Does God expect us to obey the hundreds of NT commands on day one of our service to be saved?

[Behold]

To all:
What was the reason why these types in Luke 13 were told to depart from the Lord?
Did Jesus tell them that they did not believe on the finished work of the cross

Jesus had not died on the Cross yet, in Luke 13.

You dont realize this, BibleHighligher, ether because you can't read and can't think, or because you dont care.
Your self saving Cult theology has nothing to do with the New Testament.
Nothing.

 

[mailmandan]

No. 1 John 1:6 is a condition all on it's own to describe people who walk in darkness.

1 John 1:6 describes those who merely say/claim they have fellowship with God, and walk in darkness. Such people lie and do not practice the truth. This is 'descriptive' of children of the devil who meet this condition.

1 John 1:7 is a separate condition for those who are to walk in the light.

Walking in the light is 'descriptive' of children of God who meet this condition (and only children of God are in the light - Acts 26:18; 2 Corinthians 6:14; Ephesians 5:8) and they have fellowship with God in CONTRAST with those who merely say/claim they have fellowship with God and walk in darkness.

So we have two camps here. 1. Those who merely say/claim they have fellowship with God and walk in darkness. Such people (pseudo Christians) lie and do not practice the truth. *Compare with 1 John 3:10 - ..Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is he who does not love his brother. *Also compare with 1 John 2:9 - He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. In verse 11 - But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes. *Scripture is crystal clear here that this walking in darkness is 'descriptive' of children of the devil.

2. Those who walk in the light (genuine Christians) as He is in the light, have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses them from all sin. Genuine Christians practice righteousness (and not sin) and love their brother. (1 John 3:9-10) Verse 14 - We know that we have passed from death to life, because we love the brethren. He who does not love his brother abides in death.

Luke 13:24 says, Strive to enter the straight gate. But you don't believe these words by our Lord Jesus.

I believe the words of my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. I just don't believe your eisegesis that culminates in salvation by works. You are striving in the wrong direction for the wrong purpose, namely, "works righteousness." Strive to enter through the narrow gate signifies a struggle against conflict. Christ was not suggesting that anyone could strive or work hard enough to earn eternal life based on the merits of their performance. No matter how rigorously people labor, sinners could never save themselves by works. We need a Savior! (Romans 3:23; 6:23) Entering through the narrow gate is nonetheless difficult because of it's cost in terms of human pride which prevents works-salvationists/unbelievers from choosing to repent and believe the gospel. Salvation through faith in Christ alone is the narrow gate. (John 10:9; 14:6; John 3:15-18) Either we are trusting 100% in Jesus Christ as the ALL SUFFICIENT means of our salvation or else we are 100% lost. That's as narrow as it gets and only few will find it.

Your belief claims that you don't lose salvation when you sin.

Your belief claims that you lose your salvation every time you sin yet you basically also claim to be presently sinless in violation of 1 John 1:8,9. In 1 John 2:1, we read - My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous.

This means you can abide in sin and still be saved (because you don't believe sin can separate you from God by believing in Jesus), or you claim that you have sin according to 1 John 1:8 and yet you are still magically saved.

Those who abide in Christ do not abide in sin and have received forgiveness of sins. You seem to believe that sin has more power than God's grace and the blood of Jesus Christ which continues to demonstrate that your faith is in sinless perfection/personal performance/works over faith in Christ for salvation. You still need to repent and believe the gospel. (1 Corinthians 1:18-21)

1 John 3:6 (AMP) - No one who abides in Him [who remains united in fellowship with Him—deliberately, knowingly, and habitually] practices sin. No one who habitually sins has seen Him or known Him.

Whosoever sinneth (ο αμαρτανων). Present (linear) active articular participle like μενων above, "the one who keeps on sinning" (lives a life of sin, not mere occasional acts of sin as αμαρτησας, aorist active participle, would mean).

1 John 3 - Robertson's Word Pictures in the New Testament - Bible Commentaries - StudyLight.org

CONTINUED...

 

[mailmandan]

This kind of belief means one is walking in darkness because one is justifying some level of sin under God's grace when Jesus taught that to look upon a woman in lust equates with our soul being in danger of hellfire (of which you don't believe).

So anything short of sinless perfection according to you is walking in darkness? Confessing our sins and agreeing with God's perspective about our sins and having a settled recognition and acknowledgment that we are sinners in need of cleansing and forgiveness IN CONTRAST TO saying we have no sin (present tense - 1 John 1:8) and saying we have not sinned (past tense - 1 John 1:10) is not walking in darkness. This is not about sinless perfection! Apart from faith in Christ and the blood of Christ we would all be in danger of hellfire for lust or any other sins that we have committed. So I believe what Jesus was saying in context. I just don't believe your 'sinless perfection' eisegesis.

Description of those who walk in darkness: 1 John 2:9 He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. 10 He who loves his brother abides in the light, and there is no cause for stumbling in him. 11 But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.

1 John 1:7 says if we walk in the light.
John includes himself in this condition. If it was a guarantee that he would walk in the light, he would not use the IF word.
John would say instead: “Those of us who walk in the light WILL ALWAYS do so and the blood of Jesus will cleanse you from all sin.”
But that's not what John said. John said... IF we walk in the light. It's a condition.

John includes himself and everyone who actually walks in the light and those who merely claim to walk in the light. There are only two camps here. 1. Those who merely say/claim they have fellowship with God and walk in darkness. (make believers) 2. Those who walk in the light and have fellowship with one another. (genuine believers) IF confirms these two positions here. It's one or the other. There is no 3rd camp of those who FAIL to ALWAYS walk in the light. That is your eisegesis speaking and walking in the light is not "type 2 works salvation" as you teach.

If we confess our sins. ---- then God can forgive us (See: 1 John 1:9).
Again, this is a condition.
It is telling you the reader (saint) to confess so as to be forgiven.
It's not guaranteeing you that you will always confess your sins.
If that was the case, then the word IF would not be present.

IF we confess our sins is in CONTRAST with saying we have no sin "present tense" (1 John 1:8) and we have not sinned "past tense" (1 John 10). You claim that you have no sin so you failed 1 John 1:9 no matter how much inventory confession that you spout off in a legalistic manner in order to maintain something you have not yet received.

But the point is that others do and they are on the same page with you on salvation.
This merely shows that each of you have your own tactics or strategies to undo what the Word of God says plainly (When you don't like what the Bible says).

You are the master of irony. I know what God's Word plainly says and your eisegesis does not line up with God's Word.

 

[mailmandan]

If you didnt work for Salvation to receive it by FAITH, then to teach that you have to work to keep it, is not just a Theology, that lacks common sense, but, its really the culmination of ultimate Cross Rejection..

