Be born again to be whose child?

[PS95]

Heb. 2:
10 For it was fitting for the one for whose sake all things are and through whom all things are, in bringing many sons to glory, to make the Chief Agent of their salvation perfect through sufferings. 11 For both he who is sanctifying and those who are being sanctified all [stem] from one, and for this cause he is not ashamed to call them “brothers,” 12  as he says:
“I will declare your name to my brothers;
in the middle of [the] congregation I will praise you with song.” (Psal. 22:22)
13 And again:
“I will have my trust in him.” (Is. 8:17)
And again:
“Look! I and the young children, whom Jehovah gave me” (Is. 8:18a).

Who is bringing many sons to glory?

Elie- you are sidetracking the real issue here. Jws teach that no one is born again except your special elite class..
That's why you are confused- that teaching is FALSE as can be.
The other sheep was not Jesus' way of dividing Christians into 2 groups of a heavenly born again flock and an earthly non-born again flock.
Jws twisted that "other sheep" statement up so badly and it became a central doctrine of ERROR. The Mormons also twisted it.
It is really very simple- Jesus said---

“I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them also. They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd” John 10:16

The gospel went to the Jews first and then to Gentiles where we were made ONE flock. The NT is replete with that teaching. You would have to be utterly clueless not to see it. UNLESS you were taught wrong and YOU WERE and the responsibility falls to you to be a berean and make sure of all things. You have not done that.

 

[Fred J]

Who is bringing many sons to glory?

Lord Jesus Christ is bringing many sons to glory, sons who were separated because of sin since Adam.

John 1:
12. But as many as received Him, to them gave He power to become the sons of GOD, even to them that believe on His name:
13. Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of GOD.

Sons of Adam and Eve are not only the Jews but also the Gentiles, as these sons descended from Noah's 3 sons after the flood.

They became the separated generations of Jews and Gentiles who replenish and subdued the earth.

The Jews were with GOD, and the Gentiles were without GOD since they were either 'banished' or 'strayed' from GOD.

Verse 13, writes, they became sons again, 'not' of the bloodline of Jews, nor Jews or Gentiles on their own will.

Nor by the will of man 'converted' them either, but 'alone' of the will of GOD they are sons.

John 3:16, GOD so loved the world HE will all lost sons in the world to be brought into glory as sons of GOD.

But the Son of GOD alone holds the power and can give the power to those who received Him.

Even to them that believe on His name, for them to become the sons of GOD.

Because the Son calls them to 'repent their sins' and 'accept the Good News', be baptized of water and of the Holy Ghost.

And 'He also died for the sins of sons of the world', then on the third day He rose again and ascended into Heaven to be seated at the right hand of GOD.

By grace and through faith the gift of GOD as they fully 'receive Him' and 'believe on His name', then the Son gives them power to become sons of GOD.

Furthermore they're discipled in the Gospel of grace and truth, hence too commissioned to make disciple and likewise of all nations of sons.

As to us who have the Holy Bible since, we as sons are discipled accordingly from the Old till the New Testament until today and word to word.

Therefore to remain as sons and labor in every good works for the Kingdom of GOD till the day we're 'asleep'. (2Timothy3:16&17)

Shalom in the name of Lord Jesus Christ

 

[Jack]

Nobody is born when he wants to. Nobody adopts his father, but some persons go to look for the child to adopt.

This "born again" thing became a joke for most Christians out there.

Let's talk about being born again from the biblical point of view. First thing first: being born to be whose child?

John 3:3
3 Jesus said, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God."

 

[Aunty Jane]

Lord Jesus Christ is bringing many sons to glory, sons who were separated because of sin since Adam.

John 1:
12. But as many as received Him, to them gave He power to become the sons of GOD, even to them that believe on His name:
13. Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of GOD.

Sons of Adam and Eve are not only the Jews but also the Gentiles, as these sons descended from Noah's 3 sons after the flood.

