Church councils?

[Jim B]

Lol.... it is the lone wolf mentality that YOU have of 'I can sit in my basement, eat my Doritos, drink my soda and read Scripture on my own and figure it out on my own the Truth of Scripture because I am glued to the bible and I am DUG into the bible but no one else is.

And then you get other people to follow you and YOUR truth........that is how "so many different denominations" get started.

You know....just like the Protestant revolution 500 years ago that is still going on today!!

Think about it amigo.....

Yes! Isn't it great that Martin Luther and others were recruited by God to turn people away from the corrupt teachings and practices of the Catholic denomination and bring them back to Himself?

I am so very, very thankful that we have the Bible to lead us into all truth! Sola Scriptura!

 

[Marymog]

Yes! Isn't it great that Martin Luther and others were recruited by God to turn people away from the corrupt teachings and practices of the Catholic denomination and bring them back to Himself?

I am so very, very thankful that we have the Bible to lead us into all truth! Sola Scriptura!

Hi Jim,

So, let me see if I have your theory correct: You think it is "great that Martin Luther and others were recruited by God to turn people away from... corrupt teachings and practices of the Catholic denomination and bring them back to Himself".

The 1st part of your theory, Luther and others were recruited by God, makes ZERO sense. Luther and others all taught different "truths" with each one of them thinking they and only they were teaching the "truth" given to them by God. That means either God was confused or those men were confused. Which one was it Jim?

The 2nd part of your theory, that The Catholic Church has corrupt teachings, is fascinating when you consider that "Luther and others" adhere to some of the teachings of the CC AND have multiple different teachings that they consider the "truth". So, which of those "others" are teaching the "truth" Jim?

The Protestant revolution brought Christianity confusion and division. And you think that is great?

I look forward to your response.

Mary

 

[Jim B]

Hi Jim,

So, let me see if I have your theory correct: You think it is "great that Martin Luther and others were recruited by God to turn people away from... corrupt teachings and practices of the Catholic denomination and bring them back to Himself".

The 1st part of your theory, Luther and others were recruited by God, makes ZERO sense. Luther and others all taught different "truths" with each one of them thinking they and only they were teaching the "truth" given to them by God. That means either God was confused or those men were confused. Which one was it Jim?

The 2nd part of your theory, that The Catholic Church has corrupt teachings, is fascinating when you consider that "Luther and others" adhere to some of the teachings of the CC AND have multiple different teachings that they consider the "truth". So, which of those "others" are teaching the "truth" Jim?

The Protestant revolution brought Christianity confusion and division. And you think that is great?

I look forward to your response.

Mary

Actually you probably don't look forward to my response.

What makes zero sense to you makes sense to me and others. Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, and others all taught different "truths" with each one of them thinking they and only they were teaching the "truth" given to them by God. That means, according to you, either God was confused or those men were confused. Which one was it? Neither! People can be given different words from God; that has been proven throughout history.

The Catholic church is not, and never has been, infallible. In fact, throughout history, the Catholic denomination has waged war (the crusades) that resulted in mass murder, practiced inquisitions that resulted in mass murder, conquered indigenous peoples, resulting in mass murder, excommunicated many, many people, and recently, failed to act against priests that committed sexual atrocities with little boys. They have built ornate cathedrals, using the money they got from the poor. They practice rituals that are not Biblical. Etc, etc, etc.

Catholicism claims to be the original church -- false. (The word "Catholic" doesn't appear in any Bible!) All one has to do is read the Bible to see that the first churches were 100% Jews! And there are many other false claims -- too many to mention!

Martin Luther clearly pointed out the many heresies of the Catholic church and the rampant corruption. IMHO, he saved Christianity!!! And I think that is great!!!

I have no desire to discuss all the problems with any denomination, but the claims made by the Catholic denomination are nothing but self-serving propaganda. If you want to continue, be my guest. I may or many not respond, depending on a) any valid points you make and b) if I am in the mood.

 

[Illuminator]

Actually you probably don't look forward to my response.

What makes zero sense to you makes sense to me and others. Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, and others all taught different "truths" with each one of them thinking they and only they were teaching the "truth" given to them by God. That means, according to you, either God was confused or those men were confused. Which one was it? Neither! People can be given different words from God; that has been proven throughout history.

