Co- Redemptrix

  • Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

GodsGrace

Well-Known Member
Aug 29, 2017
10,727
5,716
113
Tuscany
Faith
Christian
Country
Italy
I'm quite convinced that God doesn't judge our actions if we've believed Him (in a condemning way), but that if He's received us as adopted children through faith in His Son, He disciplines us as His own and loves us through our lives and beyond them to eternal life. This is the teaching of scripture. Of course, the scripture warns us that if we are not disciplined by God, then we are not legitimate children.
You're sounding dangerously like a calvin type person.
I believe we are children of God for as long as we want to be.
He doesn't force us.
Discipline?
Yes. It seems to come naturally when we don't adhere to God's rules.
I THINK I agree with you. (except for the calvin part)
 

GodsGrace

Well-Known Member
Aug 29, 2017
10,727
5,716
113
Tuscany
Faith
Christian
Country
Italy
ha, i'm prolly still mad at God right now!

lol
it's more like almost a joke between us now though, a REMINDER oops of where i once was
As long as it's a running joke, it's OK.
Getting mad every now and then is very human.
We are, after all, humans.
I thinky think.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bbyrd009

Stranger

Well-Known Member
Oct 5, 2016
8,826
3,157
113
Texas
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
get with it and update - it is stated in the bible at Isaiah that we are all born in sin from our mother's womb - so this would apply to Jesus unless by special dispensation and it seems God the son allowed His mother to be born in sin that He could be born in sin - you surely have a stranger grasp on reality than most others do - twinc

No, it doesn't apply to Jesus because God sidetracked the sin inheritance through the virgin birth. So, Jesus was not born in sin.

Stranger
 
  • Like
Reactions: Helen and bbyrd009

Dcopymope

Well-Known Member
May 22, 2016
2,650
800
113
36
Motor City
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
It is only 'opinion' that Mary was sinless. And a false opinion at that.

Stranger

I decided not to even bother having a discussion with these people about it once I found that the entire bases of such beliefs are based on their own man made traditions and doctrines, and not the word of God. The only one that can claim to have known no sin is Jesus Christ as he was conceived by the Holy Ghost, not of Adam.
 

michaelvpardo

Well-Known Member
Feb 26, 2011
4,204
1,734
113
67
East Stroudsburg, PA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
You're sounding dangerously like a calvin type person.
I believe we are children of God for as long as we want to be.
He doesn't force us.
Discipline?
Yes. It seems to come naturally when we don't adhere to God's rules.
I THINK I agree with you. (except for the calvin part)
The only Calvin I know is a little boy in a comic strip that has a pet tiger. My doctrine is derived entirely from scripture and from those who teach it. We receive a new nature in Christ which is at war with that nature inherited at birth. The Spirit of Christ, received as a gift of grace through faith in the Son of God, is a seal of redemption that is never cast away or broken. When you put your faith entirely in Christ, you entrust your soul to God's keeping, for better or for worse, and your salvation becomes His responsibility because the witness you bear is His Spirit and His testimony. This is where many theologians have gone astray, not understanding God's power or God's zeal for His word. When my mother was alive I would speak to her about these things, but she had a child's perception of God that was somewhat encouraged by her church, thinking of God in human terms and human limitations. E.G.: She prayed to patron saints believing that the creator of all things was too busy to listen to her, as though the omnipotent, omnipresent, omniscient Sovereign of the universe was somehow limited by His creation. What does the scripture mean saying "in Him we live and move and have our being"?
 
  • Like
Reactions: tabletalk

GodsGrace

Well-Known Member
Aug 29, 2017
10,727
5,716
113
Tuscany
Faith
Christian
Country
Italy
The only Calvin I know is a little boy in a comic strip that has a pet tiger. My doctrine is derived entirely from scripture and from those who teach it. We receive a new nature in Christ which is at war with that nature inherited at birth. The Spirit of Christ, received as a gift of grace through faith in the Son of God, is a seal of redemption that is never cast away or broken. When you put your faith entirely in Christ, you entrust your soul to God's keeping, for better or for worse, and your salvation becomes His responsibility because the witness you bear is His Spirit and His testimony. This is where many theologians have gone astray, not understanding God's power or God's zeal for His word. When my mother was alive I would speak to her about these things, but she had a child's perception of God that was somewhat encouraged by her church, thinking of God in human terms and human limitations. E.G.: She prayed to patron saints believing that the creator of all things was too busy to listen to her, as though the omnipotent, omnipresent, omniscient Sovereign of the universe was somehow limited by His creation. What does the scripture mean saying "in Him we live and move and have our being"?
Your mother was Catholic. She's most probably in heaven, I do believe.
She did what she was taught by her church.

