Bible alone!

[David H.]

divine and catholic faith (the only faith of Christians in the church the communion of saints) is revealed by God!

Unlike the traditions of men having no authority form Christ under king James deemed dan 13 and many books and chapters not scripture and men like luther (excommunicated) even wanted James Jude And revelation removed

so who decides

where did Jesus say what is the cannon of scripture?
Or that all revealed truths are in scripture
Even scripture points to the teaching authority of the apostles acts 2:42

ever the faith story of Susana in dan 13?

Yet the Lutheran Bible does contain the books of the Apocrypha, They just do not consider them scripture. And Yes i have read them, Tobit is one I particularly enjoyed. How come the Catholic Bible leaves out the Book of Enoch, which the Coptic Bibles contain? Or the Didache, and the other books in the Orthodox Apocrypha? Do You see what I am saying? The Canon of 66 Books contains all the essential doctrine of Christianity, these books though informative, and can add information do not alter the doctrine of the church, with the exception of certain (heretical) understandings such as purgatory. Many of these Books also alack divine inspiration.

The Holy Ghost is the one that preserves the Word of God through the ages, by using men who are led by the Holy Spirit. Men like St. Jerome, Wycliffe, Luther, Tyndale, and the translators of those texts. None of us who are "protestants" deny the validity of the early church fathers and what they did with the canon of Scripture, what we say is that the "One" church was corrupted, and as with Israel of Old, when one priesthood became corrupt, God raised up another priesthood whose heart is for the Truth and for God and not for earthly glory.

There are essentials of the faith that unify all Christians, You for example do not deny that Jesus is LORD, This is is an essential of the faith that unifies, But there are other man made doctrines that divide, that are none essentials (Purgatory, Calvinism, Eschatological differences), and these are in large part none essentials of the faith. Church membership is one of those non essentials. I Have brothers and sisters in the faith who are Calvinists and Arminians, Catholics and Lutherans, Fundamentalists and charismatics. We agree on the essentials and disagree on the non essentials, and that is ok by me, as long as they can say Jesus is the LORD. (1 Corinthians 12:3)

It is when one "church" starts to "beat up" on the others that that church becomes "nicolaitan" in their doctrine. This temptation is very real for the church. Fundamentalism fell into this at the turn of the 20th century, and From this was Born the Pentecostal movement. Jesus warned of this to the Apostles themselves (Matthew 20:25-28, Luke 12:42-48) You would do well to read these verses. The Catholic church, and the doctrines you are trying to foist upon the "menservants and maidens" are very much in line with this. It is this teaching which Jesus "hates" (Revelation 2:6, Revelation 2:15) This Got so Bad that Protestantism was born of it and before that The orthodox church. Yet the RCC keeps "returning to its own vomit" to use a biblical idiom.

I have recently been reading on the RCC persecution of the Moravians, this is the same sort of thing that the RCC does over and over again, and I am not defending the Protestants because they are guilty of this as well. This is what happens when men build earthly kingdoms in the name of religion, and then have to defend them because they are built upon the teachings of men rather than the word of God. This will not end until all of us who are Christians reach the fulness of Christ, and set aside those "winds of doctrine" of men (Ephesians 4:14). My Hope is that one day you will reach this point as well, and learn to speak the truth in love.

 

[Karl Peters]

To anyone who may be reading this,

You should know these are some of my thoughts on the bible if you are curious to know,

To me the bible is the word of God. That was written and inspired by those who were indwelled by the holy spirit. There is a lot of rich narrative through out the entirety of the bible along with such a lot of the relations between man and God, along side the redeeming of mankind after the fall.

The bible is a wonderful tool and guide for us to day if you are learning in the right way of looking at the context while considering all of the who, why, what, when, where, how which helps considerably as you go along slowly digesting and reading the word of God and trying to see what you can understand today that may be applicable for you in your life now today for there are so many great lessons in the bible.

Jesus Christ most certainly is a big step in a persons life to allow in their lives to trust and have faith when it is fully established that persons life tends to get spiritually better in hopes and enjoys of knowing that there is a wonderful God who loves, and cares, and desires to know about everything going on in the believers life, and that they are loved and that they have the right to understand on Yeshuas behalf they now have been made right with God and can go to Him at anytime, and God is not angry with them, and desires to help them in and through by the holy spirit which is given when a person makes the choice to believe in Christ.

Thank you for your time viewing and reading,
Matthew G.

If the Bible is the Word of God to you then do you think Jesus Christ is the Bible???

Rev 19:13 He is clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.

