Everyone Goes to Heaven

[amigo de christo]

You would've read in your bible what a man said 2000 years ago. My sheep hear my voice. They won't listen to the voice of a stranger. They will even run from them.

No fear of being led away. The Spirit within me, leads me, feeds me, protects me. No fear here brother. I'm just walking along by faith with my focus on Him. I hear His voice and its not by reading the bible.

That's my personal experience.

But what if what IF that voice contradicts what was Written in the bible .
THEN WHO ARE WE TRUSTING IN ................a hint IT AINT GOD , IT AINT HIS SPIRIT , IT AINT CHRIST
its in our own flesh and the voice that has come to lead us into darkness .
SO many make this very claim you do my friend
and yet what they seem to hear not only contradicts what is written
HECK IT EVEN CONTRADICTS each other . SOUNDS LIKE CONFUSION TO ME .
this church age is doomed , it was the moment the focus became on US and not ON GOD FIRST and FOREMOST .

 

[Nancy]

But what if what IF that voice contradicts what was Written in the bible .
THEN WHO ARE WE TRUSTING IN ................a hint IT AINT GOD , IT AINT HIS SPIRIT , IT AINT CHRIST
its in our own flesh and the voice that has come to lead us into darkness .
SO many make this very claim you do my friend
and yet what they seem to hear not only contradicts what is written
HECK IT EVEN CONTRADICTS each other . SOUNDS LIKE CONFUSION TO ME .
this church age is doomed , it was the moment the focus became on US and not ON GOD FIRST and FOREMOST .

Amen, agreed. If we do not take the scriptures to be God breathed, how else would a Christian be able to discern anything?
Everything that remains standing needs a firm foundation. What else to build upon? Base it on our own desires and whimsical fleeting "human" thoughts?? That would be disorder, we have a God of order, amen and thank you Lord and bless your Name.

 

[St. SteVen]

If we do not take the scriptures to be God breathed, how else would a Christian be able to discern anything?

Say what? ???
You seem to be saying that spiritual discernment comes from our view of biblical inspiration?
I don't see the connection. ???

I thought discernment came from the Holy Spirit.

1 Corinthians 2:14 NIV
The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come
from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them
because they are discerned only through the Spirit.

]

 

[12question]

But what if what IF that voice contradicts what was Written in the bible .
THEN WHO ARE WE TRUSTING IN ................a hint IT AINT GOD , IT AINT HIS SPIRIT , IT AINT CHRIST
its in our own flesh and the voice that has come to lead us into darkness .
SO many make this very claim you do my friend
and yet what they seem to hear not only contradicts what is written
HECK IT EVEN CONTRADICTS each other . SOUNDS LIKE CONFUSION TO ME .
this church age is doomed , it was the moment the focus became on US and not ON GOD FIRST and FOREMOST

What if, what IF someone heard God say to them something that contradicts what God Himself wrote down? What does that someone do?

 

[12question]

THEN WHO ARE WE TRUSTING IN ................a hint IT AINT GOD , IT AINT HIS SPIRIT , IT AINT CHRIST
its in our own flesh and the voice that has come to lead us into darkness .

Maybe many of the children of Isreal would've believed what you do. And it is very understandable. I wouldn't condemn them for questioning their new God appointed leader.

But they had a decision to make and it would not have been easy. It had the potential to bring division as it does today, even in this forum.

So it isn't a new thing that's for sure. Many have grappled with this for thousands of years.

You ask a pertinent question, Who are we trusting in?

I accept both, that what God said back then to those who've contributed to the scriptures and those who hear God's truth spoken directly to them now, have both heard from God, even if what they receive from the same Speaker contradict each other.

 

[12question]

Th

Say what? ???
You seem to be saying that spiritual discernment comes from our view of biblical inspiration?

This is so commonly believed. It is understandable considering the history of the church and its teaching omitting the Spirit of Truth sent to build the church, provide for it and protect it.

Yet it's comforting to know that He is sovereign and nothing can stop the Spirit accomplishing His agenda.

 

[St. SteVen]

Th

This is so commonly believed. It is understandable considering the history of the church and its teaching omitting the Spirit of Truth sent to build the church, provide for it and protect it.