Yes, according to God’s promise to Abraham, “all the nations” are included in that blessing. But his direct descendants got first option, as prophesy about the coming Messiah was to come only through them.
Jesus also said that “salvation began with the Jews”, (John 4:22-23) but it did not end with them, as God demonstrated to Peter who was the one called to baptized the gentile, Cornelius and his household.

An important point keeps getting overlooked IMO.
Jesus said that he is “the Son of God” and that all who became his disciples were also adopted as “sons of God”, as your quoted verse says.......he called these ones his “brothers”...(Matt 25:40) so how do we reconcile the fact that God is never said to have “brothers” but only “sons”...? And Jesus is only said to have “brothers” but never “sons”?

Therefore to remain as sons and labor in every good works for the Kingdom of GOD till the day we're 'asleep'. (2Timothy3:16&17)

Not sure what this actually means, or what connection it has to the cited Scripture.
Can you explain please....?

 

[PS95]

Yes, according to God’s promise to Abraham, “all the nations” are included in that blessing. But his direct descendants got first option, as prophesy about the coming Messiah was to come only through them.
Jesus also said that “salvation began with the Jews”, (John 4:22-23) but it did not end with them, as God demonstrated to Peter who was the one called to baptized the gentile, Cornelius and his household.

An important point keeps getting overlooked IMO.
Jesus said that he is “the Son of God” and that all who became his disciples were also adopted as “sons of God”, as your quoted verse says.......he called these ones his “brothers”...(Matt 25:40) so how do we reconcile the fact that God is never said to have “brothers” but only “sons”...? And Jesus is only said to have “brothers” but never “sons”?

Not sure what this actually means, or what connection it has to the cited Scripture.
Can you explain please....?

Jane, you have been answered but ignored me as usual. You are still confused.
Christians do NOT believe that the Son of God is the Father.
We know that our Father (ABBA) is the FATHER. HIS SON is our BROTHER. You can't wrap your head around the idea that to us- God the Father has a Son and always has-- and He is also called God - even by His Father. They are ONE. Only ONE God created the heavens-- and the earth ALL ALONE BY HIMSELF Isa 44:24.

Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, and the one who formed you from the womb, “I, the LORD, am the maker of all things, Stretching out the heavens by Myself And spreading out the earth all alone,

Clearly, Jesus had part in creation with His Father-- and if God considers Himself as ALONE & BY HIMSELF when with His Son in creation- then maybe you should also. One God created all things through His Son. ALL ALONE BY HIMSELF.--- Does God lie? Do you think He purposefully ignored that His Son was with Him to take credit away from Him? Of course not- He loves His Son and considers them as One- Jesus does.
Nothing that comes out from God is not eternal- It's impossible.
Can't you see Jesus with His Father alone by Himself here?
"Indeed My hand has laid the foundation of the earth, And My right hand has stretched out the heavens; When I call to them, They stand up together." Isa 48:13
On another note- Jesus is called Eternal Father in the scriptures and Jesus did refer to the apostles as His "children". And He called the woman with the discharge- "daughter." He is the lion and he is the lamb. He is the first and he is the Last. - Alpha-/ Omega- Beginning and the End. When we give glory to the Son the Father is glorified.

You want to be able to fully comprehend everything about God & I understand that but we never will. He is God and we are not.
Just be still and know he is God.

You won't get that because you insist that the only Son of God is a non worship worthy creature-
No- Jane, The JW false Jesus is Michael the Archangel who did not create the other angels after he was created or anything else. Hebrew goes out of the way to teach Jesus is not an angel.
Michael is not the only Archangel- he is "one of the foremost princes".

 

[ElieG12]

Lord Jesus Christ is bringing many sons to glory, sons who were separated because of sin since Adam.