You are literally teaching...>"God started Salvation with Christ on the Cross, and now you have do more then Give God your faith, you have to try to keep it by doing works that are filthy rags that God would not accept to begin with..."

You are one messed up Theology looking for some approval, BibleHightlighter
Unbelievable.

Pride and self righteousness on steroids! That salvation is by grace through faith and is not by works (Ephesians 2:8,9) is not hard to understand. It's just hard for works-salvationists to ACCEPT. It's a shame that human pride will not allow works-salvationists to place their faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation. Their hands are full of their works and they will not let go in order to receive Christ through FAITH.

*EITHER WE ARE TRUSTING 100% IN JESUS CHRIST AS THE ALL-SUFFICIENT MEANS OF OUR SALVATION OR ELSE WE ARE 100% LOST.*

 

[Bible Highlighter]

To all:

Some think that the words of Jesus before the cross no longer apply because it was a different dispensation. But the same teaching by Jesus can be found by the apostle Paul, as well.

While we are initially and ultimately saved by God's grace through faith in Christ, the Bible also teaches that works of faith also play a part in the salvation process. For both Jesus and Paul taught and or implied that works play a part in eternal life.

#1. Both Jesus and Paul essentially say you can deny God by one's works.

For Jesus said,
"And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity" (Matthew 7:23).

Jesus said,
"And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth" (Matthew 25:30).

Paul said,
"They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate." (Titus 1:16).​

#2. Both Jesus and Paul essentially say you need to “drink of” (i.e. Walk in, Sow to, Mortify the deeds of the body by) the Spirit as a part of everlasting life.

Jesus said,
"But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life." (John 4:14).

Jesus said,
"He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water." (John 7:38).

John said this of Jesus's words,
"(But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)" (John 7:39).

Paul said,
“...God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth” (2 Thessalonians 2:13).

Paul said,
“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.” (Romans 8:13).

Paul said,
“There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.” (Romans 8:1).

Paul said,
“For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting. And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.” (Galatians 6:8-9).​

#3. Both Jesus and Paul say that the judgment involves those being condemned or punished in the afterlife for doing evil vs. doing good leading to glory or life as a part of God's kingdom.

Jesus said,
"And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.” (John 5:29).

Paul said,
"But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile; But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile: For there is no respect of persons with God." (Romans 2:8-11).

Paul said,
19 "Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God." (Galatians 5:19-21).​

#4. Both Jesus and Paul taught that we have to continue to abide in the good works of the Lord or we will be cut off and or burned in the fire.

Jesus said,
4 "Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned" (John 15:4-6).

Paul said,
“For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee. Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.” (Romans 11:21-22).​

#5. Both Jesus and Paul essentially say that the fear of the Lord is a part of salvation.

Jesus said,
"Fear not them who can kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear Him (The Lord, i.e. Jesus) who is able to destroy both soul and body in Gehenna (i.e. the Lake of Fire) (‭‭Matthew‬ ‭10:28‬).

Paul said,
"...work out your own salvation with fear and trembling." (Philippians 2:12).​

#6. Both Jesus and Paul taught that laboring for the right kind of food relates to everlasting life.

Jesus says,
"Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you..." (John 6:29).

Jesus says,
"My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work." (John 4:34).

Paul said,
“...And having become servants of God, ye have your fruit unto holiness and the end, everlasting life.” (Romans 6:22).​

#7. Both Jesus and Paul spoke of a time in the last days of where false prophets shall arise who are faithless and who do not love (i.e. they will have a form of godliness).

Jesus said,
"Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?" (Luke 18:8).

Jesus said,
"And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold." (Matthew 24:12).

Jesus said,
"And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many" (Matthew 24:11).

Paul said,
1 "This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,
3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
4 Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
5 Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.
6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
8 Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.
9 But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as theirs also was."
(2 Timothy 3:1-9).

​

Side Note:

Please take note that James says he will show you his faith by his works (James 2:18). So the faithless that Jesus talks about are those who are fruitless or those who do not have any truly good works. 2 Timothy 3:1-9 is also a revealing passage, as well. Basically it is saying what you are not supposed to be like. For this passage describes those who have a form of godliness and they are lovers of pleasure more than lovers of God. This means that a Belief Alone Type Gospel (that leads to one not being concerned about sin or not treating it as seriously) is simply not true. For the moment I tell someone that all they need to do to be saved is to believe in Jesus and nothing else, they are going to not be concerned with living holy (because they do not think it is necessary to enter God's Kingdom).​

 

[Bible Highlighter]

To all:

Those who deny the words of Jesus before the cross (When it is not convenient for them to believe in them) do not believe the words of Paul when he said this:

“If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words,
even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine
which is according to godliness; He is proud, knowing nothing,...”

~ (1 Timothy 6:3-4).
​

So Paul here says that if any man teaches contrary to the words of Jesus Christ and contrary to the doctrine according to godliness, they are proud and they know nothing.

Is being proud a salvation issue according to the Bible?

Yes, it is.

James 4:6 says:

“But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith,
God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.”​

James says God resists the proud and gives grace to the humble. So if you are proud... you don't have grace. If you don't have grace... you cannot be saved. Paul said one is proud if they speak contrary to the words of Jesus Christ and if they speak contrary to the doctrine according to godliness.

So as we can see, those who falsely accuse the real brethren are simply not believing God's Holy Word.
They are seeking to get you to justify sin on some level while you think you can be saved.
They say you don't lose salvation when you sin. However, Jesus warned us that to look upon a woman in lust can endanger our body in hellfire (Matthew 5:28-30). Jesus warned that if we do not forgive, we will not be forgiven (Matthew 6:15). The apostle Paul said that by not providing for your own means that you have denied the faith, and you are worse than an infidel (i.e. unbeliever) (1 Timothy 5:8).

They say you will not lose your salvation by your sin if you have a belief alone in Jesus or believing in the finished work of the cross.

However, this is the same lie pushed by the devil by Eve in the garden of Eden; For the serpent told Eve that she would not die if she broke God's command (See: Genesis 3).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

To all:

Some will also attempt to say that verses like 1 John 1, and 1 John 2 is descriptive of changed believers who do not practice sin but yet they say that 1 John 1:8 is saying that they will always sin this side of Heaven in some way. Yet, they do not believe they lose their salvation if they sin (Whereby they deny the words of Jesus in Matthew 5:28-30, Matthew 6:15, and the words of Paul in 1 Timothy 5:8, Galatians 5:19-21). So in their viewpoint, they don't see 1 John 1:9 as being a salvific present tense condition. Neither do they see 1 John 1:7 as being a present tense salvific issue. They see these things as being a general after effect of believers. But John does not speak in that way. John does not say... children of God will always automatically confess of their sin and walk in the light. John uses the IF word to say IF we confess of your sins he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins (1 John 1:9).

