Don’t Ignore Or Dismiss The LORD’s Return; You Could Be Caught Unprepared And Be Left Behind To Deal With The Beast = Matthew 24;32-42, Revelation 13

[Dropship]

'Left behind' is a false theology. Once Jesus returns it is too late for all. Either we go up, and remain or we are to be slain to remain as dung upon the ground, for 1000 years...

What happens to them after 1000 years, are they let out of hell or what?

 

[The Light]

LOL. More avoidance. That is all you have. Where is your Pretrib rapture in Revelation 3, 4 and 5?

How will the blind without understanding, understand that the Master will come when they think not. They are always looking for a road map with undeniable proof of when He will come, when the Lord tells you one will not be provided as He will come when you think not.

Matthew 24
44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

And yet the Lord tells us that those that have kept His Word will be kept from the hour of temptation that will come upon all the world.

Revelation 3
10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

Here are 24 elders with crowns. You do not get crowns when you die. You get crowns when He comes..........so obviously he has come. He comes before the seals are open, which means he comes before the final week.

Revelation 4
4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.

Here is the Church in heaven BEFORE THE SEALS ARE OPENED.

Revelation 5
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

I don't expect you to understand these verses but there they are. Now.................

Ok now your turn. EXPLAIN where you get 19 years, 4.5 days and 3 hours from.

 

[The Light]

Where is your Pretrib rapture in Revelation 3, 4 and 5?

How will the blind without understanding, understand that the Master will come when they think not. They are always looking for a road map with undeniable proof of when He will come, when the Lord tells you one will not be provided as He will come when you think not.

Matthew 24
44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

And yet the Lord tells us that those that have kept His Word will be kept from the hour of temptation that will come upon all the world.

Revelation 3
10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

Here are 24 elders with crowns. You do not get crowns when you die. You get crowns when He comes..........so obviously he has come. He comes before the seals are open, which means he comes before the final week.

Revelation 4
4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.

Here is the Church in heaven BEFORE THE SEALS ARE OPENED.

Revelation 5
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

I don't expect you to understand these verses but there they are. Now.................

Ok now your turn. EXPLAIN where you get 19 years, 4.5 days and 3 hours from.

 

[WPM]

How will the blind without understanding, understand that the Master will come when they think not. They are always looking for a road map with undeniable proof of when He will come, when the Lord tells you one will not be provided as He will come when you think not.

Matthew 24
44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

And yet the Lord tells us that those that have kept His Word will be kept from the hour of temptation that will come upon all the world.

Revelation 3
10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

Here are 24 elders with crowns. You do not get crowns when you die. You get crowns when He comes..........so obviously he has come. He comes before the seals are open, which means he comes before the final week.

Revelation 4
4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.

Here is the Church in heaven BEFORE THE SEALS ARE OPENED.

Revelation 5
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

I don't expect you to understand these verses but there they are. Now.................

Ok now your turn. EXPLAIN where you get 19 years, 4.5 days and 3 hours from.

You have not quoted a rapture here in Revelation 3, 4 or 5. Highlight a literal physical future rapture in these passages. You don't seem to have anything.

 

[WPM]

How will the blind without understanding, understand that the Master will come when they think not. They are always looking for a road map with undeniable proof of when He will come, when the Lord tells you one will not be provided as He will come when you think not.

Matthew 24
44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

And yet the Lord tells us that those that have kept His Word will be kept from the hour of temptation that will come upon all the world.

Revelation 3
10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

Here are 24 elders with crowns. You do not get crowns when you die. You get crowns when He comes..........so obviously he has come. He comes before the seals are open, which means he comes before the final week.

Revelation 4
4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.

Here is the Church in heaven BEFORE THE SEALS ARE OPENED.

Revelation 5
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

I don't expect you to understand these verses but there they are. Now.................

Ok now your turn. EXPLAIN where you get 19 years, 4.5 days and 3 hours from.

When we examine the time-periods embodied within Revelation 4-19 we significantly find that they add up to a period of 19 years, 4 ½ days and 3 hours.

