Baptism

[bbyrd009]

if it's close No other perspectives is needed.........

so you say, yes, and you are not making any absolute value judgements at all, i guess. for everyone else. See, a point is that it might be case closed to you, but then you are going to be disconnecting yourself from anyone else who has a diff opinion. You make an "us" and a "them" like that; you make an adversary where there was none before, in a sense. For my part, i am fine with you believing case closed, see, even if i do not

 

[BreadOfLife]

what is it with the Catholic hang-up about sex? Sex in marriage is "defiled" now? Defiling? Joseph gets no progeny, so God can have a Son? That he did not lay with Mary, until after Jesus was born, is not enough for you? Your religious perspective is great, ok, as long as you leave it in church, and don't expect it to translate to IRL. But in IRL it is revealed to be twisted, just wadr like many Catholics take on sex as defiling.

What "hang-up"??

God Himself told the Israelites that they could NOT have relations with the wives before coming to visit Him on His Mountain:
Exod. 19:15
Then he said to the people, "Prepare yourselves for the third day. Abstain from sexual relations."

Mary's decision NOT to have relations is not without precedent.

 

[101G]

so you say, yes, and you are not making any absolute value judgements at all, i guess. for everyone else. See, a point is that it might be case closed to you, but then you are going to be disconnecting yourself from anyone else who has a diff opinion. You make an "us" and a "them" like that; you make an adversary where there was none before, in a sense. For my part, i am fine with you believing case closed, see, even if i do not

talk to the hand... .

 

[BreadOfLife]

You still have proven nothing, all you are trying to do is justify your religious doctrines, it makes no difference to any ones salvation, but makes teh religious happy.

Mat_15:9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
Mar_7:7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
Col_2:22 Which all are to perish with the using after the commandments and doctrines of men?
Going to enjoy my lovely sunday with teh Lord and no religion, because I can.

Nope - try addressing the verses I presented.
You don't get to post irrelevant verses as a valid debate response.

Like I said - this is Debating 101 . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

she might be an embodiment, the embodiment, of it, but that does not address that she was also a human being, BoL.
Jesus is the Word made flesh, but He was also able to be tempted. So the perspective just strikes me as a very forced one, not that i personally care whether you venerate Mary or not, understand

The original Ark carried SYMBOLS of God's power.
Mary, the New Ark carried GOD inside of her.

It's not that difficult to deduce . . .

 

[bbyrd009]

talk to the hand... .

ok, but you must reflect upon the difference in when you are correct v when you are not, and if no one can even have your ear, then how are you going to accomplish that? More importantly, is it worth it over such a small thing, do you think?
He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God.

 

[bbyrd009]

talk to the hand... .

is a girl with a broken hymen from riding a horse no longer a virgin?

 

[bbyrd009]

The original Ark carried SYMBOLS of God's power.
Mary, the New Ark carried GOD inside of her.

It's not that difficult to deduce . . .

the original ark was made out of wood, BoL, and it's not that difficult to deduce that Mary is not

 

[Helen]

@BreadOfLife

I must say I admire you.
I have a mental picture of you standing on a bridge ( above the river Tiber) dressed in roman armour..sword in hand. ( in the poem it started with three brave soldiers against the army.)
We had to learn the pages of the long, long poem of- " How Horatius kept the Bridge" ( based on fact? Can't remember. )
At the end he stood alone, in the middle of the bridge which was now breaking up with the swell of the great river...and defended it..forgot for how long.
That is my picture of you...when we all "jump on your case"
At the very end of the fight ( Poem) ...both sides friend and foes... cheered his bravery...
Last few verses....

LIX

‘Oh, Tiber! father Tiber!
To whom the Romans pray,
A Roman’s life, a Roman’s arms,
Take thou in charge this day!’
So he spake, and speaking sheathed
The good sword by his side,
And with his harness on his back,
Plunged headlong in the tide.
LX
No sound of joy or sorrow
Was heard from either bank;
But friends and foes in dumb surprise,
With parted lips and straining eyes,
Stood gazing where he sank;
And when above the surges
They saw his crest appear,
All Rome sent forth a rapturous cry,
And even the ranks of Tuscany
Could scarce forbear to cheer.
( last verse)
LXX
When the goodman mends his armour,
And trims their helmet’s plume;
When the goodwife’s shuttle merrily
Goes flashing through the loom;
With weeping and with laughter
Still is the story told,
How well Horatius kept the bridge
In the brave days of old."

Horatius, by Thomas Babington Macaulay

 

[BreadOfLife]

How on earth could any woman be pronounced "a virgin" after delivering a baby??? Jesus was born of Mary...right? Born naturally...

We know the hymen is a small, membrane just inside the opening to the vagina ..it would have been broken as she delivered Jesus!!
Hence- no longer a virgin.
That is how I see it!

