Can a Christian Backslide/lose salvation?

[forgivenWretch]

(His By Grace;41843)
Kriss, I'm sorry, my girl, but you're speaking about something you do not know in the "once saved always saved" doctrine in the way its believed and taught. It may be attempted to be abused by people, although they are deluding themselves, but we by no means take our grace gift as a liscense to sin. I am rather hurt about this. As the apostle Paul says, "May it never be! Where sin did abound grace did abound all the more." You guys are missing an important point. Once God's Holy Spirit has sealed you, you can't become a Satan worshipper. A house divided will not stand. It's impossible. You clearly never believed in the Jesus I serve with your whole heart. Once you see Jesus for who He really is, you can't help but love Him and serve Him. You are not the same person you used to be. Yes, you will be tempted. Yes, you may "fall away" for a time, but true believers will always come back. If they die in their sins, they can still go to heaven. Guess what! We will probably all die with some type of sin that's unconfessed since we don't know when we are going to die. Jesus' sacrifice was sufficient for all of that. He can see past what we haven't "done" and know what our true love or intent is. Sure we need to strive for holiness, but the Lord remembers that we are dust. He has already made a way. He is the way. We can rest in that. It's not Him plus anything needed for salvation. He said on the cross, "It is finished!" That's all that needed to be done. If our relationship with Christ depended upon us, that would be a joke. He is the very sustainer of our being. We can't take another breath without His ordaining it. I think OSAS doctrine shows a greater love and respect for Christ because I see that I am totally dependent on Him. I am powerless to change myself. I must fall on my knees at the cross and trust Him to cover me and keep me until that day. Yes, I have purposed to cling to Him, but should I fall, He's like the Father in the story of the Prodigal Son, waiting, running to meet me, to embrace me, kiss me, and take me back in as His very own. I never lost my "sonship".

Amen !​

 

[ncsojourner]

(forgivenWretch;41722)
kriss...doctrine is man made, but OSAS is biblical and is God's Word. You are here: God >> Once Saved, Always Saved Once Saved, Always Saved – The Biblical EvidenceThe Bible teaches “once saved, always saved” -- that we can be saved once and for all only through a repentant, saving faith in Jesus Christ. Once a person has accepted Christ as Savior, they may wonder if it is possible to lose that salvation. What if they commit a sin? What if they commit a lot of sins? What if they do something very, very wrong? Is it possible to be saved, and then lose that salvation? Fortunately, the answer is a resounding “no.” Once a person has accepted Jesus Christ as Savior, he/she is forever saved. This fact is referred to as the doctrine of “eternal security,” often summarized as “once saved, always saved.” There are several reasons why a person can be confident in their “eternal security.” First and foremost is the evidence of Scripture. [url="http://www.allaboutgod.com/truth/john-3.htm]John 3:15-18[/url] says about Christ: “The Son of Man must be lifted up, that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life. For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.”The salvation in Christ is not temporary, it is eternal. In [url="http://www.allaboutgod.com/truth/john-10.htm#28]John 10:28-30[/url], Jesus says: “I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all; no one can snatch them out of my Father's hand. I and the Father are one." The forgiveness of God through Christ is sufficient to cover all of our sins -- past, present, and future. There is nothing a person can do that God cannot forgive. This doctrine is supported by Romans 8:38-39, Ephesians 4:30, and Jude 24, among others.Here is the PROOF! Directly for the bible and God Himself. There is no other scripture that can be offered that changes this in any manner shape or form...OSAS is GUARANTEED BY GOD...the proof is in His hands, just check out the nail scars.
Here is the PROOF!???? My lawgiver, my judge, my King, and my God, with thesame exact nail scars in his loving hands, said this in Revelation 3:5, "He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels". (See 3:12, 21I think may be an in depth Bible study on how to be come an overcomer would be a good start. I can tell you now it involves more than, "asking Jesus in to your heart" and "saying the sinner's prayer".Matthew 7:21-23 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. In John 10:28-30, Jesus is referring to the "lost sheep of the house of Israel"and not to the masses or, as you are thinking, the Gentiles. In vs 27 Jesus says, "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me". Who are His sheep? Matthew 15:24 tells us, "But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel". cf. Ps 74:1; 79:13;95:7; 100:3;Jeremiah 23:1 Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the LORD. It is also claimed, "There is nothing a person can do that God cannot forgive".Matthew 12:31 "Therefore I say to you, any sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven men, but blasphemy against the Spirit shall not be forgiven. (See Mark 3:28-29) Romans 9:38, 39, is also cited as another proof. If you put those verses in proper context and go back up to vs 33 you will see that those vs also are talking of Israel and not Gentiles, as you know them. Isaiah 45:4 "For Jacob my servant's sake, and Israel mine elect, I have even called thee by thy name: I have surnamed thee, though thou hast not known me". The elect of God is Israel, whether you like it or not.2 Timothy 3:16, 17 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.No body but Jesus the Christ had perfect doctrine. As servants to the King of Kings and the Lord of Lords we should strive diligently, every day, to get as close to perfection as humanly possible. Proverbs 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.Gary

