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Church...
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Bob Estey
Well-Known Member
It seems to me my life would be very empty without my church.What is church?
Should you go?
Why?
What if it's just awful?
What if the Pastor/Preacher says something heretical?
What if I don't feel blessed after going to church?
Etc., etc., etc.?
Please, pretty please with a cherry on top...
No debate
Thank you
I don't know what I would do without it. When I was a kid my dad would never take us. He hated it. His reason was that he didn't like people asking him to transfer his membership. We were always on the move. I was a Navy brat.
I went to church today. I had kind of gotten out of the habit with the virus and all. Anyway, at a glance, there was nothing special about it. They sang one hymn I didn't know very well. The same rabidly ill-behaved, extremely noisy, and pew-jolting children were sitting to the right and rear of me, as they have every Sabbath for the last ten years. Sabbath School was a paltry affair, with the same teacher saying "uh" more than anything else, while the Pastor tried to compensate by interjecting here and there with enthusiastic preaching from the rear. The class always veers off the subject of the lesson into a slightly gossipy session that amounts to a light performance of the Pharisee part of the "Pharisee and Publican" parable ("I thank thee, O God, that I am not like...").
You'd think I was complaining. But I loved every minute of it. And I love those people very fondly. And I came away loving Jesus even more than I did going in. It took me a long time to simply take God at His Word about the importance of not forsaking assembly together, especially as the coming of Jesus draws ever nearer. I didn't understand when I first read that text that He already knew what church was going to be like when I went. And He still said, "Go." "Just do it, and you'll see."
Strangely enough, the Scripture reading for today was:
The sermon was titled: "A Culture Of Encouragement"
The speaker was a visiting Pastor from a sister church. His delivery was not sensational, but very calm and reassuring. It was just wonderful and very encouraging. He talked with me at some length before and after the service. I recognized his wife as a teacher at the parochial elementary school my now nearly middle-aged children attended.
I was so blessed. And, as many times is the case, I got the feeling that not too many others were. It's possible that I'm just not perceiving the situation correctly. People just seem to have a certain aura about them when they're tired and going through the motions. My daughter was like that until she stopped going to church altogether.
I occasionally get so emotional from corporate worship, that I can't stay afterwards and talk for fear of breaking down and causing some kind of scene. I am especially stirred by the Spirit from congregational singing of traditional hymns. Well, I think I've rambled sufficiently.
Thanks so much for dropping by, Bob.
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I don't go to church because of health problems so I just watch online. But when I didn't have health problems I went. I know the increase in spirituality of attending in person. It is a blessing. Guess I'm out now and almost everyone will have that time in their lives. But not everyone. My grandmother died at 91 years of age and she was still able to attend church until her last days.
What is church?
Should you go?
Why?
What if it's just awful?
What if the Pastor/Preacher says something heretical?
What if I don't feel blessed after going to church?
Etc., etc., etc.?
Please, pretty please with a cherry on top...
No debate
Thank you
A church that is good to go to is one that teaches the Bible verse by verse, and really explains what is being said, where you don’t have to pay tithes, prays, maybe a little music but not a whole lot, and doesn’t serve coffee and people can freely bring food for others if they desire to. And they will challenge church traditional teachings through Bible teachings. No membership, and you can come and go if you please, and even go to other churches besides this approached setup.
I know I don't have to tell you that God understands. My maternal great-grandmother (my mother's mother's mother - lol) was a saint among saints. I've talked about her a lot here, but she introduced me to Jesus and I stayed overnight at her little place a lot when I was little. She used to walk around the house talking with Jesus like He was right there (see, I didn't know at the time that He actually was there) while she cooked and cleaned, etc. She eventually had to go to a nursing home and she never missed a lick. That woman carried church with her everywhere she went. She passed away when she was 90-ish. GOOD times.
I don't know what I would do without it. When I was a kid my dad would never take us. He hated it. His reason was that he didn't like people asking him to transfer his membership. We were always on the move. I was a Navy brat.