The Scriptures say otherwise:

Heb. 2:10 For it was fitting that the one for whom and through whom all things exist, in bringing many sons to glory, should make the Chief Agent of their salvation perfect through sufferings. 11 For both the one who is sanctifying and those who are being sanctified all stem from one, and for this reason he is not ashamed to call them brothers, 12 as he says: “I will declare your name to my brothers; in the midst of the congregation I will praise you with song.” (...)
17 Consequently, he had to become like his “brothers” in all respects, so that he could become a merciful and faithful high priest in things relating to God, in order to offer a propitiatory sacrifice for the sins of the people. 18 Since he himself has suffered when being put to the test, he is able to come to the aid of those who are being put to the test.

Jesus does not bring "children to glory" because Jesus is the brother of those whom his Father brings to glory with him.

John 20:17 (...) go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father and to my God and your God.’

All of them, Jesus and his brothers, have a Father who is the One bringing all of them to glory.

John 1:
12. But as many as received Him, to them gave He power to become the sons of GOD, even to them that believe on His name:
13. Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of GOD.
...

The Greek word ἐξουσία used in John 1:12 is not translated as "power" but as "authority or right." Although Jesus gave his disciples the possibility of becoming "sons of God," the final decision on the choice rests with the Father himself, who is the One who adopts "sons" to be part of Jesus' spiritual body.

1 Pet. 1:3 Praised be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, for according to his great mercy he gave us a new birth to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 to an incorruptible and undefiled and unfading inheritance. It is reserved in the heavens for you, 5 who are being safeguarded by God’s power through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last period of time.

Please don't twist the issue of who adopts children. Jesus is the Son, and his brothers (John 20:17) are children of the same Father.

 

[Fred J]

Not sure what this actually means, or what connection it has to the cited Scripture.
Can you explain please....?

As and when we've become born again and are sons of GOD, we're disciple according to today in the All Scripture = Holy Bible.

So that a 'man of GOD' is 'thorough' and 'perfect' for every 'good works', until they 'asleep'(perish), according to 2Timothy3:16&17.

 

[Fred J]

The Scriptures say otherwise:

Heb. 2:10 For it was fitting that the one for whom and through whom all things exist, in bringing many sons to glory, should make the Chief Agent of their salvation perfect through sufferings. 11 For both the one who is sanctifying and those who are being sanctified all stem from one, and for this reason he is not ashamed to call them brothers, 12 as he says: “I will declare your name to my brothers; in the midst of the congregation I will praise you with song.” (...)
17 Consequently, he had to become like his “brothers” in all respects, so that he could become a merciful and faithful high priest in things relating to God, in order to offer a propitiatory sacrifice for the sins of the people. 18 Since he himself has suffered when being put to the test, he is able to come to the aid of those who are being put to the test.

Jesus does not bring "children to glory" because Jesus is the brother of those whom his Father brings to glory with him.

John 20:17 (...) go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father and to my God and your God.’

All of them, Jesus and his brothers, have a Father who is the One bringing all of them to glory.

The Greek word ἐξουσία used in John 1:12 is not translated as "power" but as "authority or right." Although Jesus gave his disciples the possibility of becoming "sons of God," the final decision on the choice rests with the Father himself, who is the One who adopts "sons" to be part of Jesus' spiritual body.

1 Pet. 1:3 Praised be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, for according to his great mercy he gave us a new birth to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 to an incorruptible and undefiled and unfading inheritance. It is reserved in the heavens for you, 5 who are being safeguarded by God’s power through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last period of time.

Please don't twist the issue of who adopts children. Jesus is the Son, and his brothers (John 20:17) are children of the same Father.

Sadly, am not 'twisting' anything, but your mind is apparently 'twisted' for not reading carefully scripture, as it is written.

Even you tried to give the correct word from 'power' to 'authority or 'right', yet the Son holds it and not the FATHER.

The FATHER merely 'direct' these sons to HIS Son and the Son holds the 'authority' whether to give them or not, the 'right' as sons.