 

[forgivenWretch]

I'm sorry Gary but you have proven nothing, You have only done what every one else has attempted to do. You have attempted to refute scripture with scripture, to which that in itself is blasphemy. You cannot use God's Word against God's Word!!!!

 

[Letsgofishing]

(forgivenWretch;41911)
Ryan attempt all you wish, but the only thing that you may accomplish is as stated over and over, you continue to call God a liar.! Scripture CANNOT refute Scripture...why can you not get that through that your stubborn think skull. God is not a liar! nor is His word. There is absolutely no contradiction, whatsoever in the bible. If you wish to cloud the minds of other Christians and non-Christians then God have mercy on your soul! Do NOT bother on my account. I am a born again, saved by His Grace, Christian, and He has guaranteed my salvation whether or not you wish to accept it.
God bless you Forgiven wretch may he bless every step you take

 

[forgivenWretch]

(Letsgofishing;41926)
God bless you Forgiven wretch may he bless every step you take
Like wise brother, we will laugh over this some day in heaven I hope.

 

[Letsgofishing]

Thank you forgiven I'm sorry for offending you with my second to last statement. I was tired and wasn't thinking. Below is my humble opinon, take it or leave it, we are still brothers either way. In my opinon scriptures don't contradict each other at all. Almost everything you say is true. Jesus is the giver of eternal life and there is nothing a person can do which God cannot forgive. As long as we remain in God we have eternal security. But "remain" is the main word. Everytime we sin we step away from God we have a choice, we can accept his forgiveness and infinite mercy or we can step away. For those who accept every single scripture verse you quoted remains true. But for those who don't accept his forgiveness, the scriptures you quoted do not apply. But can a true christian freely step away from God, and not repent after he sins. I believe so, Becoming christian does not cause you to live free will. God has given each of us a great gift of allowing us to feel his love, a love which is almost impossible to step away from. But you can step away from it. God has promised that he will leave 99 of his sheep to bring back the one that is lost. This is a beautiful!!!! This is beautiful even if we step away God will do everything to get us back. But again we have our free will and we can refuse to come back to him. God has offered his forgiveness, but he does not force it on us. We have to choose it for ourselves, even after we become christians.

 

[waynemlj]

Hi WildB,A request: whenever you quote the Bible directly, you need to give the reference to the book, chapter, and verse. That is a big help to all who read you Post. It makes it possible to verify your quote and, maybe, to read around it a little and learn something you didn't even intend in your original Post.You never know what the Holy Spirit wants to teach someone who reads your Bible quotes.Thanks,waynemlj

 

[His By Grace]

What a breath of fresh Holy Ghost air, LGF!!!! Thanks for your extended kindness to our brother, Forgivenwretch. You are "showing" the fruit of the Spirit(Galatians 5:22). We can agree to disagree. Just like my sweet sis, Kriss. She didn't even post anything in rebuttal to my comment. I guess it was an extension of grace to me. That's how I took it. These are all the workings of the Spirit, showing that the Lord IS WHO HE SAYS HE IS!!! The great I AM, NOT THE GREAT I WAS!!!!(like the song says!) These kinds of things speak more to the lost, dying, unbelieving than 10,000 words in arguments and anger. Yes, we should be able to give a defense for the hope that is within us ( 1 Peter 3:15), but our badge as a Christian is the way we love others (1 John 4:8)and our Lord! Jesus said these were the greatest two commandments(Mark 12:30,31). We can't help but be saved by Him when following these two things. Man, I'm stoked for the worship we will have this morning! Death could not hold him in the ground! Hallelujah! What a Savior!!!!