You are really confused. Matthew, Mark, Luke and John did not teach different truths. Peter and Paul had no theological differences.

The Catholic church is not, and never has been, infallible.

Because your definition of "infallible" is warped.

In fact, throughout history, the Catholic denomination has waged war (the crusades) that resulted in mass murder, practiced inquisitions that resulted in mass murder, conquered indigenous peoples, resulting in mass murder, excommunicated many, many people, and recently, failed to act against priests that committed sexual atrocities with little boys. They have built ornate cathedrals, using the money they got from the poor. They practice rituals that are not Biblical. Etc, etc, etc.

6 myths and lies etc., etc.

Catholicism claims to be the original church -- false. (The word "Catholic" doesn't appear in any Bible!) All one has to do is read the Bible to see that the first churches were 100% Jews! And there are many other false claims -- too many to mention!

Your claims are false, too many to refute one by one. "Catholic" is English for the Greek word "kataholos" found in Romans 1:8.

Martin Luther clearly pointed out the many heresies of the Catholic church and the rampant corruption. IMHO, he saved Christianity!!! And I think that is great!!!

Protestant Inquisitions: "Reformation" Intolerance & Persecution

Documentation that the early Protestants were every bit as intolerant as Catholics, and engaged in systematic persecuting inquisitions.

www.patheos.com

I have no desire to discuss all the problems with any denomination, but the claims made by the Catholic denomination are nothing but self-serving propaganda. If you want to continue, be my guest. I may or many not respond, depending on a) any valid points you make and b) if I am in the mood.

The only mood you have is anger. And you never stay on topic. Your stupid rants have nothing to do with councils; post #229 has you stumped so you throw irrelevant temper tantrums because you are incapable of understanding the importance of councils.

The Council of Jerusalem in Acts 15 was infallible, but you have to ignore that truth because it doesn't fit in with your man made tradition of a non-infallible church.

 

[Marymog]

Actually you probably don't look forward to my response.

What makes zero sense to you makes sense to me and others. Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, and others all taught different "truths" with each one of them thinking they and only they were teaching the "truth" given to them by God. That means, according to you, either God was confused or those men were confused. Which one was it? Neither! People can be given different words from God; that has been proven throughout history.

The Catholic church is not, and never has been, infallible. In fact, throughout history, the Catholic denomination has waged war (the crusades) that resulted in mass murder, practiced inquisitions that resulted in mass murder, conquered indigenous peoples, resulting in mass murder, excommunicated many, many people, and recently, failed to act against priests that committed sexual atrocities with little boys. They have built ornate cathedrals, using the money they got from the poor. They practice rituals that are not Biblical. Etc, etc, etc.

Catholicism claims to be the original church -- false. (The word "Catholic" doesn't appear in any Bible!) All one has to do is read the Bible to see that the first churches were 100% Jews! And there are many other false claims -- too many to mention!

Martin Luther clearly pointed out the many heresies of the Catholic church and the rampant corruption. IMHO, he saved Christianity!!! And I think that is great!!!

I have no desire to discuss all the problems with any denomination, but the claims made by the Catholic denomination are nothing but self-serving propaganda. If you want to continue, be my guest. I may or many not respond, depending on a) any valid points you make and b) if I am in the mood.

Yes, I honestly did look forward to your response.

John 16:13 says the spirit of truth would guide the Apostles into all truth. But according to your theory Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John all taught different "truths"! Your theory is opposite of what Scripture says. How do you explain that?

You are putting a false belief on my shoulders that I never said, indicated or suggested. You have accused me of something OPPOSITE of what I believe. I don't think God or those men were confused because I don't think that Matthew, Mark, Luke and John all taught different "truths"! YOU are the one that believes that. Not me. YOU have to explain your teaching that is opposite of what Scripture says. Not me.

Do you even know what the Crusades were? According to what you have written, it appears that you don't.

Yes, some of the things that you said about the Catholic Church are true. But pointing out those things does not answer the question I asked you. So let's try again: You believe that the CC does not teach the Truth and that "others" do teach the Truth. Which of those "others" are teaching the "truth" Jim?

