Catholic Inquisitions
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Sacred as in I heard it through the grape vine as oral traditons of the father . . law of the fathers. ? Or sacred as in all things writen in the law and the porphets (sola scriptura)the law of our one Holy father. No man can serve two teaching masters as our unseen Lord as God .
Which one wil you serve?
Teaching of Christ and His apostles!
Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Acts 1:17 acts 8:31 & 35 acts 9:4 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20
Lk 10:16
He who hears you hears me...
John 13:20
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.
Jn 20:21 as my father sent me, so send in you. (The apostles) posses the same power mission and authority as Christ!
Peter, the apostles and their successors!
John 15:15
Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.
Romans 16:26
But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:
Ephesians 3:3
How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery;
Ephesians 3:5
Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;
2 Peter 1:16
For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.
John 17:8
For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.
Acts 20:24
But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God.
1 Corinthians 11:23
For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, that the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread:
1 Corinthians 15:3
For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
1 Thessalonians 2:13
For this cause also thank we God without ceasing, because, when ye received the word of God which ye heard of us, ye received it not as the word of men, but as it is in truth, the word of God, which effectually worketh also in you that believe.
2 Thessalonians 3:6
Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us.
2 Thessalonians 2:15
Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.
(Even scripture is part of sacred tradition)
False doctrine!
Jn 8:32 the truth shall make you free!
The opposite is also true, false doctrine will enslave you!
2 Thessalonians 2:10
And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
Teachings of Christ alone. . . not of mankind..nothing.
His apostles are sent. Giving meaning to the word apostle . . sent with His teaching not their own private interpretation as a personal commentary, or oral traditions of the fathers that lord it over the non-venerable faith . .. Just as those today he sends them out two by two with the gospel the incorruptible seed by which men are born again.
It’s easy to see that the Catholic fathers (legion) have redefined the word apostle with a little searching of sola scriptura the Bible .That would seem to be when the divison has its beginning.
To redefine the word apostle violates the warning not to add new meaning to a word (singular) it is considered plagiarism it can change the outcome of the commandments (plural) and destroy the integrity of the one author (Christ)
Another warning not to add to the whole book of prophecy is seen at the end the last book Revelation . .together they work to protect the word of God from plagiarism . ( Did God not seen say you will die? Surely you will not look at me and live.
Deuteronomy 4: 2 Ye shall not add unto the word (singular) which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it (singular) , that ye may keep the commandments(plural) of the Lord your God which I command you.
As apostles today we can plant the born again gospel seed and water it with the doctrines of God, the water of the word. . that fall from above as the proper form of inspiration.Not inspired from earth Rome. .
But clearly if Christ does not work in a person to both reveal his will and empower them to perform it Then there is no conversions . Apostles are considered as nothing, nada. zip . The question I would ask is why would you puff up the apostles above that which is written (sola scriptura) .What’s the hope in the end of the matter ?
mentioning twice is used to emphasize the law not subject to change . . by a law of men called fathers .
1 Corinthians 3:6 I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase.So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.
As apostles today sent with the gospel we must continue to decrease as he increase .He is our one source of faith. Not a legion of fathers
It would seem you are preaching another gospel another Christ that you must call the Pope or what scripture calls a daysman.
Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Acts 1:17 acts 8:31 & 35 acts 9:4 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20
Lk 10:16
He who hears you hears me...
John 13:20
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.
Jn 20:21 as my father sent me, so send in you. (The apostles) posses the same power mission and authority as Christ!
Peter, the apostles and their successors!
read those verses carefully
I have read them and studied them .You are simply relying on the private interpretation of your sect seeking their approval as if they were the power that works in a believer .
Successors Hmmmm as if we serve a heirarchy of men and not the Holy Spirit that lives in each beliver..Did you forget the first century reformation came over 2000 years ago and another 500 years ago ?
Really and what power is that the power of Christ working in them to both will and do the good pleasure of the unseen father?
Do the apostles apply to the law below?
2 Corinthians 4:7 But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.
I read them the verses you offered there are no successors of Christ. One God not many gods . You simply changed the meaning of the word sent one into powerfull one .