As far as what you've said above, you believe that one cannot lose their salvation. You sound sincere and I will not debate this with you unless a thread is specifically for that. Know why? Because you're still saved even if you believe you're sealed forever. As long as you live as a Christian should, I have no problem.

My problem is for those reading along who might get the idea they could do as they wish because of this sealing.

We might yet spar another day!
But lovingly in Christ, I hope.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Helen

michaelvpardo

Well-Known Member
Feb 26, 2011
4,204
1,734
113
67
East Stroudsburg, PA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Your mother was Catholic. She's most probably in heaven, I do believe.
She did what she was taught by her church.

As far as what you've said above, you believe that one cannot lose their salvation. You sound sincere and I will not debate this with you unless a thread is specifically for that. Know why? Because you're still saved even if you believe you're sealed forever. As long as you live as a Christian should, I have no problem.

My problem is for those reading along who might get the idea they could do as they wish because of this sealing.

We might yet spar another day!
But lovingly in Christ, I hope.
Those who have been forgiven much, love much. The Apostle Paul addressed your same concerns nearly 2000 years ago and the truth remains truth. My problem with the Roman Catholic Church, if you would call it a problem, is that the leadership has stolen away the privileges of adoption by God, from their own membership, placing a priesthood between God and those that He adopts through faith in His Son. All genuine believers are priests of God and not for believers, but for unbelievers and those that have not been recipients of His Spirit. I think that this is egregious sin against Christ and His gospel, but this is primarily the reason for enmity between those who hold to "reformation theology" and Roman Catholic appologists.
If you had a child that was fully capable of being a doctor, but you insisted that your child be a shoe salesman and pay a doctor for medical treatment, would you have sinned against your child? It's a difficult question to answer, but scripture tells us that it was for freedom that Christ set us free.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Helen and mjrhealth

Helen

Well-Known Member
Oct 22, 2011
15,476
21,157
113
Faith
Christian
Country
Canada
I think it is of consequence to the body of Christ which doesn't recognize denomination. If you believe that scripture is inspired by the Spirit of God, then scripture can't be broken as Christ said Himself. If we find an apparent contradiction between different passages, then either our translation is flawed or our understanding is uninformed (or misinformed.) God doesn't make mistakes.

I have tried saying that every which way from Sunday...you said it so much better! AMEN!!
 

Richard_oti

Well-Known Member
Mar 17, 2008
1,170
739
113
the interp is still prolly whacked i guess, no matter which tranny you use. i mean it is BoL after all, c'mon

The point was, it is not something that is only in a Catholic Bible. The conjugation as given, was accurate.
 

michaelvpardo

Well-Known Member
Feb 26, 2011
4,204
1,734
113
67
East Stroudsburg, PA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I have tried saying that every which way from Sunday...you said it so much better! AMEN!!
I had some help and the Lord has been answering the desires of my youth, to understand His word, since the day I committed my soul to His keeping. He does this for all of us, but I started reading His word at the same age I participated in the RCC rite of first communion. I read scripture fairly regularly for over 30 years before I finally understood and believed the gospel. He's been teaching me and helping me reconcile scripture to itself for the last 22 years. The tricky part of making argument from scripture is dealing with those who mishandle what you say (or write) as badly as they mishandle scripture. The problem that most people have is simply believing what the word of God says plainly. When the resurrected Christ walked unrecognized with some disciples on their way to Emmaus, His only rebuke was that they were slow to believe all that the scripture said about Him. That doesn't seem to have changed in nearly 2000 years.
 

twinc

Well-Known Member
Apr 3, 2011
1,593
265
83
93
Faith
Country
United Kingdom
I have tried saying that every which way from Sunday...you said it so much better! AMEN!!
I have tried saying that every which way from Sunday...you said it so much better! AMEN!!


but you have overlooked overridden the actual problem - human devils disguised and accepted as angels claiming inspiration and guidance and indwelling by the Holy Spirit - twinc
 

Helen

Well-Known Member
Oct 22, 2011
15,476
21,157
113
Faith
Christian
Country
Canada
but you have overlooked overridden the actual problem - human devils disguised and accepted as angels claiming inspiration and guidance and indwelling by the Holy Spirit - twinc

So you keep on saying...where?
Show me where? Who? Show me who?
Like I said before...you have this "bee in your bonnet" and have said this for 12 years now...WHERE?
What are you talking about? You never ever explain in a sensible sentence, you talk in riddles.
I can't answer when you don't make yourself plain to be understood.