Yet it's comforting to know that He is sovereign and nothing can stop the Spirit accomplishing His agenda.

Agree.
I launched a topic about part of this problem. Link below.

Bibliolatry: Worship/knowledge of the book MORE than the author

]

 

[St. SteVen]

Maybe many of the children of Isreal would've believed what you do. And it is very understandable. I wouldn't condemn them for questioning their new God appointed leader.

But they had a decision to make and it would not have been easy. It had the potential to bring division as it does today, even in this forum.

So it isn't a new thing that's for sure. Many have grappled with this for thousands of years.

You ask a pertinent question, Who are we trusting in?

I accept both, that what God said back then to those who've contributed to the scriptures and those who hear God's truth spoken directly to them now, have both heard from God, even if what they receive from the same Speaker contradict each other.

This is such an interesting verse. Who are these Prophets?

Ephesians 2:20 NIV
built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone.

]

 

[Hillsage]

This is such an interesting verse. Who are these Prophets?

Ephesians 2:20 NIV
built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone.

]

Great question. I'd say we're not talking about the prophets of the OLD covenant. We're talking about the prophets of the NEW covenant. What did Jesus say would happen to the stones of the OLD temple? GONE with the judgment of GOD through the armies of TITUS. WHY?.....because the stiff-necked JEWS sewed up the VEIL and kept on keeping on, with that which was no more.

When did Jesus become the CORNERSTONE of the new TEMPLE? Before....or after the cross? And what temple did he say HE would replace the faded away temple with?

JOH 2:21 But he spake of the temple of his body.

"YE are the temple of God,"

 

[St. SteVen]

.....because the stiff-necked JEWS sewed up the VEIL and kept on keeping on, with that which was no more.

I wasn't aware of that fact. That they repaired the torn veil.
I had heard that it was torn from top to bottom. (in that direction)
Who could do that? (only God)

Could I ask a HUGE favor.
I had a topic on the previous forum that I would like to bring over here.
The title contained the term "Apostles and Prophets".
If you could send me the actual title and OP (post #1)
I'll post it here. Thanks.

]

 

[Nancy]

What if, what IF someone heard God say to them something that contradicts what God Himself wrote down? What does that someone do?

Example?
If you do not understand the simple things, or the "milk of the word", which, nobody can discern things themselves. Reading scripture (which I do NOT cherry pick) is done after praying God to send His Spirit to help us TO discern. I know, many do not rely on His God breathed words, but their own imaginations. Remember, Satan comes as an angel of light. How do we know that? Well...scripture! Not all "voices" are from God and one will be mis-directed...without discernment.

 

[St. SteVen]

What if, what IF someone heard God say to them something that contradicts what God Himself wrote down? What does that someone do?

It seems that Abraham had that experience.
God asked him to do something unthinkable in order to test his faith.
What if Abraham had refused?

] cc: @Nancy

 

[Cyd]

What if, what IF someone heard God say to them something that contradicts what God Himself wrote down? What does that someone do?

That is a great question... I pray quietly meaning in my head to God and ask for a second and have asked before for a third witness. He has always done that... but where scripture is concerned it would need to be out of the mouth of God not man.. Satan used the psalms with Jesus to tempt him.. Jesus came back with it is written out of the mouth of God. This what I do anyway.

 

[St. SteVen]

12question said:

What if, what IF someone heard God say to them something that contradicts what God Himself wrote down? What does that someone do?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

This begs a question about what this scripture below means. I had always interpreted it to mean weigh against scripture.
But that might not be the whole picture here.

1 Corinthians 14:29 NRSVue
Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others weigh what is said.

--- COMPARE ---

Acts 15:28-29 NRSVue
For it has seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to impose
on you no further burden than these essentials:
29 that you abstain from what has been sacrificed to idols
and from blood and from what is strangled[a] and from sexual immorality.
If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well. Farewell.”

