of course establishes the Biblical principle of God manifestation i.e Jesus manifested, revealed, made known the Character, or Person of God perfectly...to which, on some level you must agree. What the author of the Epistle is saying is that the Son is exactly like the Father in person.
This was an interesting read. U said, "Jesus cannot be said to be the image of something He already is". I have a question, "Is the flesh the Image of the Spirit?" yes or no. remember man is the IMAGE of God.

I'll be looking for your answer.

PCY.
 

face2face

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This was an interesting read. U said, "Jesus cannot be said to be the image of something He already is". I have a question, "Is the flesh the Image of the Spirit?" yes or no. remember man is the IMAGE of God.

I'll be looking for your answer.

PCY.

Greetings

It might be a little off topic (Who is God?).

We can start with Paul's words in Galatians 5 "For the Flesh (substance & thinking) is actively inclined against the Spirit (thinking), and the Spirit against the Flesh. Indeed these two forces constitute a pair of opposites at war with one another"

It is noted that the Spirit to which Paul refers, cannot be inherent in us like that of a bodily organ. It is the Spirit of God’s Son (or divine knowledge & wisdom), that God has sent into our minds and hearts (invasively perhaps). Galatians 4:6 for context.

How can that which is weak be the image of that which is strong? Is Isaac the image of Ishmael? Was Adams marred character and corrupting nature the image of Almighty God?

The key to understanding this subject is discovering how "dominion" relates to selem & dĕmût.

F2F
 

101G

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GINOLJC , to all. first thanks for the reply.
We can start with Paul's words in Galatians 5 "For the Flesh (substance & thinking) is actively inclined against the Spirit (thinking), and the Spirit against the Flesh. Indeed these two forces constitute a pair of opposites at war with one another"
The first thing one must understand who have been redeemed is this. you're not your "OWN", you have been bought with a price. first understand that. so it's the Spirit/God purchase. hence the upper case "S" in Spirit. knowing that, yet I live IN him. and he is my HELPER with the Flesh body we dwell in. supportive scripture, Romans 8:26 "Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered". so it is us, "spirit" who is at war with our flesh which is not yet redeemed.
It is noted that the Spirit to which Paul refers, cannot be inherent in us like that of a bodily organ. It is the Spirit of God’s Son (or divine knowledge & wisdom), that God has sent into our minds and hearts (invasively perhaps). Galatians 4:6 for context.
inherent in spirit. it is noted, Romans 8:1 "There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit". supportive scripture, Romans 8:5-9 "For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.Romans 8:6 "For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 "Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 8 "So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God. 9 "But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his". and this indwelling is noted in John chapter 14.
How can that which is weak be the image of that which is strong? Is Isaac the image of Ishmael? Was Adams marred character and corrupting nature the image of Almighty God?
ANSWER, Romans 8:20 "For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope". now as for Adam marred character and corrupting nature the image of Almighty God. 1 Corinthians 15:46 "Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. 47 "The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven".
now, was he that came in the IMAGE of God weaker or stronger? through weakness we're made strong. scripture, Romans 5:14 "Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come". understand, he "TOOK PART" in our weakness, (nature), so that we can be "PARTAKER" of his divine (NATURE), see 2 Peter 1:4.

PCY

and thanks for the Questions.
 
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face2face

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GINOLJC , to all. first thanks for the reply.

The first thing one must understand who have been redeemed is this. you're not your "OWN", you have been bought with a price. first understand that. so it's the Spirit/God purchase. hence the upper case "S" in Spirit. knowing that, yet I live IN him. and he is my HELPER with the Flesh body we dwell in. supportive scripture, Romans 8:26 "Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered". so it is us, "spirit" who is at war with our flesh which is not yet redeemed.

inherent in spirit. it is noted, Romans 8:1 "There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit". supportive scripture, Romans 8:5-9 "For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.Romans 8:6 "For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 "Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 8 "So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God. 9 "But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his". and this indwelling is noted in John chapter 14.

ANSWER, Romans 8:20 "For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope". now as for Adam marred character and corrupting nature the image of Almighty God. 1 Corinthians 15:46 "Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. 47 "The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven".
now, was he that came in the IMAGE of God weaker or stronger? through weakness we're made strong. scripture, Romans 5:14 "Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come". understand, he "TOOK PART" in our weakness, (nature), so that we can be "PARTAKER" of his divine (NATURE), see 2 Peter 1:4.