Looking forward to your response.....Mary

 

[Jim B]

Yes, I honestly did look forward to your response.

John 16:13 says the spirit of truth would guide the Apostles into all truth. But according to your theory Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John all taught different "truths"! Your theory is opposite of what Scripture says. How do you explain that?

You are putting a false belief on my shoulders that I never said, indicated or suggested. You have accused me of something OPPOSITE of what I believe. I don't think God or those men were confused because I don't think that Matthew, Mark, Luke and John all taught different "truths"! YOU are the one that believes that. Not me. YOU have to explain your teaching that is opposite of what Scripture says. Not me.

Do you even know what the Crusades were? According to what you have written, it appears that you don't.

Yes, some of the things that you said about the Catholic Church are true. But pointing out those things does not answer the question I asked you. So let's try again: You believe that the CC does not teach the Truth and that "others" do teach the Truth. Which of those "others" are teaching the "truth" Jim?

Looking forward to your response.....Mary

Why do you think there are four different gospels? And why do they disagree with each other? For example, both Matthew and Luke describe Jesus' birth differently. And John describes Jesus going to Jerusalem to cleanse the temple at different times. The mistake you are making is thinking that "the truth" is the equivalent of Western journalism or testifying in court. It isn't. It's the truth because it's spiritual truth. God wants us to understand certain principles, which is why He sent us the Holy Spirit to guide us into all truth. My "theory" is exactly what Scripture says. => YOU have to explain your teaching that is opposite of what Scripture says. Not me. <=

I know exactly what the Crusades were. I have read quite a bit about them. They were instigated by Popes to reclaim the Holy Land for Christians. Many innocent people thought they were doing God's will -- by committing mass murder! How is that untrue?

The Bible is the written truth, Jesus is the incarnate truth. John 8:31-32, "Then Jesus said to the Jews who had believed in him, “If you continue in my word, you are truly my disciples, and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.” John 1:14-17, And the Word became flesh and lived among us, and we have seen his glory, the glory as of a father’s only son, full of grace and truth. (John testified to him and cried out, “This was he of whom I said, ‘He who comes after me ranks ahead of me because he was before me.’ ”) From his fullness we have all received, grace upon grace. The law indeed was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ." John 4:22-24, " You [Samaritans] worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews. But the hour is coming and is now here when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father seeks such as these to worship him. God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.” John 8:31-32, "Then Jesus said to the Jews who had believed in him, “If you continue in my word, you are truly my disciples, and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.” John 14:6, "Jesus said to him, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." John 17:16-17, "They do not belong to the world, just as I do not belong to the world. Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth." Luke 20:21, "So they asked him, “Teacher, we know that you are right in what you say and teach, and you show deference to no one but teach the way of God in accordance with truth." And especially John 14:17, "This is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive because it neither sees him nor knows him. You know him because he abides with you, and he will be in you."

Anyone who has received the Spirit of God has received the truth. If someone teaches anything different than the above, which the Catholic church clearly does in some of their doctrine, then they are not teaching Biblical truth. No person teaches the perfect Biblical truth. That can be taught only by the Holy Spirit, not by the doctrine of any denomination or person.

 

[amigo de christo]

You are really confused. Matthew, Mark, Luke and John did not teach different truths. Peter and Paul had no theological differences.
THIS is actually TRUE . as far as the RCC , its still false . but this is true . THEY taught the same truth . None of them
not even james or jude or paul , or peter , or john taught contrary to Christ . THEY ALL TAUGHT THE TRUTH
and not a word they wrote contradicted TRUTH or one another . THAT IS TRUE .

 

[amigo de christo]

Why do you think there are four different gospels? And why do they disagree with each other? For example, both Matthew and Luke describe Jesus' birth differently. And John describes Jesus going to Jerusalem to cleanse the temple at different times. The mistake you are making is thinking that "the truth" is the equivalent of Western journalism or testifying in court. It isn't. It's the truth because it's spiritual truth. God wants us to understand certain principles, which is why He sent us the Holy Spirit to guide us into all truth. My "theory" is exactly what Scripture says. => YOU have to explain your teaching that is opposite of what Scripture says. Not me. <=

I know exactly what the Crusades were. I have read quite a bit about them. They were instigated by Popes to reclaim the Holy Land for Christians. Many innocent people thought they were doing God's will -- by committing mass murder! How is that untrue?