5 months – the wicked tormented (Rev 9:5-10).
1 year, 1 month, 1 day, 1 hour – four angels prepared to pour out the 6th trumpet judgment (Rev 9:15)
42 months – the temple trampled by Gentiles (Rev 11:2).
1260 days – the two witnesses prophesy (Rev 11:3).
3 ½ days – two witnesses lie dead (Rev 11:9).
1260 days – woman flees into the wilderness (Revelation 12:6).
Times, time, and half a time – woman nourished in the wilderness (Rev 12:14).
42 months – power given to the beast (Rev 13:5).
1 hour – the beast receives power with the ten kings (Rev 17:12).
1 hour – Babylon destroyed (Rev 18:10-19).

5 x 3 ½ years + 1 year = 18 ½ years.
5 months + 1 month = 6 months (or ½ year).
3 ½ days + 1 day = 4 ½ days.
3 x 1 hr = 3 hrs.

TOTAL 19 years, 4 ½ days and 3 hours.

 

[David in NJ]

How will the blind without understanding, understand that the Master will come when they think not. They are always looking for a road map with undeniable proof of when He will come, when the Lord tells you one will not be provided as He will come when you think not.

Matthew 24
44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

And yet the Lord tells us that those that have kept His Word will be kept from the hour of temptation that will come upon all the world.

Revelation 3
10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

Here are 24 elders with crowns. You do not get crowns when you die. You get crowns when He comes..........so obviously he has come. He comes before the seals are open, which means he comes before the final week.

Revelation 4
4 And round about the throne were four and twenty seats: and upon the seats I saw four and twenty elders sitting, clothed in white raiment; and they had on their heads crowns of gold.

Here is the Church in heaven BEFORE THE SEALS ARE OPENED.

Revelation 5
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

I don't expect you to understand these verses but there they are. Now.................

Ok now your turn. EXPLAIN where you get 19 years, 4.5 days and 3 hours from.

The 24 Elders are not the Church = this is adding to God's words what HE did not say.

There is no account given from the Lord Jesus Christ of any Saints being pretrib-raptured in Revelation.

Here is what the LORD Jesus Christ says: Rev ch6
And when the Lamb opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony they had upheld. And they cried out in a loud voice, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You avenge our blood and judge those who dwell upon the earth?”
Then each of them was given a white robe and told to rest a little while longer, until the full number of their fellow servants, their brothers, were killed, just as they had been killed.

No crowns given to His Bride/Church in Revelation = ONLY White Robes

 

[The Light]

The 24 Elders are not the Church = this is adding to God's words what HE did not say.

Oh no. That is not what I said. The 24 elders with crowns shows that Jesus has returned.

Here is the Church in heaven.
Rev 5
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

There is no account given from the Lord Jesus Christ of any Saints being pretrib-raptured in Revelation.

Rev 5
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

Here is what the LORD Jesus Christ says: Rev ch6
And when the Lamb opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony they had upheld. And they cried out in a loud voice, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You avenge our blood and judge those who dwell upon the earth?”
Then each of them was given a white robe and told to rest a little while longer, until the full number of their fellow servants, their brothers, were killed, just as they had been killed.

No crowns given to His Bride/Church in Revelation = ONLY White Robes

The fifth seal takes place during the great tribulation. The Church is already in heaven before the seals are opened. The tribulation is the time of Jacobs trouble which occurs after the fullness of the Gentiles comes. How is it that you do not know these things?

 

[David in NJ]

Oh no. That is not what I said. The 24 elders with crowns shows that Jesus has returned.

Here is the Church in heaven.
Rev 5
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.


Rev 5
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.


The fifth seal takes place during the great tribulation. The Church is already in heaven before the seals are opened. The tribulation is the time of Jacobs trouble which occurs after the fullness of the Gentiles comes. How is it that you do not know these things?

The 24 Elders are not the Church and Christ has not returned to gather His Bride in Revelation chapters 1- 19.

“Worthy are You to take the scroll and to break its seals; for You were slaughtered, and You purchased people for God with Your blood from every tribe, language, people, and nation.