Sooooo, with God, all things are NOT possible??

He turned water into wine, gave sight to the blind, healed the crippled, brought dead people back to life, parted the sea - but He can't preserve Mary's virginity?? What kind of a God is that??

Mary's perpetual virginity is foretold:
Ezek. 44:2
The LORD said to me, "This gate is to remain shut. It must not be opened; no one may enter through it. It is to remain shut because the LORD, the God of Israel, has entered through it.

 

[mjrhealth]

Nope - try addressing the verses I presented.
You don't get to post irrelevant verses as a valid debate response.

Like I said - this is Debating 101 . . .

And you have proven what,?? this is not a debate, it is an argument, which proves nothing, changes nothing and adds nothing.

Col_2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

All you do is seek to justify your religions doctrines, no more no less, doesnt add one dot to ones salvation.

2Ti 2:16 But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.
2Ti 2:17 And their word will eat as doth a canker:

 

[mjrhealth]

Ezek. 44:2
The LORD said to me, "This gate is to remain shut. It must not be opened; no one may enter through it. It is to remain shut because the LORD, the God of Israel, has entered through it.

Doesnt say that at all. good one though...

 

[BreadOfLife]

@BreadOfLife

I must say I admire you.
I have a mental picture of you standing on a bridge ( above the river Tiber) dressed in roman armour..sword in hand. ( in the poem it started with three brave soldiers against the army.)
We had to learn the pages of the long, long poem of- " How Horatius kept the Bridge" ( based on fact? Can't remember. )
At the end he stood alone, in the middle of the bridge which was now breaking up with the swell of the great river...and defended it..forgot for how long.
That is my picture of you...when we all "jump on your case"
At the very end of the fight ( Poem) ...both sides friend and foes... cheered his bravery...
Last few verses....

LIX

‘Oh, Tiber! father Tiber!
To whom the Romans pray,
A Roman’s life, a Roman’s arms,
Take thou in charge this day!’
So he spake, and speaking sheathed
The good sword by his side,
And with his harness on his back,
Plunged headlong in the tide.
LX
No sound of joy or sorrow
Was heard from either bank;
But friends and foes in dumb surprise,
With parted lips and straining eyes,
Stood gazing where he sank;
And when above the surges
They saw his crest appear,
All Rome sent forth a rapturous cry,
And even the ranks of Tuscany
Could scarce forbear to cheer.
( last verse)
LXX
When the goodman mends his armour,
And trims their helmet’s plume;
When the goodwife’s shuttle merrily
Goes flashing through the loom;
With weeping and with laughter
Still is the story told,
How well Horatius kept the bridge
In the brave days of old."

Horatius, by Thomas Babington Macaulay

Well, thank you for always being civil and refraining from lying like some of the others.
However - I'm not a brave man. Just one trying to stay faithful.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Doesnt say that at all. good one though...

What is it talking about, then?

 

[BreadOfLife]

And you have proven what,?? this is not a debate, it is an argument, which proves nothing, changes nothing and adds nothing.

Col_2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

All you do is seek to justify your religions doctrines, no more no less, doesnt add one dot to ones salvation.

2Ti 2:16 But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.
2Ti 2:17 And their word will eat as doth a canker:

I gave you Scriptural proof for the fact that Jesus had no uterine siblings - and you are completely unprepared and unable to offer ANY evidence to the contrary.

You're right - this isn't a debate. It's a slaughter . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

the original ark was made out of wood, BoL, and it's not that difficult to deduce that Mary is not

The Bronze Serpent on the pole that Moses created to cure the people was a prefigurement of Christ(Num. 21:8-9, John 3:14-15).
Was HE made of bronze??

 

[mjrhealth]

I gave you Scriptural proof for the fact that Jesus had no uterine siblings - and you are completely unprepared and unable to offer ANY evidence to the contrary.

You're right - this isn't a debate. It's a slaughter . .

You have offered nothing, and as I said it adds what??? Others have proven that He did have siblings, but than that goes againt your religious beliefs and doctrines and cant be accepted. As I said, it adds to what... Pride is an awful thing.

 

[mjrhealth]

You're right - this isn't a debate. It's a slaughter . .

Oh you finally admit to it, cool.... Ill provide the body bags for you, where do i send them??

 

[Helen]

The Bronze Serpent on the pole that Moses created to cure the people was a prefigurement of Christ(Num. 21:8-9, John 3:14-15).
Was HE made of bronze??

Gold represents the nature of God.
Silver represents redemption..
Bronze represents Judgement...which Jesus became for us...sin being judged on the cross and our freedom purchased. Etc

 

[mjrhealth]

Ezek. 44:2
The LORD said to me, "This gate is to remain shut. It must not be opened; no one may enter through it. It is to remain shut because the LORD, the God of Israel, has entered through it.

What does it say, or is it so hard to understand english,