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brightfame52

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So then in your understanding God caused men to sin, because it pleased God that men should be sinners.

We are very far apart on this.

Much love!
Yes, because it pleased God for Christ to be the Saviour of sinners.
 

marks

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Yes, because it pleased God for Christ to be the Saviour of sinners.
Then that's concupiscence. The inner desire for what is evil. In this case, you are asserting God desired that men would be sinners so that He could save them. The desire for what is evil is sin. You ascribe sin to God. How dare you! God Himself is the One who alone is righteous and holy, being Himself all that is good and nothing of evil. You ascribe to Him that He also falls from His holiness and righteousness into the same sin He condemns us for. You make Him a sinner and a hypocrite.

No way!

Much love!
 

marks

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complete RUBBISH!

You know ZERO about Greek grammar!

The use of the article is NOT used here for EXCLUSIVENESS!!!
This is from a guy's website, I think he's got some great stuff on there. I use it for a refresher. Even if someone is not familiar with Koine Greek grammar, if they have a basic understanding of grammatical terms, they will soon see the Koine Greek article follows different rules than the English.

Much love!

Miscellaneous Greek Items

Articles (Definite and Indefinite)
In English the definite article is the word "the", which tends to point out one or more particular items of a group or class. It is like an adjective in that it always modifies a noun (substantive). In Greek, the definite article is declined (i.e. it changes form to match the case, number, and gender of the noun which it modifies). In many cases the definite article in Greek is used to draw attention to the noun it modifies in a way very much unlike the English definite article. However, without a thorough understanding and "feel" for the Greek definite article, it is probably best to include the English article when one is present in Greek (unless it creates an awkward result in the English translation) and to omit it in English if not present in the Greek.

English also has what is called an indefinite article, which is the word "a" or "an". The indefinite article points out or denotes any one of the items in a group or class. Greek does not have a word exactly corresponding to the English indefinite article, therefore sometimes a noun without a definite article can be translated and treated in English as if it had an indefinite article (however, this is not always the case and should be applied cautiously since there are ways to indicate the same idea as the English indefinite article). (A more in-depth explanation will be included in subsequent lessons).

A substantive that is being modified by a definite article is referred to as being ‘articular’, whereas a substantive without a definite article is termed ‘anarthrous’.
 

brightfame52

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Then that's concupiscence. The inner desire for what is evil. In this case, you are asserting God desired that men would be sinners so that He could save them. The desire for what is evil is sin. You ascribe sin to God. How dare you! God Himself is the One who alone is righteous and holy, being Himself all that is good and nothing of evil. You ascribe to Him that He also falls from His holiness and righteousness into the same sin He condemns us for. You make Him a sinner and a hypocrite.

No way!

Much love!
What, its concupiscence for God to be pleased to bruise Christ for the sins of His People ? Isa 53:10


Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.

May God have mercy on you and your foolish talking.
 

marks

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What, its concupiscence for God to be pleased to bruise Christ for the sins of His People ? Isa 53:10
That has nothing to do with what I'm saying, or what you've claimed.

You are asserting it was God's desire for man to be sinful, dead in sin, hopeless sinners. That God created man so he would become fully evil. And again, that was what God wanted from the beginning.

So no, it's not concupiscence for God to be pleased to bruise Christ, to rescue us from our sins.

It's concupiscence to want others to sin, to desire that they sin. The desire for what is evil, that is sin. You accuse God of sin.

You make God dishonest, that when He commanded Adam to not eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil, that in fact God wanted him to eat, planned for him to eat, left him no option but to eat, because God wanted it so.

Sin came when God's creatures disobeyed Him. You would have sin begin with God Himself, the original sinner. I have a hard time just typing these words! I can't imagine believing such a thing!

Much love!
 

ByGraceThroughFaith

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This is from a guy's website, I think he's got some great stuff on there. I use it for a refresher. Even if someone is not familiar with Koine Greek grammar, if they have a basic understanding of grammatical terms, they will soon see the Koine Greek article follows different rules than the English.

Much love!