You have made them into a kingdom and priests to our God, and they will reign upon the earth.”

Go back and read Revelation chapter 1

Protect yourself from being ashamed before the LORD.

Every word of God is pure;
He is a shield to those who take refuge in Him.
Do not add to His words
Or He will rebuke you, and you will be proved a liar.
Proverbs 30:5-6

 

[WPM]

Oh no. That is not what I said. The 24 elders with crowns shows that Jesus has returned.

Here is the Church in heaven.
Rev 5
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.


Rev 5
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.


The fifth seal takes place during the great tribulation. The Church is already in heaven before the seals are opened. The tribulation is the time of Jacobs trouble which occurs after the fullness of the Gentiles comes. How is it that you do not know these things?

No. It shows where the dead in Christ are now. Hello! Where is your rapture in Revelation?

 

[David in NJ]

Oh no. That is not what I said. The 24 elders with crowns shows that Jesus has returned.

Here is the Church in heaven.
Rev 5
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.


Rev 5
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.


The fifth seal takes place during the great tribulation. The Church is already in heaven before the seals are opened. The tribulation is the time of Jacobs trouble which occurs after the fullness of the Gentiles comes. How is it that you do not know these things?

You said: "The fifth seal takes place during the great tribulation. The Church is already in heaven before the seals are opened. The tribulation is the time of Jacobs trouble which occurs after the fullness of the Gentiles comes. How is it that you do not know these things?"

You are adding to God's words what HE never said = you are currently speaking falsely.

The Saints you see in Revelation are the spirits/souls of those who have died in Christ.

Now you must bring forth the Scripture that validates your speculation that His Bride/Body/Church has been
pre-trib raptured and is not on earth during Jacob's Trouble.

If you cannot, then you must turn to the Lord and seek forgiveness for speaking falsehood to His Body = the Church.

 

[The Light]

When we examine the time-periods embodied within Revelation 4-19 we significantly find that they add up to a period of 19 years, 4 ½ days and 3 hours.

5 months – the wicked tormented (Rev 9:5-10).
1 year, 1 month, 1 day, 1 hour – four angels prepared to pour out the 6th trumpet judgment (Rev 9:15)
42 months – the temple trampled by Gentiles (Rev 11:2).
1260 days – the two witnesses prophesy (Rev 11:3).
3 ½ days – two witnesses lie dead (Rev 11:9).
1260 days – woman flees into the wilderness (Revelation 12:6).
Times, time, and half a time – woman nourished in the wilderness (Rev 12:14).
42 months – power given to the beast (Rev 13:5).
1 hour – the beast receives power with the ten kings (Rev 17:12).
1 hour – Babylon destroyed (Rev 18:10-19).

5 x 3 ½ years + 1 year = 18 ½ years.
5 months + 1 month = 6 months (or ½ year).
3 ½ days + 1 day = 4 ½ days.
3 x 1 hr = 3 hrs.

TOTAL 19 years, 4 ½ days and 3 hours.

Thankyou WPM. I appreciate your answer and explanation. Please see my comments below.


5 months – the wicked tormented (Rev 9:5-10). These 5 months occur during the one-year wrath of God.

1 year, 1 month, 1 day, 1 hour – four angels prepared to pour out the 6th trumpet judgment (Rev 9:15) First let me post the scripture.
Revelation 9
15 And the four angels were loosed, which were prepared for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year, for to slay the third part of men.
This is not saying add an hour to a day to a month with a year. Here is an example of what the scripture is talking about.. 12 Noon on 20th day of July 2029. That is an example of an hour and a day and a month and a year.

42 months – the temple trampled by Gentiles (Rev 11:2).
1260 days – the two witnesses prophesy (Rev 11:3).
Revelation 11
2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
How do you know these are not separate time periods or overlap?

3 ½ days – two witnesses lie dead (Rev 11:9). Happens during the one year wrath of God.

1260 days – woman flees into the wilderness (Revelation 12:6).
Times, time, and half a time – woman nourished in the wilderness (Rev 12:14). These are obviously the same time frame and likely overlap with part of the 2 witnesses prophesying.

