Expose on Mormonism.

[CoreIssue]

Y

Not exactly. God the Son is on earth while God the Father is in heaven; because He did not and could not vacate eternity when He descended. Time has nothing to do with any of it. We are dealing with eternity; and sometimes eternity is difficult to understand without the Holy Ghost (see 1 Corinthians 2:10-12). God the Father is in heaven and the Son was on earth and the Son is in heaven, from the perspective of eternity.

Well, that claim is illogical and nonbiblical. You just put a limit on God.

 

[justbyfaith]

Do you believe that God can lie or that He can even sin? if not, then you just put a limit on God, yourself.

 

[justbyfaith]

It is the nature of eternity that if God vacated eternity, He was never in eternity. I suppose it takes a mind that can grasp eternal concepts to be able to understand this.

 

[brakelite]

Since Jesus is God, He did not *come into existence*. He simply existed from eternity past, with the Father and the Spirit. Had He created absolutely nothing, it would have made no difference. He is the Self-Existent I AM (with the Father and the Holy Spirit).

So at the incarnation of Christ, the Holy Spirit supernaturally brought about a miraculous conception within the virgin's womb, and the child which was conceived was Jesus. But He had already existed before time began as "the Word of God", the Creator.

As to the temptations of Christ, since He was born of a virgin, He did not have a sin nature inherited from Adam. Which means that He was sinless and could not be tempted to sin. That is because God cannot be tempted to sin, neither does He tempt any man.

Satan is not omniscient, and he foolishly imagined that he could present temptations to Christ and have Him succumb to them. But he could not know that the Son of God cannot be tempted.

It is only when people forget that Jesus is fully God and fully sinless Man at one and the same time (not comprehensible to humans) that we have all kinds of heresies about the Person of Christ.

KJV Romans 8
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.

The Son of God became fully human, taking on the flesh of fallen man.

KJV Hebrews 2
18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

KJV Hebrews 4
15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.
16 Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.

No trace of Imperfection in Christ—Those who claim that it was not possible for Christ to sin, cannot believe that He really took upon Himself human nature. But was not Christ actually tempted, not only by Satan in the wilderness, but all through His life, from childhood to manhood? In all points He was tempted as we are, and because He successfully resisted temptation under every form, He gave man the perfect example, and through the ample provision Christ has made, we may become partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption which is in the world through lust.
The obedience of Christ to His Father was the same obedience that is required of man. Man cannot overcome Satan’s temptations without divine power to combine with his instrumentality. So with Jesus Christ; He could lay hold of divine power. He came not to our world to give the obedience of a lesser God to a greater, but as a man to obey God’s holy law, and in this way He is our example. The Lord Jesus came to our world, not to reveal what a God could do, but what a man could do, through faith in God’s power to help in every emergency. Man is, through faith, to be a partaker in the divine nature, and to overcome every temptation wherewith he is beset.
If Christ did not come in our fallen human nature, then He had an advantage over us that we can not emulate... He cannot then be our example.
The fact that Christ could have sinned in His humanity, is greater evidence of the incredible risk the Father took in giving His Son to the human race.

 

[justbyfaith]

It is not the true gospel that we can somehow become holy enough to enter into the kingdom of heaven by following Jesus' example.

The true gospel is that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures, was buried, and rose again the third day according to the scriptures (1 Corinthians 15:1-4).

In dying for our sins, He brought forgiveness to our lives (Psalms 51:3, 1 John 1:9, Romans 4:8).

Having been forgiven, we now desire to please the Lord because we love Him for what He has done for us (Luke 7:36-50, 1 John 4:19, Romans 5:5).

This love is not in word or in tongue only, but in deed and in truth (1 John 3:17-18). It is the fulfilling of the law (Romans 13:8-10, Galatians 5:14, Romans 8:4 w/ Romans 5:5).

While we are capable of living a holy life because of what Christ has done for us, in giving us the Spirit...it is not the living of a holy life that saves us, it is the other way around...because we are saved we will live a holy life.

Our flesh is made like Christ's perfect flesh (to a certain degree) when we mortify the flesh; in that the flesh is rendered dead (Galatians 5:24) and thus sin is rendered dead (Romans 7:8); so that it no longer has any say over our behaviour. This concept interprets 1 John 1:8 also.

Christ did not come in sinful flesh, he came in the likeness of sinful flesh.

 

[brakelite]

I agree with all the above, just wondering what this means to you...

Christ did not come in sinful flesh, he came in the likeness of sinful flesh.

Did Christ come and inhabit the flesh of fallen humanity, or humanity as it was before the fall? Were the temptations real, or just a farcical show? If Jesus could not have possibly sinned, what means the following?
KJV Hebrews 2
Christ Partook of Flesh and Blood
14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.
16 For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.
17 Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.
18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

That seed of Abraham is the seed of fallen humanity. Of course although Christ shared in our weak depleted spiritual state, through faith in His Father He overcame all temptation and did no sin.

 

[justbyfaith]

Christ knew no sin, was without sin, did no sin, and there is no sin in Him (1 John 3:5, 1 Peter 2:22, Hebrews 4:15, 2 Corinthians 5:21). We begin with that.

So then, Christ's temptations did not have to do with Him having a fallen sinful human nature; but with the fact that He was human. Only after fasting for forty days was He even temptable with hunger by the devil (Matthew 4:2).

 

[CoreIssue]

I think a couple points are being missed here.

Christ did not have sin nature.

Christ was fully capable of sinning.

Before Adam fell he was innocent and did not know good from evil.

Christ was not innocent, he knew good from evil.

His flesh was fully human. His spirit fully God. That is why he is the God/man

In genealogy, Christ can be traced all the way back to Adam.