Ah Patrick, all people can benefit from the scriptures if they chose to apply it soundly in their lives.
The sad part is that many people reject what the scriptures state like you are attempting to do here in this thread.
Changing verses to conform to forever punishment theology
- Thread starter Patrick1966
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
Ah Patrick, all people can benefit from the scriptures if they chose to apply it soundly in their lives.
The sad part is that many people reject what the scriptures state like you are attempting to do here in this thread.
So my change is accurate and that it's good news for only "some" people and not ALL people as the angel claimed.
I'm glad that you're able to correct the errors of statements made by God's angels so that we don't adopt false doctrines.
Only in your eyes. I suspect that God will have the last word on what you push as "Good Theology," and you will not be able to repent if you find yourself in the Lake of Fire.
The angel said it was news for ALL people, but you claim that the angel is wrong and that it's good news for only SOME people and then you accuse me of changing the meaning of the scriptures. Priceless.
No, that is not true. God said before the Flood that He would not contend with living people on the face of the earth for more than 120 years. What you are pushing with your universalism is that God will contend with those who have been dispatched into the Lake of Fire for as many years as is necessary for them to repent. The people in the lake of Fire may realise that they made many wrong decisions before they breathed their last, but the Lake of Fire is where they are forever separated from seeing or interacting with God. If they are not able to interact with God, then they have to accept the consequences of their own foolish decisions and any repentance that they may utter when in the Lake of Fire will not change their circumstances. Our oaths that we make when we breathe our last breath are recorded when we die and nothing that could be done after that point of time allows for the books to be changed.
My friend it is your bad that is binding on you.
Shalom
The gospel is good news for all people Patrick. Let me explain to you how it works:
Jesus died for us to provide salvation for all he desires. We can make ourselves desirable to be saved. We can also make ourselves desirable to be destroyed. It's good news for all people that desire salvation. One must become a listener, believer and follower of Jesus as a little child would.
Matthew 18:2 Then Jesus called a little child to Him, set him in the midst of them, 3 and said, “Assuredly, I say to you, unless you are converted and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven. 4 Therefore whoever humbles himself as this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven.
Last edited:
I go where the word of God takes me. The angel said it was good news for ALL people. I believe it is true. Dennis claims it's not true and that God sends many to be tortured by fire forever.
We've all felt the horrific pain of being burned. Can you imagine the pain of your whole body being on fire? I can't because it's unimaginable. It's happened to people but at least they quickly died and escaped that horrible experience. Dennis and most other Christians believe that Jesus routinely does this to many people.
To me that is theology taught by Satan and demons.
Next I'll be told that the following is also incorrect and that Jesus didn't save the "world" but only "some".
1 John 4:7-22 ESV
7 Beloved, let us love one another, for love is from God, and whoever loves has been born of God and knows God. 8 Anyone who does not love does not know God, because God is love. 9 In this the love of God was made manifest among us, that God sent his only Son into the world, so that we might live through him. 10 In this is love, not that we have loved God but that he loved us and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins. 11 Beloved, if God so loved us, we also ought to love one another. 12 No one has ever seen God; if we love one another, God abides in us and his love is perfected in us. 13 By this we know that we abide in him and he in us, because he has given us of his Spirit. 14 And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world.
We've all felt the horrific pain of being burned. Can you imagine the pain of your whole body being on fire? I can't because it's unimaginable. It's happened to people but at least they quickly died and escaped that horrible experience. Dennis and most other Christians believe that Jesus routinely does this to many people.
To me that is theology taught by Satan and demons.
Next I'll be told that the following is also incorrect and that Jesus didn't save the "world" but only "some".
1 John 4:7-22 ESV
7 Beloved, let us love one another, for love is from God, and whoever loves has been born of God and knows God. 8 Anyone who does not love does not know God, because God is love. 9 In this the love of God was made manifest among us, that God sent his only Son into the world, so that we might live through him. 10 In this is love, not that we have loved God but that he loved us and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins. 11 Beloved, if God so loved us, we also ought to love one another. 12 No one has ever seen God; if we love one another, God abides in us and his love is perfected in us. 13 By this we know that we abide in him and he in us, because he has given us of his Spirit. 14 And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world.
So the verse is wrong and it should read that it's good news for some people and not ALL people. The angel Gabriel really put his foot in his mouth!
John 12:32 ESV
And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL people to myself.”
changed to...
And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw SOME people to myself.”
And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL people to myself.”
changed to...
And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw SOME people to myself.”
No it's not wrong. It is good news for all people. We can't reject the hundreds of other scriptures that explain how to be part of this plan of salvation and how people that reject it get cast off into hell.
There are those of us that care about others and are pleasant people. There are also them that could care less about others and inflict torture and misery on people when they can get away with it.
Is Jesus just and the judge? Yes he is.
Put it this way, God is a good father and he is Holy. How would a father look on one child torturing another or living selfishly and denying aid to their brothers and sisters. He would look with sorrow and a desire that they should turn from that wickedness into goodness. And that I believe is God the Father and how he works. But what Father wouldn't step in to stop one of his children from torturing another of his children. And that I believe is what spirit prison is for.
On a side note, spirit prison is not the same as the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the final judgment. Many believe spirit prison might be a place where people can think about where their crimes led them. The bible says "all" will be resurrected and they will, some to eternal life, others to eternal shame.
Why do you believe it's good news for all people if only some people receive the benefit?
It's news patrick. It means it's good for all people to hear it. The possibility of being saved.
I think you also have to understand the context of the good news. The Jews believed they were the chosen people and that God would save them. But they thought little of the gentiles and other tribes that didn't follow their God. And to them the good news of the Old Testament and being the seed of Abraham meant only they would be saved.
So when he said good news for all people, he was extending the chance of salvation to all peoples and tribes. Which is something the Jews may not have liked.
So when he said good news for all people, he was extending the chance of salvation to all peoples and tribes. Which is something the Jews may not have liked.
It is indeed good news for all but not because they have the "possibility" of being saved; it is because all WILL be saved! However, that doesn't mean that the wicked won't pay a high price for their rejection of God and their extreme depravity.
Hebrews 1:3 ESV
3 He is the radiance of the glory of God and the exact imprint of his nature, and he upholds the universe by the word of his power. After making purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high,
What did Jesus say in the sheep and goats:
Matthew 25:41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.
Remember those are Jesus' own words.
No, that's not what Jesus said. Jesus said...
Matthew 25:41 CLNT
41 "Then shall He be declaring to those also at His left, 'Go from Me, you cursed, into the fire eonian, made ready for the Adversary and his messengers.
Dev, the Bible from which you quoted contradicts itself due to erroneous translations. Good Bible translations don't contradict themselves.
I see, we have different translations. I use the New King James version. What version do you use?
@dev553344
1 John 3:3 ESV
And everyone who thus hopes in him purifies himself as he is pure.
What can we glean from that? We can glean that ALL get purified but not necessarily in the same way. What John was saying is that we believers get purified the nice and easy way through our faith in Christ.
We can deduce that everyone else is also purified, but their purification process differs from ours.
1 John 3:3 ESV
And everyone who thus hopes in him purifies himself as he is pure.
What can we glean from that? We can glean that ALL get purified but not necessarily in the same way. What John was saying is that we believers get purified the nice and easy way through our faith in Christ.
We can deduce that everyone else is also purified, but their purification process differs from ours.
That is from the Concordant Literal New Testament.
I prefer the ESV for its ease of reading but whenever I encounter verses that relate to time I check with the CLNT. Young's Literal Translation is also good.
Similar threads