PCY

and thanks for the Questions.

101G
Noted is your liking of Romans 8 which happens to be my favourite section of the Bible.
You were not clear if you believe the Spirit was inherent from birth, or not...I'll assume you understand the nature of your calling and election.
F2F
 

101G

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101G
Noted is your liking of Romans 8 which happens to be my favourite section of the Bible.
You were not clear if you believe the Spirit was inherent from birth, or not...I'll assume you understand the nature of your calling and election.
F2F
GINOLJC to all. first thanks for your response. I believe I was clear. we have two births. 1 a natural birth in which we get a portion of the Spirit, in authority, which conducts his power, as well as our Faith. and 2. our birth from above which is inherent of the Spirit, is not in portion in authority, but in power.

PCY.
 

101G

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It is noted that the Spirit to which Paul refers, cannot be inherent in us like that of a bodily organ. It is the Spirit of God’s Son (or divine knowledge & wisdom), that God has sent into our minds and hearts (invasively perhaps). Galatians 4:6 for context.
I would like to ask you a question. the Spirit of the Son, Christ, is it not the same Spirit which is the Spirit of God, yes or no?.0
 

face2face

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GINOLJC to all. first thanks for your response. I believe I was clear. we have two births. 1 a natural birth in which we get a portion of the Spirit, in authority, which conducts his power, as well as our Faith.

PCY.

Not clear and still not clear.

Born with a portion of the Spirit?
 

101G

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Not clear and still not clear.

Born with a portion of the Spirit?
GINOLJC, to all. thanks for the response. second, if it's still not clear, 2 Corinthians 4:3: "But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:"

Good day, PCY.
 

face2face

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GINOLJC, to all. thanks for the response. second, if it's still not clear, 2 Corinthians 4:3: "But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:"

Good day, PCY.

Wow, that portion of spirit was very quick to give up on the hope that is in you! Next time practice patience, who knows, that gospel might one day be found.

F2F
 

101G

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Wow, that portion of spirit was very quick to give up on the hope that is in you! Next time practice patience, who knows, that gospel might one day be found.

F2F
no need to be patience. do you know what the portion of spirit is?

PCY.
 

Wormwood

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F2F,

Sorry for the slow response, I have been ill recently.

Jesus cannot be said to be the image of something He already is. When we say image, we suggest two distinct things: firstly, the thing imaged and the thing imaging it. If the Son is the image of God’s hypostasis, then the hypostasis of God must be something which the Son does not share; it must be rather something which He is like.

I think this is a real stretch and does not accurately reflect either the Greek or the concept of the Trinity.

1. Hypostasis indicates the "essence," "nature," or "basis" of something. Essentially, it is what makes something what it is. So, this is the very opposite of what you are suggesting. This text is not saying that Jesus is "something else" that is merely a resemblance of God, but Jesus is the very essence of what God is.
2. The text says that Jesus is the "exact imprint" of God's hypostasis (essence, nature, basis). The word here is "character." The Greek here implies that of a signet ring making an impression on a piece of wax. The "character" of the ring is EXACTLY represented in the impression. They are mirror images. The point here is not to say Jesus is something else that looks like God, but that what we see in the man, Jesus, is a completely perfect image of God's very being. In other words, if you were to take the unseen God and imprint who he is into something tangible, you would get Jesus. Another example would be a mirror. When you see yourself in the mirror, you aren't seeing something, or someone else that looks very very similar to you like a twin. No, you see yourself, exactly. The mirror simply reflects precisely your image. The same is true of Jesus. He is an exact image of God...God is spirit, but Jesus is the exact image of that invisible God revealed in flesh.
3. Finally, this text says Jesus is the "radiance" of "the glory." Thus, Jesus is the brilliance of God's essence or reality. Again, there is no way anyone reading this would come to the conclusion that Jesus is a completely distinct being that simply is a great deal like God. No, these words are very clear that this is way more than that. We do not distinguish the sun's brilliance and shining from the sun itself. We don't say the light, heat and shining in the sky merely looks like the sun but is something else. No, the emission of that light, heat and power is how we go about perceiving the sun itself.