Jn 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God.

Clearly the Bible say Jesus Christ is the Word of God and that is His name, so do you think Jesus Christ is the Bible?

 

[theefaith]

Yes: "...until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature..." Ephesians 4:13

It's a process. And it is the Spirit of discernment within the the born again person that guides them through the buffeting waves, "blown here and there by every wind of teaching and by the cunning and craftiness of men in their deceitful scheming" Ephesians 4:14

Every true believer has this anointing in him to recognize the false teachings of cunning and crafty men. We don't need a Catholic priesthood to do that for us. That's the point. God has given the capacity to do that to the individual believer himself.

but in the church
Ephesians 3:21
Unto him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen.

1 Timothy 3:15
But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

 

[theefaith]

Teachers teach the teachings. Believers then discern them as being true or not. Individual believers themselves don't write doctrines (unless they had that calling). They discern them. John says each believer has this anointing to discern truth from falseness (1 John 2:20-21, 1 John 2:26-27). This is in fulfillment of prophecy:

"...your teachers will be hidden no more; with your own eyes you will see them. Whether you turn to the right or to the left, your ears will hear a voice behind you, saying, 'This is the way; walk in it.'" Isaiah 30:20-21
​

That voice behind us whispering in our ear is the Holy Spirit, not your local Catholic or Protestant priest. We don't need them to tell us what teachings are true and which ones are not. They just need to be faithful to teach the truth as each is responsible to God to do that.

the true church cannot teach error Jn 16:13 jn 8:32

 

[theefaith]

Justification occurs when a person believes. And justification is a one time event that does not have to be repeated. Hebrews 10:10, Hebrews 10:14
He will be saved from the wrath of God when Christ returns.



I don't care about Mary. And I don't care about any church father because my allegiance is not to men. The Spirit is my guide into truth. You are sorely wrong if you think I submit to everything protesting leaders say just because they are protesters of the Catholic church.

you’re allegence is to the men who decided dan 13 is not scripture

 

[theefaith]

Justification occurs when a person believes. And justification is a one time event that does not have to be repeated. Hebrews 10:10, Hebrews 10:14
He will be saved from the wrath of God when Christ returns.



I don't care about Mary. And I don't care about any church father because my allegiance is not to men. The Spirit is my guide into truth. You are sorely wrong if you think I submit to everything protesting leaders say just because they are protesters of the Catholic church.

justification is not salvation but faith and baptism

 

[Ferris Bueller]

you’re allegence is to the men who decided dan 13 is not scripture

If I read Daniel 13 and found spiritual value in it I would embrace it as such. I guess your problem is you can't differentiate between valuable spiritual material and actual scripture. I have heard lots of spiritual teachings from teachers in the body of believers. But I would hardly exalt those teachings to the status of Biblical Canon. But they are very valuable, nonetheless. Because they are about already established scripture. Certain men had their reasons for relegating some writings to less than scripture. All I know is what they did relegate to actual scripture is sufficient to reveal spiritual truth and to fuel centuries of teachings about those truths down through the centuries. We don't need any more than what we have. The Catholics got in trouble when they decided they can write scripture, not just teach about existing scripture.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

justification is not salvation but faith and baptism

You have to be justified in order to be saved. Justification (being declared righteous) occurs entirely by faith apart from works - Romans 4:6. You are trapped in the deceits of false teachers who say that Paul was wrong about that.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

the true church cannot teach error Jn 16:13 jn 8:32

Your problem is you define 'church' as an organization instead of the sum total of genuine believers with the various spiritual gifts they possess. History has shown your Catholic 'church' is, and has been riddled with false leaders for centuries. So your 'church' does indeed teach error. So by your own definition (the true church cannot teach error) your church can not be the true church.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

but in the church
Ephesians 3:21
Unto him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all ages, world without end. Amen.

1 Timothy 3:15
But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

Your problem is every time you see 'church' in scripture you instantly translate it as 'Catholic church'. Stop doing that and your eyes will open. The true church is the sum total of all genuine believers with their various spiritual gifts. It's not an organization that men move in and out of.

 

[GEN2REV]

If the Bible is the Word of God to you then do you think Jesus Christ is the Bible???
...
Clearly the Bible say Jesus Christ is the Word of God and that is His name, so do you think Jesus Christ is the Bible?

Actually, in a very real sense, Jesus IS the Bible. And He claims that Himself in John chapter 6.