 

[forgivenWretch]

(Letsgofishing;41952)
Thank you forgiven I'm sorry for offending you with my second to last statement. I was tired and wasn't thinking. Below is my humble opinon, take it or leave it, we are still brothers either way. In my opinon scriptures don't contradict each other at all. Almost everything you say is true. Jesus is the giver of eternal life and there is nothing a person can do which God cannot forgive. As long as we remain in God we have eternal security. But "remain" is the main word. Everytime we sin we step away from God we have a choice, we can accept his forgiveness and infinite mercy or we can step away. For those who accept every single scripture verse you quoted remains true. But for those who don't accept his forgiveness, the scriptures you quoted do not apply. But can a true christian freely step away from God, and not repent after he sins. I believe so, Becoming christian does not cause you to live free will. God has given each of us a great gift of allowing us to feel his love, a love which is almost impossible to step away from. But you can step away from it. God has promised that he will leave 99 of his sheep to bring back the one that is lost. This is a beautiful!!!! This is beautiful even if we step away God will do everything to get us back. But again we have our free will and we can refuse to come back to him. God has offered his forgiveness, but he does not force it on us. We have to choose it for ourselves, even after we become christians.
Thank you Ryan. One of the most amazing attributes as Christians that we possess is our deep love, and it is always amazing as how it always shines in the end. Thank God we will stand together in Heaven and be on the same page some day. Bless you Ryan and with all my love,Wayne

 

[His By Grace]

Hey, guys. I e-mailed Bro. Dennis, my pastor, to get his take on this. I have heard him preach on it, but it's been a while back. I knew Moses had spoken of having his name blotted out of the book if God wouldn't forgive the children of Israel, but that was before the cross payment was made to cover our sin debt. So, I'm not saying that Exodus and Psalms aren't relevant scriptures, but we need to view them in the light of which they are intended- in context. Now as far as the Revelation scriptures, they don't say one's name will be blotted out, but they do seem to imply that. Anyway, Bro. D. reminded me that there are "books". One of the books has every name of every person that was ever born with all of the acts committed, but upon salvation, one's name is transferred to the Lamb's Book of Life. I also remember that he used a visual with his hands that was very effective as far as the verse goes in John 10:28 and 29. He showed us how we are in the center of Christ's Hand because God the Father gave us to Christ; so not only are we covered by Christ (close your fist of your left hand), but we are also covered by the One Jesus said was greater (while He was on earth), so we are fully secured (cover your left hand with your right). Isn't that a beautiful picture of how secure we are in Jesus'/God's Hands? I love these verses. To quote them directly: "And I (Jesus) give them ETERNAL life, and they shall NEVER perish; neither shall ANYONE snatch them out of My Hand. My Father, Who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and NO ONE is able to snatch them out of My Father's Hand." Verse 30 goes on to say, "I and the Father are one." That brings about another good point. When they move in and make their abode with us, we are united with them forever. We are one with Christ and God. We have the righteousness of Christ. How then could we ever fall from grace, since we never did anything to earn grace in the first place?

 

[His By Grace]

If you want an even clearer picture of what we believe as far as OSAS, then you could also read Charles Stanley's book, Eternal Security of the Believer. It goes into great detail on the whole subject, so that no one will think that we take the precious grace of Jesus lightly or carelessly. It's not about an excuse to sin. It's about a security needed to have a hope for the future; believing that Jesus paid it all and all to Him we owe. Though sin had left a crimson stain, He washed it white as snow!

 

[ncsojourner]

(forgivenWretch;41432)
Only you and God know the answer to that, Franklin.B making life changes ...changes nothing/ baptism saves nobody/ reading your Bible is something one is required to do but still has nothing to do with one's actual salvation/praying alone does not save you eitherl.
1 Peter 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

 

[waynemlj]

Hi forgivenWretch,One who is truly regenerated by the Holy Spirit and given the gift of faith to believe in Jesus Christ as Savior, cannot lose salvation!1 Peter 1:3-4, "Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! According to his great mercy, he has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, to an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, kept in heaven for you, who by God's power are being guarded through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last time."Here's another proof of the permanence of salvation: Hebrews 12:2, "looking to Jesus, the founder and perfecter of our faith . . ."One more proof: Romans 8:34,38,39, "Who is to condemn? Christ Jesus is the one who died -- more than that, who was raised -- who is at the right hand of God, who indeed is interceding for us.For I am sure the neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all of creation will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord."waynemlj

 

[forgivenWretch]

Thank you Wayne,Wayne

 

[WildB]

Originally posted by fastforward:[qb] WildB,Thanks.If you cared to look at my little profile here at this site you will see trucking listed. In the good old U.S. of A. we ship more goods by truck than any other country in the world. And on the backs of all those truck trailers are placed these seals. Only authorized personnel can legally break the seals and only when they reach their destination, (excepting upon some sort of catastrophe and even then it is still only authorized personnel just a different set). It was good talking to you WildB,Fastforward [/qb]
I did. And hopefully we can put this dog to rest.I too understand SEALING. ALL safty valves on a Boiler are SEALED.The valve is set to a limit that lets the valve lift to mantain a safe operating pressure.When lifted it goes back to the limit operation without having to be ~RE-SEALED.Those that teach OSAS , ONCE SEALED AIN'T SEALED, are those that would by~pass the valve and jepordized the overal integaty of the boiler.Boilers with misfunctioning, improperly set or TAMPERED with safty valves KILL.Thats why the SEAL is important. Lets Let the Holy Spirit SEAL and not man's sillyness.I thank God Thru Jesus my Lord that I am SEALED untill the day of REDEMPTION.