Read the Gospel thoroughly, even in Israel that day, Jesus did not give 'authority' to all Israel to become sons of GOD.

As we read clearly there were only 11 disciples the Son chose where He addressed them as 'brothers', whom He disciple them personally and finally commissioned them.

And He acknowledged the FATHER that the FATHER have given them to Him, to 'follow' and be 'disciple', and to continue after Him.

As the FATHER have sent them to the Son, for only the Son gave them 'authority' or 'right' to become sons of GOD and called them 'brothers'.

Even the Son said to them that if any man deny Him here on earth, He will deny them, even to the FATHER, in Heaven.

Besides, the Son have 'created' them laying the foundation of the earth in the beginning and He is apparently their God the Son.

Yet on earth He wasn't ashamed, whom GOD the FATHER have sent, who obey and does HIS will, to call them 'mother'. 'brother' and 'sister'.

That's how unmeasurable the Son's love is even though He's God the Son, willing to share everything in His power and possession.

With undeserving sinners and the lowly of heart, making them no longer 'orphans', but equally family members of the FATHER GOD MOST HIGH.

Besides the FATHER's role, because of the Son we're born again of water and the Holy Ghost, and in the spirit able to call out, "ABBA, FATHER."

Once we were 'wretched', white washed sepulchre, white washed on the outside but inside full of 'dirt', bone' and 'stench'.

Only for formality sake on the outside we show love and care for one another, but on the inside full of the opposite.

Heaven witnessed this and GOD 'laughs' at us, as we think no one knows and no one can see who are we on the inside.

And ironically this is to whom the Son laid aside His Majesty in Heaven, and came to the rescue, bringing us the 'Good News' instead of the 'rod' of punishment.

As to the Son we're 'sick' on the inside and 'fake' on the outside, need of a 'physician', and nothing else.

That's why the FATHER 'smiles' when HE appears to where HE's Son is, and proud to proclaim to us unworthy witnesses.

Saying, "MY only begotten", "MY dearly beloved", "AM well pleased", furthermore, "Listen to Him".

So, don't make up your own fall short of glory and incomplete gospel since being 'shortsighted' to the context of the scripture.

No thank you

 

[Aunty Jane]

As and when we've become born again and are sons of GOD, we're disciple according to today in the All Scripture = Holy Bible.

What does it mean to be “born again”? What is the purpose of this rebirth? How does it happen?

So that a 'man of GOD' is 'thorough' and 'perfect' for every 'good works', until they 'asleep'(perish), according to 2Timothy3:16&17.

Not sure what translation you are using but mine says....
“All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness, 17  so that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work.”

Where does it mention “asleep” as “perishing”?

That was an attempt at answering the second part of my post....but what about the first part?
Why is God said to have “sons”, of which Jesus is his “firstborn” before any other creation, (Col 1:15) and Jesus is only said to have “brothers”? Who all have the same Father.
Even the Lord’s Prayer opens with “OUR FATHER”......

Jesus is said to only have “brothers” but only God is said to have “sons”.....a “son of God” is either a creation of God like Jesus or Adam, or he is adopted as a son because of proving worthy of that title by his faith and conduct in imitation of God’s firstborn.

 

[PS95]

Sadly, am not 'twisting' anything, but your mind is apparently 'twisted' for not reading carefully scripture, as it is written.

Even you tried to give the correct word from 'power' to 'authority or 'right', yet the Son holds it and not the FATHER.

The FATHER merely 'direct' these sons to HIS Son and the Son holds the 'authority' whether to give them or not, the 'right' as sons.

Read the Gospel thoroughly, even in Israel that day, Jesus did not give 'authority' to all Israel to become sons of GOD.

As we read clearly there were only 11 disciples the Son chose where He addressed them as 'brothers', whom He disciple them personally and finally commissioned them.

And He acknowledged the FATHER that the FATHER have given them to Him, to 'follow' and be 'disciple', and to continue after Him.