If Rick wrote to Bob and said,

“If we drive drunk and run red lights we can
potentially get seriously injured and or die.” ​

Rick would only say this to Bob if he had a concern of the reality of them doing this or that they might have done this in the past and he does not want to do so again. If such was never a possibility for them as friends, he would never need to tell him this.

It's the same with the apostle John writing to the brethren. If the brethren were going to just automatically confess of sin as being descriptive as being children of God, then he would never tell them this:

“If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins,
and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” ​

~ (1 John 1:9).
​

So as we can see that by a plain reading of the text above here it only makes sense of John to write to the brethren to let them know that they need to confess of sins in order to be forgiven of their sins. Yet, OSAS and Non-OSAS Sin and Still Be Saved Type Believers (Free Will Baptists) will say you are forgiven of all future sin by a belief alone in Jesus. Therefore, by default logic, confessing sin is not really necessary, but then they will try to act like they really are in support of this verse by saying that it is descriptive of believers as if they are going to just automatically do this kind of thing when that is not the language used by the apostle John here. John does not say true children of God will always confess of their sins. John says IF we confess of our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins. John includes himself in this conversation with the word “we” in this conditional statement by using the word “If.”

At the end of the day: They don't want you to live holy for God. They don't want you to sanctify yourself by the Spirit and live holy.
They don't believe Paul when he said the following to the Corinthians:

2 Corinthians 7:1

“Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves
from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.” ​

They don't fear God. They are Once Saved Always Saved (and you need not worry about your soul in regards to sin), or they believe they can sin and still be saved. So stay true to your Bible and believe it. Don't listen to those who want you to sin and think you are saved. For that is their end goal just like the devil tried to convince Eve she could sin (break God's command) and not die (i.e. be saved).

Don't believe them.

Believe God and His Word.
Get away from Protestant Perpetual Belief Alone Salvationists and just get in your Bible alone and ask the Spirit to help you to understand His Word. Just stay focused on God's Word in what it says and do not speak against what it says. Believe every word of God.

 

[mailmandan]

 

[Bible Highlighter]

To all:

They will of course deny my claims on their teaching that God's grace is a license for immorality (See: Jude 1:4). They will see my statements as false claims (or straw man arguments). But it is true.

How so?

Let me give you an example: There is a Christian I have known for many years. We talk about the things of God for many years. I know this person closely. He has admitted to the fact if a believer generally lives a holy life, and then one day they look upon a woman in lust and but they then get hit by a bus and instantly died, ... they are still saved.

Meaning they agree that this could happen.

So this is what they mean by the fact that they will not practice sin but yet they will always sin as per 1 John 1:8. This means they can sin sometimes and be saved while doing so. Meaning, that they can look upon a woman in lust on occasion and be saved while doing so (and confession of sin is not really necessary to be forgiven or to be restored back to God). Confession of sin is just tacked on later as being descriptive of God's people and does not always apply. But just as Eve sinned just one time by listening to the serpent with her thinking she would not die (be saved), so today, it really is all about a Christian thinking they can sin and still be saved today. Some justify larger amounts of sin, and others justify smaller amounts of sin.

Don't listen to them.
They are out to get you to think you can sin and still be saved on some level.

We are told to in Hebrews:

Hebrews 12:14

“Follow peace with all men, and holiness,
without which no man shall see the Lord:”​

So stay true to the faith of believing God's Word and don't listen to their words.
While they might not quote the serpent's words exactly, they will use other words to say,

“Yea, hath God said...?”
~ The serpent --- (Genesis 3:1).​

They then will seek to twist and or ignore God's Holy Word to get you to break God's commands with you thinking you will not die.

 

[mailmandan]

 

[Bible Highlighter]

To all:

Some in the “Perpetual Belief Alone Salvationism Camp” will try to use Matthew 7:15 against those of us who believe the Bible in living holy and not justifying sin while under God’s grace.

Jesus says in Matthew 7:15,

“They come to you in sheep’s clothing,
but inwardly they are ravenous wolves.”​

Okay, first, we know that the “Perpetual Belief Alone Salvationist” does not believe you can lose your salvation if you sin. Some like the “Hyper Grace type believer” will teach that you can live in rampant amounts of sin and be saved by having a belief alone on Jesus as your Savior. The most popular version of Christianity is the one that I call, “Partial Hyper Grace.” They believe that a Christian does not practice sin or live in a lifestyle of sin but then they turn around and double speak and say that 1 John 1:8 is a confessional of the Christian in the fact that they must either declare that they have sin in the present tense or that they must sin again at some point this side of Heaven (on some level).

Second, we see sheep described in Matthew 25:31-46 in the Parable of the Sheep and Goats. It was by their conduct that they were sheep. It was by their helping the poor that defined them as sheep whereby they were told to inherit the Kingdom (Whereas those who did not help the poor were told to go away into everlasting punishment). Jesus says that his sheep hear His voice, and they follow Him in John 10:27. This would be doing what Jesus says. For the person who keeps the Lord’s sayings will not see death.

John 8:51

“Verily, verily, I say unto you,
If a man keep my saying,
he shall never see death.”​

So the idea of having a sheep skin covering one being a wolf is that they appear to be outwardly for holiness, but in reality they are wolves inwardly seeking to deceive you to sin (i.e. do the opposite of what a sheep would do).

Jesus says,

“Beware of false prophets,
which come to you in sheep's clothing,
but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
Ye shall know them by their fruits.”
~ (Matthew 7:15-16).​

So we see here that false prophets (those who wear sheep’s skins and are inwardly wolves) are known by their fruits. Fruits are deeds (Compare Luke 3:8 with Acts 26:20). Any theology or belief that gets you to justify sin on any level (See my post #310) makes one a wolf. So if one says they don’t lose salvation if they look upon a woman in lust (When in reality Jesus taught we can lose our soul by looking upon a woman in lust in Matthew 5:28-30), then they are doing evil and running contrary to the words of Jesus. They are justifying sin under God’s grace.

Jesus says,

“Not every one that saith unto me,
Lord, Lord, shall enter into the
kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth
the will of my Father which is in heaven.”
~ (Matthew 7:21).​

The will of God the Father is this:

“For this is the will of God,
even your sanctification, that ye should
abstain from fornication:” (1 Thessalonians 4:3).​

We see in Matthew 7:22-23 certain believers who did wonderful works in Christ’s name but yet Jesus told them to depart from Him because they worked iniquity. This plays in part to what Jesus said before in that a good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, and a bad tree cannot bring forth good fruit. Meaning, one cannot mingle good fruit with bad fruit. These believers in Matthew 7:22-23 thought they could mingle both good fruit with their bad fruit. Meaning, they thought they could do good works for God, but yet they also believed they could sin, too.