I went to church today. I had kind of gotten out of the habit with the virus and all. Anyway, at a glance, there was nothing special about it. They sang one hymn I didn't know very well. The same rabidly ill-behaved, extremely noisy, and pew-jolting children were sitting to the right and rear of me, as they have every Sabbath for the last ten years. Sabbath School was a paltry affair, with the same teacher saying "uh" more than anything else, while the Pastor tried to compensate by interjecting here and there with enthusiastic preaching from the rear. The class always veers off the subject of the lesson into a slightly gossipy session that amounts to a light performance of the Pharisee part of the "Pharisee and Publican" parable ("I thank thee, O God, that I am not like...").
You'd think I was complaining. But I loved every minute of it. And I love those people very fondly. And I came away loving Jesus even more than I did going in. It took me a long time to simply take God at His Word about the importance of not forsaking assembly together, especially as the coming of Jesus draws ever nearer. I didn't understand when I first read that text that He already knew what church was going to be like when I went. And He still said, "Go." "Just do it, and you'll see."
Strangely enough, the Scripture reading for today was:
The sermon was titled: "A Culture Of Encouragement"
The speaker was a visiting Pastor from a sister church. His delivery was not sensational, but very calm and reassuring. It was just wonderful and very encouraging. He talked with me at some length before and after the service. I recognized his wife as a teacher at the parochial elementary school my now nearly middle-aged children attended.
I was so blessed. And, as many times is the case, I got the feeling that not too many others were. It's possible that I'm just not perceiving the situation correctly. People just seem to have a certain aura about them when their tired and going through the motions. My daughter was like that until she stopped going to church altogether.
I occasionally get so emotional from corporate worship, that I can't stay afterwards and talk for fear of breaking down and causing some kind of scene. I am especially stirred by the Spirit from congregational singing of traditional hymns. Well, I think I've rambled sufficiently.
Thanks so much for dropping by, Bob.
Interesting story.
Philip James
Well-Known Member
Hello amigo.
Rebellion is never the answer.
Non serviam! Has ever been the enemies cry.
They went out from us, but they were not really of our number; if they had been, they would have remained with us. Their desertion shows that none of them was of our number.
Christ is risen!
Alleluia!
Bob Estey
Well-Known Member
You're welcome. Your story reminded me of when I was in high school. My dad and I didn't get along well then, but he'd sometimes ask me to go to church with him, and I'd say yes.I don't know what I would do without it. When I was a kid my dad would never take us. He hated it. His reason was that he didn't like people asking him to transfer his membership. We were always on the move. I was a Navy brat.
I went to church today. I had kind of gotten out of the habit with the virus and all. Anyway, at a glance, there was nothing special about it. They sang one hymn I didn't know very well. The same rabidly ill-behaved, extremely noisy, and pew-jolting children were sitting to the right and rear of me, as they have every Sabbath for the last ten years. Sabbath School was a paltry affair, with the same teacher saying "uh" more than anything else, while the Pastor tried to compensate by interjecting here and there with enthusiastic preaching from the rear. The class always veers off the subject of the lesson into a slightly gossipy session that amounts to a light performance of the Pharisee part of the "Pharisee and Publican" parable ("I thank thee, O God, that I am not like...").
You'd think I was complaining. But I loved every minute of it. And I love those people very fondly. And I came away loving Jesus even more than I did going in. It took me a long time to simply take God at His Word about the importance of not forsaking assembly together, especially as the coming of Jesus draws ever nearer. I didn't understand when I first read that text that He already knew what church was going to be like when I went. And He still said, "Go." "Just do it, and you'll see."
Strangely enough, the Scripture reading for today was:
The sermon was titled: "A Culture Of Encouragement"
The speaker was a visiting Pastor from a sister church. His delivery was not sensational, but very calm and reassuring. It was just wonderful and very encouraging. He talked with me at some length before and after the service. I recognized his wife as a teacher at the parochial elementary school my now nearly middle-aged children attended.