The Bible is the written truth, Jesus is the incarnate truth. John 8:31-32, "Then Jesus said to the Jews who had believed in him, “If you continue in my word, you are truly my disciples, and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.” John 1:14-17, And the Word became flesh and lived among us, and we have seen his glory, the glory as of a father’s only son, full of grace and truth. (John testified to him and cried out, “This was he of whom I said, ‘He who comes after me ranks ahead of me because he was before me.’ ”) From his fullness we have all received, grace upon grace. The law indeed was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ." John 4:22-24, " You [Samaritans] worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews. But the hour is coming and is now here when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father seeks such as these to worship him. God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.” John 8:31-32, "Then Jesus said to the Jews who had believed in him, “If you continue in my word, you are truly my disciples, and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.” John 14:6, "Jesus said to him, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." John 17:16-17, "They do not belong to the world, just as I do not belong to the world. Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth." Luke 20:21, "So they asked him, “Teacher, we know that you are right in what you say and teach, and you show deference to no one but teach the way of God in accordance with truth." And especially John 14:17, "This is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive because it neither sees him nor knows him. You know him because he abides with you, and he will be in you."

Anyone who has received the Spirit of God has received the truth. If someone teaches anything different than the above, which the Catholic church clearly does in some of their doctrine, then they are not teaching Biblical truth. No person teaches the perfect Biblical truth. That can be taught only by the Holy Spirit, not by the doctrine of any denomination or person.

They didnt disagree with each other jim . You giving the CC more power by saying things like this .
Even illuminator was right when he said what he said about this . YET they are in dire grave danger .
YOU need to simply learn fresh and anew for yourself . I agree the CC is dangerous , but what you are saying
is dangerous too . Not one gospel , not one letter of any of those apostels CONTRADICTED each other .
Its simply misunderstanding on your behalf .

 

[Jim B]

They didnt disagree with each other jim . You giving the CC more power by saying things like this .
Even illuminator was right when he said what he said about this . YET they are in dire grave danger .
YOU need to simply learn fresh and anew for yourself . I agree the CC is dangerous , but what you are saying
is dangerous too . Not one gospel , not one letter of any of those apostels CONTRADICTED each other .
Its simply misunderstanding on your behalf .

You need to read the Bible more carefully. When did Jesus go up to the temple in Jerusalem and overturn the money changers' tables? Matthew describes it in chapter 21, toward the end of His ministry. John describes it in chapter 2, at the beginning of His ministry. When it occurred is not important. What is important is the "pollution" of God's temple and Jesus cleansing it. The Gospel were not modern journalists; they taught spiritual lessons.

Your insistence that the Gospels are akin to modern journalism will get you into all kinds of erroneous thinking. That gives Catholics, atheists, and others power!

 

[Enoch111]

Why do you think there are four different gospels? And why do they disagree with each other? For example, both Matthew and Luke describe Jesus' birth differently. And John describes Jesus going to Jerusalem to cleanse the temple at different times.

No. None of the Gospels "disagree" with each other. They all COMPLEMENT each other. So it is our duty and responsibility to harmonize the Gospels. Yes Jesus did cleanse the temple TWICE. And why not? And there is perfect harmony between Matthew and Luke regarding the birth of Christ. But we need to be able to simply connect the dots. Mark and John don't even mention this important event. Why? Because God the Holy Spirit told them to write exactly what they wrote. Every book in the Bible is "from above" (from God the Holy Spirit).

People think that Luke obtained his information merely from others. But he actually said that his Gospel was given "from above": It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus...(Luke 1:3)

But that is not what the Greek text says: ἔδοξε κἀμοί, παρηκολουθηκότι ἄνωθεν* πᾶσιν ἀκριβῶς, καθεξῆς σοι γράψαι, κράτιστε Θεόφιλε,

*Strong's Concordance
anóthen: from above
Original Word: ἄνωθεν
Part of Speech: Adverb
Transliteration: anóthen
Phonetic Spelling: (an'-o-then)
Definition: from above
Usage: (a) from above, from heaven, (b) from the beginning, from their origin (source), from of old, (c) again, anew.