42 months – power given to the beast (Rev 13:5). Overlaps with other 1260 days.

1 hour – the beast receives power with the ten kings (Rev 17:12).
1 hour – Babylon destroyed (Rev 18:10-19). Two hours



5 x 3 ½ years + 1 year = 18 ½ years.
5 months + 1 month = 6 months (or ½ year).
3 ½ days + 1 day = 4 ½ days.
3 x 1 hr = 3 hrs.

TOTAL 19 years, 4 ½ days and 3 hours.

There is only 1 week left after the covenant is confirmed. THAT WEEK IS 7 YEARS. That covenant will not be confirmed until after the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. That's because the Jews cannot see until after the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. The final week is about the people of Daniel and has nothing to do with the Church. They are already in heaven before the seals are opened.

Rom 11
25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

 

[The Light]

No. It shows where the dead in Christ are now. Hello! Where is your rapture in Revelation?

Those 24 elders have crowns. THAT CANNOT HAPPEN UNTIL JESUS COMES. So Jesus has come before the seals are opened. The FACT that you are unable to understand this, or unwilling to admit this does not change the truth.

 

[David in NJ]

Those 24 elders have crowns. THAT CANNOT HAPPEN UNTIL JESUS COMES. So Jesus has come before the seals are opened. The FACT that you are unable to understand this, or unwilling to admit this does not change the truth.

lol - so your whole thesis is based on the 24 Elders with crowns - WOW

The truth is the Gospels, Acts, 1 Thess , 2 Thess , Romans , OT Scripture which ALL of it refutes your claims.

Jesus never said HE came back to earth in Revelation until chapter 19 which is exactly what HE said in the Gospels, Apostles & Prophets.

 

[The Light]

lol - so your whole thesis is based on the 24 Elders with crowns - WOW

Laugh all you want. You are the one without understanding.

The truth is the Gospels, Acts, 1 Thess , 2 Thess , Romans , OT Scripture which ALL of it refutes your claims.

Baloney. How can they refute the truth. Post your scriptures and show how they refute the truth. I already know they don't, because they can't.

Jesus never said HE came back to earth in Revelation until chapter 19 which is exactly what HE said in the Gospels, Apostles & Prophet

Again you are talking without knowledge and understanding. Here is Jesus shown coming to earth for the 144,000 first fruits of the second harvest. Jesus comes and takes them before the throne.

Revelation 14
And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:

3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.

4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

 

[ewq1938]

Those 24 elders have crowns. THAT CANNOT HAPPEN UNTIL JESUS COMES.

Of course it can happen before he comes. There is no rule regarding crowns in heaven.

In one of the Rev letters it speaks of people who already have crowns and that was written in the 1st century.

 

[ewq1938]

Laugh all you want. You are the one without understanding.


Baloney. How can they refute the truth. Post your scriptures and show how they refute the truth. I already know they don't, because they can't.


Again you are talking without knowledge and understanding. Here is Jesus shown coming to earth for the 144,000 first fruits of the second harvest. Jesus comes and takes them before the throne.

The 144k are not in heaven in front of the throne. That is spoken about the harpers who sing the song. The 144k are learning the song being sung to them on Earth.

 

[WPM]

Thankyou WPM. I appreciate your answer and explanation. Please see my comments below.


5 months – the wicked tormented (Rev 9:5-10). These 5 months occur during the one-year wrath of God.

1 year, 1 month, 1 day, 1 hour – four angels prepared to pour out the 6th trumpet judgment (Rev 9:15) First let me post the scripture.
Revelation 9
15 And the four angels were loosed, which were prepared for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year, for to slay the third part of men.
This is not saying add an hour to a day to a month with a year. Here is an example of what the scripture is talking about.. 12 Noon on 20th day of July 2029. That is an example of an hour and a day and a month and a year.

42 months – the temple trampled by Gentiles (Rev 11:2).
1260 days – the two witnesses prophesy (Rev 11:3).
Revelation 11
2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
How do you know these are not separate time periods or overlap?