Jesus says in Matthew 7:26-27, that everyone who hears His sayings and does them not is like a fool who built his house upon the sand and when a storm came, great was the fall of that house. Meaning, if we do not receive the words of Jesus, those words will judge us on the last day (See: John 12:48). For many Christians today do not believe certain words of Jesus apply to them. They don’t believe the words of Jesus in Matthew 5:22, Matthew 5:28-30, Matthew 6:15, Matthew 12:37, Matthew 25:31-46, Luke 9:62, etcetera.

Perpetual Belief Alone Salvationist Christians will also try to use Galatians 1:7-8 against us Christians who believe Scripture in that we have to be faithful (or work out our salvation with fear and trembling) as a part of God’s plan of salvation (after we are saved by God’s grace).

They do not understand that Paul was fighting against a heresy of which I call, “Circumcision Salvationism” (of which we learn at the Jerusalem council in Acts 15; See: Acts 15:1, Acts 15:5, and Acts 15:24). This was the false belief during this time period that said you had to first be circumcised in order to be initially saved (Instead of being saved initially by God’s grace). Even the apostle Paul referred to this heresy by saying, “if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.” (See: Galatians 5:2). Paul says he did not compel Titus (a Gentile) to be circumcised in Galatians 2:3. So when we read passages like Galatians 1:7-8 and we understand that Paul is talking within the framework or perspective of refuting this false belief of “Circumcision Salvationism.” The gospel is 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 in that we must believe that Jesus died for our sins, He was buried, and risen the third day. We must not only receive this gospel message by a belief alone, but we must continue to believe it as a part of God’s plan of salvation. But little do many Christians today realize that there is a CALL of the gospel (Not that it is the gospel). This call is… God has chosen you to salvation through the Sanctification of the Spirit and a belief of the truth.

2 Thessalonians 2:13-14

“…God hath from the beginning chosen you
to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit
and belief of the truth: Whereunto he called you
by our gospel,…”​

So Sanctification of the Spirit (sanctifying ourselves and living holy by the Spirit) is also a part of our salvation.

Romans 8:13 says,

“For if ye live after the flesh,
ye shall die: but if ye through
the Spirit do mortify the deeds of
the body, ye shall live.”​

Galatians 6:8-9 says,

“For he that soweth to his flesh shall
of the flesh reap corruption; but he that
soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit
reap life everlasting. And let us not be
weary in well doing: for in due season
we shall reap, if we faint not.”​

Many Christians today do not understand that God’s grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and that we should live righteously and godly in this present world.

Titus 2:11-12

“For the grace of God that bringeth
salvation hath appeared to all men,
Teaching us that, denying ungodliness
and worldly lusts, we should live soberly,
righteously, and godly,
in this present world;”​

This is the truth that many Christians today ignore. They appear to be outwardly holy and righteous but they secretly teach that they can sin and still be saved even on a smaller level (saying they don’t lose salvation when they sin because they have a belief alone in Jesus).

Side Note:

We even see at Gotquestions.org (a Christian website) whereby they double speak and say that on the one hand a Christian who practices sin should be questioned whether they are a true Christian, and yet at the same time they say on the other hand that a Christian who backslides into a lifestyle of sin is still saved.

Is a backsliding Christian still saved? | GotQuestions.org

But the thing is that not all Christians who believe this way will openly say this to their followers. They lead them to believe that they must live holy to be a true believer but they don’t tell the whole story in that they believe that a Christian can also sin and still be saved on some level, as well. This means, that they may appear to be for holy conduct (i.e. appearing to be like a sheep), when in reality underneath that sheep skin they are a ravenous wolf trying to really deceive them into thinking they can be saved. Granted, I am sure not all Partial Hyper Grace Christians would agree with this article, but what I do know is that they most definitely believe they can sin on occasion and still be saved while they commit that sin. For they say you cannot lose your salvation and yet they also say they must sin as a part of 1 John 1:8. Therefore, they are saying they must do evil at some point in the future and when they do… they are still saved by a belief alone in Jesus. This is the problem. This is also at times their deception towards some, as well. They don’t come right out and tell all people that they can and must sin again at some point and they are saved while they do so. They are more subtle than that (just as the serpent was subtle).

 

[L.A.M.B.]

1 John 1:6 describes those who merely say/claim they have fellowship with God, and walk in darkness. Such people lie and do not practice the truth. This is 'descriptive' of children of the devil who meet this condition.

Walking in the light is 'descriptive' of children of God who meet this condition (and only children of God are in the light - Acts 26:18; 2 Corinthians 6:14; Ephesians 5:8) and they have fellowship with God in CONTRAST with those who merely say/claim they have fellowship with God and walk in darkness.

So we have two camps here. 1. Those who merely say/claim they have fellowship with God and walk in darkness. Such people (pseudo Christians) lie and do not practice the truth. *Compare with 1 John 3:10 - ..Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is he who does not love his brother. *Also compare with 1 John 2:9 - He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. In verse 11 - But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes. *Scripture is crystal clear here that this walking in darkness is 'descriptive' of children of the devil.

2. Those who walk in the light (genuine Christians) as He is in the light, have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses them from all sin. Genuine Christians practice righteousness (and not sin) and love their brother. (1 John 3:9-10) Verse 14 - We know that we have passed from death to life, because we love the brethren. He who does not love his brother abides in death.

I believe the words of my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. I just don't believe your eisegesis that culminates in salvation by works. You are striving in the wrong direction for the wrong purpose, namely, "works righteousness." Strive to enter through the narrow gate signifies a struggle against conflict. Christ was not suggesting that anyone could strive or work hard enough to earn eternal life based on the merits of their performance. No matter how rigorously people labor, sinners could never save themselves by works. We need a Savior! (Romans 3:23; 6:23) Entering through the narrow gate is nonetheless difficult because of it's cost in terms of human pride which prevents works-salvationists/unbelievers from choosing to repent and believe the gospel. Salvation through faith in Christ alone is the narrow gate. (John 10:9; 14:6; John 3:15-18) Either we are trusting 100% in Jesus Christ as the ALL SUFFICIENT means of our salvation or else we are 100% lost. That's as narrow as it gets and only few will find it.

Your belief claims that you lose your salvation every time you sin yet you basically also claim to be presently sinless in violation of 1 John 1:8,9. In 1 John 2:1, we read - My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous.

Those who abide in Christ do not abide in sin and have received forgiveness of sins. You seem to believe that sin has more power than God's grace and the blood of Jesus Christ which continues to demonstrate that your faith is in sinless perfection/personal performance/works over faith in Christ for salvation. You still need to repent and believe the gospel. (1 Corinthians 1:18-21)

1 John 3:6 (AMP) - No one who abides in Him [who remains united in fellowship with Him—deliberately, knowingly, and habitually] practices sin. No one who habitually sins has seen Him or known Him.