Why do you puff up the apotles above that which is writen? What is your hope in a legion of fathers called patron saints as disembodied workers with a famailar spirit .Christians serve one unseen father not 3500 and rising.
Christians according to the word of God and not according to the law of your fathers in their bible of sacred to themeslves (CCC) Chriostians pray or seek after the manner he has given us .Our Father in heaven hallowed be His name not our patron saints in heaven hallowed be their names (3500 and rising) How many wil be enough ?
Successors of Jesus Christ!
Jesus already prepares His apostles to continue His mission with His power (binding and loosing) and with His authority (keys) matt 16:18 matt 18:18
John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.
John 4:1 when therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John...
Jn 4:2 Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples
Here we see Jesus delegating to His successors, Peter and the apostles!
Jn 15:5 apart from me you can do nothing
There can be no unity of the spirit without obedience to the faith! Rom 1:5 eph 4:3
Matt 28 I am with you (the apostles)
The papacy based on Matt 16:18 and Isa 22:21-22
Matt 16:18-19
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
Isa 22:21-22
21 And I will clothe him with thy robe, and strengthen him with thy girdle, and I will commit thy government into his hand: and he shall be a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and to the house of Judah.
22 And the key of the house of David will I lay upon his shoulder; so he shall open, and none shall shut; and he shall shut, and none shall open.
Behold I am with you (the successors or the apostles until the end of the age, so the successors must remain until the end of the age) matt 28:19
(None of the so called reformers were apostles) (no man has authority to start a church)
Successors of Moses!
Matt 23 why does Jesus say to obey the successors of Moses?
The successors of Moses sit in the chair of Moses having the authority of the keys and the power to bind and loose Matt 23 and Jesus commanded them to be obeyed! Then the kingdom was taken from them matt 21:43 and given to Peter, Matt 16:18 the apostles, Matt 18:18 and their successors with the authority of the keys and the power to bind and lose!
Jesus said to obey the authority of the successors of Moses mt 23 authority of the keys and power to bind and loose and this power and authority was taken from them matt and given by Christ to Peter, the apostles and their successors, mt 16:18 18:18 this same authority and power must be obeyed!
mt 28:18-20 all authority is given to Peter, the apostles, and their successors requiring obedience, rom 1:5 obedience to the faith!
And Jesus say to Peter, the apostles, and their successors: behold I am with you even until the end of the world!!!
So the apostles have to remain until the end! Revelation 5:10
And hast made us unto our God kings and Priests: and we shall reign on the earth. Reign with kingdom authority (keys) power (bind loose) matt 16:18
The successors of Peter and the apostles have a valid jurisdictional authority (keys) and power (bind and loose) by Jesus Christ!
Lk 10:16
He who hears you hears me...
John 13:20
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.
apostolic succession!
explicit and implicit in scripture
Judas was an apostle
Acts 1:17 For he was numbered with us, and had obtained part of this ministry.
acts 1:20 For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishoprick let another take.
Matthias succeeded him as apostle
acts 1: 26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.
now if it applies to judas how much more to Peter and the other apostles
Matt 28:19-20
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
Jesus is with His church and His apostles until the end! So the apostles must remain until the end governing the church administering the kingdom
Mt 16:18 Peter received the keys of the kingdom: (jurisdictional authority of the universal church) and the power to bind and loose:
Lk 22:32
Jesus prays for Peter:
Jn 21:17
Peter commanded to Feed my sheep:
But it was Protestant Queen Elizabeth that was the bloodiest of all killing thousands of faithful Catholics
And expelling the Jews
And expelling the Jews
Old manuscript discovered.
Manuscript discovered detailing Inquisition trials against Jews
Manuscript discovered detailing Inquisition trials against Jews
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JohnPaul
Soldier of Jehovah and Christ
@theefaith we were discussing this topic a few days ago. I read this article in the Jerusalem Post yesterday, which was reporting on a press release that was issued on Wednesday by the National Library of Israel. Rather than post the article in that thread, where many topics were being discussed, I posted it in this thread, which is specifically dedicated to the subject.
Jim B
Well-Known Member
Catholics naturally avoid discussing this dark chapter in their history. In addition to the demonic inquisitions, don't forget the crusades, the excommunications of those who dared oppose their doctrine, the slaughter of Native Americans (and others) who refused to succumb, the sexual abuse of children, and many other grotesque, sinful actions, all the while proclaiming themselves as the one true faith.