Waiting.......
 

twinc

Well-Known Member
Apr 3, 2011
1,593
265
83
93
Faith
Country
United Kingdom
I had some help and the Lord has been answering the desires of my youth, to understand His word, since the day I committed my soul to His keeping. He does this for all of us, but I started reading His word at the same age I participated in the RCC rite of first communion. I read scripture fairly regularly for over 30 years before I finally understood and believed the gospel. He's been teaching me and helping me reconcile scripture to itself for the last 22 years. The tricky part of making argument from scripture is dealing with those who mishandle what you say (or write) as badly as they mishandle scripture. The problem that most people have is simply believing what the word of God says plainly. When the resurrected Christ walked unrecognized with some disciples on their way to Emmaus, His only rebuke was that they were slow to believe all that the scripture said about Him. That doesn't seem to have changed in nearly 2000 years.


that is because they do not recognise Him even in the breaking of bread but breaking away in the breaking ol bread[Jn 6:66-69] - twinc
 

twinc

Well-Known Member
Apr 3, 2011
1,593
265
83
93
Faith
Country
United Kingdom
So you keep on saying...where?
Show me where? Who? Show me who?
Like I said before...you have this "bee in your bonnet" and have said this for 12 years now...WHERE?
What are you talking about? You never ever explain in a sensible sentence, you talk in riddles.
I can't answer when you don't make yourself plain to be understood.

Waiting.......


you accuse me of repeating myself and then ask me to repeat myself just because you cannot see or hear - so here it is again, so please do get it for it is " unforgiveable blasphemy to claim inspiration/guidance/indwelling by the Holy Spirit and produce rotten results/fruits of division, divergence, differences, disputes, contradictions, confusion and chaos - twinc
 

michaelvpardo

Well-Known Member
Feb 26, 2011
4,204
1,734
113
67
East Stroudsburg, PA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
you accuse me of repeating myself and then ask me to repeat myself just because you cannot see or hear - so here it is again, so please do get it for it is " unforgiveable blasphemy to claim inspiration/guidance/indwelling by the Holy Spirit and produce rotten results/fruits of division, divergence, differences, disputes, contradictions, confusion and chaos - twinc
Christ was conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit, led by the Holy Spirit, anointed by the Holy Spirit at His baptism, and filled with power by the agency of the Holy Spirit (in His humanity) yet He said that He came with a sword (of division). I'd be a bit more careful about defining what is or isn't unforgivable blasphemy (we don't get to make that judgment.)
 

Helen

Well-Known Member
Oct 22, 2011
15,476
21,157
113
Faith
Christian
Country
Canada
" unforgiveable blasphemy to claim inspiration/guidance/indwelling by the Holy Spirit and produce rotten results/fruits of division, divergence, differences, disputes, contradictions, confusion and chaos - twinc

Oh..okay, NOW I can understand you...
Just because you understand what you are writing does not mean that I understand.

Who can not agree. I'm not sure it comes under the banner of blasphemy , that is a stretch o_O....but you're right, it is not "good fruit" but bitter.
Yet it has been in the church since the beginning.

James 3 11 Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter? 12 Can the fig tree, my brethren, bear olive berries? either a vine, figs? so can no fountain both yield salt water and fresh."

You posted this as a blanket statement. We know the problem.
What do you give as an answer and remedy?


 
  • Like
Reactions: Richard_oti

Dcopymope

Well-Known Member
May 22, 2016
2,650
800
113
36
Motor City
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Christ was conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit, led by the Holy Spirit, anointed by the Holy Spirit at His baptism, and filled with power by the agency of the Holy Spirit (in His humanity) yet He said that He came with a sword (of division). I'd be a bit more careful about defining what is or isn't unforgivable blasphemy (we don't get to make that judgment.)

But does that sword of division include the many believers claiming to be led by the Holy Spirit yet are as divided as any religion can get? Was causing discord within his church apart of the plan? I don't recall. You can't get anything done if you are at each others throats even over the most basic, most well understand and clear cut Biblical doctrines. I would say the Prince of Devils is the more likely culprit here.