3 ½ days – two witnesses lie dead (Rev 11:9). Happens during the one year wrath of God.

1260 days – woman flees into the wilderness (Revelation 12:6).
Times, time, and half a time – woman nourished in the wilderness (Rev 12:14). These are obviously the same time frame and likely overlap with part of the 2 witnesses prophesying.

42 months – power given to the beast (Rev 13:5). Overlaps with other 1260 days.

1 hour – the beast receives power with the ten kings (Rev 17:12).
1 hour – Babylon destroyed (Rev 18:10-19). Two hours



5 x 3 ½ years + 1 year = 18 ½ years.
5 months + 1 month = 6 months (or ½ year).
3 ½ days + 1 day = 4 ½ days.
3 x 1 hr = 3 hrs.

TOTAL 19 years, 4 ½ days and 3 hours.

There is only 1 week left after the covenant is confirmed. THAT WEEK IS 7 YEARS. That covenant will not be confirmed until after the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. That's because the Jews cannot see until after the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. The final week is about the people of Daniel and has nothing to do with the Church. They are already in heaven before the seals are opened.

Rom 11
25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

But where does it teach a 7-year trib here?

Daniel 9 does not mention a rapture or a 3rd coming?

 

[David in NJ]

Laugh all you want. You are the one without understanding.


Baloney. How can they refute the truth. Post your scriptures and show how they refute the truth. I already know they don't, because they can't.


Again you are talking without knowledge and understanding. Here is Jesus shown coming to earth for the 144,000 first fruits of the second harvest. Jesus comes and takes them before the throne.

Revelation 14
And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:

3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.

4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

You referred to Revelation 14:1 "a Lamb stood on the mount Sion"

Do you believe this is Jesus standing on earth? and as such evidence for pre-trib rapture?

 

[The Light]

You referred to Revelation 14:1 "a Lamb stood on the mount Sion"

Do you believe this is Jesus standing on earth?

Yes.

and as such evidence for pre-trib rapture?

No. It is not evidence for a pretrib rapture as that has already occurred before the seals are opened. The seals are the final. Also, when Jesus comes for His Church, I don't believe He will touch the earth. He will remain in the clouds.

That 144,000 is the first fruits of the second harvest. Here is that harvest.

Revelation 14
14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.

16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.

18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.

19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.

The Church is the wheat harvest. This second harvest is the fall fruit harvest. Since the first fruits are of the twelve tribes, we can be absolutley 100% sure that the majority of this harvest will be of the 12 tribes.

This harvest occurs at the 6th seal, before the wrath of God begins with the opening of the 7th seal.

 

[David in NJ]

Yes.

No. It is not evidence for a pretrib rapture as that has already occurred before the seals are opened. The seals are the final. Also, when Jesus comes for His Church, I don't believe He will touch the earth. He will remain in the clouds.

That 144,000 is the first fruits of the second harvest. Here is that harvest.

Revelation 14
14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.

16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.

18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.

19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.

The Church is the wheat harvest. This second harvest is the fall fruit harvest. Since the first fruits are of the twelve tribes, we can be absolutley 100% sure that the majority of this harvest will be of the 12 tribes.

This harvest occurs at the 6th seal, before the wrath of God begins with the opening of the 7th seal.

OK - Let's take this Point by Point = one point at a time/post

#1 Revelation 14:1 is not taking place on earth.

You may not know this or perhaps have not read this = Galatians ch4

Tell me, you who desire to be under the law, do you not hear the law? 22For it is written that Abraham had two sons: the one by a bondwoman, the other by a freewoman. 23But he who was of the bondwoman was born according to the flesh, and he of the freewoman through promise, 24which things are symbolic.
For these are the two covenants: the one from Mount Sinai which gives birth to bondage, which is Hagar—
25for this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia, and corresponds to Jerusalem(Mt Sion) which now is, and is in bondage with her children—
26but the Jerusalem(Mt.Sion) above is free, which is the mother of us all.

Revelation 14:1 = We are seeing the True Mt.Sion that is in Heaven far above/beyond earth, where only the Saints are permitted in.