 

[Franklin]

(His By Grace;42031)
If you want an even clearer picture of what we believe as far as OSAS, then you could also read Charles Stanley's book, Eternal Security of the Believer. It goes into great detail on the whole subject, so that no one will think that we take the precious grace of Jesus lightly or carelessly. It's not about an excuse to sin. It's about a security needed to have a hope for the future; believing that Jesus paid it all and all to Him we owe. Though sin had left a crimson stain, He washed it white as snow!
I've read it... Not a very good book, and not very complete in answering objections. Go ahead and read it if you want to understand the viewpoint, but it wont impress you

 

[Christina]

You guys are thinking sealed is the same as being saved it is not the 144,000 are believers and have been saved will be sealed. Sealing occurs only after you have been proven to have Gods truth of his Word fixed upon your mind it can come in stages there is believing and repenting seals the promise of salvation Something is not sealed or closed untill it is done and completed rightly teachings of men believers who are lukewarm complete sealing is reserved for those who are found worthy the sealing here is the oppisite of the seal (mark) of the beast those who are not sealed with truth are in danger of taking the wrong seal(mark) All pre-trib raptures believers risk this mistake not to count all the false teachers and preachers and those that believe falsness of men over God you may still be saved without being yet sealed this is future144,000 Sealed 1After this I saw four angels standing at the four corners of the earth, holding back the four winds of the earth to prevent any wind from blowing on the land or on the sea or on any tree. 2Then I saw another angel coming up from the east, having the seal of the living God. He called out in a loud voice to the four angels who had been given power to harm the land and the sea: 3"Do not harm the land or the sea or the trees until we put a seal on the foreheads of the servants of our God." 4Then I heard the number of those who were sealed: 144,000 from all the tribes of Israel. 5From the tribe of Judah 12,000 were sealed, from the tribe of Reuben 12,000, from the tribe of Gad 12,000, 6from the tribe of Asher 12,000, from the tribe of Naphtali 12,000, from the tribe of Manasseh 12,000, 7from the tribe of Simeon 12,000, from the tribe of Levi 12,000, from the tribe of Issachar 12,000, 8from the tribe of Zebulun 12,000, from the tribe of Joseph 12,000, from the tribe of Benjamin 12,000.

 

[Christina]

2 Corinthians 1:22who also sealed us and gave us the Spirit in our hearts as a pledge.Ephesians 1:13In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation--having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promiseWhen one is baptised (that is believe and reptance) you have a promise of being completley sealed Ephesians 4:30Do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption.this promise is for the day of redemption, when those deemed worthy that is have truth in their mind will be sealed. Belief gets you the promise of being worthy it is you who decides by your choices if you will be among the sealed2 Timothy 2:19Nevertheless, the firm foundation of God stands, having this seal, "The Lord knows those who are His," and, "Everyone who names the name of the Lord is to abstain from wickedness." if you do not abstain from wickness you can lose your promise

 

[Shan Missions]

By law, the government of the country has the power and authority to revoke a citizenship of any citizen when he/she committed crime against the country not deserve to be a citizen any more.God has power and authority of refusing any Christian to go to heaven who has committed sin and has not been forgiven. ( I mean backslider). Salvation is not a license to sin.

 

[His By Grace]

Since God is doing the pleding and the promising, it's just like in the faith chapter of Hebrews (Ch. 11), where Abraham believed God and "called those things that were not as though they were." Remember, with God, time is really not an issue. Therefore, we ARE sealed unto the day of redemption. So, our salvation is technically complete now. We can enjoy the fruit of heaven here on earth. " For whatsoever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven and whatsoever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven." (Matthew 18:18)Franklin, I'm sorry the book Eternal Security wasn't good to you. Sometimes when we read things, we read with a certain expectation. Maybe you were looking for something more than he could give. He is a mere man and isn't going to misquote the Bible. Anyway, to each his own thoughts about this, but live for the Lord. That's a surety we can all agree on! Have a blessed day. It doesn't offend me whatsoever if anyone disagrees with me. BUT, I do have a right to believe what I believe. I will let the Spirit Himself convict me otherwise.