As the FATHER have sent them to the Son, for only the Son gave them 'authority' or 'right' to become sons of GOD and called them 'brothers'.

Even the Son said to them that if any man deny Him here on earth, He will deny them, even to the FATHER, in Heaven.

Even though the Son have 'created' them laying the foundation in the beginning and He is their God the Son.

So, don't make up your own fall short of glory incomplete gospel since being 'shortsighted' to the context of the scripture.

No thank you

Hi Fred, It might be helpful for you to understand where these two- Elie and Jane- are coming from, and why what they say is so alien to you.
I guess you know by now that they are JWs-
JWs do NOT believe that they are born again and they are not. They have that much right.
They believe their deeds they do in this life don't really matter because they will never have to answer for them. They do not believe that the Lord Jesus was capable of paying for all of our personal sins. He was only able to pay for Adam's sin and even he is not forgiven.. JWs teach that only ONE payment for sins is required and we do agree on that much.
BUT JWs teach that when they die physically that is how they pay for their own sins.. So they will be resurrected automatically since they became sinless by dying..
To them, Jesus died to give them a 2nd chance on earth to earn salvation over a literal 1000 yr judgment-- where Michael the Archangel and apostles and their JW elite members will rule over them from heaven.
They will be subject to new rules to obey and those new rules is how they will be judged to either life or eternal sleep. Jesus will resurrect them in their previous sinful mortal bodies...
They will be joined by people who died who never heard the JW false gospel of 1914, so they could not reject it- and they will all live together on earth in their sinful mortal natures-- where the JWs will be teaching the non-JWS how to obey God.

So you see, you are not speaking to people who teach or believe the gospel at all , but teach an invented perverted one.
I would tell you to just avoid them as the Lord said. They are only present on this forum to try to convert others.
Scripture twisting is their forte. This religion has a background steeped in the occult.

 

[Fred J]

Hi Fred, It might be helpful for you to understand where these two- Elie and Jane- are coming from, and why what they say is so alien to you.
I guess you know by now that they are JWs-
JWs do NOT believe that they are born again and they are not. They have that much right.
They believe their deeds they do in this life don't really matter because they will never have to answer for them. They do not believe that the Lord Jesus was capable of paying for all of our personal sins. He was only able to pay for Adam's sin and even he is not forgiven.. JWs teach that only ONE payment for sins is required and we do agree on that much.
BUT JWs teach that when they die physically that is how they pay for their own sins.. So they will be resurrected automatically since they became sinless by dying..
To them, Jesus died to give them a 2nd chance on earth to earn salvation over a literal 1000 yr judgment-- where Michael the Archangel and apostles and their JW elite members will rule over them from heaven.
They will be subject to new rules to obey and those new rules is how they will be judged to either life or eternal sleep. Jesus will resurrect them in their previous sinful mortal bodies...
They will be joined by people who died who never heard the JW false gospel of 1914, so they could not reject it- and they will all live together on earth in their sinful mortal natures-- where the JWs will be teaching the non-JWS how to obey God.

So you see, you are not speaking to people who teach or believe the gospel at all , but teach an invented perverted one.
I would tell you to just avoid them as the Lord said. They are only present on this forum to try to convert others.
Scripture twisting is their forte. This religion has a background steeped in the occult.

Thank you very much for that and GOD bless in Jesus name.

 

[Fred J]

What does it mean to be “born again”? What is the purpose of this rebirth? How does it happen?

Like Nicodemus, you're 'blind' to the saying of Jesus in John chapter 3.

That which is born of the flesh is flesh, meaning, those who're born of a human parents are human.

And that which is born of the Spirit is spirit, meaning, the same human who's born of the Holy Spirit are therefore new spirit man.

While the person is alive, he had an inner body transformation experience becoming a new man.

As i myself experienced it when i was born again over night, where the next day i felt like a new man.