Whosoever sinneth (ο αμαρτανων). Present (linear) active articular participle like μενων above, "the one who keeps on sinning" (lives a life of sin, not mere occasional acts of sin as αμαρτησας, aorist active participle, would mean).

1 John 3 - Robertson's Word Pictures in the New Testament - Bible Commentaries - StudyLight.org

CONTINUED...

Amen!

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Amen!

So you believe God forces a person against their will to be a certain way their whole life and they can never fall away?
Mailmandan does not believe a Christian can fall away from the faith even though the Bible teaches that in many places.

Fall Away List of Verses:

If we are never in jeopardy when we sin, then the Bible would not teach that we can fall away from the faith; But it does teach that we can fall away.

Here are several lists of verses that makes it absolutely clear that believers can fall away from the faith:

Here is a General List of Verses on How Believers Can Fall Away:

1 Samuel 16:14
1 Samuel 31:4
Ezekiel 18:24
Hebrews 3:12-14
Hebrews 4:11
Hebrews 6:4-9
Hebrews 10:26-30
Hebrews 12:15
1 Timothy 1:18-20
1 Timothy 4:1-7
Galatians 3:1-5
2 Peter 2:20-22
2 Peter 3:17
Matthew 13:18-23
1 Corinthians 10:12
2 Thessalonians 2:3​

Now, do not misunderstand me, believers cannot lose their salvation (like they would a pair of car keys), but they can forfeit their salvation (i.e. they can willingly throw it away by rebelling against God). In fact,

Here is a list of believers who have forfeited their salvation:

Saul (1 Samuel 16:14) (1 Samuel 31:4)
Demas (2 Timothy 4:10)
The Prodigal Son (Luke 15:11-32)
Judas Iscariot (Psalm 41:9) (Luke 6:16) (Acts 1:25)
Hymenaeus and Philetus (2 Timothy 2:17-18)
Unnamed Christians destroyed by false teaching (2 Timothy 2:17-18)
Many Unnamed Disciples (John 6:66)
Some Younger Christian Widows (1 Timothy 5:14-15)
Some Christians Eager For Money (1 Timothy 6:8-10)
Ananias and Sapphira (Acts of the Apostles 5:1-11)​

And here is a list of potential fallen believers:

The Servant Who is Not Looking For Him (Luke 12:45-46)
Recent Convert Who is a Potential Spiritual Leader (1 Timothy 3:6)
The Unforgiving in Heart (Matthew 6:14-15)
Luke Warm Unrepentant Believer (Revelation 3:14-22)
Fruitless Christians (John 15:1-10) (Matthew 25:14-30)
Widows That Live in Pleasure (1 Timothy 5:5-6)
Believers Whose Seed Fell Upon the Rocks (Luke 8:13)
Believers Whose Seed Was Choked by Thorns (Matthew 13:22)
Gentile Believer Who Did Not Have on a Wedding Garment (Matthew 22:1-14) (Revelation 19:7-8)
The Potential Fellow Believer Who Erred From the Truth & Was Converted Back (James 5:19-20)​

In fact, Paul is against Eternal Security or a sin and still be saved type belief. For Paul says,

1. We can fall from grace (Galatians 5:4).
   
   
2. We can be moved away from the hope (Colossians 1:23).
   
   
3. We can be a castaway (1 Corinthians 9:27).
   
   
4. We can be cut off just like the Jews if we do not continue in God’s goodness (Romans 11:20-22).
   
   
5. We can sow to the flesh and reap corruption instead of sowing to the Spirit which reaps everlasting life. (Galatians 6:8).
   
   
6. We can deny God by a lack of good works (Titus 1:16).
   
   
7. We can shipwreck our faith (1 Timothy 1:19).
   
   
8. We can deny the faith and be worse than an infidel if we do not provide for our own household (1 Timothy 5:8).
   
   
9. We can err from the faith and pierce ourselves thru with many sorrows if we love and covet after money (1 Timothy 6:10).
   
   
10. Hymnenaeus and Philetus have overthrown the faith of some (2 Timothy 2:18).

These things would not exist in Scripture if things are as OSAS folk say.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Amen!

Mailmandan does not actually believe 1 John 1:9 in what it says.
He believes it is descriptive of true believers but these kinds of words are just a smokescreen to hide his license for immorality under God’s grace.

Meaning, this:

Believers in his camp (those who believe as he does) have stated that if a Christian were to generally live a holy life but then one day they look upon a woman in lust, and then they got hit by a bus and died instantly… they would be saved (According to them). Why? Because they say that one needs to practice that sin to not be a true Christian. According to many of them: A slip into a particular sin is allowed and thus they believe they can sin on a smaller level and still be saved. Confession of sin does not mean they are maintaining their salvation. They just believe they are saved solely by a belief alone in Jesus and all their future sin is paid for by Jesus (Giving them a blank check to sin on some level).

Mailmandan does not believe the words of Jesus in Matthew 5:28-30, Matthew 6:15, Matthew 12:37, etcetera. He does not actually believe Jesus when he warned about how sin can destroy our souls in the afterlife unless we confess and forsake such sins. He is for the idea that once you are saved you always saved and not even sin can separate you from God. He believes you will be a mindless slave puppet to not practice sin. Yet, you must sin on occasion or you are deceived according to his wrong interpretation on 1 John 1:8. Meaning, he is still saved when he commits sin on occasion (that he declares he must do again). This is what Dan believes. He wants you to sin and still be saved (Which runs contrary to the words of our Lord Jesus Christ). Jesus said, sin no more to two people (John 5:14) (John 8:11). Dan does not believe these words by our Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[L.A.M.B.]

@Bible Highlighter

I had you on ignore bc of your repetitive threads until someone notified me of your angst against @mailmandan . THEN your response to my post.

I have clearly stated many, many, many times what I believe.

I am not of any denomination, not even non-denominal, I am simply his child. I look up to my God by his Spirit, to lead me into truth; all truth. [ NOT MANS TRUTH AS THEY SEE IT, EITHER ! ]

If you or any say something that is in agreement with the Word, rightly divided then I love his word so much I like that post.

I definitely do not agree with ALL anyone believes for themselves unless it has been revealed by the Spirit unto me, PERSONALLY !

Dan is my brother, we only have a minite few points of disagreement that are NOT SALVIC. Its ok ,we all grow as we are shown. He does not try to lead others down a primrose path.

I have had a relationship with the Lord many yrs, then I lost my faith in him by an event that caused me to say, take this faith crap and shove it. I walked away, myself and found myself many yrs later in the SLOP of the world, thankfully the Spirit once again brought me under conviction of my filthy sinful state.....but there are no guarantees for God does NOT always strive with man.

Had I died in that state, I would NOT have gone to heaven by my personal beliefs that SIN WILL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM. So you see Dan & I disagree on OSAS as a doctrine. That is ok, MY FAITH will be judged by MY WALK IN FAITH with God, not by another's belief !