 

[Marymog]

Why do you think there are four different gospels? And why do they disagree with each other? For example, both Matthew and Luke describe Jesus' birth differently. And John describes Jesus going to Jerusalem to cleanse the temple at different times. The mistake you are making is thinking that "the truth" is the equivalent of Western journalism or testifying in court. It isn't. It's the truth because it's spiritual truth. God wants us to understand certain principles, which is why He sent us the Holy Spirit to guide us into all truth. My "theory" is exactly what Scripture says. => YOU have to explain your teaching that is opposite of what Scripture says. Not me. <=

Good morning and thank you for your response.

I don't understand your "four different gospels" question, so I don't know exactly how to respond except to say that there are 4 different gospels because 4 different men decided to write or were compelled to write about their experience with Jesus.

The gospels don't disagree with each other. And if they did you shouldn't be a Christian because that means the writers of those gospels would be liars because they all have different truths. the fact is that the gospels are written from different perspectives. Matthew’s account of Jesus’ birth and early life is different from Luke’s account because Luke’s account focuses on Mary and Matthew's account focusses on Joseph. Matthew and Luke describe different aspects of Jesus’ birth. Also, Jesus did cleanse the Temple at different times. He did it 2 times soooo I don't understand your point on that either.

I don't understand your "Western journalism" accusation. It makes no sense to me. The fact is that "the truth" is equivalent to testifying in court because we are supposed to tell the truth at all times and to not bear false witness against each other no matter if it is in court or in our everyday lives. Yes, even "spiritual truth". For as Jesus said, we will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.’ So who is telling you the truth Jim? Do you believe the Spirit has guided YOU into the truth? Or has the Spirit guided other men that you follow into the truth? How can all men be guided to the truth but there be so many different "truths"? It is your misreading of the Gospel that has caused your confusion.

God didn't guide everyone individually into spiritual truth. God has guided The Church into the truth because The Church, not each individual Christian, is the pillar and foundation of truth....just like Scripture says. And if we disagree with each others "truth" then we are to take our disagreement to The Church to decide who is right and who is wrong...Just like Scripture says. So YOU need to explain why your theory that each individual person is guided to the truth.

 

[Marymog]

I know exactly what the Crusades were. I have read quite a bit about them. They were instigated by Popes to reclaim the Holy Land for Christians. Many innocent people thought they were doing God's will -- by committing mass murder! How is that untrue?

The Crusades were not about reclaiming the Holy Land FOR Christians. They were about reclaiming the Holy Land FROM Muslims.

Here are the facts Jim: The Crusades were a response to more than four centuries of conquests in which Muslims had already captured two-thirds of the Christian world. At some point, Christianity as a faith and a culture had to defend itself or be subsumed by Islam. The Crusades were that defense.The Crusades were defensive wars. The wars were a direct response to Muslim aggression. They were an attempt to turn back and defend against Muslim conquests of Christian lands.

So your 'many innocent people were committing mass murder' theory is not historically accurate. Which means you do not know exactly what the Crusades were ESPECIALLY if you believe that the Christians at the time should have allowed the Muslims to enslave, rape, kill, forcefully convert them to the Muslim faith and take the lands of those Christians.

That is how YOUR 'history' of the Crusades is UNTRUE!!!

Keeping Christian history real......Mary

 

[Marymog]

Why do you think there are four different gospels? And why do they disagree with each other? For example, both Matthew and Luke describe Jesus' birth differently. And John describes Jesus going to Jerusalem to cleanse the temple at different times. The mistake you are making is thinking that "the truth" is the equivalent of Western journalism or testifying in court. It isn't. It's the truth because it's spiritual truth. God wants us to understand certain principles, which is why He sent us the Holy Spirit to guide us into all truth. My "theory" is exactly what Scripture says. => YOU have to explain your teaching that is opposite of what Scripture says. Not me. <=

I know exactly what the Crusades were. I have read quite a bit about them. They were instigated by Popes to reclaim the Holy Land for Christians. Many innocent people thought they were doing God's will -- by committing mass murder! How is that untrue?