Illuminator
Well-Known Member
Their are at least 2 reasons why a Seventh Day Adventist would post about the inquisitions:
1) it's a handy bat to beat Catholics with.
2) it creates wider divisions between Catholics and non-Catholics.
3) the thread title is a magnet for those already disposed to hating Catholicism, like Gary Urban inserting 6-7 off topic fallacious statements.
It leads into childish "your-daddy-is-uglier-than-my-daddy" arguments. Forums are always highjacked to promote sick, inaccurate SDA videos that demonize anything Catholic. They can scare little children. The SDA manipulates the tone, pitting Catholics against Protestants. Then, they sit back in a corner and watch Catholics, Protestants and Jews engaging in something similar to a bar room brawl. Victory for the SDA.
BTW, the Catholic Church has a formal, healthy relationship with the Jews. A fake Jew would try to undermine that relationship.
@Heart2Soul This going-nowhere-thread should be closed.
1) it's a handy bat to beat Catholics with.
2) it creates wider divisions between Catholics and non-Catholics.
3) the thread title is a magnet for those already disposed to hating Catholicism, like Gary Urban inserting 6-7 off topic fallacious statements.
It leads into childish "your-daddy-is-uglier-than-my-daddy" arguments. Forums are always highjacked to promote sick, inaccurate SDA videos that demonize anything Catholic. They can scare little children. The SDA manipulates the tone, pitting Catholics against Protestants. Then, they sit back in a corner and watch Catholics, Protestants and Jews engaging in something similar to a bar room brawl. Victory for the SDA.
BTW, the Catholic Church has a formal, healthy relationship with the Jews. A fake Jew would try to undermine that relationship.
@Heart2Soul This going-nowhere-thread should be closed.
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Illuminator
Well-Known Member
4. As the sacred synod searches into the mystery of the Church, it remembers the bond that spiritually ties the people of the New Covenant to Abraham's stock.
Thus the Church of Christ acknowledges that, according to God's saving design, the beginnings of her faith and her election are found already among the Patriarchs, Moses and the prophets. She professes that all who believe in Christ-Abraham's sons according to faith (6)-are included in the same Patriarch's call, and likewise that the salvation of the Church is mysteriously foreshadowed by the chosen people's exodus from the land of bondage. The Church, therefore, cannot forget that she received the revelation of the Old Testament through the people with whom God in His inexpressible mercy concluded the Ancient Covenant. Nor can she forget that she draws sustenance from the root of that well-cultivated olive tree onto which have been grafted the wild shoots, the Gentiles.(7) Indeed, the Church believes that by His cross Christ, Our Peace, reconciled Jews and Gentiles. making both one in Himself.(8)
The Church keeps ever in mind the words of the Apostle about his kinsmen: "theirs is the sonship and the glory and the covenants and the law and the worship and the promises; theirs are the fathers and from them is the Christ according to the flesh" (Rom. 9:4-5), the Son of the Virgin Mary. She also recalls that the Apostles, the Church's main-stay and pillars, as well as most of the early disciples who proclaimed Christ's Gospel to the world, sprang from the Jewish people.
As Holy Scripture testifies, Jerusalem did not recognize the time of her visitation,(9) nor did the Jews in large number, accept the Gospel; indeed not a few opposed its spreading.(10) Nevertheless, God holds the Jews most dear for the sake of their Fathers; He does not repent of the gifts He makes or of the calls He issues-such is the witness of the Apostle.(11) In company with the Prophets and the same Apostle, the Church awaits that day, known to God alone, on which all peoples will address the Lord in a single voice and "serve him shoulder to shoulder" (Soph. 3:9).(12)
Since the spiritual patrimony common to Christians and Jews is thus so great, this sacred synod wants to foster and recommend that mutual understanding and respect which is the fruit, above all, of biblical and theological studies as well as of fraternal dialogues.