Growth & discipleship is my focus on myself and if I can help; others.

You seem to run scattered, even though we agree on some things.

I am NOT the final judge, nor even a FRUIT INSPECTOR! I hold to the Spirit bearing witness that we are the children of God, we don't have to be identical though. God can & does use each of use differently by our faith & abilities.

I can so easily name those that have agreement with the Word, I believe, and the fact OUR spirits bear witness of our love of God & the brethern.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

@Bible Highlighter

I had you on ignore bc of your repetitive threads until someone notified me of your angst against @mailmandan . THEN your response to my post.

I have clearly stated many, many, many times what I believe.

I am not of any denomination, not even non-denominal, I am simply his child. I look up to my God by his Spirit, to lead me into truth; all truth. [ NOT MANS TRUTH AS THEY SEE IT, EITHER ! ]

If you or any say something that is in agreement with the Word, rightly divided then I love his word so much I like that post.

I definitely do not agree with ALL anyone believes for themselves unless it has been revealed by the Spirit unto me, PERSONALLY !

Dan is my brother, we only have a minite few points of disagreement that are NOT SALVIC. Its ok ,we all grow as we are shown. He does not try to lead others down a primrose path.

I have had a relationship with the Lord many yrs, then I lost my faith in him by an event that caused me to say, take this faith crap and shove it. I walked away, myself and found myself many yrs later in the SLOP of the world, thankfully the Spirit once again brought me under conviction of my filthy sinful state.....but there are no guarantees for God does NOT always strive with man.

Had I died in that state, I would NOT have gone to heaven by my personal beliefs that SIN WILL NOT INHERIT THE KINGDOM. So you see Dan & I disagree on OSAS as a doctrine. That is ok, MY FAITH will be judged by MY WALK IN FAITH with God, not by another's belief !

Growth & discipleship is my focus on myself and if I can help; others.

You seem to run scattered, even though we agree on some things.

I am NOT the final judge, nor even a FRUIT INSPECTOR! I hold to the Spirit bearing witness that we are the children of God, we don't have to be identical though. God can & does use each of use differently by our faith & abilities.

I can so easily name those that have agreement with the Word, I believe, and the fact OUR spirits bear witness of our love of God & the brethern.

Greetings, blessings and peace be unto you in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ.

As for a person saying I have angst towards Mailmandan:

Well, first, I am commanded to love even my enemies (Although Dan would not classify as being a personal enemy towards me).

Second, “angst” is defined as a deep anxiety or dread. I don’t believe I feel any deep anxiety or dread towards Mailmandan; Nor I have felt any in the past. So whoever said I have angst towards Dan obviously does not know me and they are just blindly making unfounded claims. Dan and I have had these discussions before on another forum (i.e. Christian Forums).

Anyways, it’s not really about Dan as a person, but the major problem I have is his belief in Eternal Security or OSAS (Once Saved Always Saved). This kind of belief is actually a denial of tons of Scripture verses. So it’s a belief he holds to that I have a problem with because it is highly unbiblical and immoral to the highest degree.

In the other thread I kept up more with his posts, but after a while I have learned it is futile or a waste of my time to continue to do that here. I actually decided recently to not address his posts directly and I am merely responding to only a few of his unbiblical viewpoints on this topic in a more indirect way (like how one would address an audience). This is the best way to handle the topic without the other person trying to get their meat hooks into you trying to make it personal instead of merely discussing the Bible.

I mean, I get it. You have no reason to trust what I say. This is not about Dan really. It’s about the Bible. When a person does not believe parts of the Bible, then I take issue with that; Especially if they are claiming to be a Christian. Again, he does not believe Matthew 5:28-30, Matthew 6:15, Matthew 12:37, etcetera. He does not believe his soul is at risk if he sins (Which is what the Bible plainly teaches). If you don’t take issue with his belief that teaches that a believer can sin and still be saved on a smaller level then all I can do is encourage you to read the Bible more and by asking the Spirit for the understanding.

Again, it’s not personal. I am just messenger of God’s Word. God’s people can correct others using the Bible (and that can be done in love).

In any event, we can agree to disagree and that’s okay.

May the Lord’s love shine upon you today.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Mailmandan does not actually believe 1 John 1:9 in what it says.
He believes it is descriptive of true believers but these kinds of words are just a smokescreen to hide his license for immorality under God’s grace.

Meaning, this:

Believers in his camp (those who believe as he does) have stated that if a Christian were to generally live a holy life but then one day they look upon a woman in lust, and then they got hit by a bus and died instantly… they would be saved (According to them). Why? Because they say that one needs to practice that sin to not be a true Christian. According to many of them: A slip into a particular sin is allowed and thus they believe they can sin on a smaller level and still be saved. Confession of sin does not mean they are maintaining their salvation. They just believe they are saved solely by a belief alone in Jesus and all their future sin is paid for by Jesus (Giving them a blank check to sin on some level).

Mailmandan does not believe the words of Jesus in Matthew 5:28-30, Matthew 6:15, Matthew 12:37, etcetera. He does not actually believe Jesus when he warned about how sin can destroy our souls in the afterlife unless we confess and forsake such sins. He is for the idea that once you are saved you always saved and not even sin can separate you from God. He believes you will be a mindless slave puppet to not practice sin. Yet, you must sin on occasion or you are deceived according to his wrong interpretation on 1 John 1:8. Meaning, he is still saved when he commits sin on occasion (that he declares he must do again). This is what Dan believes. He wants you to sin and still be saved (Which runs contrary to the words of our Lord Jesus Christ). Jesus said, sin no more to two people (John 5:14) (John 8:11). Dan does not believe these words by our Lord Jesus Christ.

dude, You have a big Head. You need to get on your knees and repent. Not only do you think you are something you are not. Your continued false accusations against the children of God are mind boggling.

If you want to try to earn your salvation by your self willed obedience. Feel free. But stop attacking people who believe that it is God who Justifies, It is God who sanctifies, It is God who changes a person from the inside out. @mailmandan does believe those passages. And he does not believe in a mindless slave to not practice sin. He does believe the following

1. God changes us, we are no longer Dogs, We do not love sin, in fact, sin is poison to us now. so we do not continue in it, because it leaves a bad taste (I know I have experienced this)
2. That God chastens his children. They are not allowed to run free and continue to do things damaging to themselves and others. God, like he did to Job, will put things in their way, and do what he needs to do to change them. Who can withstand the discipline of God? O know I could not.. nor can any child of God I know

Maybe you can? Maybe you can sin all you want and not feel the pain and distress that comes from it. so you have not expereinced what we have? Then again, Maybe its because you have yet to repent. Your still trying to please God with your righteousness.. News flash. God will not accept your righteous deeds. they are filthy rags to him. He will only accept his sons grace.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

dude,

“Dude” is a word that is considered rude (i.e. offensive) to a third of people done in a particular survey.
While Christians can correct by the Word of God (i.e. Scripture - 2 Timothy 3:16), Christians are to also speak in love (Ephesians 4:5).

https://everyday-courtesy.com/is-it-rude-to-call-someone-dude/

You have a big Head. Not only do you think you are something you are not.