The Bible is the written truth, Jesus is the incarnate truth. John 8:31-32, "Then Jesus said to the Jews who had believed in him, “If you continue in my word, you are truly my disciples, and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.” John 1:14-17, And the Word became flesh and lived among us, and we have seen his glory, the glory as of a father’s only son, full of grace and truth. (John testified to him and cried out, “This was he of whom I said, ‘He who comes after me ranks ahead of me because he was before me.’ ”) From his fullness we have all received, grace upon grace. The law indeed was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ." John 4:22-24, " You [Samaritans] worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews. But the hour is coming and is now here when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father seeks such as these to worship him. God is spirit, and those who worship him must worship in spirit and truth.” John 8:31-32, "Then Jesus said to the Jews who had believed in him, “If you continue in my word, you are truly my disciples, and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.” John 14:6, "Jesus said to him, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." John 17:16-17, "They do not belong to the world, just as I do not belong to the world. Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth." Luke 20:21, "So they asked him, “Teacher, we know that you are right in what you say and teach, and you show deference to no one but teach the way of God in accordance with truth." And especially John 14:17, "This is the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive because it neither sees him nor knows him. You know him because he abides with you, and he will be in you."

Anyone who has received the Spirit of God has received the truth. If someone teaches anything different than the above, which the Catholic church clearly does in some of their doctrine, then they are not teaching Biblical truth. No person teaches the perfect Biblical truth. That can be taught only by the Holy Spirit, not by the doctrine of any denomination or person.

ONCE AGAIN, you did not answer my question:

You believe that the CC does not teach the Truth and that "others" do teach the Truth. Which of those "others" are teaching the "truth" Jim?

 

[Marymog]

You need to read the Bible more carefully. When did Jesus go up to the temple in Jerusalem and overturn the money changers' tables? Matthew describes it in chapter 21, toward the end of His ministry. John describes it in chapter 2, at the beginning of His ministry. When it occurred is not important. What is important is the "pollution" of God's temple and Jesus cleansing it. The Gospel were not modern journalists; they taught spiritual lessons.

Your insistence that the Gospels are akin to modern journalism will get you into all kinds of erroneous thinking. That gives Catholics, atheists, and others power!

As much as I disagree with @amigo de christo on many things I have to side with him on this. YOU need to read the Bible more carefully Jim:

Jesus’ first cleansing of the temple is described in John 2:11–12 as having occurred just after Jesus’ first miracle, the turning of water into wine at the wedding in Cana. John makes it clear that it was “after this” that He went to Capernaum, where He “stayed for a few days.” Then in the next verse (verse 13), John tells us that the “Passover of the Jews was at hand” (NKJV).

The second cleansing of the temple occurred just after Jesus’ triumphal entry into Jerusalem the last week of His life. This second cleansing is recorded in Matthew, Mark, and Luke but not in John. There are differences in the two events, aside from their being nearly three years apart.

Bible study Mary

 

[Jim B]

Good morning and thank you for your response.

I don't understand your "four different gospels" question, so I don't know exactly how to respond except to say that there are 4 different gospels because 4 different men decided to write or were compelled to write about their experience with Jesus.

The gospels don't disagree with each other. And if they did you shouldn't be a Christian because that means the writers of those gospels would be liars because they all have different truths. the fact is that the gospels are written from different perspectives. Matthew’s account of Jesus’ birth and early life is different from Luke’s account because Luke’s account focuses on Mary and Matthew's account focusses on Joseph. Matthew and Luke describe different aspects of Jesus’ birth. Also, Jesus did cleanse the Temple at different times. He did it 2 times soooo I don't understand your point on that either.

I don't understand your "Western journalism" accusation. It makes no sense to me. The fact is that "the truth" is equivalent to testifying in court because we are supposed to tell the truth at all times and to not bear false witness against each other no matter if it is in court or in our everyday lives. Yes, even "spiritual truth". For as Jesus said, we will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.’ So who is telling you the truth Jim? Do you believe the Spirit has guided YOU into the truth? Or has the Spirit guided other men that you follow into the truth? How can all men be guided to the truth but there be so many different "truths"? It is your misreading of the Gospel that has caused your confusion.