Not sure what translation you are using but mine says....
“All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness, 17  so that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work.”

Then go with yours, as in context they sum up the same meaning.

Where does it mention “asleep” as “perishing”?

Paul's epistle...

That was an attempt at answering the second part of my post....but what about the first part?
Why is God said to have “sons”, of which Jesus is his “firstborn” before any other creation, (Col 1:15) and Jesus is only said to have “brothers”? Who all have the same Father.
Even the Lord’s Prayer opens with “OUR FATHER”......

Jesus is said to only have “brothers” but only God is said to have “sons”.....a “son of God” is either a creation of God like Jesus or Adam, or he is adopted as a son because of proving worthy of that title by his faith and conduct in imitation of God’s firstborn.

i don't understand, make it short and simple, thank you

 

[ElieG12]

The Scriptures say otherwise:

Heb. 2:10 For it was fitting that the one for whom and through whom all things exist, in bringing many sons to glory, should make the Chief Agent of their salvation perfect through sufferings. 11 For both the one who is sanctifying and those who are being sanctified all stem from one, and for this reason he is not ashamed to call them brothers, 12 as he says: “I will declare your name to my brothers; in the midst of the congregation I will praise you with song.” (...)
17 Consequently, he had to become like his “brothers” in all respects, so that he could become a merciful and faithful high priest in things relating to God, in order to offer a propitiatory sacrifice for the sins of the people. 18 Since he himself has suffered when being put to the test, he is able to come to the aid of those who are being put to the test.

Jesus does not bring "children to glory" because Jesus is the brother of those whom his Father brings to glory with him.

John 20:17 (...) go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father and to my God and your God.’

All of them, Jesus and his brothers, have a Father who is the One bringing all of them to glory.

The Greek word ἐξουσία used in John 1:12 is not translated as "power" but as "authority or right." Although Jesus gave his disciples the possibility of becoming "sons of God," the final decision on the choice rests with the Father himself, who is the One who adopts "sons" to be part of Jesus' spiritual body.

1 Pet. 1:3 Praised be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, for according to his great mercy he gave us a new birth to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 to an incorruptible and undefiled and unfading inheritance. It is reserved in the heavens for you, 5 who are being safeguarded by God’s power through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last period of time.

Please don't twist the issue of who adopts children. Jesus is the Son, and his brothers (John 20:17) are children of the same Father.

The Bible teaches the truth:

Rom. 8:28 We know that God makes all his works cooperate together for the good of those who love God, those who are the ones called according to his purpose; 29 because those whom he gave his first recognition he also foreordained to be patterned after the image of his Son, so that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. 30 Moreover, those whom he foreordained are the ones he also called; and those whom he called are the ones he also declared to be righteous. Finally those whom he declared righteous are the ones he also glorified.

Jehovah's Witnesses teach exactly what the Bible teaches about who Jesus' Father is, who adopts children, giving them a new birth to join Jesus in heaven, in glory. It's not our fault that some religious fanatics are so resentful of us for teaching biblical truth that they deny the Scriptures without even having the minimum fear of God.

John 20:17; Heb. 2:10-18; 1 Pet. 1:3-5 and Rom. 8:28-30 clearly teach who is the One who adopts children to be "newborn"; No one who teach differently is really a newborn Christian or have ever "born again", unless from another very different father, like Pharisees (John 8:42-47). In fact, the hateful speech of some here reflects exactly who their spiritual father is.

 

[Fred J]

The Bible teaches the truth:

Rom. 8:28 We know that God makes all his works cooperate together for the good of those who love God, those who are the ones called according to his purpose; 29 because those whom he gave his first recognition he also foreordained to be patterned after the image of his Son, so that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. 30 Moreover, those whom he foreordained are the ones he also called; and those whom he called are the ones he also declared to be righteous. Finally those whom he declared righteous are the ones he also glorified.