Please show me what specific post or words I have posted that leads you to that conclusion?
My posts are primarily focused on what Scripture says.
Granted, while we are called kings and priests in Scripture, I believe Christians are not to think of themselves as anything, as well.

Galatians 6:3 says,

“For if a man think himself to be something,
when he is nothing, he deceiveth himself.”​

We can do nothing without Jesus Christ (John 15:5).
This includes all good works we do. We do all good works by the working and power of all three persons of the Godhead (Trinity).
No believer can do good on their own (without God) and take credit for it.
So all praise, glory, and honor are to be given to the LORD for any good done in our lives as we focus on daily picking up our cross, denying ourselves and following Jesus. My goal is to focus on our denying self and following the LORD in all things. So that is the exact opposite of pride or having a big head (as you call it).

You need to get on your knees and repent.

Repentance is a salvation issue. I believe it is important at times for all believers to ask the Lord if there is anything standing between us and God (Which would be in honor of the Lord’s Prayer). We should also be asking to do His will and not justify any kind of sin in this life.

Your continued false accusations against the children of God are mind boggling.

I would like a list of those false accusations.
If this truly is the case… according to my belief in God’s Word, this endangers my soul if I have falsely accused others.

However….

“Perpetual Belief Alone Salvation Hyper Grace Christians” would not really care if even they themselves make false accusations because they believe one can live an excessive sinful lifestyle and still be saved while doing so by having a belief alone in Jesus (Note: I am not saying you or Dan are Hyper Grace).

“Perpetual Belief Alone Salvation Partial Hyper Grace Christians” (like Mailmandan) don’t see occasional sin (outside of practicing sin) as condemning their souls. So this means a one time sin done on occasion does not equate with spiritual death (or in their losing their salvation).

But Scripture teaches…

#1. Numbers 35:16-18 says it only takes one act of murder to be a murderer; And Leviticus 20:10 says it only takes one act of adultery to be an adulterer. It does not take lots of sin or practicing sin in order to be labeled as one of these types of sinners (Whereby one would be condemned by God).

#2. Jesus Himself regarded just looking at a woman once as an act of adultery (Matthew 5:28).

#3. John says, "No murderer has eternal life abiding in them." (1 John 3:15).

#4. Proverbs 6:32 says "Whosoever commits adultery with a woman lacks understanding: he that does it destroys his own soul."​

In other words, if the Hyper Grace Christian believes they can sin on occasion and be saved, then logic dictates that even false accusations done by them on occasion does not equate with their losing their soul, either. So there is no real standard of morality that matters in this kind of belief system. One can set out to sin and still be saved. But Jesus warned us about certain sins can destroy our souls in the alter life in Matthew 5:22, Matthew 5:28-30, Matthew 6:15, Matthew 12:37, Matthew 25:31-46, and Luke 9:62.

If you want to try to earn your salvation by your self willed obedience.

I believe you are confusing Paul’s arguments against a heresy of which I call “Circumcision Salvationism” that went around during that time period. This was the false belief described at the Jerusalem council that falsely said you had to first had to be circumcised in order to be initially saved (See: Acts 15:1, Acts 15:5, Acts 15:24). So when Paul said we are saved by God’s grace through faith without works (Ephesians 2:8-9), he most likely had this heresy in mind because most of his letters mention the problem of circumcision. In fact, Paul said if you seek to be circumcised, Christ will profit you nothing (Galatians 5:2).

Christians are to work out their salvation with fear and trembling (Philippians 2:12).
Christians are to cleanse themselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness int he fear of God (2 Corinthians 7:1).

1 Peter 4:19 says:

“Wherefore let them that suffer according to
the will of God commit the keeping of their souls
to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.”​

Galatians 6:8-9 says:

“For he that soweth to his flesh shall of
the flesh reap corruption; but he that
soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit
reap life everlasting. And let us
not be weary in well doing:
for in due season we shall reap,
if we faint not.”​

John 5:29 says:

“And shall come forth; they that have done good,
unto the resurrection of life; and they that
have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”​

Hebrews 10:36

“For ye have need of patience, that,
after ye have done the will of God,
ye might receive the promise.”​

But stop attacking people who believe that it is God who Justifies, It is God who sanctifies, It is God who changes a person from the inside out.

There is a difference between being saved initially saved by God’s grace (Ephesians 2:8-9), vs. being saved by the Sanctification of the Spirit (2 Thessalonians 2:13).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

@mailmandan does believe those passages. And he does not believe in a mindless slave to not practice sin. He does believe the following

1. God changes us, we are no longer Dogs, We do not love sin, in fact, sin is poison to us now. so we do not continue in it, because it leaves a bad taste (I know I have experienced this)

2. That God chastens his children. They are not allowed to run free and continue to do things damaging to themselves and others. God, like he did to Job, will put things in their way, and do what he needs to do to change them. Who can withstand the discipline of God? O know I could not.. nor can any child of God I know

I am 100% aware of this particular belief for a very long time among the majority of Protestants (Which is the second largest branch of Christianity) (Note: I am aware that there are some Protestant groups that do not fit this mold or belief; For example: The Church of Christ are Protestant and yet they do not hold to this particular belief you describe, and yet I also disagree with the Church of Christ because they make salvation all about works and no grace because they see the work of water baptism as the point of contact of saving faith).

Anyways, this sounds all good on the surface at first glance but….

#1. It’s not biblical.

It’s not biblical because those who hold to this particular belief also interpret 1 John 1:8 as saying a believer must sin always at some point again this side of Heaven or that we as Christians must say we have sin in the present tense. It is also unbiblical because it teaches all future sin is paid for by a belief alone in Jesus as one’s Savior, and therefore no sin (individual sins) separates a believer from God thereby giving them a partial license to sin under God’s grace (as long as they are not living that lifestyle of sin). Granted, this is not always the case. According to Gotquestion’s article below, they basically state that while a Christian is characterized by a life of holy living, they also double speak and state that a Christian who backslides into a lifestyle of sin is still saved.

Is a backsliding Christian still saved? | GotQuestions.org

I believe God’s Word plainly teaches it only takes one sin (that the Bible attaches with warnings of condemnation or hellfire) to cause a loss of salvation, and it does not take lots of sin to indicate that a believer was never saved to begin with. Granted, believers can be restored back to God if they confess and forsake their sin (Proverbs 28:13) (1 John 1:9) (1 John 1:7) (James 5:19-20) (Luke 15:11-32).​

#2. It’s immoral.