In sum, this text is very specifically talking about the uniqueness of who Jesus is and WHY he is to be heeded with much more seriousness than even the OT Law. The message delivered by fire on the mountain to Moses was great, but nothing like the very essence and glory of God that has come to us and spoken in Jesus. This is why the author says:

“Therefore we must pay much closer attention to what we have heard, lest we drift away from it. For since the message declared by angels proved to be reliable, and every transgression or disobedience received a just retribution, how shall we escape if we neglect such a great salvation? It was declared at first by the Lord, and it was attested to us by those who heard,” (Hebrews 2:1–3, ESV)

What you are arguing would actually undermine the point the author is making here. If Jesus is less-than-God, and merely a close resemblance, then what would make his message and appearance of greater value and concern than the OT Law? Why would this compel a Jew to be even more concerned about the words of Jesus than the Words of the Law? No, the point here is that Jesus is NOT like an angel. He is not merely a messenger. He is not simply a higher being. He is the very imprint of God himself in human flesh and his radiance is the very glory of God....therefore, take heed and hear him with even greater reverence than that which God wrote with his finger into the tablets of stone.

Again, to see Jesus any other way is to make the entire foundation of the book of Hebrews completely impotent.

I have gone on too long, so I won't tackle the 1 Corinthians passage you quoted at this point. suffice it to say that I agree there is one God.
 
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face2face

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@Wormwood

Do you appreciate from my perspective the enormous leap one makes in forcing such a great volume of trinitarian logic upon a single Greek word, one which is also hotly debated by theologians who believe in the Trinity? Now I am not going to list all the various meanings of the word Hypostasis for surely you could not explain them all away, very few of which relate to nature. Rather, why not leave the book of Hebrews alone and press on to another book to support your argument?

Should this not suffice, I am more than willing to give you the historical interpretation for the word ὑπόστασις.

BTW I would love to continue with the OP on "Who is God" - without question "the" most important subject in forums worldwide.

I have a sneaking suspicion He is closer to the Israelite's in theological truth than Christianity - the acceptance of Jesus Christ as Gods only begotten Son will complete their knowledge.

Time will tell.

F2F
 
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101G

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I don't mean to get into your conversation. but looking at what been posted may I ask a question?.

at post read, "1. Hypostasis indicates the "essence," "nature," or "basis" of something. Essentially, it is what makes something what it is. ".

and this, "2. The text says that Jesus is the "exact imprint" of God's hypostasis (essence, nature, basis). The word here is "character." The Greek here implies that of a signet ring making an impression on a piece of wax. The "character" of the ring is EXACTLY represented in the impression. They are mirror images".

these are two good definitions, if used naturally, but not Spiritually. the exact imprint is not the RING. nor is the copy the original.

now what is correct here, it the statement "The word here is "character.". that I agree with, because the character or the characteristics is GOD. but the mirror image?.... how about this, Jesus is the ANOTHER of God himself in Flesh, not a mirror image, but actually God himself in flesh. why do I say this? the term Son used spiritually, or metaphorically is indicated as "character" according to the Vine's Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words. just look up the word Son, G5207, huios. the Lord Jesus is the Holy Spirit "shared" in flesh. not a mirror image, but the EQUAL share in flesh. and I know the first question is "how". answer, G243, Allos.

take note, no image is the source, meaning EQUAL to. but if one is equal "WITH" then it's not a image, but the source. supportive scripture, Philippians 2:6 "Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God". if something or someone is "EQUAL WITH" then it is the source, and not the image. the only image of God is in the FLESH, and not the Spirit. the essence of God is correct in Spirit, that as said I agree with. but the image of God is man, meaning God in flesh. supportive scripture, Romans 5:14 "Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come".

the word "figure" here is "IMAGE"

PCY.
 

face2face

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now what is correct here, it the statement "The word here is "character.". that I agree with, because the character or the characteristics is GOD. but the mirror image?.... how about this, Jesus is the ANOTHER of God himself in Flesh, not a mirror image, but actually God himself in flesh. why do I say this? the term Son used spiritually, or metaphorically is indicated as "character" according to the Vine's Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words. just look up the word Son, G5207, huios. the Lord Jesus is the Holy Spirit "shared" in flesh. not a mirror image, but the EQUAL share in flesh. and I know the first question is "how". answer, G243, Allos.