God didn't guide everyone individually into spiritual truth. God has guided The Church into the truth because The Church, not each individual Christian, is the pillar and foundation of truth....just like Scripture says. And if we disagree with each others "truth" then we are to take our disagreement to The Church to decide who is right and who is wrong...Just like Scripture says. So YOU need to explain why your theory that each individual person is guided to the truth.

a) I don't have to explain anything.
b) You wrote "if we disagree with each others "truth" then we are to take our disagreement to The Church to decide who is right and who is wrong". Which church are you suggesting that we take it to?

 

[Jim B]

ONCE AGAIN, you did not answer my question:

You believe that the CC does not teach the Truth and that "others" do teach the Truth. Which of those "others" are teaching the "truth" Jim?

a) Again, the CC teaches many things that are not scriptural.

b) What is your problem? I do not have to answer to you.

 

[Jim B]

As much as I disagree with @amigo de christo on many things I have to side with him on this. YOU need to read the Bible more carefully Jim:

Jesus’ first cleansing of the temple is described in John 2:11–12 as having occurred just after Jesus’ first miracle, the turning of water into wine at the wedding in Cana. John makes it clear that it was “after this” that He went to Capernaum, where He “stayed for a few days.” Then in the next verse (verse 13), John tells us that the “Passover of the Jews was at hand” (NKJV).

The second cleansing of the temple occurred just after Jesus’ triumphal entry into Jerusalem the last week of His life. This second cleansing is recorded in Matthew, Mark, and Luke but not in John. There are differences in the two events, aside from their being nearly three years apart.

Bible study Mary

Simply your interpretation.

YOU need to read the Bible more carefully Marymog.

 

[amigo de christo]

Simply your interpretation.

YOU need to read the Bible more carefully Marymog.

Everyone NEEDS to read the bible much more than ever . Every single person needs to get back in the bible for themselves .
The bible is not the difficult book many leaders have made it out to be . THEY say that as a means for control
and that we sit under their guidance . I am reminding us all that . It dont contradict itself either .
Even james and paul who to many seem to be at odds with each other , IS a misunderstanding .
They too did not contradict each other . The MORE we read it for ourselves the more clearly it would become .

 

[Jim B]

Everyone NEEDS to read the bible much more than ever . Every single person needs to get back in the bible for themselves .
The bible is not the difficult book many leaders have made it out to be . THEY say that as a means for control
and that we sit under their guidance . I am reminding us all that . It dont contradict itself either .
Even james and paul who to many seem to be at odds with each other , IS a misunderstanding .
They too did not contradict each other . The MORE we read it for ourselves the more clearly it would become .

This is your reply to my writing "YOU need to read the Bible more carefully Marymog"? Are you answering for her?

 

[amigo de christo]

This is your reply to my writing "YOU need to read the Bible more carefully Marymog"? Are you answering for her?

No , cause all they would tell you is , if we have disagreements to take it to the church . and by church
they would mean THEIR CHURCH .
Just as would any JW , any mormon and any other who is held under the bondage of their leaders who taught error .
I point to the ONLY ONE I KNOW TO POINT TOO . THE JESUS in that bible , the doctrine in that bible .
GOD Knows the hearts of all men . IF we truly desire to please HIM and not ourselves , we will indeed learn and grow .
But so long as we cling to the flesh , we will only know at most truths , we will only at most
be ever learning and yet never able to come to the TRUTH . The walk , the life , the truth and the way
IS NOT a burden to the soul of a lamb , . MEN whose desires did not align with GOD but rather with their own ideals , ARE THE ONES
who have led many down the path that though it may contain some truths , WILL NEVER KNOW THE TRUTH
NOR THE AUTHOR OF TRUTH . The problem is not the bible , the problem is not GOD , CHRIST , TRUTH .
the problem is in the heart of man . Submit to GOD , resist the devil and i tell us all HE will flee .
GOD has shown man that which is right , but man has turned the spine to GOD .
GOD has given man a way out , but man has shown THE WAY THE TRUTH and the LIFE the spine
and has decided to sit under men who will preach their own hearts desires to them .
My advice , LEARN the GOD of the bible well , go unto HIM with the desire to please HIM and not man , not the flesh .