Miscellaneous Greek Items

Articles (Definite and Indefinite)
In English the definite article is the word "the", which tends to point out one or more particular items of a group or class. It is like an adjective in that it always modifies a noun (substantive). In Greek, the definite article is declined (i.e. it changes form to match the case, number, and gender of the noun which it modifies). In many cases the definite article in Greek is used to draw attention to the noun it modifies in a way very much unlike the English definite article. However, without a thorough understanding and "feel" for the Greek definite article, it is probably best to include the English article when one is present in Greek (unless it creates an awkward result in the English translation) and to omit it in English if not present in the Greek.

English also has what is called an indefinite article, which is the word "a" or "an". The indefinite article points out or denotes any one of the items in a group or class. Greek does not have a word exactly corresponding to the English indefinite article, therefore sometimes a noun without a definite article can be translated and treated in English as if it had an indefinite article (however, this is not always the case and should be applied cautiously since there are ways to indicate the same idea as the English indefinite article). (A more in-depth explanation will be included in subsequent lessons).

A substantive that is being modified by a definite article is referred to as being ‘articular’, whereas a substantive without a definite article is termed ‘anarthrous’.

This has got nothing to do with the Greek article used by Paul to show God's special love for the elect. The grammar says nothing of that
 

brightfame52

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That has nothing to do with what I'm saying, or what you've claimed.

You are asserting it was God's desire for man to be sinful, dead in sin, hopeless sinners. That God created man so he would become fully evil. And again, that was what God wanted from the beginning.

So no, it's not concupiscence for God to be pleased to bruise Christ, to rescue us from our sins.

It's concupiscence to want others to sin, to desire that they sin. The desire for what is evil, that is sin. You accuse God of sin.

You make God dishonest, that when He commanded Adam to not eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil, that in fact God wanted him to eat, planned for him to eat, left him no option but to eat, because God wanted it so.

Sin came when God's creatures disobeyed Him. You would have sin begin with God Himself, the original sinner. I have a hard time just typing these words! I can't imagine believing such a thing!

Much love!
It has everything to do with it, The Lord was pleased to bruise Christ for sin, that was His Purpose before the world began 1 Pet 1:20

20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

God was pleased that Adam sinned and brought sin into the world, it was His Purpose, and you blaspheme saying it is concupiscence , you speaking foolish about Gods Eternal Purpose in Christ.
 

marks

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God was pleased that Adam sinned and brought sin into the world, it was His Purpose, and you blaspheme saying it is concupiscence ,
Pleasure over sin is sin.

Romans 1:32 KJV
Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

Much love!
 

brightfame52

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Pleasure over sin is sin.

Romans 1:32 KJV
Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

Much love!
Adam sinned according to Gods predetermined counsel, and He took pleasure in His predetermined counsel.
 

marks

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Adam sinned according to Gods predetermined counsel, and He took pleasure in His predetermined counsel.
Then, you have a God who takes pleasure in sin, and that's not the God of the Bible.

Much love!
 

BlessedPeace

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@marks
I believe you may find concupiscence is the wrong word there.

There is only one actual source, creator.

