Does "For Ever" mean forever?

[Hobie]

Here is a good explanation on this issue..
"In Biblical usage of the word “forever,” we see that the context and application MAY be for something that will come to an end. God said of the Temple that Solomon built, “‘For now I have chosen and sanctified this house, that My name may be there forever; and My eyes and My heart will be there perpetually'” (2 Chronicles 7:16). However, because of the sins of Israel and then Judah, God caused this Temple to be destroyed! (Compare 2 Chronicles 36:15-21).

When studying the concept of “forever” in context, we see a variety of intended meanings. The word can express a never-ending condition or situation, but it can also refer to a certain limited period of time, based on the life of the parties involved and also dependent on relevant conditions." When the Bible uses the term "forever," does this always mean the same as "everlasting" or "eternally"? | Church of the Eternal God

To the wicked, the burning in the lake of fire will not cease till it has entirely devoured them.

Psalm 37:20 King James Version (KJV)
20 But the wicked shall perish, and the enemies of the Lord shall be as the fat of lambs: they shall consume; into smoke shall they consume away.

The Bible confirms they will be turned to ashes:
Malachi 4:1,3 King James Version (KJV)
1 For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the Lord of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch...
3 And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this, saith the Lord of hosts.

But many who have been told by teachers and ministers that the false teaching that man is immortal and so the dead live forever read the words "that it shall leave them neither root nor branch...for they shall be ashes " and still insist that the wicked are alive and suffering someplace under their feet. Even Christ's words in Matthew 25 are not confusing when we see the obvious meaning:
Matthew 25:46 King James Version (KJV)
46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

Many are troubled over the expression, "everlasting punishment," but the punishment Christ is talking about is that it will last eternally. Jesus was simply saying that the death would be everlasting.

 

[justbyfaith]

When studying the concept of “forever” in context, we see a variety of intended meanings. The word can express a never-ending condition or situation,

So then, it is only your interpretation that says that everlasting punishment is not a never-ending situation!

There is no biblical basis to say that Matthew 25:41 and Matthew 25:46 are definitely speaking of a situation that isn't never-ending.

 

[Hobie]

So then, it is only your interpretation that says that everlasting punishment is not a never-ending situation!

There is no biblical basis to say that Matthew 25:41 and Matthew 25:46 are definitely speaking of a situation that isn't never-ending.

So let me ask one simple question, do the wicked live forever or do they perish?

 

[justbyfaith]

So let me ask one simple question, do the wicked live forever or do they perish?

They exist for ever in a state of eternal death (separation from God).

 

[justbyfaith]

The Bible confirms they will be turned to ashes:
Malachi 4:1,3 King James Version (KJV)
1 For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the Lord of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch...
3 And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this, saith the Lord of hosts.

But many who have been told by teachers and ministers that the false teaching that man is immortal and so the dead live forever read the words "that it shall leave them neither root nor branch...for they shall be ashes " and still insist that the wicked are alive and suffering someplace under their feet. Even Christ's words in Matthew 25 are not confusing when we see the obvious meaning:
Matthew 25:46 King James Version (KJV)
46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

Many are troubled over the expression, "everlasting punishment," but the punishment Christ is talking about is that it will last eternally. Jesus was simply saying that the death would be everlasting.

The bodies of the unredeemed can be reduced to ashes while their souls move on to be judged by the LORD at the GWT judgment.

 

[Hobie]

The bodies of the unredeemed can be reduced to ashes while their souls move on to be judged by the LORD at the GWT judgment.

The Bible clearly states that they are judged before Christ comes at the Second Coming. Now as for burning them continually, for what purpose would this serve, none. When you receive judgment, you are punished then its over. The father of lies invented the teaching that the dead are alive forever no matter how evil or sinful, or are someplace burning in a conscious state as we see in false idea of purgatory. Reincarnation, channeling, communication with spirits, spirit worship, and the "undying soul" are all inventions of Satan. When man is separated from God, there is nothing of life, it ceases. To be no more, never to exist again is a terrible punishment, but it is just. And God is just.

 

[Cooper]

The Bible clearly states that they are judged before Christ comes at the Second Coming. Now as for burning them continually, for what purpose would this serve, none. When you receive judgment, you are punished then its over. The father of lies invented the teaching that the dead are alive forever no matter how evil or sinful, or are someplace burning in a conscious state as we see in false idea of purgatory. Reincarnation, channeling, communication with spirits, spirit worship, and the "undying soul" are all inventions of Satan. When man is separated from God, there is nothing of life, it ceases. To be no more, never to exist again is a terrible punishment, but it is just. And God is just.

Why not commit your life to Jesus and don't worry. (I feel you already have done that?)

 

[Hobie]

Why not commit your life to Jesus and don't worry. (I feel you already have done that?)

That is good, but we must also care about our fellow man and show the truth in Gods word to him as well. Satan has brought in his lies that man is immortal of himself and the false ideas of purgatory and many others that must be exposed.

 

[justbyfaith]

The Bible clearly states that they are judged before Christ comes at the Second Coming.

No; for the Bible clearly teaches that there will be a resurrection both of the wicked and the just (Daniel 12:2, Revelation 20:13; also Revelation 20:4-6).