I was so blessed. And, as many times is the case, I got the feeling that not too many others were. It's possible that I'm just not perceiving the situation correctly. People just seem to have a certain aura about them when they're tired and going through the motions. My daughter was like that until she stopped going to church altogether.
I occasionally get so emotional from corporate worship, that I can't stay afterwards and talk for fear of breaking down and causing some kind of scene. I am especially stirred by the Spirit from congregational singing of traditional hymns. Well, I think I've rambled sufficiently.
Thanks so much for dropping by, Bob.
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
Philip James
Well-Known Member
That certainly sounds like a good thing..
But leaving the community of St. John the apostle, well he pretty much calls that anti-christ...
If you're not partaking of the ONE Loaf, and the ONE cup that Jesus gave to the apostles, where are you?
Christ is risen!
Alleluia!
This is swell! A virtual fistfight over apostolic succession and protestant eschatology is just what I was hoping for!
What is church?
Should you go?
Why?
What if it's just awful?
What if the Pastor/Preacher says something heretical?
What if I don't feel blessed after going to church?
Etc., etc., etc.?
Please, pretty please with a cherry on top...
No debate
Thank you
What is a church?
Church IS Christ the Lord Jesus.
Church IS the body’s of men Added to Christ’s Church.
Church is a building men construct, dedicated TO the Christ Lord God.
Church is a building men, invite men, to hear Gods Word, and freely
...join in Believing Gods Word, or not.
Should you Go?
Christ’s Church, does not require “going” to any place.
- the question presumes a man made building, so dedicated
“Going” to A man-made church/building is a freewill choice.
“Should” is dependent upon if the person’s choice.
Why should one go to A church?
Individual curiosity, want to hear Gods Word.
IF it is awful?
Awful is subjective. Can’t hear what is being said. What IS being said is in a hollering fashion. People attending are wearing distractive costumes, hats the size of a VW, can’t see the speaker. What the speaker is saying is making God sound like a tyrant.
Decide if one wants to be subjected to AWFUL, then continue going.
If one does not like being subjected to AWFUL, discontinue going.
Heretical words spoken by Pastor?
In what context? As an example to do? As an example to not do?
And Heretical according to whose definition?
A Heretick is mentioned 1 Time in Scripture, as relating to a person who rejects admonishment 2 X.
Heretic is a word, man (A) likes to use against man (B) for rejecting man (A’s) admonishment....(without consideration IF the admonishment IS according to Gods Word).
For example...the TEXT in Scripture relating to the one mention of Heretick, has a statement...
Titus 1:
1.....to obey magistrates
(This is a favorite among some Churches, that when man (B), does not obey a magistrate (ie man A), thus man (B) IS called a Heretic.)
Problem is, “obey magistrates”, is subjective.
Obey magistrates....WHEN? When their speaking IS ACCORDING TO THE WORD OF God.
- What IF the magistrates speaking...IS NOT according to the Word of God and the man (B) rejects?
^ that is the conundrum, of one with POWER over an other, and corruptly uses his power... (A) exerts his power, by the authority of his “office”, OVER man (B). Man (B) suffers the (persecution) of man (A).
Man (B) will suffer the punishment, name calling, maybe kicked out of the church, maybe ruin his reputation, maybe affect his doing business with other church members, etc.
Man (A) will continue his position, observe the congregation “whoop, whoop, ^5”, and? Man (A) has just had confirmed to him, his underhandedness has a majority approval. And? There forward, more underhandedness gaining more power, more control, more 5^.
....The office of the magistrate, has become carte blanch’ authority, without consideration of the Word of God...
....
<—- IMOIf you do not feel blessed?
Should you?
Church is a house of prayer, to Praise God, Worship God, Petition God, and bless Gods Name.
If one is seeking the presence of God, and not feeling it...Probably not a place one would continue going.