John 6:27 "Labor not for the food that perishes, but for the food that endures to everlasting life."
John 6:32-35 "...(the) Father gives you the True Bread from Heaven. ... the Bread of God is He who comes down from Heaven and gives Life to the world. ... they said...Lord give us this Bread always. ... Jesus said...I am the Bread of Life. He who comes to Me shall never hunger and he who believes in Me shall never thirst."
John 6:53-57 "...Jesus said...Most assuredly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no Life in you. Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has Eternal Life, ..."He who feeds on Me will live because of Me.(He who reads 'The Word')
John 6:63 "It is the Spirit that gives Life,(God is a Spirit) the flesh profits nothing. The Words that I speak to you are Spirit, and they are Life."
John 6:67-68 "...Jesus said..."Do you also want to go away? ...Simon Peter answered...Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the Words of Eternal Life."

The Bible that you hold in your hands is not Jesus in some idolic, irreverant sense, but The Words of Christ have great power. Jesus is named God's Word, THE Word and the Bible IS God's (Jesus') Words ... from cover to cover.

So, yes. The Bible is the Word of God ... as Jesus is the Word of God. When you are reading the Bible, you are not only spending time with God (Jesus), but you are literally ingesting His Spirit into your soul and thus quickening (giving Life) to your soul.

Those who are lost, who will not receive salvation, have no life in their soul. Spiritually, they are dead.

 

[Karl Peters]

the true church cannot teach error Jn 16:13 jn 8:32

Jn 16:13 “But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come.

Jn 8:32 and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.”

So we read a couple of verses and come to our own conclusion. One conclusion that "Christians" often come is the belief that they become perfect because they have the Holy Spirit. The Lord is the Truth and His Holy Spirit cannot teach error, but that doesn't mean we are perfect. We are forgiven, not perfect.

Rom 7:15 For what I am doing, I do not understand; for I am not practicing what I would like to do, but I am doing the very thing I hate.

Paul - the converted follower of Jesus Christ via His Holy Spirit - explained that he was "doing" (present tense as of the time of his writing as a converted follower of Jesus Christ) very thing that he did not want to do and even hated. So this concept of thinking that once we are Christians we can not make an error is a teaching in "error".

John also covered this mistake:

1 Jn 1:8 f we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us.

Note again that John wrote "we have" which is again a present tense at the time when John - also a known follower of Jesus Christ - wrtoe those words - and "we" in the verse means he included himself in that statement. Therefore John was not saying that he did not have sin at the time he wrote the verse. Yet the verse shows that John was aware that some were deceiving themselves into thinking that all they did was righteous (all unrighteousness is sin). They were in fact deceiving themselves if they believed that, and they deceived themselves because the truth (Jesus Christ via His Holy Spirit) was not in them!!

Therefore anyone saying they can not make an error does not have the Holy Spirit of God in them - according to the Bible.


Honestly - this becomes sooooooo very obvious if you are in fact a believer and thus seek the Lord Jesus Christ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It is the case because He reproves those He loves - us believers who do indeed seek Him!

Rev 3:19 ‘Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline; therefore be zealous and repent.

The Lord said through Isaiah - "come reason with me" - and one of the things you do when you truly come to know the Lord is reason with Him, because we have our thoughts. When you do actually reason with Him, exchanging words back and forth with Him, you quickly find out that His thoughts are not your thoughts and He is always right!! So it is a bit hard on your pride and that thinking of ours that we are prefect. He is perfect, not us!! Any real believer understand that, so obviously you are both deceiving yourself and don't have the truth in you (Jesus Christ) if you think the church can not make an error. In fact that church or member of that that church that thinks that ways does not know Jesus Christ - period. John was correct in writing what the Holy Spirit told him. But the Holy Spirit told them that if we believe we have not sin then we are deceiving ourselves - an you understand that "all unrighteousness is sin" and that means any error - like thinking we can not make an error.

I am counted as being righteous because of my faith, not because of my good works. That doesn't mean I don't try to do the right thing. But trying to do the right thing means actually seeking the Lord and listening to Him. I need to be much better at that too.

 

[theefaith]

Dan thirteen was accepted by the R double C for over a thousand years . Lets face it , THE RCC are the apostels YOU speak about .
But there was no original DAN thirteen . Men added that stuff .

the tradition of men removed it and Luther also no authority wanted James Jude and revelation removed

 

[theefaith]

What will it add to what I now know from my Bible?

Faith purity trust in God!