] cc; @Cyd

 

[amadeus]

But what if what IF that voice contradicts what was Written in the bible .
THEN WHO ARE WE TRUSTING IN ................a hint IT AINT GOD , IT AINT HIS SPIRIT , IT AINT CHRIST
its in our own flesh and the voice that has come to lead us into darkness .
SO many make this very claim you do my friend
and yet what they seem to hear not only contradicts what is written
HECK IT EVEN CONTRADICTS each other . SOUNDS LIKE CONFUSION TO ME .
this church age is doomed , it was the moment the focus became on US and not ON GOD FIRST and FOREMOST .

Isa 28:7	But they also have erred through wine [wrong spirit] , and through strong drink [wrong doctrines] are out of the way [Jesus]; the priest and the prophet have erred through strong drink [wrong doctrines], they are swallowed up of wine [wrong spirit], they are out of the way [Jesus] through strong drink [wrong doctrines]; they err in vision, they stumble in judgment.
Isa 28:8	For all tables [churches] are full of vomit and filthiness, so that there is no place clean.

 

[Cyd]

12question said:

What if, what IF someone heard God say to them something that contradicts what God Himself wrote down? What does that someone do?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

This begs a question about what this scripture below means. I had always interpreted it to mean weigh against scripture.
But that might not be the whole picture here.

1 Corinthians 14:29 NRSVue
Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others weigh what is said.

--- COMPARE ---

Acts 15:28-29 NRSVue
For it has seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to impose
on you no further burden than these essentials:
29 that you abstain from what has been sacrificed to idols
and from blood and from what is strangled[a] and from sexual immorality.
If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well. Farewell.”

] cc; @Cyd

I have a hard time with the food sacrificed to idols... living in the USA, I don't know of any farmers that sacrifice anything to idols, do you? They do not say what they mean to me... So all food not imported to me would be clean. Prayed over asking God to bless it we do then.

 

[St. SteVen]

I have a hard time with the food sacrificed to idols... living in the USA, I don't know of any farmers that sacrifice anything to idols, do you? They do not say what they mean to me... So all food not imported to me would be clean. Prayed over asking God to bless it we do then.

Romans chapter 14 should clear that up. (meat sacrificed to idols)
Not really an issue unless you KNOW it was sacrificed to an idol.
And even then... ???

Here's a funny thing to think about. Do you drink fruit juice?
How do you know it wasn't from the tree in the midst of the garden? (orchard)
I'm joking, of course.

In Acts chapter 15...
I am very surprised at the conclusion of the Jerusalem council.
The idea was to not put a burden of law on the gentiles.
So what do they do? Put a burden of law on the gentiles! (sigh)
The sexual immorality part makes sense, but goes without saying.
I'm pretty sure they already knew that.

Acts 15:28-29 NRSVue
For it has seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to impose
on you no further burden than these essentials:
29 that you abstain from what has been sacrificed to idols
and from blood and from what is strangled[a] and from sexual immorality.
If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well. Farewell.”

'

 

[BlessedPeace]

Here's something too that make for the groundwork of what I see as lazy pastors.

If all people go to Heaven,the Gospel need not be taught.

And Hell is empty and no longer exists.

Making the Bible of non-effect and unnecessary.


Exactly what the adversary would love to accomplish in people's mind set here.

Ted Bundy is in Heaven.

Well,yes. Because his soul returned to the God who gave it him. Ecclesiastes.

Curious.

 

[Hillsage]

What if, what IF someone heard God say to them something that contradicts what God Himself wrote down? What does that someone do?

Not wanting to offend, but just asking; Do you really believe that God or Jesus ‘wrote’ anything down in ‘the bible’? I think the bible says
“all Scripture was INSPIRED”. I see that as totally different from actually written. I do think the tablets of stone on mount sinai were actually’ written’ by God.

 

[St. SteVen]

If all people go to Heaven,the Gospel need not be taught.

This is a complete misunderstanding of Christian Universalism.

God will judge/evaluate every nation, every leader and every individual,
Every deed will be accounted for. The goal is for restoration and redemption.
There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. (like when you got saved) - LOL
Jesus said, better to pluck out that eye or remove that hand...

Malachi 3:2 NIV
But who can endure the day of his coming? Who can stand when he appears?
For he will be like a refiner’s fire or a launderer’s soap.

Mark 9:49 NIV
Everyone will be salted with fire.

]