If one is seeking a fashion show, a place to flirt, a place to make lunch plans, and feels good about themselves because others complimented their clothing, a person of ones “interested” flirted with them, “lunch plans” are planned to go to a place one really likes to go, blah, blah...ya that person would likely feel “good about themselves”, after attending that church.
@devin553344 Acts 2.42 activities are very precious, health permitting; and if the person is sick, yet prayer and the Scriptures may still be possible to pursue privately...
Nice. Like I said earlier, my great-grandmother virtually took church with her everywhere she went.
"Shut-ins" shoot be visited often, too. That's something the church largely neglects (myself included). Paid and/or dedicated clergy shouldn't be the only ones doing it.
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Visiting is a two way thing; some ppl appreciate a visit; others seem very lukewarm about receiving visits... I agree it can be very encouraging for some ppl.....Nice. Like I said earlier, my great-grandmother virtually took church with her everywhere she went.
"Shut-ins shoot be visited often, too. That's something the church largely neglects (myself included). Paid and/or dedicated clergy shouldn't be the only ones doing it.
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
THE CC long ago left what JOHN said . But the truth is so have most all protestant churches too .
I am going out staying glued to the bible . That is how i shall test every man .
Your own church sold out the true gospel long , long , very long ago . AND its gotten much worse and specially as of late .
Read the ENTIRE letter from john . That church sold Christ out for another gospel in order to win converts to be a slave to it .
I wish you no ill willl , but i will happily die and be tortured and suffer the loss of all things , LONG before i enter into covenant with her
OR with those sold out protestant churches as well . I did what i could . The grace that GOD gave to me
WHO WAS THE WORST , by that same grace , that same spirit i have tried to share with many , ONLY THEY WILL NOT .
Folks had sooner sit a slave to men than to be freed by Christ . As for me the warnings and exhortations shall not cease
TILL my final breath . Cause i love not , NO ITS CAUSE I DO LOVE . I LOVE THOSE WHo hate me to the core . MY DESIRE is life
for THEM TOO . BUT pointing folks to the CC AINT LIFE its death . As are many places now . RETURN to bibles people .
That is all i can say and will continue to say . I already been evicted from more places that anyone can count on fingers and toes FOR MY LOVE
AND it aint stopped me either . NOR will it . No matter the cost i am going out POINTING TO THE SAME JESUS
that GOD HIMSELF drew the worst of the worst too , That would be me my friend . I DESIRE LIFE FOR YOU and all
AND Its why i am telling ya , FLEE HER CHAMBERS and LEARN THE TRUE JESUS FOR YOURSELF .
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
Well since so few will try and do all to help the peoples , THEN I WILL my friend . and i aint alone , the LORD is with me .
AND IT SURE aint cause i earned nor deserved it . I am done with false unity and will expose it .
I am done with false love and will expose it . AND IT AINT cause i hate , ITS cause i LOVE the people .
Feast on this .
YE SHALL NOT hate your brother in your heart , you shall in any way REBUKE , CORRECT THEM and not allow SIN upon them .
WELL entering into faleshoods and lies IS SIN . AND i am A GONNA WARN . I Knew most folks would sell out .
GOD showed me that long ago . IF anyone is any denomination that is NOT JESUS CENTERED but rather man centered they
will soon buy this all inclusive lets get along and find common ground lie . AND MANY HAVE MY FRIEND .
They have traded TRUTH , SOUND DOCTRINE , SCRIPTURE for GOOD SENSUAL FEELINGS . NOT ME .
NOT I . YET not i but the grace of GOD that is with me . I WONT DO IT MY FRIEND .
I have loved you all , i truly have and truly do . ITS why i warn all . But the more i warn the more i become the enemy .