 

[theefaith]

Yet the Lutheran Bible does contain the books of the Apocrypha, They just do not consider them scripture. And Yes i have read them, Tobit is one I particularly enjoyed. How come the Catholic Bible leaves out the Book of Enoch, which the Coptic Bibles contain? Or the Didache, and the other books in the Orthodox Apocrypha? Do You see what I am saying? The Canon of 66 Books contains all the essential doctrine of Christianity, these books though informative, and can add information do not alter the doctrine of the church, with the exception of certain (heretical) understandings such as purgatory. Many of these Books also alack divine inspiration.

The Holy Ghost is the one that preserves the Word of God through the ages, by using men who are led by the Holy Spirit. Men like St. Jerome, Wycliffe, Luther, Tyndale, and the translators of those texts. None of us who are "protestants" deny the validity of the early church fathers and what they did with the canon of Scripture, what we say is that the "One" church was corrupted, and as with Israel of Old, when one priesthood became corrupt, God raised up another priesthood whose heart is for the Truth and for God and not for earthly glory.

There are essentials of the faith that unify all Christians, You for example do not deny that Jesus is LORD, This is is an essential of the faith that unifies, But there are other man made doctrines that divide, that are none essentials (Purgatory, Calvinism, Eschatological differences), and these are in large part none essentials of the faith. Church membership is one of those non essentials. I Have brothers and sisters in the faith who are Calvinists and Arminians, Catholics and Lutherans, Fundamentalists and charismatics. We agree on the essentials and disagree on the non essentials, and that is ok by me, as long as they can say Jesus is the LORD. (1 Corinthians 12:3)

It is when one "church" starts to "beat up" on the others that that church becomes "nicolaitan" in their doctrine. This temptation is very real for the church. Fundamentalism fell into this at the turn of the 20th century, and From this was Born the Pentecostal movement. Jesus warned of this to the Apostles themselves (Matthew 20:25-28, Luke 12:42-48) You would do well to read these verses. The Catholic church, and the doctrines you are trying to foist upon the "menservants and maidens" are very much in line with this. It is this teaching which Jesus "hates" (Revelation 2:6, Revelation 2:15) This Got so Bad that Protestantism was born of it and before that The orthodox church. Yet the RCC keeps "returning to its own vomit" to use a biblical idiom.

I have recently been reading on the RCC persecution of the Moravians, this is the same sort of thing that the RCC does over and over again, and I am not defending the Protestants because they are guilty of this as well. This is what happens when men build earthly kingdoms in the name of religion, and then have to defend them because they are built upon the teachings of men rather than the word of God. This will not end until all of us who are Christians reach the fulness of Christ, and set aside those "winds of doctrine" of men (Ephesians 4:14). My Hope is that one day you will reach this point as well, and learn to speak the truth in love.

the church is a kingdom with authority from Christ having the responsibility to defend the sacred deposit of faith Jn 16:13 eph 4:5 Jude 1:3

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Faith purity trust in God!

The scriptures I have won't lead me to that?

 

[theefaith]

If I read Daniel 13 and found spiritual value in it I would embrace it as such. I guess your problem is you can't differentiate between valuable spiritual material and actual scripture. I have heard lots of spiritual teachings from teachers in the body of believers. But I would hardly exalt those teachings to the status of Biblical Canon. But they are very valuable, nonetheless. Because they are about already established scripture. Certain men had their reasons for relegating some writings to less than scripture. All I know is what they did relegate to actual scripture is sufficient to reveal spiritual truth and to fuel centuries of teachings about those truths down through the centuries. We don't need any more than what we have. The Catholics got in trouble when they decided they can write scripture, not just teach about existing scripture.

who has authority from Christ to decide for the whole church what is and what is not scripture?

 

[theefaith]

You have to be justified in order to be saved. Justification (being declared righteous) occurs entirely by faith apart from works - Romans 4:6. You are trapped in the deceits of false teachers who say that Paul was wrong about that.

rom 4:6 refers to psalm 1:3 faith and baptism

 

[theefaith]

Your problem is you define 'church' as an organization instead of the sum total of genuine believers with the various spiritual gifts they possess. History has shown your Catholic 'church' is, and has been riddled with false leaders for centuries. So your 'church' does indeed teach error. So by your own definition (the true church cannot teach error) your church can not be the true church.

Specific

 

[Ferris Bueller]

who has authority from Christ to decide for the whole church what is and what is not scripture?

Those to whom the gift and calling of doing that has been given. And it's not the Catholic church. It's not an organization. It's various individual believers in the body of Christ gifted by God to gather the books of the Bible together for us. You won't get this because you think the body of Christ is the organization called the Catholic church.