Isaiah 45:7
KJ21
I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I, the Lord, do all these things.
ASV
I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am Jehovah, that doeth all these things.
AMP
The One forming light and creating darkness, Causing peace and creating disaster; I am the Lord who does all these things.
AMPC
I form the light and create darkness, I make peace [national well-being] and I create [physical] evil (calamity); I am the Lord, Who does all these things.
BRG
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
CSB
I form light and create darkness, I make success and create disaster; I am the Lord, who does all these things.
CEB
I form light and create darkness, make prosperity and create doom; I am the Lord, who does all these things.
CJB
I form light, I create darkness; I make well-being, I create woe; I, Adonai, do all these things.
CEV
I create light and darkness, happiness and sorrow. I, the Lord, do all this.
DARBY
forming the light and creating darkness, making peace and creating evil: I, Jehovah, do all these things.
DRA
I form the light, and create darkness, I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord that do all these things.
ERV
I made the light and the darkness. I bring peace, and I cause trouble. I, the Lord, do all these things.
EHV
I am the one who forms light and creates darkness, the one who makes peace and creates disaster. I am the Lord, the one who does all these things.
ESV
I form light and create darkness; I make well-being and create calamity; I am the Lord, who does all these things.
ESVUK
I form light and create darkness, I make well-being and create calamity, I am the Lord, who does all these things.
EXB
I make the light and create the darkness. I bring ·peace [prosperity; wholeness; C Hebrew shalom], and I ·cause [create] ·troubles [disaster; calamity]. I, the Lord, do all these things.
GNV
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
GW
I make light and create darkness. I make blessings and create disasters. I, the Lord, do all these things.
GNT
I create both light and darkness; I bring both blessing and disaster. I, the Lord, do all these things.
HCSB
I form light and create darkness, I make success and create disaster; I, Yahweh, do all these things.
ICB
I made the light and the darkness. I bring peace, and I cause troubles. I, the Lord, do all these things.
ISV
“I form light and create darkness, I make goodness and create disaster. I am the Lord, who does all these things.
JUB
I form the light and create darkness; I make peace and create evil: I am the LORD that does all this.
KJV
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
AKJV
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
LSB
The One forming light and creating darkness, Producing peace and creating calamity; I am Yahweh who does all these.
LEB
I form light and I create darkness; I make peace and I create evil; I am Yahweh; I do all these things.
TLB
I form the light and make the dark. I send good times and bad. I, Jehovah, am he who does these things.
MSG
God’s Message to his anointed, to Cyrus, whom he took by the hand To give the task of taming the nations, of terrifying their kings— He gave him free rein, no restrictions: “I’ll go ahead of you, clearing and paving the road. I’ll break down bronze city gates, smash padlocks, kick down barred entrances. I’ll lead you to buried treasures, secret caches of valuables— Confirmations that it is, in fact, I, God, the God of Israel, who calls you by your name. It’s because of my dear servant Jacob, Israel my chosen, That I’ve singled you out, called you by name, and given you this privileged work. And you don’t even know me! I am God, the only God there is. Besides me there are no real gods. I’m the one who armed you for this work, though you don’t even know me, So that everyone, from east to west, will know that I have no god-rivals. I am God, the only God there is. I form light and create darkness, I make harmonies and create discords. I, God, do all these things.
MEV
I form the light and create darkness; I make peace and create calamity; I, the Lord, do all these things.
NOG
I make light and create darkness. I make blessings and create disasters. I, Yahweh, do all these things.
NABRE
I form the light, and create the darkness, I make weal and create woe; I, the Lord, do all these things.
NASB
The One forming light and creating darkness, Causing well-being and creating disaster; I am the Lord who does all these things.
NASB1995
The One forming light and creating darkness, Causing well-being and creating calamity; I am the Lord who does all these.
NCB
I form the light and create the darkness; prosperity and disaster depend upon my will; I, the Lord, do all these things.
NCV
I made the light and the darkness. I bring peace, and I cause troubles. I, the Lord, do all these things.
NET
I am the one who forms light and creates darkness; the one who brings about peace and creates calamity. I am the Lord, who accomplishes all these things.
NIRV
I cause light to shine. I also create darkness. I bring good times. I also create hard times. I do all these things. I am the Lord.
NIV
I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the Lord, do all these things.
NIVUK
I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the Lord, do all these things.
 

BlessedPeace

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NKJV
I form the light and create darkness, I make peace and create calamity; I, the Lord, do all these things.
NLV
I make light and I make darkness. I bring good and I make trouble. I am the Lord Who does all these things.
NLT
I create the light and make the darkness. I send good times and bad times. I, the Lord, am the one who does these things.
NRSVA
I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe; I the Lord do all these things.
NRSVACE
I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe; I the Lord do all these things.
NRSVCE
I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe; I the Lord do all these things.

NRSVUE
I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe; I the Lord do all these things.
OJB
I form ohr, and create choshech; I make shalom, and create rah; I Hashem worketh all these things.
RSV
I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe, I am the Lord, who do all these things.
RSVCE
I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe, I am the Lord, who do all these things.
TLV
I form light and create darkness. I make shalom and create calamity. I, Adonai, do all these things.
VOICE
I form light and create darkness; I make what is good, happy, and healthy, and I create woe. I, the Eternal One, make them one and all.
WEB
I form the light and create darkness. I make peace and create calamity. I am Yahweh, who does all these things.
WYC
forming light, and making darknesses, making peace, and forming evil; I am the Lord, doing all these things.
YLT
Forming light, and preparing darkness, Making peace, and preparing evil, I [am] Jehovah, doing all these things.'