It’s immoral to say that one can set out to sin on even a smaller level is still turning God’s grace into a license for immorality. It only took one sin to separate Adam and Eve. It only took one sin each for Ananias and Sapphira to be condemned.​

Maybe you can? Maybe you can sin all you want and not feel the pain and distress that comes from it.

You are making a straw man argument of something I don’t believe. I am not Hyper Grace and neither am I Partial Hyper Grace.

so you have not expereinced what we have? Then again, Maybe its because you have yet to repent.

There is actually no such thing as your belief in the Scriptures. The Bible does not teach we must sin on occasion in this life and we are just automatically saved while doing so (Because you believe all future sin is paid for by a belief alone in Jesus as your Savior).

Your still trying to please God with your righteousness.. News flash. God will not accept your righteous deeds.

The Lord was obviously pleased with this servant:

“His lord said unto him, Well done,
thou good and faithful servant: thou hast
been faithful over a few things,
I will make thee ruler over many things:
enter thou into the joy of thy lord.”
~ (Matthew 25:21).​

they are filthy rags to him. He will only accept his sons grace.

Many Christians today falsely misinterpret Isaiah 64:6 to say that any kind of righteous living is like filthy rags (When in context it is referring to man made righteousness; Note: In fact, they would know this if they read verse 5 before it - Isaiah 64:5).

They also do not realize the warning in the Parable of the Minas in Luke 19:27.

“But bring here those enemies of mine,
who did not want me to reign over them,
and slay them before me.’” ~ (Luke 19:27) (NKJV).​

So this is the Jesus of the Bible that many Christians today reject.

They don’t really believe fully that Jesus should reign over them. They also want to serve sin on some level, too.

We see that there are believers who did wonderful works in Christ’s name but they were told by the Lord Jesus to depart from Him because they also worked iniquity, as well (See: Matthew 7:22-23, and then see Matthew 7:26-27).

 

[Eternally Grateful]

“Dude” is a word that is considered rude (i.e. offensive) to a third of people done in a particular survey.
While Christians can correct by the Word of God (i.e. Scripture - 2 Timothy 3:16), Christians are to also speak in love (Ephesians 4:5).

https://everyday-courtesy.com/is-it-rude-to-call-someone-dude/



Please show me what specific post or words I have posted that leads you to that conclusion?
My posts are primarily focused on what Scripture says.
Granted, while we are called kings and priests in Scripture, I believe Christians are not to think of themselves as anything, as well.

Galatians 6:3 says,

“For if a man think himself to be something,
when he is nothing, he deceiveth himself.”​

We can do nothing without Jesus Christ (John 15:5).
This includes all good works we do. We do all good works by the working and power of all three persons of the Godhead (Trinity).
No believer can do good on their own (without God) and take credit for it.
So all praise, glory, and honor are to be given to the LORD for any good done in our lives as we focus on daily picking up our cross, denying ourselves and following Jesus. My goal is to focus on our denying self and following the LORD in all things. So that is the exact opposite of pride or having a big head (as you call it).



Repentance is a salvation issue. I believe it is important at times for all believers to ask the Lord if there is anything standing between us and God (Which would be in honor of the Lord’s Prayer). We should also be asking to do His will and not justify any kind of sin in this life.



I would like a list of those false accusations.
If this truly is the case… according to my belief in God’s Word, this endangers my soul if I have falsely accused others.

However….

“Perpetual Belief Alone Salvation Hyper Grace Christians” would not really care if even they themselves make false accusations because they believe one can live an excessive sinful lifestyle and still be saved while doing so by having a belief alone in Jesus (Note: I am not saying you or Dan are Hyper Grace).

“Perpetual Belief Alone Salvation Partial Hyper Grace Christians” (like Mailmandan) don’t see occasional sin (outside of practicing sin) as condemning their souls. So this means a one time sin done on occasion does not equate with spiritual death (or in their losing their salvation).

But Scripture teaches…

#1. Numbers 35:16-18 says it only takes one act of murder to be a murderer; And Leviticus 20:10 says it only takes one act of adultery to be an adulterer. It does not take lots of sin or practicing sin in order to be labeled as one of these types of sinners (Whereby one would be condemned by God).

#2. Jesus Himself regarded just looking at a woman once as an act of adultery (Matthew 5:28).

#3. John says, "No murderer has eternal life abiding in them." (1 John 3:15).

#4. Proverbs 6:32 says "Whosoever commits adultery with a woman lacks understanding: he that does it destroys his own soul."​

In other words, if the Hyper Grace Christian believes they can sin on occasion and be saved, then logic dictates that even false accusations done by them on occasion does not equate with their losing their soul, either. So there is no real standard of morality that matters in this kind of belief system. One can set out to sin and still be saved. But Jesus warned us about certain sins can destroy our souls in the alter life in Matthew 5:22, Matthew 5:28-30, Matthew 6:15, Matthew 12:37, Matthew 25:31-46, and Luke 9:62.



I believe you are confusing Paul’s arguments against a heresy of which I call “Circumcision Salvationism” that went around during that time period. This was the false belief described at the Jerusalem council that falsely said you had to first had to be circumcised in order to be initially saved (See: Acts 15:1, Acts 15:5, Acts 15:24). So when Paul said we are saved by God’s grace through faith without works (Ephesians 2:8-9), he most likely had this heresy in mind because most of his letters mention the problem of circumcision. In fact, Paul said if you seek to be circumcised, Christ will profit you nothing (Galatians 5:2).

Christians are to work out their salvation with fear and trembling (Philippians 2:12).
Christians are to cleanse themselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness int he fear of God (2 Corinthians 7:1).

1 Peter 4:19 says:

“Wherefore let them that suffer according to
the will of God commit the keeping of their souls
to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.”​

Galatians 6:8-9 says:

“For he that soweth to his flesh shall of
the flesh reap corruption; but he that
soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit
reap life everlasting. And let us
not be weary in well doing:
for in due season we shall reap,
if we faint not.”​

John 5:29 says:

“And shall come forth; they that have done good,
unto the resurrection of life; and they that
have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.”​

Hebrews 10:36

“For ye have need of patience, that,
after ye have done the will of God,
ye might receive the promise.”​

There is a difference between being saved initially saved by God’s grace (Ephesians 2:8-9), vs. being saved by the Sanctification of the Spirit (2 Thessalonians 2:13).

this just proves you have failed to repent.

You accusations against myself and @mailmandan or readily and openly shown, You know what they are. You are just trying to run from them.

You may not believe in our gospel. it does not make us in error.

we also reject your works based salvation. as we believe it is in error.

You want me to stop calling you dude. Stop falsy accusing people. and repent.