SO be it , I DONT EXPECT any of us has long time left in this world . JESUS REALLY IS COMING and ITS MUCH SOONER
than we think . MY GOAL IS TO WIN as many as i can , EVEN THOSE WHO HATE ME MOST , SO THEY TOO
can have the same ending i DO . WITH JESUS FOREVER . cause that beats a lake of fire any day .
@Taken Acts 2.42 has a good summary of local church activities......What is a church?
Church IS Christ the Lord Jesus.
Church IS the body’s of men Added to Christ’s Church.
Church is a building men construct, dedicated TO the Christ Lord God.
Church is a building men, invite men, to hear Gods Word, and freely
...join in Believing Gods Word, or not.
Should you Go?
Christ’s Church, does not require “going” to any place.
- the question presumes a man made building, so dedicated
“Going” to A man-made church/building is a freewill choice.
“Should” is dependent upon if the person’s choice.
Why should one go to A church?
Individual curiosity, want to hear Gods Word.
IF it is awful?
Awful is subjective. Can’t hear what is being said. What IS being said is in a hollering fashion. People attending are wearing distractive costumes, hats the size of a VW, can’t see the speaker. What the speaker is saying is making God sound like a tyrant.
Decide if one wants to be subjected to AWFUL, then continue going.
If one does not like being subjected to AWFUL, discontinue going.
Heretical words spoken by Pastor?
In what context? As an example to do? As an example to not do?
And Heretical according to whose definition?
A Heretick is mentioned 1 Time in Scripture, as relating to a person who rejects admonishment 2 X.
Heretic is a word, man (A) likes to use against man (B) for rejecting man (A’s) admonishment....(without consideration IF the admonishment IS according to Gods Word).
For example...the TEXT in Scripture relating to the one mention of Heretick, has a statement...
Titus 1:
1.....to obey magistrates
(This is a favorite among some Churches, that when man (B), does not obey a magistrate (ie man A), thus man (B) IS called a Heretic.)
Problem is, “obey magistrates”, is subjective.
Obey magistrates....WHEN? When their speaking IS ACCORDING TO THE WORD OF God.
- What IF the magistrates speaking...IS NOT according to the Word of God and the man (B) rejects?
^ that is the conundrum, of one with POWER over an other, and corruptly uses his power... (A) exerts his power, by the authority of his “office”, OVER man (B). Man (B) suffers the (persecution) of man (A).
Man (B) will suffer the punishment, name calling, maybe kicked out of the church, maybe ruin his reputation, maybe affect his doing business with other church members, etc.
Man (A) will continue his position, observe the congregation “whoop, whoop, ^5”, and? Man (A) has just had confirmed to him, his underhandedness has a majority approval. And? There forward, more underhandedness gaining more power, more control, more 5^.
....The office of the magistrate, has become carte blanch’ authority, without consideration of the Word of God...
....
If you do not feel blessed?
Should you?
Church is a house of prayer, to Praise God, Worship God, Petition God, and bless Gods Name.
If one is seeking the presence of God, and not feeling it...Probably not a place one would continue going.
If one is seeking a fashion show, a place to flirt, a place to make lunch plans, and feels good about themselves because others complimented their clothing, a person of ones “interested” flirted with them, “lunch plans” are planned to go to a place one really likes to go, blah, blah...ya that person would likely feel “good about themselves”, after attending that church.
Philip James
Well-Known Member
You think so? Here's St? Ignatius who received these things from St.John and the apostles and was made Bishop of the Church in Antioch by them..
They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer, because they confess not the Eucharist to be the flesh of our Saviour Jesus Christ, which suffered for our sins, and which the Father, of His goodness, raised up again. Those, therefore, who speak against this gift of God, incur death in the midst of their disputes. But it were better for them to treat it with respect, that they also might rise again.
St. Ignatius of Antioch to the Smyrnaeans (Roberts-Donaldson translation)
This is the Orthodox, Catholic faith received from Christ, through the apostles..
Who are you? To call my brothers and sisters from the Feast?
Shame on you!
Christ is risen!
Alleluia!
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