True, the Jewish authorities and those who followed their lead pressed for the death of Christ;(13) still, what happened in His passion cannot be charged against all the Jews, without distinction, then alive, nor against the Jews of today. Although the Church is the new people of God, the Jews should not be presented as rejected or accursed by God, as if this followed from the Holy Scriptures. All should see to it, then, that in catechetical work or in the preaching of the word of God they do not teach anything that does not conform to the truth of the Gospel and the spirit of Christ.
Furthermore, in her rejection of every persecution against any man, the Church, mindful of the patrimony she shares with the Jews and moved not by political reasons but by the Gospel's spiritual love, decries hatred, persecutions, displays of anti-Semitism, directed against Jews at any time and by anyone.
Besides, as the Church has always held and holds now, Christ underwent His passion and death freely, because of the sins of men and out of infinite love, in order that all may reach salvation. It is, therefore, the burden of the Church's preaching to proclaim the cross of Christ as the sign of God's all-embracing love and as the fountain from which every grace flows.
Nostra aetate
Thus the Church of Christ acknowledges that, according to God's saving design, the beginnings of her faith and her election are found already among the Patriarchs, Moses and the prophets. She professes that all who believe in Christ-Abraham's sons according to faith (6)-are included in the same Patriarch's call, and likewise that the salvation of the Church is mysteriously foreshadowed by the chosen people's exodus from the land of bondage. The Church, therefore, cannot forget that she received the revelation of the Old Testament through the people with whom God in His inexpressible mercy concluded the Ancient Covenant. Nor can she forget that she draws sustenance from the root of that well-cultivated olive tree onto which have been grafted the wild shoots, the Gentiles.(7) Indeed, the Church believes that by His cross Christ, Our Peace, reconciled Jews and Gentiles. making both one in Himself.(8)
The Church keeps ever in mind the words of the Apostle about his kinsmen: "theirs is the sonship and the glory and the covenants and the law and the worship and the promises; theirs are the fathers and from them is the Christ according to the flesh" (Rom. 9:4-5), the Son of the Virgin Mary. She also recalls that the Apostles, the Church's main-stay and pillars, as well as most of the early disciples who proclaimed Christ's Gospel to the world, sprang from the Jewish people.
As Holy Scripture testifies, Jerusalem did not recognize the time of her visitation,(9) nor did the Jews in large number, accept the Gospel; indeed not a few opposed its spreading.(10) Nevertheless, God holds the Jews most dear for the sake of their Fathers; He does not repent of the gifts He makes or of the calls He issues-such is the witness of the Apostle.(11) In company with the Prophets and the same Apostle, the Church awaits that day, known to God alone, on which all peoples will address the Lord in a single voice and "serve him shoulder to shoulder" (Soph. 3:9).(12)
Since the spiritual patrimony common to Christians and Jews is thus so great, this sacred synod wants to foster and recommend that mutual understanding and respect which is the fruit, above all, of biblical and theological studies as well as of fraternal dialogues.
True, the Jewish authorities and those who followed their lead pressed for the death of Christ;(13) still, what happened in His passion cannot be charged against all the Jews, without distinction, then alive, nor against the Jews of today. Although the Church is the new people of God, the Jews should not be presented as rejected or accursed by God, as if this followed from the Holy Scriptures. All should see to it, then, that in catechetical work or in the preaching of the word of God they do not teach anything that does not conform to the truth of the Gospel and the spirit of Christ.
Furthermore, in her rejection of every persecution against any man, the Church, mindful of the patrimony she shares with the Jews and moved not by political reasons but by the Gospel's spiritual love, decries hatred, persecutions, displays of anti-Semitism, directed against Jews at any time and by anyone.
Besides, as the Church has always held and holds now, Christ underwent His passion and death freely, because of the sins of men and out of infinite love, in order that all may reach salvation. It is, therefore, the burden of the Church's preaching to proclaim the cross of Christ as the sign of God's all-embracing love and as the fountain from which every grace flows.
Nostra aetate
@theefaith is a Catholic. I’m a Jewish monotheist. I didn’t bring the Inquisition up to him. He brought the Inquisition up to me. We were having a good conversation about it and I wanted to follow up on it with him after I came across the Jerusalem Post article.
I’ve discussed the Inquisition with other Catholics and none of them gave me the impression that they were attempting to avoid the subject. I understand that your experience with Catholics may be different from mine.
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