PCY.

You were on the right track with Character = God manifestation as in phanerosis (φανέρωσις, 5321), “a manifestation”, occurs in 1 Corinthians 12:7 and 2 Corinthians 4:2. In Romans 8:19 , kjv, apokalupsis, “an uncovering, laying bare, revealing, revelation,” is translated “manifestation” (rv, “revealing”). Now the revelation of the Sons of God (including Jesus Christ - yes a Son!) is not the manifestation of a shared divine nature, Christ himself took part in our nature (no hybrid) it was like sinful flesh (Rom 8:1-5) or better rendered, he "had sin prone nature" and for good reason.

How can you overcome a nature and thinking if its not fully in your possession?

This is why Heb 2 was written - Hebrews 2:14 Therefore, since the children (You and I) share in flesh and blood, he (Jesus) likewise shared in their humanity, so that through death he could destroy the one who holds the power of death (that is, the devil - devil here is sin which only has the power of death ), 2:15 and set free those who were held in slavery all their lives by their fear of death.

Same goes for us:

To him who overcomes, I will grant to eat Rv 2:7 3528
He who overcomes will not be hurt by the Rv 2:11 3528
To him who overcomes, to him I will give Rv 2:17 3528
‘He who overcomes, and he who keeps My Rv 2:26 3528
‘He who overcomes will thus be clothed in Rv 3:5 3528
‘He who overcomes, I will make him a Rv 3:12 3528
‘He who overcomes, I will grant to him to Rv 3:21 3528
He who overcomes will inherit these things, Rv 21:7 3528

These are simple things 101G, but Christianity and its many philosophies have complicated the Gospel.

No preexistence of Christ - No hypostatic nature - no triune god.

F2F
 

101G

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You were on the right track with Character = God manifestation as in phanerosis (φανέρωσις, 5321), “a manifestation”, occurs in 1 Corinthians 12:7 and 2 Corinthians 4:2. In Romans 8:19 , kjv, apokalupsis, “an uncovering, laying bare, revealing, revelation,” is translated “manifestation” (rv, “revealing”). Now the revelation of the Sons of God (including Jesus Christ - yes a Son!) is not the manifestation of a shared divine nature, Christ himself took part in our nature (no hybrid) it was like sinful flesh (Rom 8:1-5) or better rendered, he "had sin prone nature" and for good reason.

How can you overcome a nature and thinking if its not fully in your possession?

This is why Heb 2 was written - Hebrews 2:14 Therefore, since the children (You and I) share in flesh and blood, he (Jesus) likewise shared in their humanity, so that through death he could destroy the one who holds the power of death (that is, the devil - devil here is sin which only has the power of death ), 2:15 and set free those who were held in slavery all their lives by their fear of death.

Same goes for us:

To him who overcomes, I will grant to eat Rv 2:7 3528
He who overcomes will not be hurt by the Rv 2:11 3528
To him who overcomes, to him I will give Rv 2:17 3528
‘He who overcomes, and he who keeps My Rv 2:26 3528
‘He who overcomes will thus be clothed in Rv 3:5 3528
‘He who overcomes, I will make him a Rv 3:12 3528
‘He who overcomes, I will grant to him to Rv 3:21 3528
He who overcomes will inherit these things, Rv 21:7 3528

These are simple things 101G, but Christianity and its many philosophies have complicated the Gospel.

No preexistence of Christ - No hypostatic nature - no triune god.

F2F
GINOLJC, to all. first, thanks for the response. second I must disagree with your assessment of my statement. you said, "You were on the right track with Character = God manifestation as in phanerosis (φανέρωσις, 5321), “a manifestation”, occurs in 1 Corinthians 12:7". here is my disagreement.

#1. a manifestation is not the same as an appearance.