 

[Hobie]

No; for the Bible clearly teaches that there will be a resurrection both of the wicked and the just (Daniel 12:2, Revelation 20:13; also Revelation 20:4-6).

And they will be judged before Christ comes with His reward according to their works and the books are opened on the wicked to show the universe His judgment is true.

 

[justbyfaith]

And they will be judged before Christ comes with His reward according to their works and the books are opened on the wicked to show the universe His judgment is true.

The saints will be judged and given reward at the time of Revelation 11:15-19.

The condemned will be condemned on the basis of their works because of the GWT judgment.

 

[justbyfaith]

That is good, but we must also care about our fellow man

It's not like you are going to change God's mind by believing differently from what is the teaching of His word.

 

[Hobie]

The Bible says it over and over...
Romans 2:5-6 King James Version (KJV)
5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds:

 

[justbyfaith]

Satan has brought in his lies that man is immortal of himself and the false ideas of purgatory and many others that must be exposed.

In the NKJV, it tells us, in Ecclesiastes, that God has set eternity in the heart of man.

 

[justbyfaith]

The Bible says it over and over...
Romans 2:5-6 King James Version (KJV)
5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds:

Nevertheless, we are saved by grace through faith, and that not of ourselves; it is the gift of God: not of works, lest any man should boast (Ephesians 2:8-9).

Iow, we are regenerated and renewed through the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ (Titus 3:3-7).

This means a changed life (2 Corinthians 5:17).

 

[Hobie]

In the NKJV, it tells us, in Ecclesiastes, that God has set eternity in the heart of man.

Hmm, now you see why the version is important...
Ecclesiastes 3:11 King James Version (KJV)
11 He hath made every thing beautiful in his time: also he hath set the world in their heart, so that no man can find out the work that God maketh from the beginning to the end.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

If you look at here...
Matthew 25:41 King James Version (KJV)
41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

and compare to the text here...
Jude 7 King James Version (KJV)
7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

The fact is that eternal fire does not mean a fire that will never go out as we find same expression is used in Jude concerning the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrha. In this use for the fire of "eternal" "everlasting" many are applying modern definitions without reference to their ancient contextual usage and violates one of the most fundamental rules of interpretation.

Sodom and Gomorrha are not still burning today, yet they burned with "eternal fire," and we are told that it was an example of something. So what example is it of, we see it in 2 Peter 2:6:

2 Peter 2:6 King James Version (KJV)
6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;

The eternal fire which brought Sodom to ashes is an example of what will finally happen to the wicked. So the fire that destroyed Sodom and Gomorrha will also burn the wicked in the lake of fire. This is a eternal fire as like Sodom and Gomorrha they will be no more as it will burn the wicked to ashes.

Jude 1:7 the physical cities (houses, buildings) were destroyed by fire and those cities and that fire are gone, but that does not mean the suffering of the souls' of the wicked citizens is also gone. The fire and brimstone that fell on the cities was a foreshadow, a type of the fire and brimstone that is found in hell. Jude's use of a present tense suffering shows the suffering is still ongoing, those wicked suffered for thousands of years up till Jude wrote his letter and continuing to this very day and will continue to suffer onward and onward.

John 3:36 says the lost, the unbeliever 'shall not see life' for the wrath of God "abideth' on him. The present tense of "abideth" shows God's wrath is ongoing, sustained, continuous. Nothing at all about the wrath ending. Again Matthew 25:26 if the suffering is temporal so life is temporal and there is no eternal unending life in heaven.


2 Corinthians 4:18 "While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal."

Same greek word here for 'eternal' as in Matt 25:26. Eternal is set in contrast to what is temporal. No contrast if eternal means temporal too. Same for Philemon 1:15

 

[Hobie]

Nevertheless, we are saved by grace through faith, and that not of ourselves; it is the gift of God: not of works, lest any man should boast (Ephesians 2:8-9).

Iow, we are regenerated and renewed through the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ (Titus 3:3-7).

This means a changed life (2 Corinthians 5:17).

Notice it says 'for if you do these things'....if not then you suffer the wages of sin.

 

[Preacher4Truth]

The Bible says it over and over...
Romans 2:5-6 King James Version (KJV)
5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
6 Who will render to every man according to his deeds:

Um...keep reading into Romans 3 as Paul shows that none can or will do those things, and all are condemned, lost &c.

You're not following context or Paul's argument. You're making the classic error of thinking Paul is teaching salvation by works in Romans 2. He isn't, keep reading.

For the record, Romans 2 is misused by cultish groups to prove their false gospel of salvation by works.

 

[quietthinker]

Does "For Ever" mean forever?
Forever is as long as forever is....for example, if the fire has consumed all the fuel without being extinguished it will extinguish itself. Death will destroy itself...that is the principle. It is a diminishing factor in every sense till it vanishes.

Conversely, life, in the sense that scripture uses it will and is by its own principle as long as it is ie, never ending.
I might add, this principle does and is not referring to mere existence but rather a progressive expanding reality which we as people have never yet known.....It is the promise that God has given to those who believe.