Jehovah's Witnesses teach exactly what the Bible teaches about who Jesus' Father is, who adopts children, giving them a new birth to join Jesus in heaven, in glory. It's not our fault that some religious fanatics are so resentful of us for teaching biblical truth that they deny the Scriptures without even having the minimum fear of God.

John 20:17; Heb. 2:10-18; 1 Pet. 1:3-5 and Rom. 8:28-30 clearly teach who is the One who adopts children to be "newborn"; No one who teach differently is really a newborn Christian or have ever "born again", unless from another very different father, like Pharisees (John 8:42-47). In fact, the hateful speech of some here reflects exactly who their spiritual father is.

Jehovah's witness is alike other similar astray sects, quote scripture out of context to justify their out of context fundamental belief and tradition denomination.

Even in the matters of 'blood' given by Apostle Peter to the Gentiles in the book of Acts, JW take it to 'extreme' measure and made it a lifelong tradition.

That, needed 'blood transfusion' for a JW patience, strictly must come from their very own sect believers.

By this many are willing to die and have died, without 'sufficient' or a 'proper match' of blood transfusion.

When all i perceive by the same scripture and by the Spirit within me, that Apostle Peter is referring to the food that the Gentiles eat.

Especially like Gentile unbelievers today alike their fathers of the old, love to eat meat, if possible 'raw', preferably Japanese.

And, 'half or three quarter done', preferably the West and Caucasian alike generally, overall with 'blood' still on it.

This is what Apostle Peter 'forbid' the Gentile Christians that day making it a 'decree', even for the future generation Gentile church to follow.

Meaning, that every meat product must be well done in preparation with no blood remaining when consumed during meal or so.

That Heaven already approved since, and among others Peter did 'forbid' them in the book of Acts, period

This is 'lawlessness' and lawlessness is 'sin', confess the sin and stop sinning, for one among others, eat meat 'well done'

i beseech you friend to stop being 'haughty and be wise in your own conceit', calling others a 'religious fanatic', when you're one yourself.

For one, you take scripture out of context and 'exalt' the FATHER so much, 'folly' to think you're going to get a 'trophy' in the end'?

But disregard the remaining scripture that 'exalts' the Son 'equal' to and 'coheir' with the FATHER?

Scripture alone justifies, besides the quotation you've given above that the FATHER 'desires' and 'will' and 'made' bringing many sons to glory.

Likewise also justifies, without the Son none of these can never happen, even creation in the beginning, whether in Heaven or on earth.

Go to the Hebrew epistle and read what the FATHER in Heaven says about the Son in the presence of the 24 elders and angels.

Also the Gospel according to John, that the Son have and gave the 'authority' to grant them, 'who received Him, even to them that believe on His name', as sons of GOD. (not the FATHER)

And moreover, He's the way, the truth, the life, and 'none' go to the FATHER except by the Son, period

Any one false can boldly and openly self claim they're are 'coequal' brothers with Christ and quote scripture out of context to justify.

But truthfully the ones who truly are 'brothers' will not will not claim such, feeling themselves unworthy for one and are silent about it.

Did any of the Apostles and saints claim such, when only until the day is determined so in Heaven, even to the ones will be seated beside Jesus??

Scripture can also justify of such shortsighted ignorant falsehood religious people justifying so, remember when the Jews openly and boldly claim to Jesus that the GOD of Abraham is their FATHER??

What was Jesus' reply, who apparently their father turned out to be??

So be very cautious JWs and others, claiming yourselves to be 'coequal' with Christ as 'brothers', when in the end 'satan' will be that brother for eternity in hell.

So stop your 'immature' contention and grow up according All Scripture=Holy Bible in context wise, and not 'partial' cum 'shortsighted' childlike unwise, thank you.

Jesus did not go around persuading people to 'listen' and 'pay attention', but rather said, "If you have ears, listen and pay attention'.

For the record, He's not referring to your carnal physical ears and hearing, period