#2. The character or the characteristics of a person is abstract, and not concrete.

see, when I say the Lord Jesus is a G5321 φανέρωσις phanerosis of himself, it's only in Spirit, which you correctly identified, and as I have said, according to Acts chapter 2 and supported in 1 Corinthians 12:7-11. but the appearance of the Lord Jesus is two-fold. once before his death and resurrection, and one afterward. let me explain. before his death, he came in flesh and bone with BLOOD as a child, (see Isaiah 9:6). he only took part in our humanity and was not a partaker of it. correct, no No hypostatic nature, NATURALLY.
Now, to the appearance which was in NATURE. the key to understanding this nature are in two scriptures.

#1. Philippians 2:6 "Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God". God NATURE is "Spirit", (see John 4:24a). and this NATURE was not manifested, but appeared, meaning it is concrete. listen, the word "form" here in Philippians 2:6 is the Greek word,
G3444 μορφή morphe (mor-fee') n.
1. form.
2. (intrinsically) fundamental nature.
[perhaps from the base of G3313 (through the idea of adjustment of parts)]
KJV: form
Root(s): G3313

and we know from John 4:24a that the NATURE of God is Spirit. but the million dollar question is how is the Lord Jesus "EQUAL" in NATURE/Spirit with God, notice, not equal "to" God but equal "WITH" God. big difference. well, the answer to this verse as well as John 1:1 when it says that the Word was "WITH" God, here is the answer. look at the definition of G3444 μορφή morphe (mor-fee') n above in blue. it's G3313 the BASE or the ROOT of G3444 μορφή morphe. this is where the revelation and the UNDERSTANDING of the Godhead come in clear focus.

G3313 μέρος meros (me'-ros) n.
1. a portion (i.e. an amount allotted, a part of something).
2. a part.
3. (as an adverb) partly, in part.
4. (as a participle) participating (i.e. the act of taking part in).
5. a piece (i.e. a limited portion).
6. (of location) a district.
7. (of livelihood) an occupation (i.e. as ones' portion in life).
8. a portion in Jesus (see John 13:8).
{literally or figuratively, in a wide application}
[from an obsolete but more primary form of μείρομαι mȇírȏmai “to get as a section or allotment”]
KJV: behalf, course, coast, craft, particular (+ -ly), part (+ -ly), piece, portion, respect, side, some sort(-what)
See also: G266, G3310, H2506

did you see the GREEN highlight? a portion, what do "a portion" mean? it is synonyms with "SHARE". a share that is "equal" is the same thing, ony one have tow of the same. hold that thought. now the Greek words, G243 & G2087, allos & heteros. both have a difference in meaning. Allos expresses a numerical difference and denotes another of the same sort;" heteros expresses a qualitative difference and denotes "another of a different sort". do you see the difference now?

THE equal share is "ANOTHER" of the same sort. meaning two of the same. just what G243
allos states, a numerical difference, like in "Father" which is THE "numerical difference" from the SON. notice I used the definite article "THE" for both because they are EQUAL. why, because they are the same "SORT". dictionary.com, sort:
1. a particular
kind, species, variety, class, or group, distinguished by a common character or nature:
to develop a new sort of painting; nice people, of course, but not really our sort.

2. character, quality, or nature.

look at definition #1. well there is only ONE of the God KIND, only one in the God CLASS, only one in the God GROUP, who have the same character or nature.

now, definition #2. let's get quality, or nature first. remember what G 243
allos and G2087 heteros says? listen, Allos expresses a numerical difference and denotes another of the same sort; heteros expresses a qualitative difference and denotes "another" of a different sort.

since the Lord Jesus is the same, and equal "quality" then he's not G2087 heteros. man that nailed it.

just in this definition alone, it answered the "GREATER" that I question in John 14:28. Greater in quantity, not in Quality.

This is so easy when one understands that the Lord Jesus is the "OFFSPRING" or the Diversity of himself in flesh.

Now, one more revelation in your question above. "character". as you know I believe that the only PERSON in the Godhead is the Holy Spirit which is the JESUS. the title Holy Spirit gives us the idenity of the "Son" and the "Father". understand, "Holy" is God "character", and character used metaphorically means "SON". Spirit is God Nature, see John 4:24a.

conclusion, "
character" is God's "Son", Hebrews 1:3. and "Spirit" is God's Nature "Father". because the Spirit created and made it all. hence the title Holy, character/Son, Spirit, nature/Father, hence the title, Holy .... Spirt.

this title shows "The Son" (Holy) and The "Father" (Spirit)

PCY.